138820 réponses à ce sujet

[Tishina]

You guys all make good points about how the stay-at-home companions essentially functioned like advisors anyway. You can't take most of them with you. Most players end up with a core team they usually use for a given PC, so most of them are grounded for the duration. It then felt a bit like a chore after a while doing the lap around Skyhold to try to talk to ALL of them and make sure I didn't miss anything they might say each time I came home. 

 

There were characters I loved that I never took anywhere, because I didn't need to. 

 

Now the upside to having so many companions is that each of us, the players, got a chance to form unique attachments and avoid the characters we didn't like. So yay choice? But again, this game went with broad instead of deep in so many ways, and this is one of them. My kingdom for a proper third act and boss battle to match act one! Out damn eighteenth desert area!

 

I try to take this all as hope for DA4. DA:I accomplished all BW's core goals: adapt frostbite into a massive, beautiful gaming experience. The devs have acknowledged some of these same weakness, so I have confidence that DA4, now that the frostbite platform is built, will be kick ass. And, I think JoH is already a positive sign for the future.

And here we get into: which companions to keep (there are huge fans of all of them?) And which game zones to drop? The Hissing Wastes may be my favorite zone (aside from the amount of dwarviness we got, I generally loved the open feel of the terrain, the moonlight, etc.) It was the one zone you could actually ride across without having dropping to a walk every four steps because your mount tripped on a near invisible stone (I literally forgot I had a mount in my first playthrough until I got there because it seemed like such a waste of time in other zones.)

 

But just a reminder to be kind about other people's favorites. I suspect Solas is the only character that all of us would admit was essential, and even then, that's as much for the future of the stories as DA:I itself. As far as the advisors, why not simply let the companions left behind on the last mission or had the least active play function as the advisors instead of separate ones? I get that it was supposed to allow for including a non-combatant on your team (Josephine)...but even she had trained as a bard. Using companions as advisors would let them put more resources into telling those stories, and the imbalance between the length of the game and the content for companions was probably the flaw that bugged me the most (after the treatment of dwarves.)

 

Of course, remember that not all races got treated equally. If you cut Harding and her pseudo-romance, my female dwarves would be left up a creek, high and dry (unless they ungated one of the gated romances or bothered to fix the Blackwall one...levitating boobs ahoy!)

[The Elder King]

I'd definitely have cut Sera and Blackwall, if there were any companions to be on the chopping block.

And it might surprise you, but I wouldn't cut Solas at all. Despite my issues with him, he's an important player on the metaphorical game board now. He also serves as a big lore dump in the Arbor Wilds. An irritating one, but a lore dump nonetheless.

To be honest the one I wouldn't surely cut is Solas, and for the same reason as yours (beside the later reveal, which would made him impossible to be cut. And the switch from companion to (possible) antagonist is really interesting to me). I like all the rest of the companiosn and advisors, more or less, so I'd leave others in charge of the decision of who should be cut if I had the chance . 

[SamaraDraven]

And here we get into: which companions to keep (there are huge fans of all of them?)

 

This is why I think locking out characters based on choices would work. No one needs to be cut. You'll experience the companions you missed on a different playthrough. That way, it keeps the noise down but leaves all characters potentially accessible, though not simultaneously.

 

I didn't mind any of the zones, aside from the Storm Coast. I'd rather they cut down on fetch BS. "We've got over a hundred hours of content!" of which 80 are all fetching stuff.

[Tishina]

This is why I think locking out characters based on choices would work. No one needs to be cut. You'll experience the companions you missed on a different playthrough. That way, it keeps the noise down but leaves all characters potentially accessible., if not simultaneously.

 

I didn't mind any of the zones, aside from the Storm Coast. I'd rather they cut down on fetch BS. "We've got over a hundred hours of content!" of which 80 are all fetching stuff.

Far too true about the fetch quests (I also hated ones that required not only jumping but locating a particular route that you couldn't mark down on your map for later, sigh.) But I think a lot of the conversation was how to rearrange their time resources in order to do a really good job on fewer allied NPCs. The ratio of actual companion content to game time is way out of whack, I think.

