12496 réponses à ce sujet

[Wulfram]

It also would be a bit annoying if the only compatible orientation character who is OK with you siding with the [whoever] is the one you can't stand.

 

I mean, that's life, of course, but still, annoying.

[AkiKishi]

It also would be a bit annoying if the only compatible orientation character who is OK with you siding with the [whoever] is the one you can't stand.

 

I mean, that's life, of course, but still, annoying.

 

I for one would welcome a return to the romance style of Baldurs Gate II. 

[Rodz]

I want vivienne, and that's it. She has that snotty hard to get personality I love. It will be satisfying to conquer her heart.

[Former_Fiend]

What I want is a relationship where there's a mutual attraction, there's a mutual respect, there's an enjoyment of each other's company. And it just naturally evolves into what it's meant to be.

[kalasaurus]

What I want is a relationship where there's a mutual attraction, there's a mutual respect, there's an enjoyment of each other's company. And it just naturally evolves into what it's meant to be.

This is why Garrus was my favorite romance in the Mass Effect series. Well, it wasn't initially built on mutual attraction (though I believe it developed later as shown in Citadel), but it was built on companionship, friendship, respect and trust. I was pleasantly surprised at how well their relationship had evolved from ME2 to ME3.

[AkiKishi]

What I want is a relationship where there's a mutual attraction, there's a mutual respect, there's an enjoyment of each other's company. And it just naturally evolves into what it's meant to be.

 

Dragon Age does not have an attraction stat, nor does the game care what your appearance is. Ultimately your whatever the game says you are and everything else is not tracked. 

 

I doubt you can pull off anything that complex when you have 6-8 LIs all vying for screen time and budget. Just look at ME3 and how Liara hogged the camera. By far the best and most complete romance and additional scenes, but at the expense of other LI's.

[CronoDragoon]

Couldn't this be solved in a less squick manner by simply having LIs reject you based off decisions you made in game? You can be physically attracted to someone and not want anything to do with them intimately because of their actions.

 

I agree with you and Former Fiend on this, and it ties into my larger desire for characters to show more discretion in the romance department. In Mass Effect, I was with Liara in ME1, then Tali in ME2, then back with Liara in Shadow Broker. By the time ME3 rolls around, all this provokes is a kind of "me or her" response that I'm not sure is appropriate at that point. Surely the response is "frak you, Shepard, you're a scumbag," and you end up forever alone?

 

This routinely happens in BW games, where there is no penalty for messing around, and in fact you often get rewarded, if anything, by getting tense, often humorous catty banter.

 

Imagine for a second you cheat on Cassandra with Vivienne. Is her response really going to be, "you have to choose"? That doesn't sound like her at all. If the PC does something that would really ****** off the character, then the romance should be over, end of story.

[Ryzaki]

I agree with you and Former Fiend on this, and it ties into my larger desire for characters to show more discretion in the romance department. In Mass Effect, I was with Liara in ME1, then Tali in ME2, then back with Liara in Shadow Broker. By the time ME3 rolls around, all this provokes is a kind of "me or her" response that I'm not sure is appropriate at that point. Surely the response is "frak you, Shepard, you're a scumbag," and you end up forever alone?

 

This routinely happens in BW games, where there is no penalty for messing around, and in fact you often get rewarded, if anything, by getting tense, often humorous catty banter.

 

Imagine for a second you cheat on Cassandra with Vivienne. Is her response really going to be, "you have to choose"? That doesn't sound like her at all. If the PC does something that would really ****** off the character, then the romance should be over, end of story.

 

Honestly I really do hate the catty jealous banter. It's one thing if you leave one character for another and that's the end of it. But if you're PC's bouncing back and forth you should get shut down hard by both parties I agree.

 

Agreed.

 

Yes I would love that. It does feel like the PC's treating them like yo yos in that case. (Though that "Isabela's like a side dish. She comes with the meal." cracked me up). Or at least let them sleep around outside the relationship as well. Fair's fair.

