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DA:I too difficult for casual gamers?


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#176
CronoDragoon

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 It took me a while to figure out how to combat him with little risk of being backstabbed to death.

 

Stonewaaaaall.

 

 

Skipping combat is part of the idea of dealing the strategic challenge, so to speak.  I couldn't speak in absolutes, but some combats can be missed, some won't be able to for a variety of reasons.  Combats can serve as a gate, for example, and stuff like that.

 

For sure, it'd be silly to allow a player to Barry Sanders their way to the end boss just to get rocked.



#177
Steelcan

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I am always wary of how difficult developers say their game is



#178
Allan Schumacher

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I'm not really qualified to say if the game is genuinely difficult or not.  I don't really play through the content in real game levels.  I do know the goals of what we seek to achieve with the combat system, however.

 

This will probably change closer to ship, but not right now.


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#179
kheldorin

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I hope that Bioware also addresses any issues with the difficulty curve as you progress through the game. Witcher 2 had a weird difficulty curve where it was harder in the beginning than at the end. An ideal curve would be one that is easy at first but gets progressively harder as the game progresses.

 

It'll be interesting how to see it is done without level-scaling or level-capping. The typical "gamer" strategy is to not skip any combat, not skip any side quests and explore everything because they know that experience points gained would pay off in the long-run better than any resources lost. They'd rather "grind" at the start so that they'll be over-leveled for most of the encounters in the future. At the later stages, they would skip combat not because of strategic or role-playing reasons but because the low-level experience gained is not worth their time.

 

It might create the sense that the game is more tedious at the start and will be a breeze at the end.



#180
Allan Schumacher

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I'm not sure if it's necessary for an RPG that combat get progressively more difficult as the game goes on.  That tends to NOT be the case in a lot of RPGs I play, in large part because my character becomes very powerful.

 

Certainly there should still be some level of challenging progression, but it's always an interesting challenge given the non-linearity of the game.


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#181
AlanC9

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For sure, it'd be silly to allow a player to Barry Sanders their way to the end boss just to get rocked.

 

 

That happened to me with KotOR. I once played a high-defense scoundrel/ consular build which cruised through the entire game only to fail spectacularly against Malak, who can hit any possible AC 75% of the time. Not too big a problem in KotOR since you can use infinite medpacks while paused and by the endgame I had a couple hundred of them in inventory. But annoying.

 

The Arishok also comes to mind, and maybe the Ancient Rock Wraith; reach them and suddenly you're playing a different game. Though that maybe has more to do with the intentional design of the encounters, since apparently we were supposed to time dodges based on their attack animations or some such.



#182
Zenbry

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I hope that Bioware also addresses any issues with the difficulty curve as you progress through the game. Witcher 2 had a weird difficulty curve where it was harder in the beginning than at the end. An ideal curve would be one that is easy at first but gets progressively harder as the game progresses.

 

In the games I've played, I actually prefer when the game feels harder in the beginning. I grind and I grind and I grind, and by the end game I'm a god who smites you with one blow. It feels like my work has paid off.


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#183
In Exile

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That happened to me with KotOR. I once played a high-defense scoundrel/ consular build which cruised through the entire game only to fail spectacularly against Malak, who can hit any possible AC 75% of  the time. Not too big a problem in KotOR since you can use infinite medpacks while paused and by the endgame I had a couple hundred of them in inventory. But annoying.

 

That was terrible... until it occurred to me I had mines. The hilarity of Malak dying as he runs through tens of mines is just priceless. 


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#184
Grieving Natashina

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In the games I've played, I actually prefer when the game feels harder in the beginning. I grind and I grind and I grind, and by the end game I'm a god who smites you with one blow. It feels like my work has paid off.

While I have mixed feelings about the combat system, level grinding is going to be interesting.  As someone pointed out, (and I agree), my biggest concern isn't so much the healing or leveling changes, it's the environmental ones.  I have a feeling it's going to take a lot of reloading to make sure I don't under-farm or over-farm an area.   It's also going to be an interesting experience the first time I take a wrong turn as a low level character and get smacked across the zone by something several levels higher than me.  

This does make me wish to ask: Will be player get a little warning if they are going the wrong way?  If, say, I'm level 7 and I can see mobs ahead that might be far too powerful for me (though not close enough to aggro them,) will I be able to at least mouse over their name or something so I can see "Oh, that name's in bright red.  I might not want to go that way." ?

 

 I don't want hand holding, since I find the first game over due to the wrong path in several RPGs funny to me.  I have to chuckle at myself every time I go, "Hey, where's this leading?  <SPLAT BY SOMETHING BIG AND UGLY>"  

 

However, will there be some sort of system to tell you approximately the mob's level in relation to your own?  Like with most MMOs: 

 

Grey: Far under PC level, not worth any exp

Blue or Green: Under PC level, with only minor exp

Yellow: PC level

Orange: Just above PC level

Red: Try it and you're toast.



#185
Bobad

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Too casual for "difficult" gamers?.

