623 réponses à ce sujet

[dgcatanisiri]

Ha. I think that line is a wry commentary on the absence of air support throughout the entire trilogy. It's a throwaway comment that people take far too seriously for some reason. If it had been said by any other character it wouldn't even be mentioned.

 

Honestly, I think that line is horribly out of character for Liara. It sounds like the kind of thing that I would expect from James or Ashley or even Garrus, the soldiers who are expected to compartmentalize their feelings and express them in black humor. I can hear each of them saying it, with a wry tone of voice, maybe even a note of exasperation at the situation. They're all the type to use sarcasm as a coping mechanism.

 

But Liara? The woman who's spent the rest of the mission in shock and horror at her homeworld falling to the Reapers? Who is doing all she can to hold together in this moment as she watches her home and her people burning? Offering a bit of gallows humor? It doesn't sound like her to me. She's too close to this situation to be able to crack wise in the midst of combat on the planet of her birth. It's just... It does not sound in any way like a Liara line.

[DuskWanderer]

That's a good point, but it's a terrible line even coming from Ashley/Garrus. When the third party member talks about Talon Five ripping up the Reapers, that sounded like soldier chatter (James asking if that pilot has a boyfriend, Kaidan and Garrus talk about getting her drinks). But after that? Liara's just whining about the asari. 

 

Funny thing is, all this stuff, here and elsewhere? Proves Ashley's racism comments from the first game. 

 

This line, and the "The Major/Lieutenant Commader has gotten very capable", just reeked of OOC-ness. The first one for inappropriate gallows humor, the second for a smug sense of superiority

[dgcatanisiri]

That's a good point, but it's a terrible line even coming from Ashley/Garrus. When the third party member talks about Talon Five ripping up the Reapers, that sounded like soldier chatter (James asking if that pilot has a boyfriend, Kaidan and Garrus talk about getting her drinks). But after that? Liara's just whining about the asari. 

 

Funny thing is, all this stuff, here and elsewhere? Proves Ashley's racism comments from the first game. 

 

This line, and the "The Major/Lieutenant Commader has gotten very capable", just reeked of OOC-ness. The first one for inappropriate gallows humor, the second for a smug sense of superiority

 

Oh, you so do NOT want to get me started on that 'become quite capable' line... (Too late.)

 

For one, Ashley/Kaidan were (at least potentially) there to take down several geth and a krogan battlemaster while she stayed out of combat. Yeah, yeah, you can get in to the matter of how long she was in that prothean bubble, it's still a case where part of her first impression of Ashley/Kaidan is of them going into combat against a force of superior numbers and even potentially strength (since battlemasters are considered heavy lifters when it comes to krogan going in to combat).

 

For two, it's the writing propping up Liara at the expense of Ashley/Kaidan - if you're a newcomer to the series, that line gives the impression that Liara has seen and done far more at Shepard's side than Ashley/Kaidan, that they were some fresh-faced newbie the first time they worked with Shepard and have since grown. Kaidan earned a place on the Normandy, the state-of-the-art prototype warship, on his own prior to things going down with Saren, and Anderson picked Ashley out of her string of crap assignments given to her because of her family name and history, rather than a reflection of her abilities. Both of them were PLENTY 'capable' when they first met Shepard or Liara. If anyone's 'become' quite capable in this situation, it's absolutely Liara.

 

And for three, this is another line that does not sound like Liara, because those two are supposed to be people who she at least considers herself friendly with - neither of them ever mistreated her or insulted her. At most, Ashley had justifiable concerns about her, as she was the daughter of one of Saren's allies, but even then, every interaction between them and Liara in the first game are friendly at best, cordial at worst.

 

In my book, that line should have been something to the effect of 'Ashley/Kaidan seem to be holding up well, considering what's happened to Earth.' Maybe even a reference to how she'd react if it were Thessia instead of Earth, give some foreshadowing and show her being empathetic towards people who are supposedly her friends.

[Ryriena]

That line had me going, you better stay away from him he's mine... It had that catty feel to it, which to me seemed way out of character. The way she shakes her head, when I look over at Kaiden when telling her "I think of the people, I would lose." I just rolled my eyes at her and she lost my respect after that. It's kind of, how I felt when I played the Shepard that romanced Jacob in ME3. She kind of moved on to Kaiden in the end. I wanted to slap her so badly during most of her scenes. I would have had her say "The Commander seems to be doing well". I would have Shepard reply he's a major now"

[Nightdragon8]

I don't find her annoying on Thessia either, that's how I assume people would react in such situation and she isn't so bothered that her combat effectiveness is dampened. I do think the air support joke was a little unrealistic and inappropriate but it doesn't particularly bother me. It was Kai Leng and everything afterwards that made me angry.

 

 

I tend to agree. As I said before though I don't think it was the right time for that line.

well honestly it poses the question, Why couldn't we bring in the normandy for air support? heck even for ground support, it used missles back on earth, where the F are they?

