And what proof do we even have of that? We know they don't actively ban it, but what proof do we have that they actively use or allow such research.
Because the Chantries are often also palces of healing? Other than that we know that mages are allowed anatomical research in the Circles, which are extensions of the Chantry. So yeah.. There is that.
well at least im not naive like some users...
Will you please stop insulting anyone who disagrees with you by calling them things like stupid or naive?
sorry you made mistake you should write "no, im , don't worry"
that doesn't even make grammatical sense. but I'm gonna stop here before you bring me down any further.
So wait if someone will kill someone in movie it means that you can't kill someone in real world you can put realistic thing into fiction it happens all the time so well...
I know I didn't say this. please go back and read my post. The Dragon Age World and Mass Effect are fantasies.
Your comment: " But that was how world work sure it was your choice and only game but it showed that despite laws protecting guy we could beat guy on pulp with police blessing that how it works in real world as well..."
This made me think you were talking about the real world. If you want to talk about Dragon Age Mages then we could restrict this to the behavior of the mages in this DA world. Not all of them want to be killer. Human non mages have people who want to kill, rape and murder other. Howe was called a butcher, but not all nobles are butchers. Therefore, not all mages are nukes. The mages need to be treated as a function of their behavior.
Will you please stop insulting anyone who disagrees with you by calling them things like stupid or naive?
stop crying as he insulted me before so well...
that doesn't even make grammatical sense. but I'm gonna stop here before you bring me down any further.
Neither your setence had 
i reacted to lack of logic with lack of logic
I know I didn't say this. please go back and read my post. The Dragon Age World and Mass Effect are fantasies.
Your comment: " But that was how world work sure it was your choice and only game but it showed that despite laws protecting guy we could beat guy on pulp with police blessing that how it works in real world as well..."
This made me think you were talking about the real world. If you want to talk about Dragon Age Mages then we could restrict this to the behavior of the mages in this DA world. Not all of them want to be killer. Human non mages have people who want to kill, rape and murder other. Howe was called a butcher, but not all nobles are butchers. Therefore, not all mages are nukes and needed to be treated as a function of their behavior.
2 words power corrupts...
Look at tevinter and look at most mages...
Seriously?
Then who came up with the stupidity that it was bloodmagic? (NVM how on earth a non mage is expected to do damn bloodmagic anyway).
Well.. One quick glance through every Blood Mage enclave we have ever been thorugh in the games (they are all strewn with bodies of innocents), then it shouldn't come as a surprise that the laymen of the world, may not know the exact differences betweena morgue and a blood sacrifice.
stop crying as he insulted me before so well...
Neither your setence had
You insulted people, including him, long before he insulted you.
Justinia's only grammatical error was she had a comma instead of a period after are.
Your sentence on the other hand had the first word not capitalized, the I in I'm not capitalized, a lack of an apostrophe between the I and m in I'm, the fact you wouldn't use I'm in that sentence but would keep it as I am, a comma instead of a period, and no period after worry.
Because the Chantries are often also palces of healing? Other than that we know that mages are allowed anatomical research in the Circles, which are extensions of the Chantry. So yeah.. There is that.
And since when is a Chantry something other than a place of prayer? I definitely haven't seen anything that makes them look like they are places of healing.
Edit: Fixed my shitty grammar.
And codex doesn't mean truth only what person thinks as far practice shows otherwise so please spare me that it is rare because i will laugh at it.
Templars aren't responsible in that what mages in their incompetence and power hunger doing well they should deal with such mages and they are doing that rather badly...
No it doesn't matter because simple you can be attacked by bandits we have abomnation and in thedas being attacked by bandits is common. Having depresion ,dying loved ones , desire for better life , greed , pride , lust , desires , anger 10000 other reason to become abomnation and those are common in life... there will be always excuse to become abomnation...
So we're throwing out codex or WoT entries that you disagree with? Good to know.
At least your very last point has a semblance of a persuasive statement, I commend you. Those are all concerns, agreed. But despite these concerns abominations are still rare. And when the Templars are causing some of the problems that they claim to prevent...Well I cannot throw that blame onto Mage shoulders.
