15916 réponses à ce sujet

[N7_Heartfire]

Hmmm. It does make me wonder if that would apply to both Hero of Ferelden genders.

 

I'd say that's a no-brainer. Leliana does open up the Chantry for all races/genders, so I don't think any origin/gender of your Warden would be a problem.

 

As far as whether the Divine Leliana romance should end in marriage or at least let our Warden choose whether they want to or not, Alistair's romance is rather similar really.

 

If Alistair/Leliana become King/Divine you can marry him/her (even though the marriage in Alistair's romance is human female only).

If they remain Warden/Spymaster it's left to player interpretation, no mention of marriage at all, though I always figured the Warden and Leli exchanged vows at Valence, seeing as how Dorothea would be fairly open-minded about it regardless whether the Warden was male/female, elf or human.

[Aimi]

Unhardened Leliana seems to associate marriage with love.  That's why she ends the relationship if the Warden gets married.

 
Nah, I think unhardened Leliana doesn't agree with polyamory - she thinks that the Warden doesn't love her as much if there's somebody else in the Warden's life. That's why you can't have a threesome/foursome with unhardened Lels, Izzy, and Zevran, but you can do it with hardened Lels. That's not a marriage thing, but Lels still won't go through with it.
 

Bastila lost Revan

That wasn't a BioWare thing, not initially. Obsidian made KotOR 2, and their writers were the ones who had male Revan abandon romanced Bastila because reasons. Then Lucasfilm canonized male Revan + Bastila. Only after that did BW get back in on the action, with Karp getting the ball rolling on the "ruin Revan world tour" by writing Revan and the SWTOR writing team finishing the job with the Boarding Party/Foundry flashpoints and Shadow of Revan.

[Xilizhra]

I kind of wonder now what the nature of marriage is in the Chantry. Is it a "sacrament"? Or have any ideals about "becoming one" in a symbolic sense.

 

Or is it just politically/financially motivated.

 

It seemed like they copied the 7 deadly sins from Catholicism, but not the 7 sacraments.

 

I don't really care. It just seems like a whole civilization viewing marriage as mostly political to be a cynical stance to take. This is Vivienne's view, but don't know if it's everyone.

Keep in mind that the Chantry was literally founded on emotional adultery, and the jealous husband was written off as the Betrayer. I don't think it cares too much about marriage.

[I WANT YOU TO FUCK ME JERY]

The only way the warden issue will ever be settled, is if they kill them off. Even if they did give some sort of happy-ending; there would still be people asking to bring back The Warden. Death or a major time-skip is the only way they can resolve it imo.

No, it really isn't. The angry reaction if they gave the Warden a BS off-screen death for no reason other than 'Uh, we don't know what to do here' would be ten times worse than the people who'd be demanding more even if the Warden had a good ending.

[CosmicalAdventure]

Hawke's parents married for love.  So did Aveline and Donnic

 

True enough, but Hawke's parents marriage happened off-screen and.. we are not involved in the decision-making process . For Aveline and Donnic, I think they're cute and all but they're not the player's LI.

 

It feels weird for me if suddenly Bioware drops the marriage bomb for our PCs and their LIs, I think it's hardly necessary outside of political (or maybe narrative) context.

[Han Shot First]

I think marriage might be interesting if Bioware takes a character with a noble background, and has them in an arranged married from the start of the game. Lorewise arranged marriages are a fact of life for the nobility, but we've yet to see that come into play with our player characters. That character then taking one of the companion characters as a paramour or breaking off an engagement or a marriage could lead to all sorts of interesting consequences. Maybe your family demands you honor your vows and ditch the paramour or a younger and more dutiful son or daughter will replace you as heir. Or maybe the noble family of your bride or husband is humiliated and enraged, provoking a violent reaction against you or your family (think the Freys.) Your character could be faced with the dilemma of following his/her heart or doing your noble duty for the good of your family.

 

I think that would have plenty of potential to be mined for quality quests(s) based on your background.

 

If marriage is going to be introduced...have it come with some intrigue and drama.

[dsl08002]

First of all im not a big fan of off screen solutions, its lazy!
Second is that we still have two old gods left in the deep roads, is that to be left to imagination as well.

