Aller au contenu

Photo

Divorce


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
40 réponses à ce sujet

#26
Aremce

Aremce
  • Members
  • 267 messages

The paraphrase for the Thane romance made it seem worse, *long speech on how he loves & misses his dead wife* femshep responds with "I want you Thane".

 

Yes, this is so bad ... When this line appeared for the first time, I stared at it for, like, five minutes in disbelief. :mellow:

Please never make that happen again. Hitting on people who are mourning their dead wife/husband/lover/whatever is just ... no.



#27
CybAnt1

CybAnt1
  • Members
  • 3 659 messages

Also, Isabela's husband? Assassinated by Zevran?

 

Kind of like when Ahhhhhhnold shoots Sharon Stone in the head in Total Recall, and then intones, "consider that a divorce".

 

Be careful what you're asking for OP. This could lead to child support court orders, and Oghren is going to fight that with the biggest axe he can find.

 

BTW, what people usually did up until the rise of Protestantism (which broke with the Catholic Church's no-divorce position) was take the Henry the VIIIth solution, or ask for an annulment. Which was sort of the Church declaring that the marriage was done mistakenly, or somehow never actually occurred.

 

Think of it as the ultimate retcon, on marital status.


  • Warden Nick aime ceci

#28
Oswin

Oswin
  • Members
  • 822 messages

The paraphrase for the Thane romance made it seem worse, *long speech on how he loves & misses his dead wife* femshep responds with "I want you Thane".

 

Ha! Yes, this. I loved Thane, but romancing him always seemed a bit weird when a whole lot of your conversations seemed to be about how he met and failed his wife.

 

And Cortez was a character I also really enjoyed, but romancing him again seemed a bit weird. One minute you're his shoulder to cry on, and the next he's in your bed. That and I always felt it was too mean to romance him with my end game choices. 

 

Yeah, I don't want that again. It felt all wrong to me.



#29
SilkieBantam

SilkieBantam
  • Members
  • 1 090 messages

Wasn't there talk of Cailan perhaps divorcing Anora and marrying Celene? 



#30
XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX

XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX
  • Members
  • 2 518 messages

Wasn't there talk of Cailan perhaps divorcing Anora and marrying Celene?


That was in the RTO dlc, there were letters between them discussing things like that.

#31
Aimi

Aimi
  • Members
  • 4 616 messages

BTW, what people usually did up until the rise of Protestantism (which broke with the Catholic Church's no-divorce position) was take the Henry the VIIIth solution, or ask for an annulment. Which was sort of the Church declaring that the marriage was done mistakenly, or somehow never actually occurred.
 
Think of it as the ultimate retcon, on marital status.


By "people" you mean "[Roman] Catholic Europeans after the genesis of the imperial papacy", right?

because those two things do not mean the same thing at all

#32
DarkKnightHolmes

DarkKnightHolmes
  • Members
  • 3 602 messages

Who needs divorce when people die like flies in Thedas.



#33
The Hierophant

The Hierophant
  • Members
  • 6 908 messages

Who needs divorce when people die like flies in Thedas.


This sounds lovely, but my pc's getting a prenup just to be safe.

#34
Blackrising

Blackrising
  • Members
  • 1 662 messages

Wasn't there talk of Cailan perhaps divorcing Anora and marrying Celene?

Yeah, but the rules for royalty are generally different than those for normal folk. If there had been any indicator that their Queen was sterile (and in such cases, they always blame the wife), I believe Cailan, as king, would have every right to annull the marriage, at least in the eyes of his people. (And anyone who expects the line to not die with him.)
Of course, Thedas could have completely different customs, I'm just going by what seems logical.

(Personally, I still think Cailan was a giant douche.)

#35
CybAnt1

CybAnt1
  • Members
  • 3 659 messages

By "people" you mean "[Roman] Catholic Europeans after the genesis of the imperial papacy", right?

because those two things do not mean the same thing at all

 

Well, sure. The Catholic Church forbade divorce - still does, of course - I recognize that there were always people in Europe outside of its sphere. Pagans, Albigensians, Moors, not-yet-Christianized Vikings, etc, etc. 

 

Here's what Wikipedia says on divorce in Medieval Europe. 