[AkiKishi]

I agree with you and Former Fiend on this, and it ties into my larger desire for characters to show more discretion in the romance department. In Mass Effect, I was with Liara in ME1, then Tali in ME2, then back with Liara in Shadow Broker. By the time ME3 rolls around, all this provokes is a kind of "me or her" response that I'm not sure is appropriate at that point. Surely the response is "frak you, Shepard, you're a scumbag," and you end up forever alone?

 

This routinely happens in BW games, where there is no penalty for messing around, and in fact you often get rewarded, if anything, by getting tense, often humorous catty banter.

 

Imagine for a second you cheat on Cassandra with Vivienne. Is her response really going to be, "you have to choose"? That doesn't sound like her at all. If the PC does something that would really ****** off the character, then the romance should be over, end of story.

 

I agree with you. But you have another group that want their personal headfantasy regardless of how realistic it is, or whether it makes a lick of sense.

 

I do think you can give a bit more leeway in a scifi setting but in DA I'd expect LI's to kill each other or you.. 

[Former_Fiend]

While I'm not one to condone cheating(been cheated on too many times for that), I don't think that the ME1 LI completely breaking it off with Shep if they strayed in Me2 is an entirely justified response, given the circumstances surrounding it, not the least of which is the whole "two years dead" thing.

 

All this being said, my main Warden did romance both Morrigan and Leliana at the same time. It wasn't meant as a "he's such a player" victory; rather, it was meant as a character flaw. He was being selfish and indecisive because he was genuinely in love with both of them, and after sacrificing so much, couldn't bear to choose one over the other, though ultimately went with Morrigan in Witch Hunt. 

[CronoDragoon]

While I'm not one to condone cheating(been cheated on too many times for that), I don't think that the ME1 LI completely breaking it off with Shep if they strayed in Me2 is an entirely justified response, given the circumstances surrounding it, not the least of which is the whole "two years dead" thing.

 

The ME1 > ME2 isn't my issue. Tali should have been pissed in ME3 after I slept with Liara in Shadow Broker, is my point. She wasn't, at all. Moreover, Liara shouldn't have slept with you at all in Shadow Broker unless you broke things off with Tali first. I'd like to think she respects Tali more than that after ME1. There's too much "have your cake and eat it too" going on.

[Ryzaki]

While I'm not one to condone cheating(been cheated on too many times for that), I don't think that the ME1 LI completely breaking it off with Shep if they strayed in Me2 is an entirely justified response, given the circumstances surrounding it, not the least of which is the whole "two years dead" thing.

 

All this being said, my main Warden did romance both Morrigan and Leliana at the same time. It wasn't meant as a "he's such a player" victory; rather, it was meant as a character flaw. He was being selfish and indecisive because he was genuinely in love with both of them, and after sacrificing so much, couldn't bear to choose one over the other, though ultimately went with Morrigan in Witch Hunt. 

 

That's what I meant when I said moving one from one person to another. You can hardly say you were still in a relationship after you thought the person was dead and bit their head off when you first met. That was moving on not cheating.

 

On the other hand ME2 Lis it was six months. Really and you get a "Let's end this" dialogue with pretty much all of them on first meeting no?

 

Leliana still should've dropped him like a bad habit through. "You're wading through her swamp!" Lawl.

[BubbleDncr]

I agree with you and Former Fiend on this, and it ties into my larger desire for characters to show more discretion in the romance department. In Mass Effect, I was with Liara in ME1, then Tali in ME2, then back with Liara in Shadow Broker. By the time ME3 rolls around, all this provokes is a kind of "me or her" response that I'm not sure is appropriate at that point. Surely the response is "frak you, Shepard, you're a scumbag," and you end up forever alone?

 

This routinely happens in BW games, where there is no penalty for messing around, and in fact you often get rewarded, if anything, by getting tense, often humorous catty banter.