#186
HunterX6

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I can tell there are some dark souls fans here, one of the worst game I have ever played. I guess some people get a "rush" out of hard difficulty like a addiction, I have seen it in my cousin with that game and he looked like he needed help along with some other people in youtube anyways I just hope they aren't trying to go dark souls way. Let this be a dragon age games please just like the other but a lot better. That's my opinion.
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#187
coldwetn0se

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While I have mixed feelings about the combat system, level grinding is going to be interesting.  As someone pointed out, (and I agree), my biggest concern isn't so much the healing or leveling changes, it's the environmental ones.  I have a feeling it's going to take a lot of reloading to make sure I don't under-farm or over-farm an area.   It's also going to be an interesting experience the first time I take a wrong turn as a low level character and get smacked across the zone by something several levels higher than me.  

This does make me wish to ask: Will be player get a little warning if they are going the wrong way?  If, say, I'm level 7 and I can see mobs ahead that might be far too powerful for me (though not close enough to aggro them,) will I be able to at least mouse over their name or something so I can see "Oh, that name's in bright red.  I might not want to go that way." ?
 
 I don't want hand holding, since I find the first game over due to the wrong path in several RPGs funny to me.  I have to chuckle at myself every time I go, "Hey, where's this leading?  <SPLAT BY SOMETHING BIG AND UGLY>"  
 
However, will there be some sort of system to tell you approximately the mob's level in relation to your own?  Like with most MMOs: 
 
Grey: Far under PC level, not worth any exp
Blue or Green: Under PC level, with only minor exp
Yellow: PC level
Orange: Just above PC level
Red: Try it and you're toast.


There are potentially many ways that they could give you a quick heads up, on enemies ahead (change in music and background noises), and just like in other games, once the enemy spots you, there is still a moment before a charge actually occurs. Once they do notice you, their health bar pops up (as one example), or a lvl # (though I personally prefer the hp bar for some reason...different strokes). In games that I have played that are like this (and just as DA:I, don't have level scaling), there is generally enough time to still high-tail it out of the area, or some place to hide.

Now granted, that doesn't mean you couldn't still get in trouble. I have been off my game before, and got smacked before I had a chance to run. Most of those times, though I took damage, the enemy(ies) didn't do enough that I couldn't get out. However, there have been a few times that "they got me!" LOL! In games where I can save whenever I choose, I just try and remember to save before entering a new area, and after any big encounter. That often eases my tension enough, but YMMV. ;)

I admit I am looking forward to these new gameplay elements. (oh, and I don't play on high difficulty in any game. ;) )

#188
Guest_npc86_*

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I don't expect it'll be too difficult for anyone. I think the difficulty levels from Dragon Age: Origins and DA II will return or at least be similar.  If there is some sort of "Narrative" or "Story" mode like Mass Effect 3 had I hope it doesn't remove the dialogue wheel and things like that like it did in ME3. Changing the difficulty I can understand since I play on one of the lower difficulties but I don't think it's a good idea for things like dialogue choices to be taken out of the game since that's part of what makes Mass Effect or Dragon Age what it is.



#189
Jaulen

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I remember when games use to have no difficulty option and no regen health and gamers didn't care, now we live in a age where people want games to play themselves and for the game to be easy as pie.

 

 

*sigh* I miss the old days.

 

Like what...the arcade games from the 70s and 80s?

 

Peronally I hate the idea of NO health regen. I like the idea of slow health regen.

After all, if I get injured IRL, it's not like my body isn't in the continual process of healing itself until the injury is gone.



#190
ImperatorMortis

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I hope it will be hard on casuals. Would be nice if Bioware starting catering to hardcore gamers again.. 



#191
Grieving Natashina

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I hope it will be hard on casuals. Would be nice if Bioware starting catering to hardcore gamers again.. 

Since it looks like you consider yourself a "true gamer," here's the Word of Gaider about that.

 

http://dgaider.tumbl...ng-question-but

 

Oh, by the way?  Those "causal" gamers that you laugh at?  Yeah, you can thank them for buying the Dragon Age games.  See, the "hardcore" players are pretty much the minority and it's the "causal" gamers that are actually spending the majority of the money.  

 

What makes a "hardcore" player anyhow?  I've seen this for years, and the only thing I've concluded is that in order to be "hardcore" you have to always play in the highest difficulty with the least amount of help.  Or that you must eat, breathe and sleep video games.  There isn't "hardcore" or "casual" players, we're all gamers.

 

Besides, can't you bump up the difficulty level?  That's what it's there for, after all.  Why don't you do that instead of ripping into your fellow gamers?


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#192
Thomas Andresen

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What makes a "hardcore" player anyhow?  I've seen this for years, and the only thing I've concluded is that in order to be "hardcore" you have to always play in the highest difficulty with the least amount of help.  Or that you must eat, breathe and sleep video games.  There isn't "hardcore" or "casual" players, we're all gamers.
 
Besides, can't you bump up the difficulty level?  That's what it's there for, after all.  Why don't you do that instead of ripping into your fellow gamers?

My study mates were calling me a hardcore gamer. And they were gamers themselves. Their grounds for calling me hardcore however, despite knowing I wasn't in it for the challenge, was the obscene hours I put into gaming. Not to mention how passionate I can be about games.

