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And two bisexuals gals is more realistic? What kind of twisted logic is that?
Where did I say that? I never at all mentioned or even slightly alluded to that. Please do not put words in my mouth, I am not trying to stir up anything, I am just adding my perspective to the discussion just as everyone else has. I am doing my best to make it does not sound like I am trying to dismiss anyone else's feelings or experiences, so please do not try and make me seem like I am being unfair and ignorant.
I am doing my best to make it does not sound like I am trying to dismiss anyone else's feelings or experiences
Umm...
I love my BioWare games, I do, and a large part of that is because of the characterisation, enhanced by the ability to romance, enhanced by the ability to express romantic and sexual interest in my own gender as I do in real life. So I can fully understand the love and appreciation people have for picking up a Bioware game and being able to fully insert themselves into a game without fear of being marginalised and discriminated against. What I do not understand is the level of aggression and the sense of entitlement some people seem to get in all of these topics. Just because it is a roleplaying game does not mean you should get absolutely everything you want. Whether Cassandra is straight, bisexual or homosexual is not an injustice to anyone. It just is. It is not the writers obligation to make sure that everybody gets their cake and eats it too; to demand otherwise almost seems to me like a slight on their integrity as writers.
As to how I feel about the set sexualities: I am glad they are implementing them, even if it means not being able to romance the character I want to as the gender I would prefer. People in this thread have mentioned the issues a lot of people had with the all-inclusive method of DA2 as a result of intolerance or ignorance toward bisexuals. For me, at least, this was not the case. While I can admit to maybe being a little bi-phobic in real life due to self-esteem issues, I have no qualms with bisexual characters or romancing them in video games. I love Leliana and Zevran in Origins, and if Alistair and Zevran had been switched, I would have had no problem romancing Alistair as a man knowing that he can also be romanced by women. In DA2 however, I felt the romances were kind of empty because I felt there was LESS acknowledgement of my character and my sexuality. I was just this grey, bland character whom everybody just automatically wanted. Or that is how it felt, anyway.
So even if I do not get the exact romance that I set out wanting in Inquisition, I am happy that I will finally feel like I can roleplay a truly gay character and have it mean something. I know a lot of people do not see it the way I do, but I feel this is a more inclusive ideologically ethical way of approaching romances in games. I will also admit a little vindictive side of me pleased that for once there is a little something in it just for me, that people will have to play as a gay character to share in instead of the other way around.
Ramble finished.
I don't think there's a specific way how, or what it would entail. In terms of why, because it's human nature and it adds a personal touch. I don't speak to everybody the exact same way. I gauge people off of their behaviour, appearance, acquaintances and surroundings and base my interactions with them from that. In a video game all they have to distinguish our character (for the most part) that the game can recognise is gender, race and class. So I want reactivity based on those things. What I don't want is an army of Lucy-Liu bots as my companions.
I'm not saying I don't get your reasoning. I just don't understand what their different reacts would actually be given that there's no in-game prejudice.
I get that having every companion be bisexual is preferred by a lot of people and why it would be so. If it were the case I would be more than happy for those players because I know what it's like to feel excluded by default. I've just seen that a lot of people's points were that there's nothing gained by having set sexualities over open ones and I felt the need to express that there is for me and explain why. That is all. It's unfair to grab one tiny detail (that I admitted to being a personal bias and in no way relevant to the actual matter at hand) and make it the focal point of what I was trying to say.
Umm...
Oh my god, really? Like, actually, really? I'm sorry for being such a massive liar. I'll correct myself; I am a massive bigot. I claim to try and take an empathic and self-aware approach when I can to social situations, but in practice I'm actually a giant big-head-o-phobe. I discriminate against people who try and steamroll over others just for thinking differently from them and having to be right about everything. Is that better? Both of those quotes are so irrelevant. And the latter one was clearly in jest (I'll use an emoticon next time?) and as explicitly stated as an aside with nothing to do with what I was actually putting across.
I see the error of my ways in trying to socialise on this forum in any kind of non-superficial or satirical manner. I will thank Non-Exile and Deviija though for actually trying to have a discussion with me to see where I'm coming from and expressing where they are.
I am happy that I will finally feel like I can roleplay a truly gay character and have it mean something.
2/2/2 or all bisexual LI's aside...being gay and in a relationship with someone who is bisexual doesn't make you any less gay then if you're in a relationship with someone who also identifies as such.
