12496 réponses à ce sujet

[Allan Schumacher]

Allan... you're not a video game character lol And s/he didn't tell you that.

 

Not explicitly, no.

 

But when someone makes the statement "Their bisexuality needs to be obvious otherwise they aren't truly bisexual" it comes across as "if it's not clearly shown that someone is bisexual, then they aren't bisexual."

 

And I have seen people state the opinion, on this very board, that bisexuality isn't real it's just that someone hasn't chosen a side yet.

 

If I tell you that someone has been married in a monogamous relationship with a woman for 20 years, are you going to tell me that that person isn't truly bisexual because you've seen no indication of them being bisexual for those 20 years?  I wouldn't.

 

And I think I can understand how it can be a frustrating thing if someone has spent their entire life having to convince people that they are in fact bisexual and they come on to a message board to discuss their favourite bisexual character and see a whole bunch of people say "they are not bisexual they are playersexual" or "there is nothing that happens that makes them truly bisexual."

 

 

And yes, I feel that if you're making that statement about a video game character, based solely on the idea "because it's not made clear," is an almost identical position and one that makes me uncertain if that's fair or accurate.

[JadePrince]

 

To be honest, I mainly get the sense that Zevran was written in a way that was meant to be "un-offensive" to straight men. When he first meets a female warden he flirts with her, but not a male warden. Zevran is uncharacteristically (in my estimation of his character) cautious about his attraction to men, and that strikes me as more being worried about offending the base than it did an actual element of his character.

 

This, 100%. I mean, he asks your PERMISSION to even pay you a compliment if you're a guy. I do like that with Anders, they were a little more explicit about his attraction for you if you play a male character. It's one thing I'm glad about with Gaider's attitude these days. He gives 0 sh*ts about sparing the feewings of uncomfortable straight guys and he's said as much. 

[daveliam]

Nah, he mentions one male lover and one female lover. He's more explicit about his female lover, and unlocking the dialogue about his male lover requires a more particular circumstance. He mentioned also that he slept with several female marks.

 

 

He mentions at least three past female lovers (the assassin, the lady who he slept with and then she fell out of the carriage and Isabela).  He also flirts with Morrigan, Leliana, and (of course) Wynne and her magical bosom.  That's just off the top of my head.  I know that there are others.

 

On the other hand, he mentions the Prince who was naked when he killed him and he flirts with Alistair (and Oghren, but that's clearly trolling).    It's pretty skewed.

[TKavatar]

He mentions at least three past female lovers (the assassin, the lady who he slept with and then she fell out of the carriage and Isabela). He also flirts with Morrigan, Leliana, and (of course) Wynne and her magical bosom. That's just off the top of my head. I know that there are others.

On the other hand, he mentions the Prince who was naked when he killed him and he flirts with Alistair (and Oghren, but that's clearly trolling). It's pretty skewed.

Zevran is probably more into girls than guys.

[Hellion Rex]

He gives 0 sh*ts about sparing the feewings of uncomfortable straight guys and he's said as much. 

Amen.

[EmissaryofLies]

What the hell is going on in here?

[daveliam]

Zevran is probably more into girls than guys.

 

I don't think "probably" needs to be in that statement.  It's pretty obvious that he's more into girls than guys. 

[Hellion Rex]

Zevran is probably more into girls than guys.

That is a completely fair possibility. It's not like he has to love guys and girls equally.

[JadePrince]

I don't remember him ever mentioning doing anything with a guy tbh.

 

Yeah, I've heard that if you aren't actively romancing him then the dialogue with Taliesen implies that he and Zevran were lovers (I think the wording is "more than friends"), but that's the only direct reference to m/m that I know of Zevran making? Other than his implications that the Crows value sexual fluidity because being able to seduce marks of any gender makes carrying out missions easier. And if that's the only time Zevran addresses a past m/m relationship (and you can't even get that dialogue if you're romancing him), then he really does talk ONLY about women during your relationship.

 

EDIT: I don't think I've noticed the dialogue about the naked Prince, haha. I've heard about the dialogue with Alistair but I've never gotten it, even after spending most of my games with both of them in the party, so I think that one is easily missable.

[Nocte ad Mortem]

Like I said before, I don't think people would care about Zevran being "more into girls" if bisexuals weren't almost always portrayed as more heterosexual in media. This goes even more so for male bisexuals.    

[Hellion Rex]

EDIT: I don't think I've noticed the dialogue about the naked Prince, haha. I've heard about the dialogue with Alistair but I've never gotten it, even after spending most of my games with both of them in the party, so I think that one is easily missable.

It was from when he gives you the earring IIRC

[Deviija]

I too felt that Zevran was written with not upsetting the dudebros in mind.  As much as possible, anyway.  It's a tone that always carried across with me in how his interactions are framed.  I had that opinion when Origins was released (and shared it on the forums in '09) and still do today, even when replaying.  Of course, Zevran came across more as a Depraved Bisexual (always assassins, morally bankrupt, sadistic types) trope and I have strong aversions to that in general.  