And this marriage is something that players should experience first hand, and by just sending a tweet regarding what leliana will do with the chantry it just sounds like empty words.

Also given whats happened with, warden, hawke leliana and lots of other subjects. The course of action bioware is displaying in my opinion is that they are not sure where they want to do with dragon age in whole as series.

They had a clear and define path in DAO, but then they switched to another approach in DA2, then in DAI they switched again.

[N7_Heartfire]

I have a feeling that if Bioware had one more year of development, we would be having OUR Warden as a temporary companion during Here Lies The Abyss instead of Stroud/Alistair/Loghain.

 

It wouldn't make the decision of choosing who lives/sacrifices themselves any easier, but at least the Warden could have had a more modest role, and they would finally have closure either way. (dead, went to Weisshaupt).

 

Followed by a DLC where we play as the PC (Hawke, Warden) who wasn't left in the Fade, sort of a sequel to The Last Flight. Then at the end, our Warden/Hawke reunites with their lover, giving closure to both former protagonists, without sending them to some unknown, uncharted land and then leave it to headcanon. 

 

As far as my Warden goes, the only reason he'd leave Leliana is either because of the Calling/to avoid the false Calling from Corypheus/to send word to Weisshaupt if he survived the Fade. 19/20 years or no, he'd use them to spend as much time with Lels as possible, not running off to find some Cure that may or may not be there.

[Fiery Phoenix]

I have a feeling that if Bioware had one more year of development, we would be having OUR Warden as a temporary companion during Here Lies The Abyss instead of Stroud/Alistair/Loghain.

I wouldn't be so sure about that one. They never expressed interest in physically bringing back the Warden. In fact, I'm reasonably certain David stated the Warden wouldn't be in the game physically well before launch.

 

Of course, the recent confirmation from Patrick also doesn't make it any easier. It really does sound like they are done with the Warden, if I'm being honest.

[I WANT YOU TO FUCK ME JERY]

Leliana never becomes Divine with my canon, so no Warden official marriage to Leliana for me. My Warden's a woman, an elf, and a Dalish Elf at that, so that's three times over it'd never be legally recognized.

Don't think that bothers them, though. They're from two entirely different cultures that likely see the whole process differently. They've already been together for eleven something years now anyway, they probably see it as a 'Well, we might as well be already.'

...I do like to think they did something hush hush for a little more recognition though. Maybe she gives Leliana some kind of Dalish wedding band as a token and Leliana gave her a Chantry equivalent, for an extra little something when apart. I'm cheesy like that.

[Jaison1986]

I have a feeling that if Bioware had one more year of development, we would be having OUR Warden as a temporary companion during Here Lies The Abyss instead of Stroud/Alistair/Loghain.

 

It wouldn't make the decision of choosing who lives/sacrifices themselves any easier, but at least the Warden could have had a more modest role, and they would finally have closure either way. (dead, went to Weisshaupt).

 

Followed by a DLC where we play as the PC (Hawke, Warden) who wasn't left in the Fade, sort of a sequel to The Last Flight. Then at the end, our Warden/Hawke reunites with their lover, giving closure to both former protagonists, without sending them to some unknown, uncharted land and then leave it to headcanon. 

 

As far as my Warden goes, the only reason he'd leave Leliana is either because of the Calling/to avoid the false Calling from Corypheus/to send word to Weisshaupt if he survived the Fade. 19/20 years or no, he'd use them to spend as much time with Lels as possible, not running off to find some Cure that may or may not be there.

 

If I was writing that questline, I would have the HoF replacing Stroud as one of the possible warden contacts. And rather then running from the demon with their tails between their legs while someone is left behind to die, they would make an epic final stand against the demon.

 

I just dislike how after the ending of an game the previous protagonists become irrelevant. Hawke came back, and that gave them relevance, and if he or she survive Adamant we see our hero walking off in the sunset after an job well done. And that's the kind of thing I want to see.

[dsl08002]

If it is something that i want to see and experience is when my warden reunites with Leliana. One thing i want to see but that is to much to ask. Isnt it Bioware.

[dsl08002]

If I was writing that questline, I would have the HoF replacing Stroud as one of the possible warden contacts. And rather then running from the demon with their tails between their legs while someone is left behind to die, they would make an epic final stand against the demon.
 