I mean, I'm excited by the prospect of a gay/lesbian companion character certainly, but that is completely separate from who I plan to romance or how much I will value the character/relationship.
Random.
I don't like people calling the romances in DA2 ambiguous.
Isabela had a husband and sleeps with Fenris.
Fenris sleeps with Isabela.
Merrill awkwardly kind of flirts with Carver.
Anders has a boyfriend who he killed as his very first mission.
Some of those don't happen if certain characters are dead Or you romance them.
If you romance them you know they would be interested in at least your gender.
You play as the other gender you find out they're still interested in you.
You don't romance them you find out they're a bit interested in other people.
People complain about knowing characters are interested in you no matter what gender you are but the only way they know that is Replaying it differently, Replaying it differently Shows romance characters having interest beyond Hawke.
They really really really really were not kept ambiguous. there is no way I can think of that anyone can say that without lying in some way.
2/2/2 or all bisexual LI's aside...being gay and in a relationship with someone who is bisexual doesn't mean any less then being gay and in a relationship with someone who also identifies as such.
I know, I mentioned a couple of times that my issue is not with bisexual (i.e. the abundance of) characters. I would just as happily romance a bisexual companion as I would a gay one. When I mentioned being able to express my sexual identity, I was talking in terms of just having that distinction there, as opposed to it being "more meaningful to date someone who is also gay". I'm sorry if it came across that way.
Oh my god, really? Like, actually, really? I'm sorry for being such a massive liar. I'll correct myself; I am a massive bigot. I claim to try and take an empathic and self-aware approach when I can to social situations, but in practice I'm actually a giant big-head-o-phobe. I discriminate against people who try and steamroll over others just for thinking differently from them and having to be right about everything. Is that better? Both of those quotes are so irrelevant. And the latter one was clearly in jest (I'll use an emoticon next time?) and as explicitly stated as an aside with nothing to do with what I was actually putting across.
I see the error of my ways in trying to socialise on this forum in any kind of non-superficial or satirical manner. I will thank Non-Exile and Deviija though for actually trying to have a discussion with me to see where I'm coming from and expressing where they are.
All I was doing was showing you were dismissing some who are angry at the new system as being entitled despite you wanting them to do the system you want.
Emoticons would help, yes. Only about 7% of a message gets transferred in text.
Aggression and entitlement vs anger and hurt are two very different things. I was talking about behaviour, not emotions. Entitlement has nothing to do with "wanting them to do the system you want" - that doesn't even mean anything. When I mention entitlement, I'm speaking of EXPECTING them to do the system you want, because YOU (people in general, not you specifically) want it. Also, I had a game where they took an approach opposed to what I wanted: DA2, and I accepted that as the direction they took without any fuss, so I don't think it would be hypocritical of me even so.
In terms of my tone, I was serious about having should have used an emoticon, because looking back it isn't as obvious that I was trying to be light.
I am going to stop here, it's after midnight and I've apparently decided to randomly dye my hair red, so clearly I am not in the right frame of mind to have any kind of semi-serious discussion. Just to make it clear once and for all: I believe the total inclusivity in having all LIs romanceable by both genders is spectacular, but there is more fulfilment for me PERSONALLY in having companions with varied sexualities. I do not believe one system is superior to another outside of my personal preference. I was just trying to express my way of seeing things.
And that's quite alright. We all have our opinions. I like learning what those opinions are for discourse.
Though...
What I don't want is an army of Lucy-Liu bots as my companions.
An army of Lucy Lius? All dressed up in oiled leather and embossed metal armor...
WTF did posts get deleted or something?
That seems to be happening everywhere.
WTF did posts get deleted or something?
Bioware raised the posts per page limit from 20 to 25.
WTF did posts get deleted or something?
I said it was a contentious point. And no, two bisexual guys in a group is not unrealistic to me. Two bisexual guys in a random group of six seemed unrealistic to me. In my life, in the twenty years before I moved to Edmonton at least, I've had a total of one gay friend and one gay co-worker and zero lesbian or bisexual personal acquaintances (that I know of). While now that is no longer true, when DA2 was coming out it was, whether that's a reflection on me being sheltered or Australia being less sexually accepting and therefore less forthcoming than Canadian society or me just being an outlying piece of data when it comes to meeting sexual minorities.
