682 réponses à ce sujet

[Ellanya]

Definitely number 3! It was nice! 

[MrMrPendragon]

yes the prostitute scene are not that great but really fade to black after the conversation with "Your party lost 5 gold" is just as crap.

That bugbear is that for example a just for sex "sex scene" fits Isabella character perfectly, in fact several several occurrences of the a fore mentioned fit the character regardless if it is a 1,2,3 or 4.

regardless no one can say that brothel sex scene are forced in the player. It is a deliberate choice that the player makes. i can understand that people might be surprised by the way a conversation develops through again we all know where clinking on the heart option will lead.

phil

Sure, sure. I'm just saying the brothel scene shouldn't be used as a measuring stick or something. And yeah, you're right, fade to black with "Lost 5 gold" (that is an expensive prostitute btw) is crap.

And with regards to the "fits with the character" romance scene, I believe an option can be used as a guideline. All sex scenes can still be option 3 or 4, but each scene is modified to, like you said, "fit" the character.

[philippe willaume]

The "treat us like adults" argument has always struck me as odd.

 

I don't know anyone I consider an adult IRL who demands to see full-frontal nudity in all of their "mature" entertainment products.

 

That's probably because you are taking the argument to the extreme of one side.

The vast majority of people who ask does not ask for DA III: Spartacus inquisition

it is not a matter of demanding and wanting it everywhere, it is a matter of if you are going to allude to sex and intimacy treat us like grown up,

 

and as grown up we do object just as much to newton defying breast with the astounding ability to stay in very little cloth or armour just as we do dry humping in bridget jones hundies.

 

philippe

[Mirdarion]

None would be okay for me. If I wanted to see that kind of stuff, there is more than one website where people port other games models to the source engine to do that... However, since I'm an ignoramus, I wouldn't be bothered by that. Just like my reaction to The Witcher 3: "Oh, sex. Is it story relevant? No? Okay. Wanted to make new tea anyway."

 

Perhaps the internet and the normal life have blunted me somewhat, but sex scenes don't make a game mature for me. They could put open porn into a game and it wouldn't make the game more mature than a "fade-out"-scene would make it less mature. Even KOTOR where the kiss-scene was faded out was a mature game (at least as mature as a Star Wars-game under Lucas' eyes could be).

[Cainhurst Crow]

Fade to black because everything else leads to stupid silly sex scenes, see traynor shower scene, origins underwear sex, etc. Don't even know why we need sex in these romances, and can't just have them kissing or something. It'd spare the stupidity of underwear showing up in the whole sequence while still delivering basically the same damn product.

[philippe willaume]

Sure, sure. I'm just saying the brothel scene shouldn't be used as a measuring stick or something. And yeah, you're right, fade to black with "Lost 5 gold" (that is an expensive prostitute btw) is crap.

And with regards to the "fits with the character" romance scene, I believe an option can be used as a guideline. All sex scenes can still be option 3 or 4, but each scene is modified to, like you said, "fit" the character.

 

I think we are on the same wave length. 

i am more thinking on have 3-4 for the few times where it is important for the relation, relationship or story.

then fade to black/cut  can be use quite effectively especially if it is to show/tell that the intimacy/relationship is till active and may be that can be used to have the companion having a more active part without having the work of a full blow 3-4 scene.

 

as well if people wants romance without having to watch a 3-4 may be we can have dialog like press enter to skip scene option (or an automated version of that.

 

Phil

[Han Shot First]

Fade to black because everything else leads to stupid silly sex scenes, see traynor shower scene, origins underwear sex, etc. Don't even know why we need sex in these romances, and can't just have them kissing or something. It'd spare the stupidity of underwear showing up in the whole sequence while still delivering basically the same damn product.

 

Just out of curiosity, do you feel the same way about books and film as well? 

[CybAnt1]

Unfortunately, I think the problem is these games can be purchased and played by children.

 

The Dragon Age series is currently rated "M" by the ESRB.

 

http://www.esrb.org/...tings_guide.jsp

 

I guess they have to be careful to avoid an "A" rating.

 

If it did have one, most game shops won't sell it to someone under 17. (Although I don't think this is enforced anywhere near like the R rating for movies.)