 

I rather liked the war table missions in a general way, though it worked best in adding content that didn't need the IQ's personal involvement (which is where a lot of the fetch quests really belonged.) But while I get that they had to do the personal race missions using the war table because they'd already recorded the VAs, I hated that they substituted that for any real personal content. It was especially jarring if you played a Dalish and got your clan killed, but for my dwarf, it seemed completely...irrelevant. I know nothing about the person contacting me, and the missions themselves are totally forgettable (I can't even remember any of the details, unlike with the Dalish one.) I didn't get that far on my qunari playthrough, but the merc contacting you at least had some personality and the letters were funny. Still seemed disconnected and irrelevant, though.

[Hellion Rex]

I think a lot of the War Table added some familiar names, places, and cameos that otherwise might not have been seen in the game. The HoF and Maevaris are decent examples of this. Also, it was cool how you could technically influence different places and nations with your actions. Brokering peace between Orlais and Ferelden, and even stopping a fight between Nevarra and Tevinter. It wasn't as powerful as if it was fully in the game, but reading about it was pretty cool.

[CuriousArtemis]

His little bits of remorse thrown into lines didn't really make me feel they were trying to 'not forget about his past troubles' more like they were trying to make him apologise to all those that hated that part of him. Along with random comments from people that praised him for being a good leader. He's a commander of an army, of course he is good at leading or he wouldn't be there. I think they tried too hard to apologise for him, that still makes me angry.

YESSS This.

[Sifr]

I will also disagree on Vivienne being nixed. She had a strong place being in Inquisition, as she represented those mages within the Circles. She was really important because of how this whole game started with the Mage Templar War, which she was a figure in.

 

Not really, her being the "leader" of the Loyalists never factored into the resolution of the Mage-Templar conflict, nor did she have anything particularly interesting to say regarding it (beyond some catty remarks to Fiona). Even her field of expertise which is the Orlesian court, never gave her anything unique when it came to how Halamshiral played out.

 

Honestly, the reason I put her being the "leader" in quotations because it felt like a self-appointed title that was an authority-in-name-only, given that we never see her coordinating with anyone in the remnants of the Circle. Never do see her wield authority within her faction, or even that faction at all. It gets worse that we actually do meet a few Loyalists who joined up with the rebels in Redcliffe, because they had no leadership or protection for them when the Circle's fell... so what precisely has dear Vivienne been doing all this time, beyond soirees and salons?

 

Vivienne was like the Mage-Templar war, something that ended up being a dud because it never was given any kind of story or development within Inquisition that made us care about how it resolved. It should have been something that was on-going throughout the game, not simply abruptly end with one side being wiped out.

 

But the worst flaw is that the woman we meet in Inquisition and Trespasser is the exact same person. She's not undergone any change whatsoever, unlike the rest of the characters, because she lacked any semblance of arc or character development whatsoever. Even the Bastien plotline that did let us peak under the mask for a brief moment, had her remain the same old Ice Queen afterwards, nor did we have any reason to necessarily care about her sugar daddy since he was a non-character for us anyway?

[Hellion Rex]

Meh, I disagree vehemently. She was hardly a dud character. And in regards to Trespasser, was she supposed to change at all? I'd argue that none of the companions changed at all. I'd like to see an example of a companion that has evolved in the span of years since DAI's end. Their personalities and characteristics are the exact same in Trespasser as they were at game's end.

The only one you might make an argument for change is Solas, and that's only because we figured out that he'd been lying to us the whole time and wasn't who he said he was.

[Hellion Rex]

Expanding a bit further, there's nothing coming to mind that happened to any of the companions that would provoke some sort of character growth between DAI and Trespasser

I could see a case also for Cole/Maryden and Dorian's father. But even then, I'd argue that it simply reinforces what we have already known about them and what their motivations are post-personal quest.

[CuriousArtemis]

I agree with everything Sifr said about Vivienne, and that's not to say that I disliked Vivienne at all; hardly! Going in she was one of my favorite characters, and throughout my first playthrough, I utterly adored her, loved her look, her voice-acting, etc. But like so many characters and ideas in DAI, it was a whole lot of excitement and expectation that ultimately resulted in.... nothing. Vivienne is the leader of... nothing and no one that we ever see, hear, or encounter. Vivienne's opinions are given only if you seek her out at Skyhold or Haven. Vivienne is not involved in major decision-making plot outcomes. Vivienne does not appear in any major cut scenes. Again, I like Vivienne. I LIKE HER A LOT!!! But it's sort of like buying a gorgeous brand new BMW, feeling super excited as you settle into the driver's seat for the first time, turn the ignition... and nothing happens.