However, that was not my point and I made it clear that was for me, personally. My issue was not that they were both available to both genders, but the implementation and inferred reasoning behind it.
I'm guessing you're straight? So you have mostly straight friends. Minority sexual orientations of a feather flock together and all that. I can't remember the last time I was close with a 100% straight person, and it's not like I test people on their sexualities before befriending them. It just happens. So, really, it's Aveline and Varric who are the outliers here, except we aren't 100% sure on them either.
Bioware raised the posts per page limit from 20 to 25.
Answers at last!
I'm guessing you're straight? So you have mostly straight friends. Minority sexual orientations of a feather flock together and all that. I can't remember the last time I was close with a 100% straight person, and it's not like I test people on their sexualities before befriending them. It just happens. So, really, it's Aveline and Varric who are the outliers here, except we aren't 100% sure on them either.
Pretty sure he is gay, and his point is that being represented only by bisexuals can feel like erasure. I disagree but I understand. But no kidding, recently me and my groups of friends recently all came out to each other and we were all shocked that only one of us was straight, except for her, she seemed to know the whole time and we make jokes about the token "straight person" never intentional, and we all met over gaming, a pretty heteronormative hobby so it was a bit of a shock how we all gravitated toward each other by random coincedence.
Ah, yeah, comprehension fail for me then. Which is sort of what I see a lot of my fellow bi peeps railing against with the new system-- the bi-ness of DA2 is already handwaved away as 'playersexual', 'they're not REALLY all bi' sort of thing and that's especially hurtful because the standard representation across all media of LGBT characters is gay dudes with MAYBE a splash of hot lesbians or 'I had a phase in college' straight girls. Orange is the New Black is really the only show I can think of with a very bi main character.
TBH I think my ideal companion setup would be all bi and gay peeps with the only straight one being Maevaris Tilani (since people seem to have trouble conceptualizing trans people as straight a lot of the time and also her husband was adorable).
Ah, yeah, comprehension fail for me then. Which is sort of what I see a lot of my fellow bi peeps railing against with the new system-- the bi-ness of DA2 is already handwaved away as 'playersexual', 'they're not REALLY all bi' sort of thing and that's especially hurtful because the standard representation across all media of LGBT characters is gay dudes with MAYBE a splash of hot lesbians or 'I had a phase in college' straight girls. Orange is the New Black is really the only show I can think of with a very bi main character.
TBH I think my ideal companion setup would be all bi and gay peeps with the only straight one being Maevaris Tilani (since people seem to have trouble conceptualizing trans people as straight a lot of the time and also her husband was adorable).
House had 13. But she also had the whole promiscuous thing, too. So, I found it very frustrating.
I'm guessing you're straight? So you have mostly straight friends. Minority sexual orientations of a feather flock together and all that. I can't remember the last time I was close with a 100% straight person, and it's not like I test people on their sexualities before befriending them. It just happens. So, really, it's Aveline and Varric who are the outliers here, except we aren't 100% sure on them either.
I'm openly gay. I have a fairly even spatter of male/female friends and out of them all there is one other gay man. My best mate is about as straight as you can get. 
I'm openly gay. I have a fairly even spatter of male/female friends and out of them all there is one other gay man. My best mate is as straight as you can get. There's nothing wrong with belonging to a stereotype, but perpetuating them just makes it okay for others to do so (I don't mean to sound abrasive, I just don't like it when people make assumptions about me).
Apologies for that, as I said up there, reading comprehension fail.
All good, by the time I commented it was already cleared up and I saw that it was just an error. So my bad for getting a teensy bit preachy at the end. I've had a rough time at times with people telling me that I don't "seem" gay when they find out, as if it were something more than a sexual preference. Especially frustrates me when it comes from other gay men.
But, off-topic. My bad again.
Ah, yeah, comprehension fail for me then. Which is sort of what I see a lot of my fellow bi peeps railing against with the new system-- the bi-ness of DA2 is already handwaved away as 'playersexual', 'they're not REALLY all bi' sort of thing and that's especially hurtful because the standard representation across all media of LGBT characters is gay dudes with MAYBE a splash of hot lesbians or 'I had a phase in college' straight girls. Orange is the New Black is really the only show I can think of with a very bi main character.
TBH I think my ideal companion setup would be all bi and gay peeps with the only straight one being Maevaris Tilani (since people seem to have trouble conceptualizing trans people as straight a lot of the time and also her husband was adorable).
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