12496 réponses à ce sujet

[s-jay2676]

We're still talking about a video game, right? All I see is real life that and real life this. Let the game be a game and keep most of the real life issues out of it. It's supposed to be fun and not remind us of all the crap we have to deal with every day.

[SurelyForth]

Of course romances can be written so that the baby issue is not discussed. But why? Why wouldn't it be as any other issue in a game? If it's touchy subject then it is to some people. This just reminds me of the episode of South Park where the boys tried to make christmas presentation at school which wouldn't offend anybody and it was very bad. Nobody liked it. I think there are heavy subjects in DA world and I don't think babies are to most heaviest. I think people will be offended anyway. No matter what you do.

 

I like sexism in a game if it's done right. If I have a dialogue option to defend myself then I don't have problem with it. I like the idea that I am the hero in the end even if others didn't believe because I'm a woman. I can show them that they were wrong and people can change their mind about you which is great.

 

Why not flowers?

 

No. People get offended when babies are dragged into MF conversations, because it's like a big sign pointing towards babies as The Right Thing. There are so many dialogues about babies already in fandom, and they become super contentious because fertility is not a given in MF relationships, nor are children compulsory. It's also something that can be headcanoned in, if a player wants it, leaving the actual game content to focus on issues that aren't as exclusive or mundane.

 

That's awesome that you like sexism in a game- most people who are regularly subjected to sexism don't appreciate their femininity being called out as a weakness in any forum, especially when it almost never adds anything of substance to the game itself. When Murdoch is a sexist ass, it doesn't do anything but ****** me off for a few minutes.

 

Flowers are, as Mort suggested, not gender exclusive (I mean, Alistair gives the Warden a rose, but I think it would be just as meaningful a gift to a man as it is to a female Warden because of what it represents to him). Plus, there are so many other gifts that a LI could give the protagonist that neatly sidesteps gender? Like I said, trinkets are both useful and gender neutral. Would you argue that an enchanted ring you can equip is more shallow than flowers simply because of some erroneous belief that the latter recognizes the recipient's gender? 

[In Exile]

I was just talking about that there is risk of pregnancy in m/f relationship so it matters what is your gender. Of course the couple can talk about the positions but that means also that the gender matters in that particular case. I meant the sex scenes in a way that you can see the bare male chest but not bare female chest. So your gender matters in that case.

 

No, see, again, you're assuming there's One True Way to Have Sex. "Talk about positions", as if the default is sex where there's a risk of pregnancy and there needs to be a conversation about "alternative" ways to have sex. All of these things are a minefield of IRL problems designers should steer clear of in a game. 

[Chari]

We're still talking about a video game, right? All I see is real life that and real life this. Let the game be a game and keep most of the real life issues out of it. It's supposed to be fun and not remind us of all the crap we have to deal with every day.

Dragon age is not an escapism game. There is a lit of social problems we have to deal with in it. Slavery, racism, genocide, biases, poverty, cast system. People still deal with them. Plus mages issue - not RL accurate but still follow the same pattern.
Remove social problems from DA and you lose the game or at least a big chunk of the lore

[WildOrchid]

Children. *shudders*

[Shaen Mac Tir]

Oh my god, I think I have just blushed. I mean... what are you even discussing? There will be no sex scenes in DAI, at least not like in the Witcher. And I'm glad of it.

[Farewell]

No, see, again, you're assuming there's One True Way to Have Sex. "Talk about positions", as if the default is sex where there's a risk of pregnancy and there needs to be a conversation about "alternative" ways to have sex. All of these things are a minefield of IRL problems designers should steer clear of in a game. 

 

I'm not assuming that there is a one true way of having sex it's just position which you should avoid if you don't want to get pregnant.

[Hellion Rex]

Dragon age is not an escapism game.

For you, perhaps.

[Nocte ad Mortem]

Oh my god, I think I have just blushed. I mean... what are you even discussing? There will be no sex scenes in DAI, at least not like in the Witcher. And I'm glad of it.