 

I'd argue that none of the companions changed at all. I'd like to see an example of a companion that has evolved in the span of years since DAI's end. Their personalities and characteristics are the exact same in Trespasser as they were at game's end.

 

And this is... a good thing? Because you're quite right! Think about how characters like Fenris, Anders, and Aveline change. Fenris has to adjust some of his feelings about mages (especially when in a romance). Anders (technically "Janders") grows even more extreme as his sanity slowly slips away. Aveline makes dry comments about how she must set aside her belief in the law to help Hawke do unsavory things; she also grows past her grief for Wesley and moves on to Donnic and grapples, too, with becoming head of the guard. Imagine if there had been four or five MORE major characters in DA2; would they have been able to devote that amount of time to individual characters? Would we have gotten an entire quest that involves helping Aveline go out on a date? Would we have had the opportunity to help Fenris THREE TIMES to deal with his past? Doubt it. They would've been as much a dud as Vivienne, Blackwall, or Sera. And that's... tragic! The DAI characters had such amazing potential. 

[Sifr]

Meh, I disagree vehemently. She was hardly a dud character. And in regards to Trespasser, was she supposed to change at all? I'd argue that none of the companions changed at all. I'd like to see an example of a companion that has evolved in the span of years since DAI's end. Their personalities and characteristics are the exact same in Trespasser as they were at game's end.

The only one you might make an argument for change is Solas, and that's only because we figured out that he'd been lying to us the whole time and wasn't who he said he was.

 

Save for putting her in a place that can lead her to becoming the (worst) Divine, what precisely would be different about Vivienne, be it her character or her story, were she never to have been recruited into the Inquisition?

 

While we do see that she did love Bastien, we don't see her change or react differently following his death, nor do we see her act differently after any of the events of the game regarding the mages. Vivienne never lets the facade of Madame De Fer drop, so we never really get to know her or what makes her tick, save for her lust for power and prestige. It makes her bland because we don't really know anything about her.

 

Seriously, name something about Vivienne's personal background or history that she actually bothers to open up and share with us, that's not simply basic information? The closest might be how she met Bastien, but even that's talking about him, rather than telling us anything personal about herself.

 

In comparison, if we look at the changes that others go through;

 

Spoiler

Varric has to deal with his feelings of guilt from discovering Red Lyrium, accidentally freeing Corypheus and possibly indirectly causing the death of Hawke, his best friend who was only at Adamant because he got them involved? By Trespasser, him bankrolling the restoration of Kirkwall has led him to being made the new Viscount, a major shift from the Merchant Prince who lived in - and sole ambition was to try to steal ownership of - the Hanged Man in DA2.

 

Sera doesn't have much of an arc, but over the course of Inquisition and Trespasser she does become slightly more mature. She shows concern over Lavellan's feelings when it comes to reveals about the Evanuris being False Gods, is the first to notice and show concern over the Anchor getting worse, as well as being the one who initiates the proposal if romanced.

 

As much as he believes he was a coward, Blackwall doesn't realise how much he became the mask over the years, having truly embraced the life of the Wardens and the values of the man he's pretending to be. He didn't have to join the Inquisition and risk exposure, but he couldn't not get involved because people needed help. He has the deal with the revelation about his true identity and the broken trust with certain friends. By Trespasser, he's gone back to his old name and is seeking to do good, either as a Warden or by seeking forgiveness from those he wronged.

 

Bull's arc leads him to different places. He either reaffirms his place among the Qunari as the loyal Hissrad, who ultimately dies as a consequence of this obedience in Trespasser. Or he deals with the ramifications of saving the Chargers, by being made Tal-Vashoth and finding comfort among his friends, as well as fighting an invasion by his own people in Trespasser.

 

Cole becomes either more Spirit-like or more human. The former allowing him to help as he was meant to while being more detached, the latter making him into more of an individual, who feels more connected to those he's helping. Plus he can also get a girlfriend, good for him!