 

Imagine for a second you cheat on Cassandra with Vivienne. Is her response really going to be, "you have to choose"? That doesn't sound like her at all. If the PC does something that would really ****** off the character, then the romance should be over, end of story.

 

I think part of the reason they have to be lenient with cheating, is because you can't really start a romance at any point during the game (as far as I know), unless you just never talk to a companion.

 

So, if I like both Alistair and Zevran, but haven't decided who I want to romance, I have to romance them both simultaneously if I want the opportunity to romance either of them. Either that, or just never talk to to one of them so I don't miss any of their romance dialogue, but never speaking to one of them would hardly help me decide who I like better.

 

So unless they set up dialog so you can start a romance at any time, or make it clear to the player that not flirting with this character right now won't prevent you from doing so in the future...they have to allow the player to "play the field."

[Former_Fiend]

The ME1 > ME2 isn't my issue. Tali should have been pissed in ME3 after I slept with Liara in Shadow Broker, is my point. She wasn't, at all. Moreover, Liara shouldn't have slept with you at all in Shadow Broker unless you broke things off with Tali first. I'd like to think she respects Tali more than that after ME1. There's too much "have your cake and eat it too" going on.

 

Did Tali(or anyone, for that matter) ever find out about that little tryst? As I recall, Thane never mentioned it to my Femshep. 

 

 

And Liara's respect for anyone seems to be secondary to her desire for Shepard, including her respect for Shepard his/herself.

[CronoDragoon]

So unless they set up dialog so you can start a romance at any time, or make it clear to the player that not flirting with this character right now won't prevent you from doing so in the future...they have to allow the player to "play the field."

 

This strikes me as a meta-preference, wherein you want to "choose your romance for the playthrough." But in-world, surely playing the field should have negative consequences?

 

If you start a romance with Alistair first, and then flirt with Zevran, he should get angry. If you sleep with Zevran, it's over with Alistair. I find this to be fair. In real life it isn't really right to "sample the goods" just because you might like another person better and want to find out.

[Ryzaki]

I think part of the reason they have to be lenient with cheating, is because you can't really start a romance at any point during the game (as far as I know), unless you just never talk to a companion.

 

So, if I like both Alistair and Zevran, but haven't decided who I want to romance, I have to romance them both simultaneously if I want the opportunity to romance either of them. Either that, or just never talk to to one of them so I don't miss any of their romance dialogue, but never speaking to one of them would hardly help me decide who I like better.

 

So unless they set up dialog so you can start a romance at any time, or make it clear to the player that not flirting with this character right now won't prevent you from doing so in the future...they have to allow the player to "play the field."

 

Uh...no you don't. Not in DAO. You can start the romance with Alistair during the Landsmeet. As long as you don't reject him out of hand before then you're golden.

 

Pretty sure Zev is similar. I know you can start a relationship with Morrigan during her "you've been a great friend to me." convo. Leliana might be more picky though.

 

In Da2 yes but that's because the more structured way the game is set up. If you haven't started a romance before or during their act 2 quests you're not getting one.

 

 

This strikes me as a meta-preference, wherein you want to "choose your romance for the playthrough." But in-world, surely playing the field should have negative consequences?

 

If you start a romance with Alistair first, and then flirt with Zevran, he should get angry. If you sleep with Zevran, it's over with Alistair. I find this to be fair. In real life it isn't really right to "sample the goods" just because you might like another person better and want to find out.

 

aww my post got eaten. But yeah I agree.

 

To make it fair though if you didn't start a romance with Alistair and dump Zevran and then try to romance Alistair it should work fine. Just no more trying to play the field.

 

That's my preferences *shrug*

[Farewell]

But still, it didn't stop it from be an "last frakking before the final mission" kind of moment, did it?

