Aller au contenu

Photo

The Official Cullen Discussion Thread v.3.0


138835 réponses à ce sujet

#137976
Cerulione

Cerulione
  • Members
  • 4 596 messages

Would Lavellan even know? I mean they get married before you find Solas and he explains about the Evanuris. As far as Lavellan would be concerned, at that point, the Elvhen gods are whatever she was brought up to beleive they are. Not the dirty truth. 

 

That's my point. During the marriage it's before Conversation with Solas TM.

 

I don't think we can qualify anyone "Evil" really. I mean look at 2 games we hears of Fen Harel as the Ultimately Bad Guy TM. And we have one who hates tea, have spots on his face, burnt his coat once, believe in his truth so much, break his own heart, love helping refugees, and wish to destroy the world. Probably still Bad Guy TM but look at all the nuances...


  • Fadburger aime ceci

#137977
Fadburger

Fadburger
  • Members
  • 109 messages

That's my point. During the marriage it's before Conversation with Solas TM.

 

I don't think we can qualify anyone "Evil" really. I mean look at 2 games we hears of Fen Harel as the Ultimately Bad Guy TM. And we have one who hates tea, have spots on his face, burnt his coat once, believe in his truth so much, break his own heart, love helping refugees, and wish to destroy the world. Probably still Bad Guy TM but look at all the nuances...

 

Yup, yup~

 

Yeah I mean...the road to hell is paved in good intentions and whatnot. I don't think he is evil, persay, just did the wrong things for the right reasons and set off a chain of disastrous events that literally caused every major bad thing in "today's" Thedas.


  • Cerulione aime ceci

#137978
Cerulione

Cerulione
  • Members
  • 4 596 messages

Yup, yup~

 

Yeah I mean...the road to hell is paved in good intentions and whatnot. I don't think he is evil, persay, just did the wrong things for the right reasons and set off a chain of disastrous events that literally caused every major bad thing in "today's" Thedas.

 

We don't even get the whole story about how it all happened :3

 

So how can we judge Sylaise... Really she's presented as one of the gentler one probably? Goddess of Hearth, to the comparison of Elgarnan's God of Fengeance & Falon'Din's less sympathetic representation and lustful Andruil...


  • Fadburger aime ceci

#137979
Fadburger

Fadburger
  • Members
  • 109 messages

We don't even get the whole story about how it all happened :3

 

So how can we judge Sylaise... Really she's presented as one of the gentler one probably? Goddess of Hearth, to the comparison of Elgarnan's God of Fengeance & Falon'Din's less sympathetic representation and lustful Andruil...

 

Indeed...for all we know they were the good guys and Fen'Harel shut them away for some reason while making himself look good...we are hearing all this from him after all.


  • Tishina et Cerulione aiment ceci

#137980
Cerulione

Cerulione
  • Members
  • 4 596 messages

Indeed...for all we know they were the good guys and Fen'Harel shut them away for some reason while making himself look good...we are hearing all this from him after all.

 

I'm a huge Solavellan fans and I still can't stop thinking, Solas' might be quite skewed in term of point of view... Although he believes he's doing good actually... O.o


  • Tishina et Fadburger aiment ceci

#137981
Fadburger

Fadburger
  • Members
  • 109 messages

I'm a huge Solavellan fans and I still can't stop thinking, Solas' might be quite skewed in term of point of view... Although he believes he's doing good actually... O.o

 

Yeah I am sure HE thinks he's doing the right thing haha


  • Cerulione aime ceci

#137982
R2s Muse

R2s Muse
  • Members
  • 19 846 messages

tumblr_o626rnd9q31qah051o1_540.jpg
tumblr_o626rnd9q31qah051o4_540.jpg
tumblr_o626rnd9q31qah051o2_540.jpg
tumblr_o626rnd9q31qah051o3_540.jpg
 
 

cute-ellyna:

Daises
Relaxing, quiet, quality time (◡‿◡✿)

Staying like this is something I really love to do with my boyfriend, especially now that spring is coming: it makes the world feel so calm and beautiful… I could spend hours like this. And of course I thought Cullen and my Inquizzy would totally do the same and love it as much as I do :)