 

Cassandra can become a warmer individual across the events of the game, having found a connection with the people in the Inquisition that she didn't necessarily have among her fellow Seekers. Her arc either has her attempt to restore the Seekers or reform the Chantry as the Divine.

 

Dorian can form probably some of the deepest friendships he has ever had, among people who accept him for who he is, especially if befriended by the Inquisitor. He becomes more motivated to want to put his money where his mouth is and try to change Tevinter for the better, rather than sit idle and remain apathetic about it like many of his countrymen do. He has to deal with his own personal conflicts with his family, as well as later his father's assassination in Trespasser. He also has to deal with his former mentor Alexius, if you chose to do In Hushed Whispers.

 

And Solas can become torn over his plans due to his romance arc with Lavellan or friendship with the Inquisitor, so that he now understands something of what Felassan was talking about in Masked Empire.

[CuriousArtemis]

And here we get into: which companions to keep (there are huge fans of all of them?) And which game zones to drop? The Hissing Wastes may be my favorite zone (aside from the amount of dwarviness we got, I generally loved the open feel of the terrain, the moonlight, etc.) It was the one zone you could actually ride across without having dropping to a walk every four steps because your mount tripped on a near invisible stone (I literally forgot I had a mount in my first playthrough until I got there because it seemed like such a waste of time in other zones.)

 

But just a reminder to be kind about other people's favorites. I suspect Solas is the only character that all of us would admit was essential, and even then, that's as much for the future of the stories as DA:I itself. As far as the advisors, why not simply let the companions left behind on the last mission or had the least active play function as the advisors instead of separate ones? I get that it was supposed to allow for including a non-combatant on your team (Josephine)...but even she had trained as a bard. Using companions as advisors would let them put more resources into telling those stories, and the imbalance between the length of the game and the content for companions was probably the flaw that bugged me the most (after the treatment of dwarves.)

 

Of course, remember that not all races got treated equally. If you cut Harding and her pseudo-romance, my female dwarves would be left up a creek, high and dry (unless they ungated one of the gated romances or bothered to fix the Blackwall one...levitating boobs ahoy!)

 

I don't think I've said anything unkind; I've been speaking very objectively. I agree that Solas is the only character who is essential because effort was made to create a compelling and richly complex character who was deeply involved in the plot of the narrative. The only character who comes even close to this level of attention is Cassandra, and she bizarrely disappears midway through the game and is even supplanted by Morrigan at the war table. 

 

No, not all races got treated equally, and not all genders, either. I'm not really talking about romances; that's kind of a different discussion, honestly. I think the decisions made concerning romances were a massive debacle. Fairness was an issue; stereotyping was an issue; sheer cut scene quality was an issue. But yeah, that's a different discussion. I still advocate no more than SIX major companions; feel free to divde those up equally according to gender and sexuality and race. (Personally I advocate making all romances available to all PCs, as you know!)

 

Oh, and as for the maps... I, too, love The Hissing Wastes. It's my favorite map because it's so haunting and beautiful. BUT IT ADDS NOTHING TO THE STORY!!! It's just a big beautiful map. Yes it has some interesting dwarven lore. I can read about lore on the wiki or in a book. When it comes to game time, everything, and I mean everything, should be in support of the narrative, if that's the type of game you're trying to create (which is pretty much what BioWare does). If you're looking to simply a create a massive, absolutely beautiful world with hundreds of codices to collect, then you're probably looking for something like Skyrim (which is fine; I love Skyrim!)

 

I rather liked the war table missions in a general way, though it worked best in adding content that didn't need the IQ's personal involvement (which is where a lot of the fetch quests really belonged.) But while I get that they had to do the personal race missions using the war table because they'd already recorded the VAs, I hated that they substituted that for any real personal content. It was especially jarring if you played a Dalish and got your clan killed, but for my dwarf, it seemed completely...irrelevant. I know nothing about the person contacting me, and the missions themselves are totally forgettable (I can't even remember any of the details, unlike with the Dalish one.) I didn't get that far on my qunari playthrough, but the merc contacting you at least had some personality and the letters were funny. Still seemed disconnected and irrelevant, though.

