Leliana dedicates the Chantry to charity...I don't see anything about Cassandra doing the same in her epilogue.
I don't even consider your 'problems' the problem.
I think mages being completely unmonitored is a bigger problem.
See previous post about Tevinter. There's also the issue of the Chantry's institutional racism that Cassandra doesn't do anything about.
Or I actually recognize her flaws.
What, meeting her at times of great personal crisis?
I'm guessing we played a different game here, or you're letting your apparently very personal problems with her views get in the way here, because Cassandra was most certainly someone with a desire to do good for the world.
Simply having a desire to do good doesn't make you good. See previous post about imprisoning/indenturing refugees.
Tevinter is corrupted and pretty much full of psycho blood mages from what i know one tevinter almost destroyed world twice while another tried brainwash whole world.Horrible example that mages can watch themselves.
I think Cassandra is better as Divine, with Leliana...enjoying her life somewhere far away with a particular Grey Warden. Leliana is far too succeptible to other people's influence for me to trust her in a leadership role anyway.
urgh I said I don't want to do this
I thought that was the point of her personal quest (both outcomes)? IMO it shows that she is finally ready for a leadership role.
"I have been many things - bard, sister, left hand - and always because someone needed something from me. I realise now I am all of these things, and yet, not defined by any one. I am now Divine Victoria, but to my friends - to you - I will always be just Leliana."
> using Tevinter in defense of unmonitored mages
Hahahahaha
The problem comes from all the slavery and such. But as for the circles, Tevinter has the right idea.
Well I just made a new Keep world state and it still shows Leliana as the Divine. Guess it's just your playthroughs that determine the Divine.
> using Tevinter in defense of unmonitored mages
Hahahahaha
Well, A. there's no realistic chance the College of Enchanters could politically take over all of southern Thedas, and B. even if they did, what do I care if one undemocratic government replaces another?
If Leliana does wind up being a better Divine and mage freedom doesn't backfire, how would you react?
Well I just made a new Keep world state and it still shows Leliana as the Divine. Guess it's just your playthroughs that determine the Divine.
Well, A. there's no realistic chance the College of Enchanters could politically take over all of southern Thedas, and B. even if they did, what do I care if one undemocratic government replaces another?
No but there is great chance it will end corrupted like tevinter empire and you should care because i don't know like you but i don't want want whole series about cleaning mess that mages have caused.
The problem comes from all the slavery and such. But as for the circles, Tevinter has the right idea.
I thought that was the point of her personal quest (both outcomes)? IMO it shows that she is finally ready for a leadership role.
"I have been many things - bard, sister, left hand - and always because someone needed something from me. I realise now I am all of these things, and yet, not defined by any one. I am now Divine Victoria, but to my friends - to you - I will always be just Leliana."
Meh. I just don't see Leliana fitting there.
I think Leliana is the best person for the job. Mages will never be free and will continue to be abused so long as they. Leliana has both the political skill and caring faith to truly make the Chantry great. Vivienne only wants the position for power and I think Cass' reforms will eventually stop working considering how the Circle's were originally free but eventually devolved into their current states, plus she isn't that forgiving. Her turning the Chantry against the Inquisition just because she doesn't like what the Inquisitor did kind of strikes me as petty.
And from the ridiculous amounts of corruption, abuses of power, and the fact that the life of a mundie in Tevinter seems to be a lot worse than a mage living well-educated and healthy in a Circle down in southern Thedas.
Using Tevinter as a defense is just going to make me laugh.
None of which has anything to do with mages being in charge, since things are nearly as bad or just as bad in Orlais, for instance.
I don't think either of them are really the ideal Divine. If they were, then they'd have been Inquisitor instead.
Really, Vivienne seems the best suited to be divine in terms of skill set, I just don't like her policies. And I'm not really sure how she gets the support of the conservatives what with the whole "magic exists to serve man, never to rule over him".
I don't think either of them are really the ideal Divine. If they were, then they'd have been Inquisitor instead.
Really, Vivienne seems the best suited to be divine in terms of skill set, I just don't like her policies. And I'm not really sure how she gets the support of the conservatives what with the whole "magic exists to serve man, never to rule over him".
I have to agree that Viv is the best suited in terms of skill set/experience. It's her ideologies I'm not a fan of. That and she just strikes me as an incredibly dense woman in general, which is another turn off as far as making her Divine goes.