  • thats1evildude, kitcat1228, Zarro-Morningstar et 5 autres aiment ceci

#137983
meanieweenie

meanieweenie
  • Members
  • 3 494 messages

 
 
Independent of what may be The Truth (with a questionmark on 'truth' as has been pointed out), as far as Lavellan is concerned, she's not invoking evil during her wedding. But I also think that's neither here nor there in terms of Cullen. I doubt invoking an Evanuris during their wedding was intended to turn him into an elvhen slave to the CauseTM. :lol:

Am I the only one twisted enough to think this would make a helluva short fic? LOL


  • R2s Muse et Cerulione aiment ceci

#137984
Qun00

Qun00
  • Members
  • 4 381 messages
I must say, Cullen x Mage Inquisitor simply is the best. I can just imagine them together in a beautiful spot in the forest:

"Inquisitor: I know what you are.

Cullen: Say it. Out loud. Say it!

Inquisitor: Templar.

Cullen: Are you afraid?

Inquisitor: No. "
  • R2s Muse, Cerulione et Ghost Gal aiment ceci

#137985
R2s Muse

R2s Muse
  • Members
  • 19 846 messages

I must say, Cullen x Mage Inquisitor simply is the best. I can just imagine them together in a beautiful spot in the forest:

"Inquisitor: I know what you are.

Cullen: Say it. Out loud. Say it!

Inquisitor: Templar.

Cullen: Are you afraid?

Inquisitor: No. "

:sputter: OMG, I was drinking my coffee just now thankyouverymuch! bwahahahaha!!

All I have to say to that is:

cullen_templars_dont_sparkl_womens_vneck
  • Flaine1996 aime ceci

#137986
CuriousArtemis

CuriousArtemis
  • Members
  • 19 655 messages
Oh... is that a Twilight reference?
  • R2s Muse et Cerulione aiment ceci

#137987
Ghost Gal

Ghost Gal
  • Members
  • 1 028 messages

Thanks for answering, all. I'm sorry I risked the devs' disapproval to share that, I just had to know, "I'm not crazy, right? Is there some glaringly huge portion of Lavellan players that tried to change Cullen to be more 'elfy' that I'm not aware of?"

 

[snip]
 

cute-ellyna:

Daises
Relaxing, quiet, quality time (◡‿◡✿)

Staying like this is something I really love to do with my boyfriend, especially now that spring is coming: it makes the world feel so calm and beautiful… I could spend hours like this. And of course I thought Cullen and my Inquizzy would totally do the same and love it as much as I do :)

 

This is too precious for words.  :wub:

 

While Solas is still my favorite, one of the reasons I like Cullen so dang much is the freedom to headcanon tons of really sweet, relaxing, romantic moments like this. With Solas you have the threat of the Breach or the Elder One looming over your heads until the moment the latter is defeated, then he runs off. Cullen sticks around, so you've got literally two years after the danger has passed to imagine them just spending time together, being happy, and enjoying romantic time-well-wasted moments.  ^_^

 

Plus, as someone who doesn't loathe the Dalish, it's nice to headcanon my Dalish gal spending time with a loved one who doesn't badmouth her culture every chance he gets.  :unsure:


  • R2s Muse et Tishina aiment ceci

#137988
R2s Muse

R2s Muse
  • Members
  • 19 846 messages

Oh... is that a Twilight reference?

LOL Yeah, it's from one of more infamous scenes, particularly how they staged it in the movie. 
 

 
Of course, Cullen - Twilight refs aren't new, but hee hee, this one particularly tickles me. The notion that being a templar would be a big bad dark secret just makes me laugh. :lol:


  • CuriousArtemis, Tishina et Cerulione aiment ceci

#137989
Mistic

Mistic
  • Members
  • 2 199 messages

Plus, as someone who doesn't loathe the Dalish, it's nice to headcanon my Dalish gal spending time with a loved one who doesn't badmouth her culture every chance he gets.  :unsure:

 

One of the things that surprised me more when I role-played a Dalish Inquisitor was how respectful Cullen can be towards pagan characters. It's especially noticeable in Haven.