 

As for romance in itself, something I would like to see is an romancable companion that shows little interest in the protagonist at the beggining. I think it's far more interesting winning over their affection by hard work and proving yourself then just having them kissing the ground you walk by the use of an single flirt. And also certain romances being locked by the protagonist actions, refusing to get involved with someone that does things they find deplorable.

How would you like to prove yourself to your LI? I was just thinking how this could work in a game because you would have to know somehow what you will have to do to get the LI and what are the things you should not do. I think this kind of thing could be done but it isn't that easy because if getting LI is too hard then people would get frustrated.

[Jaison1986]

How would you like to prove yourself to your LI? I was just thinking how this could work in a game because you would have to know somehow what you will have to do to get the LI and what are the things you should not do. I think this kind of thing could be done but it isn't that easy because if getting LI is too hard then people would get frustrated.

 

More in a sense that the LI wouldn't instantly swoon over the protagonist when he/she shows interest, in a similar sense that whenever Hawke flirted with an companion, they melted. I would like to see an companion wanting you to be worth of their time before showing interest. Not falling for your charms the moment you crack them a smile. To me, that feels to easy, if not cheap. Of course, not every LI, everyone is different after all, but at least some of them.

[simpatikool]

I don\

 

How would you like to prove yourself to your LI? I was just thinking how this could work in a game because you would have to know somehow what you will have to do to get the LI and what are the things you should not do. I think this kind of thing could be done but it isn't that easy because if getting LI is too hard then people would get frustrated.

 

Sort of this. I like your idea and would also step it up a bit. Romance is complicated in real life. As fun as the romance has been in all these bioware games...I am a bit of a realist. The character we play is the prime ALPHA in these games. Whatever the various LIs are, I sometimes wish they would make an offer, let us know what they have to bring into a relationship. Sometimes, the Romances seem robotic, and once you are locked into a relationship, you are locked into it. You don't get to experience whatever other characters have to offer.

[Ryzaki]

More in a sense that the LI wouldn't instantly swoon over the protagonist when he/she shows interest, in a similar sense that whenever Hawke flirted with an companion, they melted. I would like to see an companion wanting you to be worth of their time before showing interest. Not falling for your charms the moment you crack them a smile. To me, that feels to easy, if not cheap. Of course, not every LI, everyone is different after all, but at least some of them.

 

Considering in DA2 you can't even romance a companion before dealing with their personal drama exactly how else was Hawke to show s/he was worth their time?

 

In DAO you couldn't start a romance til your approval was fairly high (which was done by doing things they agreeded with, gifting them to hell, or doing their quests or a mix. You can't romance Leliana til you do her quest. Morrigan, Alistair and Zev don't hit the love stage til you do theirs either).

[AkiKishi]

I don\

 

 

Sort of this. I like your idea and would also step it up a bit. Romance is complicated in real life. As fun as the romance has been in all these bioware games...I am a bit of a realist. The character we play is the prime ALPHA in these games. Whatever the various LIs are, I sometimes wish they would make an offer, let us know what they have to bring into a relationship. Sometimes, the Romances seem robotic, and once you are locked into a relationship, you are locked into it. You don't get to experience whatever other characters have to offer.

 

Of course they are. They are scripted and pre-programmed. The big difference between them and Baldurs Gate 2 is that its much easier to find out what the trigger conditions are. They even put little hearts in after DA:O to make it even easier. 

 

The only two that really worked for me were.

 

Viconia since the story of a Paladin that fell (as in lost Paladinhood) for love and a Drow that turned her back on her religion and people for the same was very powerful. Her epilogue was icing on the cake. 

 

Tali because she was just so mysterious and I wanted to know more about her in ME so when she became a choice in ME2 that was great. 

 

The others I could take or leave. 

[BubbleDncr]

This strikes me as a meta-preference, wherein you want to "choose your romance for the playthrough." But in-world, surely playing the field should have negative consequences?