Leliana is really the only one of the three I'm comfortable with, and IMO it's a position she's earned fair and square.
I have to agree that Viv is the best suited in terms of skill set/experience. It's her ideologies I'm not a fan of. That and she just strikes me as an incredibly dense woman in general, which is another turn off as far as making her Divine goes.
Leliana is really the only one of the three I'm comfortable with, and IMO it's a position she's earned fair and square.
Close minded and short sighted, definitely. All she cares about is getting power and keeping it. The spiritual needs of the populace are probably not a priority.
Cassandra is the least suitable skill wise because she really has no head for politics.
Leliana, well... it depends if she is in a romance or not. If she is, screw being the Divine!
Except that's literally exactly my first playthrough. It can happen.
This woman punches bears in the face in the name of Andraste. Show some damned respect, heathens.
Well, then you must be an miracle maker, I checked the point system in the Dragon age wiki, and after recruiting the mages as allies and recruiting the wardens, even if you fully support Cassandra and do the support war table mission, she stays 3 or 2 points behind Leliana. You can check it out:
http://dragonage.wik...Divine_election
I'm not sure which Divine is the absolute best. I can see they are three interesting characters with very valid views of the matters in South Thedas. I like all three of them in some ways and I think they have some evident flaws (Viv is a tyrant, Cass dislikes politics too much, hard Leli makes bloodshed her sport and enlightened Leli is too soft for such radical changes). I have no honest idea of which one will be objectively the best, and endgame slides have been notoriously misleading in past games.
My perspective is a role playing one, and from a role playing point of view: each one of them is the best for some of my different characters. I find this discussions about who is the best Divine a little improductive and repetitive.
By the way some tiny part of me thinks that Mother Giselle could have been good Divine material. She has an awful moment, her role in Dorian's quest, that I'm still not sure if it's plain homophobia or irrational hate to Tevinter, but what she did when the Inquisition was in the lowest moment after the attack on Haven was the best an intelligent cleric could do. That's the way I want a religious leader to act: gather the faithful when they need to, rise their spirits and make them work for the common good.
Close minded and short sighted, definitely. All she cares about is getting power and keeping it. The spiritual needs of the populace are probably not a priority.
Cassandra is the least suitable skill wise because she really has no head for politics.
Leliana, well... it depends if she is in a romance or not. If she is, screw being the Divine!
It's even better if she's in a romance; it'll lead to her getting rid of that ridiculous celibacy rule.
Well, then you must be an miracle maker, I checked the point system in the Dragon age wiki, and after recruiting the mages as allies and recruiting the wardens, even if you fully support Cassandra and do the support war table mission, she stays 3 or 2 points behind Leliana. You can check it out:
As best I can work out from the Wiki
Leliana effectively gains 15 points lead over Cassandra from Allying with Mages, and 10 from the Wardens. So Cassandra needs to find 26 points for an outright victory - I don't know how ties are resolved.
+5 "I'll be a servant of faith."
+5 "You'd be perfect."
+5 "You'd make a good Divine."
+10 Support Cassandra Operation
+1 "I agree" while talking to Vivienne
= 26 and thus Divine Cassandra
Not much margin there, but possible
As best I can work out from the Wiki
Leliana effectively gains 15 points lead over Cassandra from Allying with Mages, and 10 from the Wardens. So Cassandra needs to find 26 points for an outright victory - I don't know how ties are resolved.
+5 "I'll be a servant of faith."
+5 "You'd be perfect."
+5 "You'd make a good Divine."
+10 Support Cassandra Operation
+1 "I agree" while talking to Vivienne
= 26 and thus Divine Cassandra
Not much margin there, but possible
You do realize that Cassandra gets negative points when you do something she disagrees of, right? So, if you recruit mages, this would be the score: Cassandra -10 and Leliana +10, ultimately, giving an 20 point gap between them.
You do realize that Cassandra gets negative points when you do something she disagrees of, right? So, if you recruit mages, this would be the score: Cassandra -10 and Leliana +10, ultimately, giving an 20 point gap between them.
I took that into account. The Mages are +10 Leliana -5 Cassandra, thus leading to an effective +15 Leliana. Grey Wardens are +5 Lel -5 Cass = +10 Leliana
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