 

Cullen is a devout believer in the Maker, still follows the Chantry and it's evident he believes the Inquisitor is the Herald of Andraste, but he never judges or berates the PC for their religion, never expects them to share the same views, never tries to convert or convince them to change their ways. When the whole "Herald of Andraste" thing is mentioned for the first time, he's the one (the only one) to ask the PC about what they feel and is always more worried about the Inquisitor's safety than about any propaganda scheme. Him being totally okay with Dalish vows in the wedding is in character and the icing on the cake.

 

And it's not as if every other character was the same. Thankfully, Bioware provided many points of view. From Cassandra's "there's no room among your gods for one more?" to Mother Giselle trying (very kindly and politely) to convert you, from Sera breaking up with a Dalish Inquisitor that doesn't agree with her to the aforementioned Dalish vows in Cullen's wedding, from trying to deny being the Herald to embracing the role and judge in the name of the Maker, every character and every Inquisitor had their own opinion on the matter.


  • Exile Isan, Tishina, Cerulione et 1 autre aiment ceci

#137990
Cerulione

Cerulione
  • Members
  • 4 596 messages

Thanks for answering, all. I'm sorry I risked the devs' disapproval to share that, I just had to know, "I'm not crazy, right? Is there some glaringly huge portion of Lavellan players that tried to change Cullen to be more 'elfy' that I'm not aware of?"

 

 

This is too precious for words.  :wub:

 

While Solas is still my favorite, one of the reasons I like Cullen so dang much is the freedom to headcanon tons of really sweet, relaxing, romantic moments like this. With Solas you have the threat of the Breach or the Elder One looming over your heads until the moment the latter is defeated, then he runs off. Cullen sticks around, so you've got literally two years after the danger has passed to imagine them just spending time together, being happy, and enjoying romantic time-well-wasted moments.  ^_^

 

Plus, as someone who doesn't loathe the Dalish, it's nice to headcanon my Dalish gal spending time with a loved one who doesn't badmouth her culture every chance he gets.  :unsure:

 

Basically this!!! :wizard:


  • Tishina et Ghost Gal aiment ceci

#137991
CuriousArtemis

CuriousArtemis
  • Members
  • 19 655 messages

 
While Solas is still my favorite, one of the reasons I like Cullen so dang much is the freedom to headcanon tons of really sweet, relaxing, romantic moments like this. :


Hey they had a fade date / dream date in the fic I wrote :P Really though that's the beauty of headcanon. Heck Ceru and I have sibling inquisitor headcanons :lol: Cause why not!

To me Cullen doesn't get interesting until the marriage proposal. My brain immediately went "RELATIONSHIP DRAMZ!" And if I ever get around to continue that fic I started I'll have to remember to actually include some plot with that dramz :lol:
  • Tishina et Cerulione aiment ceci

#137992
Ghost Gal

Ghost Gal
  • Members
  • 1 028 messages

One of the things that surprised me more when I role-played a Dalish Inquisitor was how respectful Cullen can be towards pagan characters. It's especially noticeable in Haven.

 

Cullen is a devout believer in the Maker, still follows the Chantry and it's evident he believes the Inquisitor is the Herald of Andraste, but he never judges or berates the PC for their religion, never expects them to share the same views, never tries to convert or convince them to change their ways. When the whole "Herald of Andraste" thing is mentioned for the first time, he's the one (the only one) to ask the PC about what they feel and is always more worried about the Inquisitor's safety than about any propaganda scheme. Him being totally okay with Dalish vows in the wedding is in character and the icing on the cake.

 

And it's not as if every other character was the same. Thankfully, Bioware provided many points of view. From Cassandra's "there's no room among your gods for one more?" to Mother Giselle trying (very kindly and politely) to convert you, from Sera breaking up with a Dalish Inquisitor that doesn't agree with her to the aforementioned Dalish vows in Cullen's wedding, from trying to deny being the Herald to embracing the role and judge in the name of the Maker, every character and every Inquisitor had their own opinion on the matter.