 

I still maintain that the War Table was just a waste of time and a sad attempt to get all their ideas into one game. The amount of sh!ts I gave about whether or not a noble girl and her boyfriend managed to run away together or not is so small it cannot be counted lol And yes the Dalish clan storyline is just so sad and weak... I mean the effort is sad and weak. Can you imagine playing the Dalish origin in DAO and learning via a letter that your whole clan was wiped out. Then you go around camp talking to everyone and not a single companion mentions it. WTF. They just wouldn't have considered even making that kind of mistake in DAO. And I'm not exactly a huge fan of DAO but it had a nice, tight narrative (that sentence could've ended so dirty...). Things happened and we reacted to them. Albeit silently and with a creepy murder face in all the cut scenes, but we reacted nonetheless.

[Hellion Rex]

I agree with everything Sifr said about Vivienne, and that's not to say that I disliked Vivienne at all; hardly! Going in she was one of my favorite characters, and throughout my first playthrough, I utterly adored her, loved her look, her voice-acting, etc. But like so many characters and ideas in DAI, it was a whole lot of excitement and expectation that ultimately resulted in.... nothing. Vivienne is the leader of... nothing and no one that we ever see, hear, or encounter. Vivienne's opinions are given only if you seek her out at Skyhold or Haven. Vivienne is not involved in major decision-making plot outcomes. Vivienne does not appear in any major cut scenes. Again, I like Vivienne. I LIKE HER A LOT!!! But it's sort of like buying a gorgeous brand new BMW, feeling super excited as you settle into the driver's seat for the first time, turn the ignition... and nothing happens.


And this is... a good thing? Because you're quite right! Think about how characters like Fenris, Anders, and Aveline change. Fenris has to adjust some of his feelings about mages (especially when in a romance). Anders (technically "Janders") grows even more extreme as his sanity slowly slips away. Aveline makes dry comments about how she must set aside her belief in the law to help Hawke do unsavory things; she also grows past her grief for Wesley and moves on to Donnic and grapples, too, with becoming head of the guard. Imagine if there had been four or five MORE major characters in DA2; would they have been able to devote that amount of time to individual characters? Would we have gotten an entire quest that involves helping Aveline go out on a date? Would we have had the opportunity to help Fenris THREE TIMES to deal with his past? Doubt it. They would've been as much a dud as Vivienne, Blackwall, or Sera. And that's... tragic! The DAI characters had such amazing potential.

In regards to DA2 companions though, there were major differences, primarily being that the game spanned for 7 years versus the 1 year in DAI, with a short episode 3 years later.

[Sifr]

I agree with everything Sifr said about Vivienne, and that's not to say that I disliked Vivienne at all; hardly! Going in she was one of my favorite characters, and throughout my first playthrough, I utterly adored her, loved her look, her voice-acting, etc. But like so many characters and ideas in DAI, it was a whole lot of excitement and expectation that ultimately resulted in.... nothing. Vivienne is the leader of... nothing and no one that we ever see, hear, or encounter. Vivienne's opinions are given only if you seek her out at Skyhold or Haven. Vivienne is not involved in major decision-making plot outcomes. Vivienne does not appear in any major cut scenes. Again, I like Vivienne. I LIKE HER A LOT!!! But it's sort of like buying a gorgeous brand new BMW, feeling super excited as you settle into the driver's seat for the first time, turn the ignition... and nothing happens.

 

This is my problem with her as well, because Maker knows I want to love her character! But she ended up being disappointing, because there's nothing about her that was explored and had a story to tell, something that said she could bring more to the table than... stuff to the war table?

 

I mean, have a rival in the Great Game discover out something blackmail worthy on Bastien, Vivienne or about her parents, give her something to do with the Mages if you allied with them, give her something she could do in Halamshiral... there was so many interesting options and places they could have taken her, but they kind of wasted them a little?

 

Personally, would have been intriguing if she was present during the Spire during the events of Asunder, since she never seems to indicate that she was present at either vote when the Rebellion began? I wonder if she'd have been so quick to call her colleagues "terrorists" if she'd been actually in the room when Lambert kicked down the door and wanted to start a fight? Would have also given her something to discuss with Cole that wasn't solely lobbing insults at him and accusing him of being a demon.