I honestly don't mind the "fade to black" scenes from DA2. They worked perfectly fine, for me. I don't think sex scenes develop the relationship to any deeper extent. The resources spent on the cutscenes could be better used, imo. Sex scenes in video games are a little awkward and give me a bit of an "uncanny valley" effect. lol  

[pallascedar]

And in an act 3 she is back to her past self. Sweet

 

While I think Isabela's actions in Act III aren't particularly noble; she doesn't engage in any slaving. Not killing a slaver isn't the same thing as selling slaves yourself.

[s-jay2676]

Dragon age is not an escapism game. There is a lit of social problems we have to deal with in it. Slavery, racism, genocide, biases, poverty, cast system. People still deal with them. Plus mages issue - not RL accurate but still follow the same pattern.
Remove social problems from DA and you lose the game or at least a big chunk of the lore

Well, I think that every game is an escapism game, because while I play it, I don't think about real life issues that bother me. Therefore I "escape" them, even if only for a few hours.

[Deviija]

Oh goodness, no.  I want no "you're not like other women" special snowflake nonsense in romances or in general.  It's insulting.  Just like I never again want to see lines like, "I'm the bravest -- and I'm a woman!"  

 

As to an earlier post, mentioning that having Cullen and Scribbles as bi is unrealistic symmetry because it's too "artificial," I will point out that every companion's *class* is also considered by the writers/devs so there is an even enough spread for people to have proper party make-up choices.  As well, each companion is crafted to have a specific themely viewpoint to be utilized within the context of the game, to act as a mouthpiece for a faction or events that are happening.  Really, everything is "artificial" in that they are crafted with specific goals and symmetry (class, viewpoints, morals) in mind.  I don't see why sexuality is singled out.  

 

If we do have a discussion on pregnancy/children -- not that I'm interested in having this discussion in the least with LIs -- I would hope there would be a dialogue option that goes something like,

 

Cullen: Do you want kids?

Femquisitor:  Gross, no. 

Cullen:  Me neither!  

Femquisitor:  Aw yeah!  

Then they high-five enthusiastically.  

[Chari]

For you, perhaps.

If for you an escapism game deals constantly with real life problems such as slavery, genocide, destruction of culture, poverty, racism and abuse then, well, that's quite an escapism world you enjoy
Though the beauty of da and me is that it deals with such problems, make people think, analyse their own values and choices, sympathise with others and see that sometimes nothing can be done and nobody can be saved

[Chari]

Well, I think that every game is an escapism game, because while I play it, I don't think about real life issues that bother me. Therefore I "escape" them, even if only for a few hours.

Every person issues are different. Just because you don't deal with these issues doesn't mean others don't.
All da and me issues were based in some way on RL ones. Like everything else

[In Exile]

Cullen: Do you want kids?

Femquisitor:  Gross, no. 

Cullen:  Me neither!  

Femquisitor:  Aw yeah!  

Then they high-five enthusiastically.  

 

Seriously. But also female LIs should do the same for male Inquisitors. I'm kind of tired of hearing IRL that I'll change my mind about children as I get older, or really want to be a father, or whatever. Some of us don't want kids, and other people need to deal with it. 

[AresKeith]

Well, I think that every game is an escapism game, because while I play it, I don't think about real life issues that bother me. Therefore I "escape" them, even if only for a few hours.

 

Many games have their own form of escapism, but DA is one of the games where it does deal with real life/social issues in it's own form

[Hellion Rex]

If for you an escapism game deals constantly with real life problems such as slavery, genocide, destruction of culture, poverty, racism and abuse then, well, that's quite an escapism world you enjoy

First of all, who are you to be judging what people enjoy escaping into, hmmm? Maybe Thedas isn't the place for you to find your escape, but there are still plenty of us on here that do use this world as such.

[Farewell]

No. People get offended when babies are dragged into MF conversations, because it's like a big sign pointing towards babies as The Right Thing. There are so many dialogues about babies already in fandom, and they become super contentious because fertility is not a given in MF relationships, nor are children compulsory. It's also something that can be headcanoned in, if a player wants it, leaving the actual game content to focus on issues that aren't as exclusive or mundane.