I just dislike how after the ending of an game the previous protagonists become irrelevant. Hawke came back, and that gave them relevance, and if he or she survive Adamant we see our hero walking off in the sunset after an job well done. And that's the kind of thing I want to see.

Yes what the hell happens then in weisthupt hawke dissappears as well and is never seen again if weekes statement is to be applied here as well.

Besides the two remaining old gods in the deep roads they will continue to exist. Why not simply hold the warden off and then in a final game if there is one conclude with a blight again, and the same person that started the series can end it as well

[TheKomandorShepard]

The last thing i would need to the warden replace grey warden in that quest further destroying that character and turning him/her into generic grey warden that loves grey wardens. 

[Serza]

Leliana never becomes Divine with my canon, so no Warden official marriage to Leliana for me. My Warden's a woman, an elf, and a Dalish Elf at that, so that's three times over it'd never be legally recognized.

Don't think that bothers them, though. They're from two entirely different cultures that likely see the whole process differently. They've already been together for eleven something years now anyway, they probably see it as a 'Well, we might as well be already.'

...I do like to think they did something hush hush for a little more recognition though. Maybe she gives Leliana some kind of Dalish wedding band as a token and Leliana gave her a Chantry equivalent, for an extra little something when apart. I'm cheesy like that.

 

She ended the Fifth Blight.

 

I'm pretty sure the Chantry won't mind a thing when it comes to the Hero of Ferelden, the Slayer of Urthemiel.

[AWTEW]

No, it really isn't. The angry reaction if they gave the Warden a BS off-screen death for no reason other than 'Uh, we don't know what to do here' would be ten times worse than the people who'd be demanding more even if the Warden had a good ending.

The angry reaction? I honestly don't think there would be a major one, if it was done correctly.

[I WANT YOU TO FUCK ME JERY]

The angry reaction? I honestly don't think there would be a major one, if it was done correctly.

 

Except there is no 'correct way' to do an off-screen death of a protagonist that plenty of people still love. 

 

It'd be **** by default. The idea is horrible. 

[Fiery Phoenix]

Except there is no 'correct way' to do an off-screen death of a protagonist that plenty of people still love. 

 

It'd be **** by default. The idea is horrible. 

Well, the only good thing about off-screen is making it easier for fans to headcanon stuff, but otherwise I agree.

[I WANT YOU TO FUCK ME JERY]

Well, the only good thing about off-screen is making it easier for fans to headcanon stuff, but otherwise I agree.

 

Not much of a good thing in regards to an off screen death, though. What am I supposed to headcanon? How many arrows it took to kill them? What disease they died from? Doesn't matter, they'd be disappointingly dead because BioWare got lazy and didn't know what to do with the character either way. There's literally no way to do that without it being a pointless middle finger to the Warden's story. 

 

If they want to leave it to headcanon they should actually leave it to headcanon, killing them isn't doing that. Really, I have no idea why anyone would even begin to think that's a good idea.

[CosmicalAdventure]

 

I think marriage might be interesting if Bioware takes a character with a noble background, and has them in an arranged married from the start of the game. Lorewise arranged marriages are a fact of life for the nobility, but we've yet to see that come into play with our player characters. That character then taking one of the companion characters as a paramour or breaking off an engagement or a marriage could lead to all sorts of interesting consequences. Maybe your family demands you honor your vows and ditch the paramour or a younger and more dutiful son or daughter will replace you as heir. Or maybe the noble family of your bride or husband is humiliated and enraged, provoking a violent reaction against you or your family (think the Freys.) Your character could be faced with the dilemma of following his/her heart or doing your noble duty for the good of your family.

 

I think that would have plenty of potential to be mined for quality quests(s) based on your background.

 

If marriage is going to be introduced...have it come with some intrigue and drama.

 

Well Josephine romance's quests sorta follow that storyline, especially if you romance her with a human male. Nevertheless even though there are dramas and duel and intrigues, Josie's romance quests are often seen by the players as something too Disney-ish thus it is somewhat dull (though I don't agree with this notion at all). So yeah, I think it's reasonable for me to be skeptical if the whole marriage thing would be... properly written in a non-sappy way. 