[CuriousArtemis]

In regards to DA2 companions though, there were major differences, primarily being that the game spanned for 7 years versus the 1 year in DAI, with a short episode 3 years later.

 

That's certainly true, and that's a good point. But surely we aren't going to blame the fact that DAI had terrible characterization (and character growth) because its narrative only spanned one year instead of seven. Pride and Prejudice spans approximately 15 months (if I remember correctly), and the fact that the characters must grow and evolve is literally in the title.

[The Elder King]

I don't think that DAI had terrible characterization and/orcharacter grow. This happened for DA2 as well (people criticizing this matter of the game). 

[The dead fish]

Honestly that's the problem though? The reason people (like me) liked him was because he was a complex and interesting character; he was a character of fascinating and REAL contradictions: an honorable, moral man, a good man at heart, but a man who had made questionably moral choices in the past and who stubbornly held to his beliefs about mages for a long, long time. This could've been explored to its fullest extent in DAI but instead they essentially gave us a pretty ken doll whom we help kick a LIFELONG addiction in a couple months. And that's pretty much his entire story in DAI. 

 

Wow. I'd cry If I could. This is exactly that guy that I loved.  I think everyone remember that I loved Cullen and claimed it several times in this thread; the Cullen from DAII, his charcter development from DAO to DAII. I was really hopeful about what would follow. Of course after DAI, I never came back again in this thread until today. Simply because I was terribly disappointed with the new Cullen. He wasn't the same to me. You can change as well, but it wasn't that. It felt disconnected from the previous episodes, Cullen felt disconnected. Now infortunately I just feel that he just became a ken doll, the perfect husband, even his romance is boring to me and that annoys me. 

 

Also the fact that Bioware keep telling us how Cullen is pretty, loved, wanted by everyone can only annoys me even more, whether in Trepasser or in Halamshiral, or comments between Josephine and Leliana. We get it, Cullen is a pretty boy, a dream for women. Okay, stop wth that crap. I'd like to think of him as a serious commander, not a popular top model.

 

Cullen is not anymore the fascinating character that gave me chills. I like him, but just as much  as I would like any random npc that is loyal and nice to me as a commander in in my army. That's it. Cullen became a bit too bland. I'm disappointed with what her new writer did with him. But he isn't the only one. I agree about what was said about Vivienne and Blackwall. 

[The Elder King]

I honestly think he's the same character, in terms of personality, as he was in DA2. With just a shift to a more moderate position on mages (which would've happened anyway I think). I do agree that they missed the opportunity to explain more this shift, and that the lyirum addiction plot might've been better switched with a plot about the whole mage-templar situation and his beliefs. But DAI in general in underwhelming in that regards. Though both the mage and templar 'recruitment' quest were very well done in my opinion.

[Sifr]

 

Also the fact that Bioware keep telling us how Cullen is pretty, loved, wanted by everyone can only annoys me even more, whether in Trepasser or in Halamshiral, or comments between Josephine and Leliana. We get it, Cullen is a pretty boy, a dream for women. Okay, stop wth that crap. I'd like to think of him as a serious commander, not a popular top model.

 

At least Cassandra treats him with due respect as the Inquisition's military commander, never making those kind of comments about him. Besides her being a Seeker and thus understanding what he'd be going through, I think that the other reason Cullen confided in her about his intention to cease taking Lyrium was because he considers her more of a friend than Leliana or Josephine.

 

You do get the sense that Cullen and Cassandra share a mutual respect and trust and are often on the same wavelength, even if they happen to disagree on a particular issue. Probably because both of them are career military, so they have a lot in common and love rules, as Bull comments on. Aveline is very similar in this regard too, so that's probably why Cullen ended up befriending her at some point during the gap between DA2 and DAI.

[Tishina]

I don't think I've said anything unkind; I've been speaking very objectively. I agree that Solas is the only character who is essential because effort was made to create a compelling and richly complex character who was deeply involved in the plot of the narrative. The only character who comes even close to this level of attention is Cassandra, and she bizarrely disappears midway through the game and is even supplanted by Morrigan at the war table. 