 

That's awesome that you like sexism in a game- most people who are regularly subjected to sexism don't appreciate their femininity being called out as a weakness in any forum, especially when it almost never adds anything of substance to the game itself. When Murdoch is a sexist ass, it doesn't do anything but ****** me off for a few minutes.

 

Flowers are, as Mort suggested, not gender exclusive (I mean, Alistair gives the Warden a rose, but I think it would be just as meaningful a gift to a man as it is to a female Warden because of what it represents to him). Plus, there are so many other gifts that a LI could give the protagonist that neatly sidesteps gender? Like I said, trinkets are both useful and gender neutral. Would you argue that an enchanted ring you can equip is more shallow than flowers simply because of some erroneous belief that the latter recognizes the recipient's gender? 

 

Right or wrong thing. There is a risk that woman can get pregnant if couple have sex in a certain way. I'm just saying that why wouldn't it be as any other content that there is like slavery etc.

 

It's very rewarding in a game that you can become a hero when you are a woman. You can show to people that you can be somebody important even if you are a "weak" woman.

 

I was just saying that if it's customary to give flowers to women then when male LI will give a sword instead then he is not sure does the woman like that sword or should he give her flowers instead because that is how courting is handled in that world.

[In Exile]

I honestly don't mind the "fade to black" scenes from DA2. They worked perfectly fine, for me. I don't think sex scenes develop the relationship to any deeper extent. The resources spent on the cutscenes could be better used, imo. Sex scenes in video games are a little awkward and give me a bit of an "uncanny valley" effect. lol  

 

Sex scenes could add to the game.. if they were used for characterization. But then we'd have a very different game if you suddenly got dialogue choices like "No, Morrigan, I want you to be inside me." So FTB just works way better for everyone. 

[Hellion Rex]

Many games have their own form of escapism, but DA is one of the games where it does deal with real life/social issues in it's own form

And how does that prevent someone from escaping into such a world?

[In Exile]

It's very rewarding in a game that you can become a hero when you are a woman. You can show to people that you can be somebody important even if you are a "weak" woman.

 

I was just saying that if it's customary to give flowers to women then when male LI will give a sword instead then he is not sure does the woman like that sword or should he give her flowers instead because that is how courting is handled in that world.

 

Holy sexism, Batman. It is not rewarding that you have to do something that is literally world-altering to prove that you're the equal of Droolie McMoron, the town cellar guard, because you happen to be a woman. It's a sad reflection on the world. 

 

Edit: Everytime someone asks for sexism, it's always for women to be treated poorly. It's pretty transparent when people aren't asking for things like men not to be taken seriously on account of their gender, and to have people like the Grand Cleric go "Lol, seriously, a man leading the Inquisition? Why don't you get back into the kitchen and let the women talk about politics."  

[AresKeith]

And how does that prevent someone from escaping into such a world?

 

I never said it didn't 

[s-jay2676]

Every person issues are different. Just because you don't deal with these issues doesn't mean others don't.
All da and me issues were based in some way on RL ones. Like everything else

Just because it isn't an escapism game to you, doesn't mean it isn't to others.

[Chari]

First of all, who are you to be judging what people enjoy escaping into, hmmm? Maybe Thedas isn't the place for you to find your escape, but there are still plenty of us on here that do use this world as such.

Common sense and basic logic. We are all human beings, different in details, sharing lots in common
Tell me, do you enjoy fleeing into Theda's knowing that while you romance a li you like some poor elven girl is being sold in slavery, a childmage is taken away from his parents or a casteless dwarf dying all alone while people pass by without caring? And such things happen in Thedas all the time. Even worse, such things (sans magic) happen in real life all the time

[Chari]

Edit: Everytime someone asks for sexism, it's always for women to be treated poorly. It's pretty transparent when people aren't asking for things like men not to be taken seriously on account of their gender, and to have people like the Grand Cleric go "Lol, seriously, a man leading the Inquisition? Why don't you get back into the kitchen and let the women talk about politics."

That's mostly you assuming we talk only about women
Want some sexism directed at men? Go to qunari. There men are either cannon fodder or priests. No artists, no governors