Evelina of Dragon Age II is the picture perfect example of mages who do everything right and end up hounded until the templars give them no choice but to become the monsters that the Templars envision them to be.
2 words power corrupts...
Look at tevinter and look at most mages...
Yes power does corrupt, but we are not discussing giving them power. Giving them a guarded community is not power. It is giving them an opportunity with families to choose stability over chaos.
Edit: Everything I read pointed to Tevinter being an older kingdom with different norms. One would think that those norms play into how that society functions. I haven't read that much on Tevinter but I don't have enough data to say that mages want to be just like them in every way.
Laws are "arbitrary" in the sense that they do not have to exist. But they cannot (or at least should not) be arbitrary in the sense of being capricious, or unsupported, or undetermined, or in the sense of being subject to individual will without restriction. Because that's just plain tyranny.
Say I agree with that definition- how does that apply here? Blood magic charges aren't given to sudden and unaccountable changes of behavior: phylacteries and blood mage concerns both long standing policies. Blood mage convictions are not undetermined: accusation alone has not been sufficient proof in a number of cases, so clearly some other sort of burden of proof in quantity or believability is required. Nothing about the phylactery context is subjecting blood magic to individual will without restriction.
I could agree with you on every single thing you write here and it still not apply to the case at hand.
And that's the problem with "blood magic" and "maleficar" as terms. They're not clearly defined. Or, if they ever were, the Chantry has muddled those definitions by applying the labels capriciously to any sort of magic or mage that they do not approve of.
They're about as defined as what the Western powers use to identify their enemies in Afghanistan, which is constantly changing. I have seen 'terrorist,' 'anti-government militia,' 'insurgent', 'enemy of Afghanistan,' 'rebel', 'warlord forces,' 'foreign fighters,' 'local fighters,' 'mujaheddin,' 'jihadist,' and a personal favorite, 'military age male.' Try making a distinct definition out of that one. All of these can be used to refer to the same sort of individuals, even the 'local fighters' and 'foreign fighters' labels. (Ah, the wonderful nature of cross-border nomads.)
This isn't because it's capricious. This is because working terms are used differently than legal terms even when they're the same words, especially to the people charged with enforcement and not legal niceties. The same word has different meanings. Maleficar literally means 'one who is depraved,' a character label. Legally it means a mage using forbidden magics (which is inherently magic they do not approve of), a classification. Functionally, though? Templars use it as a synonym for 'bad mage.' Why is it bad? Well, it could be the legal part (using forbidden magics), or just the character part (hurting and/or endangering people). Both are real and legitimate meanings of the word.
As fun as it can be to try and convince soldiers to speak like lawyers regarding hybrid classifications, I'd be amused if you could figure out a way to do that. You might have better luck working to convince them to distinguish between apostates (mage outside the circle) and maleficar (bad mage). Of course, if you got me walking around a couple hundred miles a year in armor to hunt down some runaway who thinks they can be trusted outside a circle and I'd probably make an empassioned case that an apostate is already a bad mage. Grouchy feet and all that.
Blood magic has a basic and generally understood definition: mind control is bad, and cutting people to make spells more powerful is bad. The grey zone and ambiguity over blood as a spell component that our great hypocrisy amounts to is, by comparison with our hyper-legalistic system, pretty minor. Classifying pornography is a classic, but how about that good old catch-all of 'disturbing the peace,' 'obstructing an officer in his duties,' or (for you military types) 'conduct unbecoming'?
Since the Chantry itself doesn't have a clear definition of blood magic (or at least, none that they apply as rigidly as they ought), then on what basis does the Chantry, or Master Warder Z, make the claim that certain, Chantry-approved magicks, like phylacteries, do not qualify as blood magic?
By the basis of being the defining authority, of course.
I'm not clear on where you find support that the Chantry doesn't have a clear definition of blood magic- the fact that you don't know it? The existence of people who believe what Wynn does should count? If legal ambiguity is your basis, I'd hate to live in the legal tyrannies of the West. So many vague laws open to selective interpretation and implementation.