 

Also I think the Thax cannon should have been used at all really, I mean the way Joker can fly I'm pretty sure he can be a moblie "Ion cannon" platform. if need be.

[Barquiel]

well honestly it poses the question, Why couldn't we bring in the normandy for air support? heck even for ground support, it used missles back on earth, where the F are they?

 

Also I think the Thax cannon should have been used at all really, I mean the way Joker can fly I'm pretty sure he can be a moblie "Ion cannon" platform. if need be.

 

Exactly. Liara's comment is definitely not unreasonable. Sending reinforcements to Thessia was even an option in an earlier version of the script (I am not sure if it would have affected gameplay)...but it was obviously cut.

<data>Exactly. So you see, Commander, the battle over Thessia will be most crucial.</data>
<data>We cannot win it outright. But without the knowledge to defeat the Reapers, no planet will be spared. No rescue will come. No hope will remain.</data>
<data>Then I will divert the Justice and Apex dreadnoughts and their attendant fleets to reinforce the asari at Thessia.</data>
<data>Commander, you have a deal.</data>
<data>[The original turian and salarian councilors wait by the bedside of the original asari councilor.]</data>
<data>Commander. Please come in quietly. Councilor Tevos is sleeping.</data>
<data>We have taken the time to review your evidence against Councilor Udina, and I would like to thank you.</data>
<data>Between that video and Commander Bailey's corroborating evidence, it is clear Udina attempted to overthrow us by violent means.</data>
<data>But at least this puts to rest the debate about throwing fleets at the humans' homeworld.</data>

I wish they had kept this version...it sounds more interesting than what we got. But humans (especially Shepard) acting like everyone else should only care about Earth while their own homeworlds are burning is perfectly fine, of course.

[Han Shot First]

Exactly. Liara's comment is definitely not unreasonable. Sending reinforcements to Thessia was even an option in an earlier version of the script (I am not sure if it would have affected gameplay)...but it was obviously cut.

<data>Exactly. So you see, Commander, the battle over Thessia will be most crucial.</data>
<data>We cannot win it outright. But without the knowledge to defeat the Reapers, no planet will be spared. No rescue will come. No hope will remain.</data>
<data>Then I will divert the Justice and Apex dreadnoughts and their attendant fleets to reinforce the asari at Thessia.</data>
<data>Commander, you have a deal.</data>
<data>[The original turian and salarian councilors wait by the bedside of the original asari councilor.]</data>
<data>Commander. Please come in quietly. Councilor Tevos is sleeping.</data>
<data>We have taken the time to review your evidence against Councilor Udina, and I would like to thank you.</data>
<data>Between that video and Commander Bailey's corroborating evidence, it is clear Udina attempted to overthrow us by violent means.</data>
<data>But at least this puts to rest the debate about throwing fleets at the humans' homeworld.</data>

I wish they had kept this version...it sounds more interesting than what we got. But humans (especially Shepard) acting like everyone else should only care about Earth while their own homeworlds are burning is perfectly fine, of course.

 

Interesting. Justice and Apex aren't human dreadnoughts. The Alliance names its dreadnoughts after mountains on Earth. So were they Turian ships?

 

In any case I agree that the above sounds more interesting than what actually shipped with the game. 

[themikefest]

What good would've having air support? The Asari government failed to call for help until it was to late. Our homeworld is getting attacked. Can you help us? Oh by the way we have an artifact that might help with the war. Had the idiots asked for help a lot earlier or revealed the artifact a lot earlier, than I could see the Alliance providing some air support. But because the idiots were stubborn and just flat out stupid, they wait till the last minute, at which point no amount of air support would've made a difference. So that line from  t'soni was uncalled for and stupid on her part.

[Barquiel]

Interesting. Justice and Apex aren't human dreadnoughts. The Alliance names its dreadnoughts after mountains on Earth. So were they Turian ships?
 
In any case I agree that the above sounds more interesting than what actually shipped with the game.

Turians or Salarians, I guess. There were more such options in the script. The coup for example had something to do with the Hanar homeworld, iirc.

If we take the N7 HQ minigame and the multiplayer storyline as canon alliance forces apparently bolstered asari lines, but it's never mentioned in the single player game. Here we're spending the entire game crying about Earth and trying to rally support to retake it (even though it makes absolutely no sense)...

[themikefest]

@Barquiel

 

If you wanted that version of the script in the game than I want the VS-Liara decsion in the game.

[Zazzerka]

Well if you want the VS-Liara decision, then I want Samantha's character to be cut. Make Liara more relevant.

[themikefest]

Fine by me. It won't bother me.

[Zazzerka]

Fine by me. It won't bother me.

 

[von uber]

Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!

[Barquiel]

The leaked script with the VS-Liara decision made Ashley/Kaidan even more incompetent than ME2 and ME3 (I thought the version we got was already bad enough), and significantly reduced their content as well (they only joined after Thessia, if they survive). I am not sure why anyone who likes Ashley or Kaidan would want this version...