 

As of now, the "M" means it is suggested only people over 17 should play it, and it's kind of a warning for parents perhaps to engage some supervision for children playing it under 17, but people who are 10-12, say, could be playing it unsupervised.

 

We could have the discussion about what children should or should not see in entertainment products, and whether we should constantly invoke that to affect what adults can or cannot consume, but it's a separate one.

 

As is the one, of course, as to why people rarely raise this objection to gratuitous violence, like say blood-splatter animations, and what effect that might have on children (perhaps some parents are more bothered by that than that they may see nipples, or silhouetted nudity).

 

But I digress.

[AlanC9]

I'll be glad when game shops finally go away for good. But you're right, we're not there yet

[Oswin]

Over here in the UK, both Origins and 2 had an 18 rating. That's the highest rating we give. So they could bring all the nakedness into Inquisition and it wouldn't effect the rating (or it could just get censored, like many things over in the EU do)

 

Always felt it seemed a bit of an odd rating for it. Especially when compared to other games with the same rating (like Grand Theft Auto). Or with TV shows; season 3 of Game of Thrones was only rated a 15 and that has way more bad language/nudity/gore than either Origins or 2 

 

Ah, but yes; on the whole censorship issue. That is a problem if option 4 was to happen. We have suffered a lot of censored games in Europe lately and I would really hate to have to go through this again. Might kill the romance a bit 

[CybAnt1]

Oh, it's just one of my favorite little pet oddities. People will think a game with limbs being hacked off and dismembered, entrails spilling out onto the floor, and blood splatters flying dozens of feet in every direction, as not a problem for children. Ahhh, but any hint of erotism or sensuality between human beings and their lives could be irrevocably harmed and shattered.

 

It truly amazes me how many people in the USA called into ABC over incredible outrage over the deadly threat of Janet Jackson's nipple, and the horrors its appearance posed at the Super Bowl.

 

By the way, the U.S. ESRB ratings are supposed to be based on both sex and violence, yet (IMHO) just like the movies, they really do seem to weight one far more than the other.

 

Thus, as a result, developers have to be on their toes about showing that people using the shower usually do so nude (btw, whether that is about to lead to a sexual encounter or not), but the dismemberment, or gangsta crime sprees and torture porn, well go for that.

[chris2365]

Definitely 3. Mass Effect 1 executed them very well, and it's the style I'd like to see them adopting forward. Mass Effect 3's were also ok, depending on the character. For example, Ashley starts off in her underwear, followed by a fade to black. When they wake up they still have their underwear on, even though the camera angles don't show anything. That was not well done. Liara's on the other hand, was.

[Reclusiarch]

Thanks for keeping the discussion nice and mature. Nice to see all this feedback!

[Remmirath]

Fade to black is preferable to me, unless for some reason the scene is actually plot or character relevant such that it actually needs to be seen rather than assumed. I'm guessing that's not going to be the case, though I can't rule it out.

I have no particular problem with sex scenes, however, although I find them entirely uninteresting and would certainly rather resources be spent elsewhere. If they're there, I'll either skip them or take the opportunity to grab a drink, and I won't complain about their inclusion. I realise (or certainly assume, otherwise many things about the entertainment industry make no sense at all) most people don't find them so boring as I do.

I do feel the same way about them in books or movies. I'm most likely to find that they actually contribute something in books, probably because in a book they can be used as a vehicle to show a character's thought processes and such. Not that they always are. I skip over the ones where that isn't the case. Films and games are far less likely to reveal anything in that fashion, so it's just a dull few minutes. I feel the same way about other uninteresting things that don't advance the plot or character development directly: I don't want to see/read details about a character choosing their clothing in the morning or taking a bath unless there's something to be revealed from that, either.

If it did have one, most game shops won't sell it to someone under 17. (Although I don't think this is enforced anywhere near like the R rating for movies.)
 
As of now, the "M" means it is suggested only people over 17 should play it, and it's kind of a warning for parents perhaps to engage some supervision for children playing it under 17, but people who are 10-12, say, could be playing it unsupervised.

I suppose it must be different where you are, but I've been carded every time I bought an M-rated game for the last seven years, so either store clerks have a conspiracy to annoy me (unlikely) or they won't sell M-rated games to anyone under seventeen. Now, I only even tried to purchase them for myself since I was seventeen, so I can't say for sure that they would actually do something about it if I were younger than that, but if they go through the trouble of carding people I presume that they wouldn't let younger people buy the games.