 

Yeah, I was rather surprised to learn that BioWare made the Tevinter Magister's son and Andrastian holy warriors (Cassandra, Cullen, and to a lesser extent Leliana) more accepting and open-minded about the Dalish than our two elven companions. I guess it was for some tastefully subtle message that sometimes people not part of an oppressed minority can be more sympathetic to your cause than fellow members of said minority (same with Bull to Adaar), but eh. To this day I'm still holding out for that "elfy" romance where said elven companion doesn't disavow all elven culture (the only elven companion thus far who doesn't distance themself from other elves is Merrill, and you can only romance her as a human  :unsure: ), but it looks like I'll wait a long time yet.

 

For now, Solas and Cullen are awesome. Maybe it makes me a bad person, but my Dalish elves tend to prejudge Andrastian humans as intolerant of mages, elves, and pagans, especially Andrastian priests and Templars. One of the things I like about the Cullen romance is being able to headcanon my girl starting out distrusting him for being a former Templar, then getting to know him, learning how kind and open-minded he is, and learning to be more accepting and open-minded herself.

 

Some people take issue with his lyrium quest since it involves the PC "fixing" a love interest instead of you two supporting each other, but I don't think that's strictly true. Like you said, he's probably the only companion or adviser who asks how you're feeling and doesn't ever pressure you to live up to propaganda schemes, so you have his full and undivided military and moral support. (Even Dorian, the only other companion/adviser who asks how you're doing, still worries about your image--like how it would look for the Herald of Andraste to befriend a Tevinter mage like him.) 

 

I'd like to think that Cullen helped free her from the mental bonds of subconscious prejudice by being kind and supportive, so she returned the favor by helping to free him from his lyrium leash by being kind and supportive. I like to head-canon that it was a trade-off, not a one-sided, "I fix you, then you reward me with sex."

 

Hey they had a fade date / dream date in the fic I wrote :P Really though that's the beauty of headcanon. Heck Ceru and I have sibling inquisitor headcanons :lol: Cause why not!

To me Cullen doesn't get interesting until the marriage proposal. My brain immediately went "RELATIONSHIP DRAMZ!" And if I ever get around to continue that fic I started I'll have to remember to actually include some plot with that dramz :lol:

 

That's true, there's a lot of room to interpret them having a lot of dream dates. :D

 

Between the in-game ability for my character to talk to him any time at Haven or Skyhold and take him anywhere in the game, I imagine that my gal spent every waking moment she could with Solas, and then dreamed with him after she learned Fade-walking at Skyhold. I actually headcanon that they spent so much time together that she eventually became mentally exhausted--not from lack of sleep, but lack of being able to rest her brain since she was essentially "conscious" all the time. Eventually even Solas had to tell her that she needed rest... cue her taking a nap in the Fade by sleeping with her head propped up on his shoulders while they rest under a tree on a lovely summer's day.  :D


  • Mistic, CuriousArtemis, Tishina et 1 autre aiment ceci

#137993
CuriousArtemis

CuriousArtemis
  • Members
  • 19 655 messages

Eventually even Solas had to tell her that she needed rest... cue her taking a nap in the Fade by sleeping with her head propped up on his shoulders while they rest under a tree on a lovely summer's day.  :D

 

What a precious image!  :wub:


  • Cerulione et Ghost Gal aiment ceci

#137994
thats1evildude

thats1evildude
  • Members
  • 11 001 messages
Eccch, Deviantart user. Draw your Cullen/Dorian fanart if you like, but "pregnant Doria" is gross and awful. :sick:

#137995
Fadburger

Fadburger
  • Members
  • 109 messages

 

I'd like to think that Cullen helped free her from the mental bonds of subconscious prejudice by being kind and supportive, so she returned the favor by helping to free him from his lyrium leash by being kind and supportive. I like to head-canon that it was a trade-off, not a one-sided, "I fix you, then you reward me with sex."

 

 

Yeah, I get more of the feeling that your relationship has just progressed to the level where they have sex rather than it's a reward or anything...just that now you've seen him at his worst and helped him be the man he wants to be...you're closer and thus the natural progression is that you are at the stage of your relationship where intimacy is good/right.