 

If you start a romance with Alistair first, and then flirt with Zevran, he should get angry. If you sleep with Zevran, it's over with Alistair. I find this to be fair. In real life it isn't really right to "sample the goods" just because you might like another person better and want to find out.

 

In the real world, I could be with Alistair for awhile, then meet Zevran, decide I like Zevran better, and break up with Alistair and run off with Zevran. Alistair would then probably be really pissed off and not want to accompany me on any quests anymore. But that would break the game.

 

In the real world, you also get sources of information about people that you don't get in video games. You also get to talk with people a lot more. If I was with Alistair, but thought Zevran might be better for me, I could talk to both of them about our relationships, without ever cheating on anyone. Can't do that in the game, you have to be in a romance with both of them in order to do that.

 

Uh...no you don't. Not in DAO. You can start the romance with Alistair during the Landsmeet. As long as you don't reject him out of hand before then you're golden.

 

Pretty sure Zev is similar. I know you can start a relationship with Morrigan during her "you've been a great friend to me." convo. Leliana might be more picky though.

 

In Da2 yes but that's because the more structured way the game is set up. If you haven't started a romance before or during their act 2 quests you're not getting one.

 

 

 

aww my post got eaten. But yeah I agree.

 

To make it fair though if you didn't start a romance with Alistair and dump Zevran and then try to romance Alistair it should work fine. Just no more trying to play the field.

 

That's my preferences *shrug*

 

I've played the game 5 times and still didn't know I could do any of this. My experience with bioware games has tended to be that if I don't pick a dialog option when I'm given the chance, I won't get that chance ever again. Maybe if they changed how they presented "camp dialog" that would be different. For instance, in DA:O, pretty much every time I click a companion to speak to them, I have the option to tell them to leave. If you always had an option to "tell someone what they mean to you," maybe I wouldn't feel like if I don't take the flirt options when they come up, I won't ever get to.

[CronoDragoon]

The others I could take or leave. 

 

The only game I've "left" is DA2. I like what the Isabela romance does for her character, but the Hawke I'm ultimately going to make canon just doesn't work with any of them. Plus, I like the idea that Hawke is left with no one to comfort her at the end, other than the return of her sister. Then, after the game, she goes off alone.

[kalasaurus]

I think part of the reason they have to be lenient with cheating, is because you can't really start a romance at any point during the game (as far as I know), unless you just never talk to a companion.

 

So, if I like both Alistair and Zevran, but haven't decided who I want to romance, I have to romance them both simultaneously if I want the opportunity to romance either of them. Either that, or just never talk to to one of them so I don't miss any of their romance dialogue, but never speaking to one of them would hardly help me decide who I like better.

 

So unless they set up dialog so you can start a romance at any time, or make it clear to the player that not flirting with this character right now won't prevent you from doing so in the future...they have to allow the player to "play the field."

 

Well, both Alistair and Zevran have "romance starting" dialogues once their approval reaches a certain point, and they'll stay available until the Warden either starts their romance or shoots them down.

 

Alistair: "Has anyone ever told you how handsome you are?"

Zevran: "Do you stare at everyone like that?"

[Jaison1986]

Considering in DA2 you can't even romance a companion before dealing with their personal drama exactly how else was Hawke to show s/he was worth their time?

 

In DAO you couldn't start a romance til your approval was fairly high (which was done by doing things they agreeded with, gifting them to hell, or doing their quests or a mix. You can't romance Leliana til you do her quest. Morrigan, Alistair and Zev don't hit the love stage til you do theirs either).

 

But you could flirt with them before their personal quests, and they would aways be over you when you did that. You can actually flirt with all of them when you first meet them, and they aways responded with interest. They barely know you and yet is all sunshine and butteflies. 

 

And as for Origins, you can easily start an romance with the companions even if they are barely neutral just by selecting the right line. I got ninjamanced by Zevran just because I didn't wanted to be rude. They are too easy to impress and persuade. So you can romance any of them before their quests, they are just required for the culmination of the romance.