 

No, not all races got treated equally, and not all genders, either. I'm not really talking about romances; that's kind of a different discussion, honestly. I think the decisions made concerning romances were a massive debacle. Fairness was an issue; stereotyping was an issue; sheer cut scene quality was an issue. But yeah, that's a different discussion. I still advocate no more than SIX major companions; feel free to divde those up equally according to gender and sexuality and race. (Personally I advocate making all romances available to all PCs, as you know!)

 

Oh, and as for the maps... I, too, love The Hissing Wastes. It's my favorite map because it's so haunting and beautiful. BUT IT ADDS NOTHING TO THE STORY!!! It's just a big beautiful map. Yes it has some interesting dwarven lore. I can read about lore on the wiki or in a book. When it comes to game time, everything, and I mean everything, should be in support of the narrative, if that's the type of game you're trying to create (which is pretty much what BioWare does). If you're looking to simply a create a massive, absolutely beautiful world with hundreds of codices to collect, then you're probably looking for something like Skyrim (which is fine; I love Skyrim!)

 

 

I still maintain that the War Table was just a waste of time and a sad attempt to get all their ideas into one game. The amount of sh!ts I gave about whether or not a noble girl and her boyfriend managed to run away together or not is so small it cannot be counted lol And yes the Dalish clan storyline is just so sad and weak... I mean the effort is sad and weak. Can you imagine playing the Dalish origin in DAO and learning via a letter that your whole clan was wiped out. Then you go around camp talking to everyone and not a single companion mentions it. WTF. They just wouldn't have considered even making that kind of mistake in DAO. And I'm not exactly a huge fan of DAO but it had a nice, tight narrative (that sentence could've ended so dirty...). Things happened and we reacted to them. Albeit silently and with a creepy murder face in all the cut scenes, but we reacted nonetheless.

I wasn't targeting any one person, just a reminder, generally, that people can react strongly to anything critical of their own favorites. I'd rather not see a casual discussion become heated by accident...

 

So, honestly, did ANY map zone actually add much to the story? Fallowmire or the Forbidden Oasis, for instance? The Hinterlands is enormous, but really, meeting up with the priest in the Crossroads and a few bits at Redcliffe itself are the only parts important to the story. Even recruiting the horsemaster isn't important to the plot. The main story scenes almost all take place outside the regular explorable zones. I don't count Orlais because it really wasn't a map zone as much as a shopping and meeting destination. The one exception might be the Arbor Wilds. Otherwise, the actual plot takes you to Therinfal Redoubt, Redcliffe Castle, Halam'shiral, Adamant Fortress, etc.

[Hellion Rex]

Wow. I'd cry If I could. This is exactly that guy that I loved. I think everyone remember that I loved Cullen and claimed it several times in this thread; the Cullen from DAII, his charcter development from DAO to DAII. I was really hopeful about what would follow. Of course after DAI, I never came back again in this thread until today. Simply because I was terribly disappointed with the new Cullen. He wasn't the same to me. You can change as well, but it wasn't that. It felt disconnected from the previous episodes, Cullen felt disconnected. Now infortunately I just feel that he just became a ken doll, the perfect husband, even his romance is boring to me and that annoys me.

Also the fact that Bioware keep telling us how Cullen is pretty, loved, wanted by everyone can only annoys me even more, whether in Trepasser or in Halamshiral, or comments between Josephine and Leliana. We get it, Cullen is a pretty boy, a dream for women. Okay, stop wth that crap. I'd like to think of him as a serious commander, not a popular top model.

Cullen is not anymore the fascinating character that gave me chills. I like him, but just as much as I would like any random npc that is loyal and nice to me as a commander in in my army. That's it. Cullen became a bit too bland. I'm disappointed with what her new writer did with him. But he isn't the only one. I agree about what was said about Vivienne and Blackwall.

Considering the nature of where Halamshiral is located, it didn't surprise me the sexual nature of them. I'd almost consider it uncharacteristic if they were avoided. That said, there were only a few comments here and there, so I don't think it was as bad as you were making. And despite that, I had never any indications that our troops or other people in power considered Cullen to be anything other than our military leader and a very capable one at that. Hell, Gaspard lets Cullen get first crack at the graduating class of Chevaliers.