 

EDIT: I mean he won't stay with you if he goes back on the lyrium either. He wants your support in his quitting the lyrium, perhaps one of the reasons he breaks it off with you if you tell him to keep taking it is that he feels you aren't nurturing what is best for him, as a person, but rather using him as a tool just as he was as a Templar in the circle. Even if you lie to him and say you'll find a way to cure him of his addiction after everything is over, it's not happily after...and not a healthy relationship IMO..you lied to him, he doesn't get cured. 

ANYWAY the point is I think he HOPES you will help him cure his lyrium addiction, after all he didn't start going cold turkey on it because of your relationship with him and your compliance with those hopes of his and your caring about him as a person rather than being cold and professional and letting him be able to focus better at his detriment is what he wants, and drives forward your relationship with him.

 

Sorry that was rambling, I hope that made some sense lol



#137996
Mistic

Mistic
  • Members
  • 2 199 messages

Yeah, I was rather surprised to learn that BioWare made the Tevinter Magister's son and Andrastian holy warriors (Cassandra, Cullen, and to a lesser extent Leliana) more accepting and open-minded about the Dalish than our two elven companions. I guess it was for some tastefully subtle message that sometimes people not part of an oppressed minority can be more sympathetic to your cause than fellow members of said minority (same with Bull to Adaar), but eh.

 

I actually welcome it. Discussions about elves, both in and out universe, tend to abuse the No True Scotsman fallacy, so Bioware providing several characters that defy elven stereotypes and don't even agree on what being an elf means (try to have Zevran, Merrill, Fenris, Solas and Sera agree on an elven manifiesto) adds more variety and challenges the player's preconceived notions. It's role-playing gold.

 

Some people take issue with his lyrium quest since it involves the PC "fixing" a love interest instead of you two supporting each other, but I don't think that's strictly true. Like you said, he's probably the only companion or adviser who asks how you're feeling and doesn't ever pressure you to live up to propaganda schemes, so you have his full and undivided military and moral support. (Even Dorian, the only other companion/adviser who asks how you're doing, still worries about your image--like how it would look for the Herald of Andraste to befriend a Tevinter mage like him.)

 

I see where that issue may come from, but I don't share it. I would understand it if it was a romance-only content, and in that case I would agree Bioware went for the "fix your love interest" route. But the lyrium quest is available for all Inquisitors regardless their personal relationship with Cullen, so the tone is more "What kind of boss are you? One who wants soldiers ready for Corypheus no matter the price or one who cares for their subordinates' wellbeing? Is Cullen a tool or a friend to you?".

 

I read it as a way to measure and role-play your Inquisitor's level of coldness and/or selfishness. What lyrium addiction can do to a person is awful. It's the worst kind of a drug, a poison, not a personal point of view or a character flaw that has to be "corrected". The later would certainly be insulting to Cullen's character, but it isn't what happens. The initial idea to try to give up lyrium? Cullen's. The professional help? Cassandra's. The Inquisitor is there just to provide minor but key support in one way or another.



#137997
R2s Muse

R2s Muse
  • Members
  • 19 846 messages

EDIT: I mean he won't stay with you if he goes back on the lyrium either. He wants your support in his quitting the lyrium, perhaps one of the reasons he breaks it off with you if you tell him to keep taking it is that he feels you aren't nurturing what is best for him, as a person, but rather using him as a tool just as he was as a Templar in the circle. Even if you lie to him and say you'll find a way to cure him of his addiction after everything is over, it's not happily after...and not a healthy relationship IMO..you lied to him, he doesn't get cured.

Just to point out here, I've heard a lot of really detailed reasons from fans who romanced him and chose to find another way, and they were not lying to him. At that point in the game, it was not clear whether or not it would work out in the end. There are lots of ways to role play that, and that option does not strictly mean the IQ is selfish, cold or deceptive.
  • Tishina, Ghost Gal et Fadburger aiment ceci

#137998
Tishina

Tishina
  • Members
  • 5 300 messages

Just to point out here, I've heard a lot of really detailed reasons from fans who romanced him and chose to find another way, and they were not lying to him. At that point in the game, it was not clear whether or not it would work out in the end. There are lots of ways to role play that, and that option does not strictly mean the IQ is selfish, cold or deceptive.