Edit: Those study mates were much better than me in games we all played, and we all knew it, but that wasn't the point.
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#193
brightblueink

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Peronally I hate the idea of NO health regen. I like the idea of slow health regen.

After all, if I get injured IRL, it's not like my body isn't in the continual process of healing itself until the injury is gone.

Eh, but you don't heal over the course of a day unless it's a really, really minor injury. For anything but that you still need bandages and medicine to heal more effectively, too.



#194
Grieving Natashina

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My study mates were calling me a hardcore gamer. And they were gamers themselves. Their grounds for calling me hardcore however, despite knowing I wasn't in it for the challenge, was the obscene hours I put into gaming. Not to mention how passionate I can be about games.

Edit: Those study mates were much better than me in games we all played, and we all knew it, but that wasn't the point.

To me, there's no difference between someone that's really passionate about getting to the next level of Candy Crush versus someone trying to get all the highest difficulty achievements/trophies in Dark Souls.  The ones that tend to use the term "hardcore" think that passion or even the amount of time isn't good enough.  We're all video game nerds that enjoy the games we play.  Shouldn't that be all that matters?

 

@Cold I agree.  I don't think I'll always retreat in time, but a heads up is all I ask.   :)



#195
CENIC

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What makes a "hardcore" player anyhow? I've seen this for years, and the only thing I've concluded is that in order to be "hardcore" you have to always play in the highest difficulty with the least amount of help. Or that you must eat, breathe and sleep video games. There isn't "hardcore" or "casual" players, we're all gamers.

I have clocked 690 hours in Dragon's Dogma. I've beaten the main campaign 11 times. I've defeated the DLC final final boss 266 times (no, wait... 267). My pawn and I are both max level and possess the best gear available, fully upgraded.
I didn't minmax for stats. My pawn is wearing suboptimal gear because I dress for style. And worst of all (only fellow Dragon's Dogma players will get this) my mage pawn's inclinations are Guardian/Scather.

There are some people who try to tell me I am not "hardcore" because I don't do things a specific way.
I say, "That's nice," and go back to having fun with video games. ;)

PS - I don't have as much concrete info about my playtime with Dragon Age, but I'm WAY more obsessive with it than Dragon's Dogma.

EDIT: This post would probably pack more of a punch if I had remembered to state that I never play above "Normal" difficulty. D'oh.
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#196
Allan Schumacher

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I likely do fit into the vagueishly defined term of "hardcore gamers" but I think such labeling is silly.

 

I don't care if someone else enjoys a game differently than I do, as long as I enjoy the game.  Now if there's concerns that BioWare isn't making a game that is enjoyable to you because it features things that are more enjoyable to a different style of gamer, that's one thing.  But then, gaming seems to be continuing to grow and while I think Dark Souls is a bit overrated on its punitive nature (I found the game excellently designed, where the game rarely kills you just because, but rather it kills you because you didn't notice something or failed at execution), I consider it an excellent game and it's success shows that there is diversity in game difficulty.  Now if the hope is that all (or even most) games get catered specifically to your tastes, then that's not being very reasonable.

 

I prefer PC as a platform, but don't even joke about being a part of the PC master race anymore.  We're all gamers, that share gaming.  I don't judge because your hobby is only really, really close in details to mine, as opposed to precisely the same.


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#197
Thomas Andresen

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To me, there's no difference between someone that's really passionate about getting to the next level of Candy Crush versus someone trying to get all the highest difficulty achievements/trophies in Dark Souls.  The ones that tend to use the term "hardcore" think that passion or even the amount of time isn't good enough.  We're all video game nerds that enjoy the games we play.  Shouldn't that be all that matters?

If I was to make a point, which I'm not sure I was trying to in the first place, it would be that the term "hardcore" is about as useful as "RPG". Like Gaider pointed out in his blog, one would have hoped that "those people" had learned perspective, but clearly there are those who don't.
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#198
Zenbry

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 We're all gamers, that share gaming.  I don't judge because your hobby is only really, really close in details to mine, as opposed to precisely the same.

 

This!



#199
Mihura

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I doubt they would do it the same way as The Witcher 2 and Dark Souls, sure maybe if you play on hard or nightmare. It would be bad design to punish players on easy, that only want to enjoy the story.  



#200
Grieving Natashina

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I prefer PC as a platform, but don't even joke about being a part of the PC master race anymore.  We're all gamers, that share gaming.  I don't judge because your hobby is only really, really close in details to mine, as opposed to precisely the same.

 That is exactly how I feel.  I don't judge others for their play style, but I'll admit that I tend to judge their behavior towards others.  

 

I remember the good old days, before too much of the "casual versus hardcore" nonsense really took hold.  Oh, it was there, don't get me wrong.

 

 

Player A: "Well I beat Contra with no continues and no Konami Code."  

 

Player B: "Oh yeah?  Well, I used the Game Genie code to give me only 1 life and no continues and I finished that game in one sitting!"  

 

Player A: "Bet you can't beat it in 2 hours."

 

<chuckle> And a few folks wonder why the trophy/achievement system came into being. 

 

 

We all love playing with a bunch of pixels a screen.   At the end of the day, when I shut down my computer for the day, that's all that matters to me.