[themikefest]

The leaked script with the VS-Liara decision made Ashley/Kaidan even more incompetent than ME2 and ME3 (I thought the version we got was already bad enough), and significantly reduced their content as well (they only joined after Thessia, if they survive). I am not sure why anyone who likes Ashley or Kaidan would want this version...

The one thing it would do is give you the breath scene with Liara dead. I wouldn't pick her every time, it would just give me the option if I wanted to or not and add replay value for me.

[KaiserShep]

What good would've having air support? The Asari government failed to call for help until it was to late. Our homeworld is getting attacked. Can you help us? Oh by the way we have an artifact that might help with the war. Had the idiots asked for help a lot earlier or revealed the artifact a lot earlier, than I could see the Alliance providing some air support. But because the idiots were stubborn and just flat out stupid, they wait till the last minute, at which point no amount of air support would've made a difference. So that line from  t'soni was uncalled for and stupid on her part.

 

Air support beyond Talon might have prevented a hostile gunship from making it to the temple, or, at the very least, would have prevented it from escaping. After all, the air support isn't for the other asari on the ground; it's just for Shepard.

[Ryriena]

Exactly. Liara's comment is definitely not unreasonable. Sending reinforcements to Thessia was even an option in an earlier version of the script (I am not sure if it would have affected gameplay)...but it was obviously cut.

<data>Exactly. So you see, Commander, the battle over Thessia will be most crucial.</data>
<data>We cannot win it outright. But without the knowledge to defeat the Reapers, no planet will be spared. No rescue will come. No hope will remain.</data>
<data>Then I will divert the Justice and Apex dreadnoughts and their attendant fleets to reinforce the asari at Thessia.</data>
<data>Commander, you have a deal.</data>
<data>[The original turian and salarian councilors wait by the bedside of the original asari councilor.]</data>
<data>Commander. Please come in quietly. Councilor Tevos is sleeping.</data>
<data>We have taken the time to review your evidence against Councilor Udina, and I would like to thank you.</data>
<data>Between that video and Commander Bailey's corroborating evidence, it is clear Udina attempted to overthrow us by violent means.</data>
<data>But at least this puts to rest the debate about throwing fleets at the humans' homeworld.</data>

I wish they had kept this version...it sounds more interesting than what we got. But humans (especially Shepard) acting like everyone else should only care about Earth while their own homeworlds are burning is perfectly fine, of course.

That would've been interesting, but I hated the forced emotions about earth. I have four spacers and five Colony kids as my Shepard's. I'm like wait. why am I so upset over earth I had no attachments to earth.

[KaiserShep]

That can be said about just about every world we visit in ME3, since pretty much every rock we've visited in ME1 was either a barren rock, a ruin inhabited by a meager lot of colonists or a frozen wasteland inhabited by corrupt corporations, and in ME2, it's space hubs and Tuchanka, yet another wasteland. I guess it depends on whether or not you're concerned about the fate of your species, but aside from that, the reapers attacking any planet, be it Earth, Palaven or whatever, is a sign of the beginning of the end.

[Ryriena]

For me, my Shepard was worried about all the species in ME home worlds.

[Sirzechs_Krios]

That would've been interesting, but I hated the forced emotions about earth. I have four spacers and five Colony kids as my Shepard's. I'm like wait. why am I so upset over earth I had no attachments to earth.

Pretty much this.

[themikefest]

Air support beyond Talon might have prevented a hostile gunship from making it to the temple, or, at the very least, would have prevented it from escaping. After all, the air support isn't for the other asari on the ground; it's just for Shepard.

Why would they waste air support in an area that is already filled with reapers? That may work had the asari called earlier for help. I would not send air support with the reapers all over the place having the possibility that they wouldn't do any good. And had they of been there, the reapers would've engaged them wondering what the Alliance is doing and while the reapers and Alliance are engaged, the Cerberus gunship sneaks in

[Sir DeLoria]

What's wrong with Liara being killable nearly every other squadmate is? I don't get the fuss.

I also don't see why the Council should reinforce Thessia, it doesn't have any special tactical value (Earth doesn't either until the ending). But why include such a useless option in the first place?

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

What's wrong with Liara being killable nearly every other squadmate is? I don't get the fuss.

I also don't see why the Council should reinforce Thessia, it doesn't have any special tactical value (Earth doesn't either until the ending). But why include such a useless option in the first place?

It does have good logistical value. It's the center of the Galactic economy and one of its primary sources of eezo. Any resources that can be pulled off their to assist with the crucible would be very useful. 

[Barquiel]

Because Shepard spending the entire game trying to get the other races to send their fleets to the Sol System is stupid. Thessia is described as a "vital military asset" in the N7 minigame. Thessia ensures that the galaxy's supply of eezo is maintained during the war. Both Palaven and Thessia had greater strategic significance than Earth. And nobody said Liara shouldn't be killable. I don't think Liara fans would have complained about the leaked script. But the Ashley/Kaidan fans...I don't think they would have been very happy. They were portrayed more incompetent than in the actual games (VS-wants-to-kill-Prothy-and-works-with-Kai-Leng).