[daveliam]

 

EDIT: I don't think I've noticed the dialogue about the naked Prince, haha. I've heard about the dialogue with Alistair but I've never gotten it, even after spending most of my games with both of them in the party, so I think that one is easily missable.

 

I might be remembering incorrectly, but wasn't the earring that he gives to the Warden from a prince who was wearing the earring when he killed him......and nothing else......... (sexy latin Zev accent innuendo stuff......)

 

Come to think of it, that makes me wonder:  If you are a female who romances Zev, is the earring from a guy or gal?

[Ianamus]

He mentions at least three past female lovers (the assassin, the lady who he slept with and then she fell out of the carriage and Isabela).  He also flirts with Morrigan, Leliana, and (of course) Wynne and her magical bosom.  That's just off the top of my head.  I know that there are others.

 

On the other hand, he mentions the Prince who was naked when he killed him and he flirts with Alistair (and Oghren, but that's clearly trolling).    It's pretty skewed.

 

Why should he have to have had an equal number of male and female lovers in the past though? It's not like bisexual people go "Oh my last lover was a woman, so it's time to pick a man now".

[Hellion Rex]

I might be remembering incorrectly, but wasn't the earring that he gives to the Warden from a prince who was wearing the earring when he killed him......and nothing else......... (sexy latin Zev accent innuendo stuff......)

 

Come to think of it, that makes me wonder:  If you are a female who romances Zev, is the earring from a guy or gal?

It's still from a guy.

[Ryzaki]

It's still from a guy.

 

Yep he even asks a fem protag if she's okay with him being bisexual.

[Grieving Natashina]

I too felt that Zevran was written with not upsetting the dudebros in mind.  As much as possible, anyway.  It's a tone that always carried across with me in how his interactions are framed.  I had that opinion when Origins was released (and shared it on the forums in '09) and still do today, even when replaying.  Of course, Zevran came across more as a Depraved Bisexual (always assassins, morally bankrupt, sadistic types) trope and I have strong aversions to that in general.  

 

 

Am I the only female player that found Zevran's flirting to be far more creepier and off putting than Anders' one direct flirt in DA2?   I'm not talking about Zevran being honest about liking men, but the way he flirts in general for a few conversations before he gets the point to drop it.

[Hellion Rex]

Yep he even asks a fem protag if she's okay with him being bisexual.

He asks?

[Hellion Rex]

Am I the only female player that found Zevran's flirting to be far more creepier and off putting than Anders' one direct flirt in DA2?   

Yup. I thought he was hot lol

[daveliam]

Why should he have to have had an equal number of male and female lovers in the past though? It's not like bisexual people go "Oh my last lover was a woman, so it's time to pick a man now".

 

I don't think that he should have equal numbers, in general.

 

It's really three things:

 

1.)  The extreme amount of lovers (vastly female, I might add) plays into the promiscuous bisexual trope.

2.)  As mentioned by others here, it's tiring to see another bisexual man who is into females mostly, but occasionally goes with men too.  It's never the other way around.

3.)  Zev is the only m/m option and his constant talking about past lady loves and flirting with pretty ladies when standing beside my male Warden gives me the impression that he wasn't really written with gay men in mind.  The fact that I've got to take him or leave him since I have no other option makes it worse.

[Hellion Rex]

Just gonna drop these in here...

 

BY QUEEN AIMO

 

[JadePrince]

I might be remembering incorrectly, but wasn't the earring that he gives to the Warden from a prince who was wearing the earring when he killed him......and nothing else......... (sexy latin Zev accent innuendo stuff......)

 

Come to think of it, that makes me wonder:  If you are a female who romances Zev, is the earring from a guy or gal?

 

Okay, yeah, I sort of recall that now. Aside from him messing with Oghren, the naked Prince was the only reference to m/m that Zevran made in my games. (Also, I mean, this wasn't him sleeping with a guy because he WANTED to. It was part of the job). As far as I know (since I never got the Taliesen dialogue) my Warden was the only guy Zevran had ever actually WANTED to be with. I definitely felt like his 'exception' to his usual rule.

[daveliam]

It's still from a guy.

Yep he even asks a fem protag if she's okay with him being bisexual.

 

Well good.  That's something at least.  I was afraid for a minute that it wouldn't be mentioned or the gender would change for a female PC.

[Grieving Natashina]

I don't think that he should have equal numbers, in general.

 

It's really three things:

 

1.)  The extreme amount of lovers (vastly female, I might add) plays into the promiscuous bisexual trope.

2.)  As mentioned by others here, it's tiring to see another bisexual man who is into females mostly, but occasionally goes with men too.  It's never the other way around.

3.)  Zev is the only m/m option and his constant talking about past lady loves and flirting with pretty ladies when standing beside my male Warden gives me the impression that he wasn't really written with gay men in mind.  The fact that I've got to take him or leave him since I have no other option makes it worse.

I think bisexual men are honestly one of the most overlooked representations in media.   Most media tends to depict them as just "greedy lovers that will take a man in a pinch" or "they are just confused and it'll take that one special guy/or gal to confirm he's gay or straight."  For the record, I loathe that so very much.