And since when is a Chantry something other than a place of prayer. I definitely seen anything that looks like they are places of healing.
People have been going to the Chantries for help and shelter, and mentions that the Chantry can help in all the games. But if you want a specific case, then I point you towards Lelianna who was nursed back from the verge of death in a Chantry.
Well.. One quick glance through every Blood Mage enclave we have ever been thorugh in the games (they are all strewn with bodies of innocents), then it shouldn't come as a surprise that the laymen of the world, may not know the exact differences betweena morgue and a blood sacrifice.
Except those goons aren't the ones making the laws. So it really doesn't explain the bans.
You insulted people, including him, long before he insulted you.
Justinia's only grammatical error was she had a comma instead of a period after you.
Your sentence on the other hand had the first word not capitalized, the I in I'm not capitalized, a lack of an apostrophe between the I and m in I'm, the fact you wouldn't use I'm in that sentence but would keep it as I am, a comma instead of a period, and no period after worry.
As far i renember i was first insulted here by many including you by calling me a troll not that i cared because i didn't and then i was called sociopath by few users.After a while it is little annoying especially if other put words into my mouth and keep insulting me and then complain if i insulted them so well...
So we're throwing out codex or WoT entries that you disagree with? Good to know.
At least your very last point has a semblance of a persuasive statement, I commend you. Those are all concerns, agreed. But despite these concerns abominations are still rare. And when the Templars are causing some of the problems that they claim to prevent...Well I cannot throw that blame onto Mage shoulders.
Evelina of Dragon Age II is the picture perfect example of mages who do everything right and end up hounded until the templars give them no choice but to become the monsters that the Templars envision them to be.
Eee not i throw out codex entry that doesn't match reality (at least that in da) and i don't know about wot but i never heard that such sentence is there... if there is so i have to question if writers even know what they are writing...
-Entire circle tower in ferelden
-half of mages from circle in kirkwall
-Grace and her peoples
-Tarone (that was her name?) and her peoples
-baroness
-connor
-nameless abomnation on the road in ferelden
-huon
-evelina
-Anders
-Wynne
-Gaxkang
-Olivia
And that was from 2 peoples perspective in 1 country and 1 city during 10 years timeline heh pretty much that gives us hefty numbers of abomnations and thats are only saw by our 2 protagonists...
And evelina was possessed because she wanted power to fight templars and even her helping peoples turned to be destructive deed.
As far i renember i was first insulted here by many including you by calling me a troll not that i cared because i didn't and then i was called sociopath by few users.After a while it is little annoying especially if other put words into my mouth and keep insulting me and then complain if i insulted them so well...
I only called you a troll after you called me an idiot with something along the lines of "Can you even think?" And even then I only called you that because you seemed to be trolling. My first time calling you such was literally "Is TKS a troll?" to which I apologized after.
Would it be more accurate then to say magic is the lethal weapon that just so happens to be permanently built into a person who will by his very nature always have his finger on the trigger whether he wants to or not?
I like the comparison to a plague carrier with a currently dormant virus myself.
The disease is abomination, and the symptom is death!
But more seriously, you can actually model the Circles as a quarantine scenario, and mages as carriers and potential patient zeroes for an outbreak. The social segregation and enforcement parallels are strong, the outbreak analogy fits for an abomination, the scale of death and non-deliberate nature can apply... it really only doesn't work well to more mundane abuses of magic. There's no disease which is a selectively lethal offensive weapon.
I only called you a troll after you called me an idiot with something along the lines of "Can you even think?" And even then I only called you that because you seemed to be trolling. My first time calling you such was literally "Is TKS a troll?" to which I apologized after.
Eee no that was later can "you even think" line when you started twist my words one after another. You and other users called me a troll because of my "final solution" with mages then sociopath entered the stage as well for my views...
Eee no that was later can "you even think" line when you started twist my words one after another. You and other users called me a troll because of my "final solution" with mages then sociopath entered the stage as well for my views...
Nope.
Except those goons aren't the ones making the laws. So it really doesn't explain the bans.