 

She ended the Fifth Blight.

 

I'm pretty sure the Chantry won't mind a thing when it comes to the Hero of Ferelden, the Slayer of Urthemiel.

 

This is an interesting point to be discussed though somewhat unrelated. I feel that even though HoF ends the Fifth Blight, I get the feeling his/her heroism is not as long-lasting as someone like.. Garahel who ended the Fourth Blight. Perhaps it's because the Fifth Blight happened so fast, people just thought it's a mere legend rather than an extraordinary achievement.

 

oh to avoid off-topic, I don't think whether the marriage is technically legal or not actually matters in Thedas.

[ThePhoenixKing]

Honestly, they should just bring the Warden back, not as an NPC like they did with Hawke (seeing how poorly that turned out), but as the PC for the next game. Why not? The Warden is definitely the best of the three protagonists thus far, and certainly more interesting than the Inquisitor (who generally has the personality of dried toast). And if they feel the need to justify the Bag of Spilling, then they could just say that the means by which the Calling was ended exacted a big physical/spiritual toll on them, and they're still recovering.

[CosmicalAdventure]

Honestly, they should just bring the Warden back, not as an NPC like they did with Hawke (seeing how poorly that turned out), but as the PC for the next game. Why not? The Warden is definitely the best of the three protagonists thus far, and certainly more interesting than the Inquisitor (who generally has the personality of dried toast). And if they feel the need to justify the Bag of Spilling, then they could just say that the means by which the Calling was ended exacted a big physical/spiritual toll on them, and they're still recovering.

 

 

I believe from the beginning Bioware already intended to use different approach for Dragon Age series (using Mass Effect as a comparison). So rather than having a single protagonist who gets trapped and involved in various calamities, Dragon Age is more intented to be an event-based game, so we knows what happens all around Thedas from each PCs' perspective. 

 

There are also technical and resources limitations as well, and considering that the Warden was a silent protagonist, perhaps making them having a voice-over would make their personalities become... unnatural for many people (and his/her personality isn't as customizable as Hawke). 

[ThePhoenixKing]

I believe from the beginning Bioware already intended to use different approach for Dragon Age series (using Mass Effect as a comparison). So rather than having a single protagonist who gets trapped and involved in various calamities, Dragon Age is more intented to be an event-based game, so we knows what happens all around Thedas from each PCs' perspective. 

 

There are also technical and resources limitations as well, and considering that the Warden was a silent protagonist, perhaps making them having a voice-over would make their personalities become... unnatural for many people (and his/her personality isn't as customizable as Hawke). 

 

I don't really see how resource limitations would be an issue; it's just a matter of prioritizing. Yes, you wouldn't be able to make your Warden look 100% identical, what with the engine change, but they could give it the old college try. Besides, Inquisition was a game where they built entire zones that had no bearing on the plot whatsoever, if they shifted resources away from doing that to the Warden and his/her quest, they could make it work. Same thing with the voices, it'll be a change, but with some good writing and a focus on player agency, a managable one.

[Xilizhra]

Honestly, they should just bring the Warden back, not as an NPC like they did with Hawke (seeing how poorly that turned out), but as the PC for the next game. Why not? The Warden is definitely the best of the three protagonists thus far, and certainly more interesting than the Inquisitor (who generally has the personality of dried toast). And if they feel the need to justify the Bag of Spilling, then they could just say that the means by which the Calling was ended exacted a big physical/spiritual toll on them, and they're still recovering.

Wouldn't it be a better use of resources to make a new protagonist? Especially since not everyone will have played Origins, or agree with you about the Hero of Ferelden being the best PC.

[Aimi]

Honestly, they should just bring the Warden back, not as an NPC like they did with Hawke (seeing how poorly that turned out), but as the PC for the next game. Why not? The Warden is definitely the best of the three protagonists thus far, and certainly more interesting than the Inquisitor (who generally has the personality of dried toast). And if they feel the need to justify the Bag of Spilling, then they could just say that the means by which the Calling was ended exacted a big physical/spiritual toll on them, and they're still recovering.

YMMV.

A lot of people are done with the Warden.