[The dead fish]

Considering the nature of where Halamshiral is located, it didn't surprise me the sexual nature of them. I'd almost consider it uncharacteristic if they were avoided. That said, there were only a few comments here and there, so I don't think it was as bad as you were making. And despite that, I had never any indications that our troops or other people in power considered Cullen to be anything other than our military leader and a very capable one at that. Hell, Gaspard lets Cullen get first crack at the graduating class of Chevaliers.

 

Really ? A few comments ? What do you call a few comments ? You had literally in Halamshiral a whole thing happening about how people find Cullen absolutely beautiful, even touching his butt in the end. It lasts a few minutes. in other parts of Halamshiral, you had other people saying a nice comment about Cullen... Leliana and Josephine have a party banter about Cullen's popularity. Or  ' shuut, be pretty and shut up. ' Or how about Sera commenting about how the hair of Cullen look nice ? Or how Josephine in Trepasser say how many want Cullen, and how they could have projects of marriage for him ? Or even Varric ?

 

Oh and do I need to talk about the free fanservice that was Cullen running naked ? reminding me again how Cullen is supposed to be ' that guy ' ?

 

Yes, it happens, to the point that you CAN'T FORGET that Cullen is a pretty boy and admired for it.  

[Hellion Rex]

Really ? A few comments ? What do you call a few comments ? You had literally in Halamshiral a whole thing happening about how people find Cullen absolutely beautiful, even touching his butt in the end. It lasts a few minutes. in other parts of Halamshiral, you had other people saying a nice comment about Cullen... Leliana and Josephine have a party banter about Cullen's popularity. Or shuut, be pretty and shut up. Or how about Sera commenting about how the hair of Cullen look nice ? Or how Josephine in Trepasser say how many want Cullen, and how they could have projects of marriage for him ? Or even Varric

Oh and do I need to talk about the free fanservice that was Cullen running naked ? reminding me again how Cullen is supposed to be ' that guy '

Yes, it happens, to the point that you CAN'T FORGET that Cullen is a pretty boy and admired for it.

Again though, that seems more like it's your own personal immersion being ruined, not mine. Being labeled attractive and being shown to be desirable hardly detracts from his character, for me.

[The dead fish]

Again though, that seems more like it's your own personal immersion being ruined, not mine. Being labeled attractive and being shown to be desirable hardly detracts from his character, for me.

 

Where did I say my immersion was ruined. I simply found it annoying. In only two posts, you gave me twice the impression that you like to use hyperbole. 

[CuriousArtemis]

You do get the sense that Cullen and Cassandra share a mutual respect and trust and are often on the same wavelength, even if they happen to disagree on a particular issue. Probably because both of them are career military, so they have a lot in common and love rules, as Bull comments on. Aveline is very similar in this regard too, so that's probably why Cullen ended up befriending her at some point during the gap between DA2 and DAI.

 

True, I like how Cass is the person Cullen goes to first about going off lyrium. That's a relationship I would've liked to have seen more defined!

 

I wasn't targeting any one person, just a reminder, generally, that people can react strongly to anything critical of their own favorites. I'd rather not see a casual discussion become heated by accident...

 

So, honestly, did ANY map zone actually add much to the story? Fallowmire or the Forbidden Oasis, for instance? The Hinterlands is enormous, but really, meeting up with the priest in the Crossroads and a few bits at Redcliffe itself are the only parts important to the story. Even recruiting the horsemaster isn't important to the plot. The main story scenes almost all take place outside the regular explorable zones. I don't count Orlais because it really wasn't a map zone as much as a shopping and meeting destination. The one exception might be the Arbor Wilds. Otherwise, the actual plot takes you to Therinfal Redoubt, Redcliffe Castle, Halam'shiral, Adamant Fortress, etc.

 

Well, sorry not sorry, I guess? If we can't speak critically about various aspects of the game then there's really no point in having a discussion thread anyway. I guess I was just a little confused because when you posted that I hadn't seen anyone saying anything rude yet, so I was like, huh.

 

I mean, I'll make an example of myself. Someone wants to come in an criticize Fenris in a rational way, I'll listen with guarded interest but interest nonetheless, and I'll either disagree or concede the point (because that's how argument works), but if someone comes in a screams that Fenris is just an emo anime boy created to please the yaoi fangirls yes then I could see that being problematic lol 

 

And, um, yeah. Totally agree. Proves my point lol The game's a frigging mess.