What makes you think that some noble has any knowledge of anatomical research AND can make the distinction between that and blood magic?
Nope.
eee yes? it was even on old froum bsn when users started call me a troll for my views on mages case pretty much how it was then it was sociopath i know how that was so well...
besides now it is spam...
What makes you think that some noble has any knowledge of anatomical research AND can make the distinction between that and blood magic?
I'd expect a king/queen to be well read/researched.
Besides one would think it's obviously not bloodmagic by the sheer issue that non mages can do it.
People have been going to the Chantries for help and shelter, and mentions that the Chantry can help in all the games. But if you want a specific case, then I point you towards Lelianna who was nursed back from the verge of death in a Chantry.
The Chantry takes care of orphans, for another example.
eee yes? it was even on old froum bsn when users started call me a troll for my views on mages case pretty much how it was then it was sociopath i know how that was so well...
besides now it is spam...
I remember that, and I wasn't one of them.
As far i renember i was first insulted here by many including you by calling me a troll not that i cared because i didn't and then i was called sociopath by few users.After a while it is little annoying especially if other put words into my mouth and keep insulting me and then complain if i insulted them so well...
Eee not i throw out codex entry that doesn't match reality (at least that in da) and i don't know about wot but i never heard that such sentence is there... if there is so i have to question if writers even know what they are writing...
-Entire circle tower in ferelden
-half of mages from circle in kirkwall
-Grace and her peoples
-Tarone (that was her name?) and her peoples
-baroness
-connor
-nameless abomnation on the road in ferelden
-huon
-evelina
-Anders
-Wynne
-Gaxkang
-Olivia
And that was from 2 peoples perspective in 1 country and 1 city during 10 years timeline heh pretty much that gives us hefty numbers of abomnations and thats are only saw by our 2 protagonists...
And evelina was possessed because she wanted power to fight templars and even her helping peoples turned to be destructive deed.
-Entire circle tower in ferelden - That is blatantly false.
-half of mages from circle in kirkwall - Disagree and the abominations that did appear were entirely Meredith and her army's doing.
-Grace and her peoples - Grace, sure, Decimus was not an abomination.
-Tarone (that was her name?) and her peoples - Not true either.
-baroness - Okay
-connor - Okay
-nameless abomnation on the road in ferelden - Gameplay story segregation or are you referring to when mages sent the warden after said roderick/abomination?
-huon - Not true
-evelina - Because of templars, true.
-Anders - He wasn't a dangerous abomination in the sense that you believe. He only really lost it when in Templar capital that just happens to preside over a hellmouth.
-Wynne - Seriously?
-Gaxkang - Okay
-Olivia - Once again, hounded until she became an abomination at Templar hands.
With the exception of arguably five cases, the whole of these accusations are misleading at best. You're also not crediting the mages who didn't become abominations. You know, the circle of kirkwall until Meredith lost her mind. Morrigan, Bethany, Malcolm, Merrill, Velana, The Mages' Collective, The Mages you raise to fight the Archdemon. Just to name a few.
I'd expect a king/queen to be well read/researched.
Besides one would think it's obviously not bloodmagic by the sheer issue that non mages can do it.
Why on earth would a noble (who makes the local laws) ever bother with anatomy?
First of all you have to remember the social stigma there is surrounding the subject. A noble studying this topic could suffer severe political and social blowback.
Second of all, if he is in the capacity of setting the law, means that he should be much more busy studying statemanship and warfare than anatomy.
You also have to remember that there is no visible or probably even physical difference betweena mage and a mundane. If you were to stumble across a man cutting corpses apart, then you would probably also be jumping to all the wrong conclusions. Especially based on the fact that you would have NO knowledge of anatomy yourself, but you would know of the existance of apostates and maleficar.
The ban of anatomical research is a perfectly natural evolution of society, based on the threats posed by blood magic and the undead.
-Olivia - Once again, hounded until she became an abomination at Templar hands.
Uhm.... What? Isn't Olivia Thrask's daughter... Who was smuggled OUT of the Circle and sold into slavery and was hounded by PIRATES?
Retour en haut