607 réponses à ce sujet

[Divine Justinia V]

this is still going on from last night? whew

[SerCambria358]

this is still going on from last night? whew

Thats bsn :/

[Master Warder Z_]

No they didnt, ive already given you a support from the WoT that says the Qunari AGREED to due to civilian losses, they werent the ones who initially sued for peace. We're going in circles because you ignore supporting evidence.

 

No, Actually that was a Codex.

 

And WOT supports the notion that they sued for Peace.

 

And no my friend, you ignore the evidence that doesn't fit with your preconceptions, that the Qunari were actually magically winning the war despite them being booted out of every front they opened besides Rivain and they were losing that by the end of the war.

[Master Warder Z_]

this is still going on from last night? whew

 

Eh, I get bored and i can support a bit of back and forth.

 

Besides arguing the Qunari wars is a fun little past time.

 

Especially with Qunari supporters because they get angry when you start pointing out that from a military standpoint, they were on the verge of defeat. Thedas was broken and bankrupt but it still was winning

[Divine Justinia V]

Eh, I get bored and i can support a bit of back and forth.

 

Besides arguing the Qunari wars is a fun little past time.

 

Especially with Qunari supporters because they get angry when you start pointing out that from a military standpoint, they were on the verge of defeat. Thedas was broken and bankrupt but it still was winning

 

lol Z, you're such an evil God

 

I do see both points, though. One is a bit stronger, imo though.

[SerCambria358]

No, Actually that was a Codex.

 

And WOT supports the notion that they sued for Peace.

 

And no my friend, you ignore the evidence that doesn't fit with your preconceptions, that the Qunari were actually magically winning the war despite them being booted out of every front they opened besides Rivain and they were losing that by the end of the war.

Then its a contradiction in lore, who's more likely to sue for peace, the nation who maintained a strong defense or the nation who failed to push their opponent? 

[Master Warder Z_]

Then its a contradiction in lore, who's more likely to sue for peace, the nation who maintained a strong defense or the nation who failed to push their opponent? 

 

The very codex you admitted showed that it was that person's perspective that it wasn't the destruction of their armies or navies, it was the killing of the population of a settlement that prompted that withdrawal. So what can we take from that? Thedas was obviously fairly successful at both in the late game, factor in their military failures of the recent decades and it can be safely said. Thedas didn't "fail" to push their opponent.

 

The Qunari were stuck in Rivain after all when they were in the Imperium, Antiva, Rivain and The Freemarches.

 

.-.

 

Your own source stresses that Thedas didn't fail to push anything, it just was supposedly not what prompted the end of the war. (Which i personally think is a load of crap, they were losing bad by that point)

[Mister Gusty]

"Massive Naval battle that was lost by them." Factor in that they were reduced a singular front, Also you left out how the mass combination of slave revolts and Magister counterattack, broke the siege of Tevinter and allowed the Imperium to renter the war after their capital was besieged. Sure Bioware wasn't as cut and dry as "they picked a fight with a continent while it took near two centuries they were losing by the end of it." But that isn't exactly inaccurate either, The timeline though is as you said not definite proof of a "rout" but it isn't proof there wasn't a "rout" what is confirmed though is that they were shoved out of the Imperium, The free Marches, Antiva and only clung to Rivain which was under siege by the time the war ended.

 

There is a difference between losing a massive battle and a massive defeat, one is losing a battle of a very large scale, the other is essentially being annihilated.

 

Also from WOT referencing the Qunari loss at Estwatch  

 

"The Qunari held the island until 7:78 Storm, when the Felicisima Armada, with the backing of the New Exalted Marches, fought a titanic battle in the waters around the island. It ended with the sinking of a dreadnought and the raiders taking over the port."

 

That isn't a massive defeat, that is just a defeat in a large scale battle, they only lost one dreadnought during that battle, according to WOT.

 

I am not going to try and make an argument out of this, I can see how someone could interpret WOT to see the Qunari clearly losing and I don't see the point in trying to change your viewpoint on it as you are entitled to see it that way. I personally don't see it this way but I'm also slightly biased by how much I like the qunari.

[SerCambria358]

The very codex you admitted showed that it was that person's perspective that it wasn't the destruction of their armies or navies, it was the killing of the population of a settlement that prompted that withdrawal. So what can we take from that? Thedas was obviously fairly successful at both in the late game, factor in their military failures of the recent decades and it can be safely said. Thedas didn't "fail" to push their opponent.

 

The Qunari were stuck in Rivain after all when they were in the Imperium, Antiva, Rivain and The Freemarches.

 

.-.

 

Your own source stresses that Thedas didn't fail to push anything, it just was supposedly not what prompted the end of the war. (Which i personally think is a load of crap, they were losing bad by that point)

Where is that said?

[Master Warder Z_]

Where is that said?

 

The war drained the resources of every nation in Thedas, leaving most on the brink of collapse. For the giants, it did not appear to be the damage to their armada or the loss of their soldiers, but the terrible toll upon the Rivaini population that prompted their retreat. When the Third New Exalted March had all but massacred the people of Kont-aar without even chipping the Qunari occupying force, the giants finally withdrew.