Too true. For some, it was a measure of whether they put personal interests (i.e. Cullen's happiness and future) against the risks of a possible failure on Cullen's part when you're facing world-ending consequences. And most people who told him they'd find another way headcannoned that it was sincere. And it appears to work out and he has the same ending as supporting him to continue without lyrium. It would be very easy to make the argument that a romanced Inquisitor who tells him to stick it out without lyrium is being more selfish, after all.

 

A lot of people who made the pro-qunari alliance choice did so for the same reasons: the good of the many. :wacko: It's safer not to make judgments about why people made the decisions they did. After all, it's a game, and even when people pick what appear to be the worse evil choices, they may have their reasons (even if it's to feel the pain of sacrificing their happiness...or they just want to see what happens.) :lol:


  • R2s Muse et Fadburger aiment ceci

#137999
Ghost Gal

Ghost Gal
  • Members
  • 1 028 messages

I actually welcome it. Discussions about elves, both in and out universe, tend to abuse the No True Scotsman fallacy, so Bioware providing several characters that defy elven stereotypes and don't even agree on what being an elf means (try to have Zevran, Merrill, Fenris, Solas and Sera agree on an elven manifiesto) adds more variety and challenges the player's preconceived notions. It's role-playing gold.

 

While for the most part I agree with you, I don't like the way BioWare handles it. 

 

That's probably the most diplomatic way I can say it.

 

 

As for the Cullen-lyrium discussion, I think you make a really good point.

 

In a broader sense, though, I rather agree with R2s Muse and Tinisha. In hindsight (20/20), it seems pretty obvious that Cullen wanted to break free of his lyrium leash and gain a sense of control in his life, and an Inquisitor who supports that is showing (outwardly) that they value him as a person while an Inquisitor who encourages him to go back on lyrium is showing (outwardly) that they value the good of the Inquisition more than him at best, that they view him as just a tool for their cause that they'll use just like how the Chantry and Templar order used him at worst.

 

I will say, though, that it might not seem that obvious on a first playthrough. Keep in mind that the game often hints that his lyrium withdrawal is so bad that he could die from it. I've seen a decent amount of players say that they put Cullen back on lyrium because they were trying to save his life. Others were afraid that, yes, if they let him stay off lyrium maybe something bad would happen in the final battle against Corypheus. And, as R2s Muse and Tinisha pointed out, many players honestly meant it it when they said they'd help him get over his lyrium addiction after the danger has passed.

 

I know the first time I played I seriously hesitated to encourage Cullen to stay the course because I was really afraid he'd die, but I trusted Cassandra's judgment, so decided to stay have him the course. Now that I've seen how it all ends from both decisions, it now seems obvious that of course encouraging him to quit shows that you support his well-being, and encouraging him to get back on it is hinting that you care how he's of use to the Inquisition more than his own well-being, but, to me, it wasn't 100% obvious on the first playthrough. It's possible that others didn't feel it either; I'm just lucky I trusted Cassandra and went the "no risk, no gain" route.


  • R2s Muse et Fadburger aiment ceci

#138000
Fadburger

Fadburger
  • Members
  • 109 messages

Just to point out here, I've heard a lot of really detailed reasons from fans who romanced him and chose to find another way, and they were not lying to him. At that point in the game, it was not clear whether or not it would work out in the end. There are lots of ways to role play that, and that option does not strictly mean the IQ is selfish, cold or deceptive.

 

Yeah I don't mean the reason players chose it, I mean the way it's presented in the game, because there is no resolution he doesn't get cured if you choose that option and the result is the same as if you kept him on the lyrium without telling him you'd find another way. I was rambling in my original comment, which I tend to do a lot lol, so I think my point got muddled. I think Bioware dropped the ball on the ending basically, you can say that you will find a way to cure him later but it never gets followed up as such. I should have worded it better but that's what I meant. 

 

Of course the way people role play it are different and I am not making a judgement about that, I'm purely going with the way Bioware wrote it here. I'm sure without a guide I would have made the same judgment call about him staying on the lyrium until everything is over.