I do agree that the difference in how much people restrict violent content and sexual content is bizarre and more than a bit wrongheaded, but there it is.

[Twilight_Princess]

Thought this video was appropriate for this discussion
 
Angry Joe's thoughts on video game nudity
 

XD

[Hanako Ikezawa]

And the Dragon Age team lacks the maturity to do it well? I guess I see where you are coming from.

No, you clearly don't. I'm not accusing the DA team of being immature.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Just out of curiosity, do you feel the same way about books and film as well? 

 

Books and films don't try and have their cake and eat it to. They describe or show a sex scene, they don't show two people in their undies bumping uglies and call it sex. Bioware does. Bioware has been doing this for a while. And it's obvious bioware isn't going to stop insisting characters wear underwear and never be nude on screen. They did that once, and then they stopped, and I doubt they'll go back again, for whatever reason.

 

With that information in hand, it seems logical that the route to go is, rather then having them constantly trying to make underwear sex seem natural or appealing, to just do what mass effect 2 did and not have the characters strip at all, for the most part.

 

All I know is stuff like traynor or morrigans romance was just so incredibly dumb when it got to the supposed apex of their romance that it killed any romantic mood and just made it comedy.

[Mes]

All I know is stuff like traynor or morrigans romance was just so incredibly dumb when it got to the supposed apex of their romance that it killed any romantic mood and just made it comedy.

 

That's sort of what it did for me too - the awkwardness was very anti-climactic and, like I mentioned before, killed my immersion.

 

I remember thinking how weird mShep and Kaidan's bodies looked in ME3. All tetris-shaped buldging muscles, not to mention their heads looked ridiculous on the way oversized bed pillows... Just... no.

[daveliam]

Books and films don't try and have their cake and eat it to. They describe or show a sex scene, they don't show two people in their undies bumping uglies and call it sex.

 

Wait, what?  Are you claiming that there aren't movies that have "sex scenes" with people in their underwear?  Because, that's not really the case.  Like, at all.

 

Of course, don't get me wrong, they are equally ridiculous when it happens.

 

Also, not in response to this comment from above, that someone made a really great point earlier.  People keep putting the Witcher forward but that series also has ridiculous sex scenes as Gerhalt is wearing pants while the ladies are going all full frontal like.

[Cainhurst Crow]

That is weird, I will grant you. Though morrigan's still makes me laugh harder.

 

She wears more to cover her breasts when having sex then she does in her default clothing.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

The "treat us like adults" argument has always struck me as odd.
 
I don't know anyone I consider an adult IRL who demands to see full-frontal nudity in all of their "mature" entertainment products.

I do its togtfo for me, all the best shows on tv have nudity now.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Thought this video was appropriate for this discussion
 
Angry Joe's thoughts on video game nudity
 

XD

 

I forgot about that review. By god was that stripclub dumb as hell.

[Mockingword]

That's probably because you are taking the argument to the extreme of one side.

The vast majority of people who ask does not ask for DA III: Spartacus inquisition

it is not a matter of demanding and wanting it everywhere, it is a matter of if you are going to allude to sex and intimacy treat us like grown up,

 

and as grown up we do object just as much to newton defying breast with the astounding ability to stay in very little cloth or armour just as we do dry humping in bridget jones hundies.

 

philippe

I think fade-to-black treats you perfectly like a "grown up". If you know that sex is occuring (and as a "grown up", you should), why do you need it to be shown at all?

[Mockingword]

I do its togtfo for me, all the best shows on tv have nudity now.

Well, I don't know you IRL, and, to my mind, "****** or gtfo" is a childish attitude, not an adult one.

 

I don't know what shows you think are "the best", but I have serious doubts that nudity is an important component of their quality.

 

Also, let's be honest and make it clear that "nudity" refers to female nudity only. I seriously doubt that most of the people advocating for full-frontal scenes are hoping to see huge, pendulous dicks.

[Grieving Natashina]

I do its togtfo for me, all the best shows on tv have nudity now.

 

 

 

Well, this thread just went downhill quickly.