 

http://en.wikipedia....Medieval_Europe

 

After the fall of the Roman Empire, familial life was regulated more by ecclesiastical authority than civil authority. By the ninth or tenth century, the divorce rate had been greatly reduced under the influence of the Church,[52]which considered marriage a sacrament instituted by God and Christ indissoluble by mere human action.[53]

Although divorce, as known today, was generally prohibited after the tenth century, separation of husband and wife and the annulment of marriage were well-known. What is today referred to as "separate maintenance" (or "legal separation") was termed "divorce a mensa et thoro" ("divorce from bed-and-board"). The husband and wife physically separated and were forbidden to live or cohabit together; but their marital relationship did not fully terminate.[54] Civil courts had no power over marriage or divorce. The grounds for annulment were determined by Church authority and applied in ecclesiastical courts. Annulment was for canonical causes of impediment existing at the time of the marriage. "For in cases of total divorce, the marriage is declared null, as having been absolutely unlawful ab initio."[55][56][57] The Church held that the sacrament of marriage produced one person from two, inseparable from each other: "By marriage the husband and wife are one person in law: that is, the very being of legal existence of the woman is suspended during the marriage or at least incorporated and consolidated into that of the husband: under whose wing, protection and cover, she performs everything."[58] Since husband and wife became one person upon marriage, that oneness could only be annulled if the parties improperly entered into the marriage initially.

[end]

 

From the Church's point of view, you had only two options:

 

1) legally separate - which you could, of course, do, but the Church still would consider you to be married, just living "apart lives"

2) be given an annulment

If you knew the right Churchfolk and greased their palms, annulments were apparently quite easy to get. Apparently, it would be discovered that the priest who performed the wedding vows skipped some important ceremonial declaration, and guess what, therefore the marriage had in fact never taken place. Annulment granted. 

Elsewhere in the article, it notes that divorce was certainly accepted in Greece and Rome prior to Christianization, although it carried a certain stigma, maybe not unlike how divorce did so in American culture until the 2nd half of the 20th century. Generally, almost every culture throughout history has rites of marriage - and along with that, rituals for those who want to end it. 



#36
Aimi

Aimi
  • Members
  • 4 616 messages

Well, sure. The Catholic Church forbade divorce - still does, of course - I recognize that there were always people in Europe outside of its sphere. Pagans, Albigensians, Moors, not-yet-Christianized Vikings, etc, etc.


And, y'know, Orthodoxals. It's funny how little mind many Western-trained persons pay to the other half of medieval Christian Europe.

Also, since your original comment was awfully sweeping, it looked like it applied to more than just medieval Europe, in which case it'd be even more wrong. :P

#37
superdeathdealer14

superdeathdealer14
  • Members
  • 982 messages

So divorces in Thedas work just like Tamriel right? just grab your sword, stab them, loot their body, find yourself someone who looks hotter then your previous spouse, rinse and repeat. Right?



#38
Nefla

Nefla
  • Members
  • 7 672 messages

Like Oghren?



#39
Warden Nick

Warden Nick
  • Members
  • 176 messages

Like Oghren?

I hope so. That guy was hilarious :D



#40
Beerfish

Beerfish
  • Members
  • 23 867 messages

We can put the divorce angle and sex scenes together, just have the two divorcees have this conversation "F you!"  no "F you!" no...."F you!"



#41
CybAnt1

CybAnt1
  • Members
  • 3 659 messages

And, y'know, Orthodoxals. It's funny how little mind many Western-trained persons pay to the other half of medieval Christian Europe.

Also, since your original comment was awfully sweeping, it looked like it applied to more than just medieval Europe, in which case it'd be even more wrong. :P

 

The word people was followed by a later reference to the Catholic Church in the same sentence, which I thought hoped make clear I was talking about Catholic Church-controlled Western Europe. 

 

And while your point is taken, while the Eastern Orthodox Church allowed divorce, it's not like they were using the no-fault quickie system.  :)

 

http://en.wikipedia...._Church#Divorce

 

Divorce is permitted in the Orthodox Church for various reasons. The more usual divorce occurs under the pastoral guidance of the spiritual director of the spouses when all attempts at salvaging a marriage have been exhausted. In such cases, remarriage may be possible but there is a special rite for a second marriage which contains a penitential element for the dissolution of the first, i.e. some of the more joyful aspects are removed.[2] Marriage is permitted up to three times in Orthodoxy but each divorce necessitates a short period of excommunication. The Orthodox Church, as the saying goes, "blesses the first marriage, performs the second, tolerates the third, and forbids the fourth".

Another type of divorce is what is known as a "hieratic divorce", which does not signify the breakdown of the relationship but is a step taken for the sake of the theosis of the spouses and with the full support and blessing of the Church. This type of divorce may only take place where there is mutual agreement between the two spouses, and is usually carried out in cases where one or both spouses wish to enter into monasticism.

[end]

 

I guess it's good that Elizabeth Taylor did not belong to the Eastern Orthodox Church, they would have drawn the line at spouse #3.  :D