 

http://dragonage.wik...omerryn_Accords

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The Qunari withdrew because they signed the peace treaty, not the other way around. The book does not say which side sued for peace and which side agreed. Both the humans and Qunari are shown to have reasons to want peace. The human nations were strained to the point of collapse and did not have the strength tho continue that fight much longer.

[SerCambria358]

The war drained the resources of every nation in Thedas, leaving most on the brink of collapse. For the giants, it did not appear to be the damage to their armada or the loss of their soldiers, but the terrible toll upon the Rivaini population that prompted their retreat. When the Third New Exalted March had all but massacred the people of Kont-aar without even chipping the Qunari occupying force, the giants finally withdrew.

 

http://dragonage.wik...omerryn_Accords

Thats a non bias account from a Chantry scholar, thats not a single persons perspective. You'd think the chantry of all people would want to demonize the qunari, thats not apparent here.

[The Ascendant]

I doubt the Qunari or Tevinter will launch a full scale invasion, they're too busy fighting each other, I think they will interfere in more subtle ways. Don't forget about Aurelian Titus and his dragon cult who nearly succeeded in brainwashing everyone in Theda's. Or Tallis with her list of Qunari agents spread throughout the world. I think our dear Inquisitor will have to beware the enemy within as well as demons, rogue mages and templars and dragons.

[The Baconer]

I doubt the Qunari or Tevinter will launch a full scale invasion, they're too busy fighting each other, I think they will interfere in more subtle ways. Don't forget about Aurelian Titus and his dragon cult who nearly succeeded in brainwashing everyone in Theda's. Or Tallis with her list of Qunari agents spread throughout the world. I think our dear Inquisitor will have to beware the enemy within as well as demons, rogue mages and templars and dragons.

 

Long-term sidequest: crossing names off of the Qunari agent list.

 

plz bioware

[renfrees]

Actually, i have a question to Qunari experts - how big is the firepower of a single dreadnought? I mean estimate number of cannons and people (crew and boarding troops). Also approximate length.

[Master Warder Z_]

Actually, i have a question to Qunari experts - how big is the firepower of a single dreadnought? I mean estimate number of cannons and people (crew and boarding troops). Also approximate length.

 

If we go by the size of the vessel (to my eye they seemed like 60 to 80 meter ironclads) I'd presume you would need a crew of at least thirty to sixty to successfully man and operate the vessel, and for boarding troops? No idea. The comic and DA 2 indicated they likely could hold a troop compliment of several hundred though.

 

As for firepower? Qunari Gatlock weapons are pretty destructive, i'd presume that would be accurate for their naval weapons as well.

 

Bring down heavy stonewalls, breach fortresses, etc.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

If we go by the size of the vessel (to my eye they seemed like 60 to 80 meter ironclads) I'd presume you would need a crew of at least thirty to sixty to successfully man and operate the vessel, and for boarding troops? No idea. The comic and DA 2 indicated they likely could hold a troop compliment of several hundred though.

 

As for firepower? Qunari Gatlock weapons are pretty destructive, i'd presume that would be accurate for their naval weapons as well.

 

Bring down heavy stonewalls, breach fortresses, etc.

They're wooden though, not ironclad.

 

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Well the Arishok took a single Dreadnaught to go after the Tome of Koslun, and the hundreds of warriors that were stranded in Kirkwall were just a (presumably large) fraction of it's crew.

[renfrees]

How many cannons though?

The numbers I'd say up to a thousand in manpower approx.

[KainD]

How many cannons though?

The numbers I'd say up to a thousand in manpower approx.

 

Thousand muggle power you mean? 

I think the image shows 16 cannons each side.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

How many cannons though?

The numbers I'd say up to a thousand in manpower approx.

It doesn't say how many cannons. I'd assume a couple dozen on each side an d a few in the front and back at least though.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Thousand muggle power you mean? 

They have Saarebas too.

[KainD]

They have Saarebas too.

 

Need to steal control rods, that would be quite the sabotage. 

[Master Warder Z_]

They're wooden though, not ironclad.

 

You need to study that ship model more Hana

 

The C.S.S Virginia was a Ironclad and yet it had a wooden shell, in fact its keel and hull were laid down as an entirely different vessel before it was re purposed to that role. Anyway, Ironclads need not be "ironclad" to be that model of vessel, i described it as one because it sort of looked like one.

 

Dreadnoughts are dreadnoughts though, I know of many classifications and types of vessels, but that struck me as nearly alien as Asari ship design, it looked sort of like a man of war crossed between a Skiff and Ironclad.

 

Its deck and hull are angular like an ironclad but it's oarship like a skiff.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

You need to study that ship model more Hana

 

The C.S.S Virginia was a Ironclad and yet it had a wooden shell, in fact its keel and hull were laid down as an entirely different vessel before it was re purposed to that role. Anyway, Ironclads need not be "ironclad" to be that model of vessel, i described it as one because it sort of looked like one.

 

Dreadnoughts are dreadnoughts though, I know of many classifications and types of vessels, but that struck me as nearly alien as Asari ship design, it looked sort of like a man of war crossed between a Skiff and Ironclad.

 

Its deck and hull are angular like an ironclad but it's oarship like a skiff.

 I thought by ironclad, you meant clad in iron and not the shape.