No, you're thinking about it the other way around. It was decided that technically, you could perceive it as raping Leliana.
Simply, a no-go. But the original idea was just... so much superior, IMHO. And yes, I'll emphasize again, it was superior if you removed that whole "sleep with Leli" bit.
No, the Envy demon would be raping the Inquisitor via rape by deception.
In any event, the only reason I would want this Envy demon thing is to troll the people who wanted a Leliana romance in Inquisition. Muahaha take that.
Hey, don't hate on people who realize that Leliana is the best female character in the game. It's not like we have many options.
No, you're thinking about it the other way around. It was decided that technically, you could perceive it as raping Leliana.
Since Leliana wouldn't have anything to do with it, technically you couldn't.
What people were referring to was the envy demon's deception. And it's still somewhat of a stretch, complicated by the fact that there is no real world equivalent to "mimicking someone in exact physical detail." If we actually considered pretending to be something you're not in order to seduce someone to be the same as rape it would be pretty radical. It would cover an awful lot of people, and be very complicated to argue where the line should be drawn with regards to what lies, large or small, qualified.
I can understand BioWare deciding not to face these questions, but I think people tossed the word "rape" around awfully loosely.
I think the way the Envy Demon attacks you now is pretty cool.
I just wouldn't buy defeating the demon easily. Considering a virtually identical situation played out in the webcomic Order of the Stick only a couple of months before, I would be like "Whatever, Demon Leliana. Stop being so demon-y."
I think the way the Envy Demon attacks you now is pretty cool.
I do think it should have been more of a mental battle though. I'm iffy on the Leliana concept in the scrapped part of that quest, but I wish they stuck with the idea of Envy messing with your head by tricking you.
Sort of inception, "is this the real world or is it all fake?" 
Sort of inception, "is this the real world or is it all fake?"
In any event, the only reason I would want this Envy demon thing is to troll the people who wanted a Leliana romance in Inquisition. Muahaha take that.
I like the Envy encounter as it is just fine, I do wish they would have saved the old idea for a future game, it would fit perfectly for an encounter with a desire demon. I liked that Envy operated differently from the other demons.
Funny those were my thoughts exactly when I heard about it, bonus points if Leliana ended up killing the Inquisitor and giving them a game over.
I think the original idea could have been done without the seduction and it would have been cool if made right. The Fade part in Champions of the Just was for me another demon trying to trick my character in a Fade sequence. It's not the first time in a DA game. Making us players think it was real and not another Fade sequence could have been great.
The idea of Leliana trying to seduce the Inquisitor in that scenario doesn't work for me. I have personally no troubles with the concept of one of my characters being seduced by trickery and deception, but Leliana trying to seduce the Inquisitor would have made me, the player, very suspicious. We know Leliana is a woman quite distant to the Inquisitor, she's hurt by Justinia's death, and she isn't the kind of person that would look for a quick nookie to cheer herself up, and that's with the unromanced Leli scenario, it would make no sense for a romanced Leliana. That kind of scene would make me think immediately "Who are you and what have you done with Leliana?"
Sorry for interrupting, but the other Leliana thread seems quite dead, so I think there's nothing wrong about asking here: I read somewhere that originally Leliana was intended to be a warrior (see also the cover of DA tabletop rpg, it's a concept art; sorry, I can't find a better resolution picture).
Anyone has some informations about that? I thought to ask Gaider on Tumblr, only to discover that his blog was closed 
I don't really know what to think about the whole Leliana-disguised-as-Envy-seducing-you cut content, but it would've been very interesting to see what would've happened to the relationship between the Inquisitor and Leliana if Quizzy decided to tell Lels that they slept with her.
I can only imagine how much devastated Leliana would be (especially if you consider what happened to her in that prison in Leliana's Song) to find out that the Inquisitor used her in a way, even if it was only for pleasure.
I, as a player, would have probably been put off playing and interacting with Leliana for the rest of the game, most likely restart to do In Hushed Whispers (which, in my opinion, is the most amazing moment of Leliana as a character). 
I don't really know what to think about the whole Leliana-disguised-as-Envy-seducing-you cut content, but it would've been very interesting to see what would've happened to the relationship between the Inquisitor and Leliana if Quizzy decided to tell Lels that they slept with her.
I can only imagine how much devastated Leliana would be (especially if you consider what happened to her in that prison in Leliana's Song) to find out that the Inquisitor used her in a way, even if it was only for pleasure.
I, as a player, would have probably been put off playing and interacting with Leliana for the rest of the game, most likely restart to do In Hushed Whispers (which, in my opinion, is the most amazing moment of Leliana as a character).
Except that it wouldn't have been her per say. In the scenario Envy took her form, but the real Leliana was untouched. She still would find it disturbing, but the squick factor would have been diminished by the fact that the Inquisitor thought she was making a move.
I can imagine DAI Leliana would have reacted to such a revelation with a mix of disgust, anger and possibly scorn. She certainly wouldn't think too highly of a Herald who got fooled by any demon, and after learning about this particular type from Cullen, she would think even less of them.
f anything it would have been interesting if internal politics had played a bigger role. We get elected as Inquisitor unanimously by the 'Council of Four' (Cullen, Leliana, Josephine and Cassandra), but what if the vote had been divided? What if we'd been installed as a mere figurehead for politics' sake and we'd had to actually earn the respect and trust of our inner circle?
As it is, the approval/disapproval mechanic is largely cosmetic. Most of the companions' personal quests unlock regardless of how they feel about us. Higher relationship values could have lead to new abilities or perhaps a buff like in Origins.
Sorry for interrupting, but the other Leliana thread seems quite dead, so I think there's nothing wrong about asking here: I read somewhere that originally Leliana was intended to be a warrior (see also the cover of DA tabletop rpg, it's a concept art; sorry, I can't find a better resolution picture).
Anyone has some informations about that? I thought to ask Gaider on Tumblr, only to discover that his blog was closed
It may be possible. In his blog he did make passing reference to some of the first concept designs that some characters started off as I still have a screen below. Part of her concept seems to gotten rolled into Cassandra's character. Not much to go off though.
"Eventually we’ll settle on a final list— but chances are it won’t look much like when we started. The concepts we began with probably won’t be recognizeable any longer. Does Morrigan still talk in an ethereal, dreamy fashion like Delirium from the Sandman comic? Nope. Is Alistair still the grizzled veteran Grey Warden, distrustful of others due to his bitterness at being an unwanted bastard? Nope. Is Leliana still the free-wheeling adventuress from a long line of dragon hunters? Umm… no. Is Shale the unfeeling automoton who talks in a monotone and to whom you must prove the value of human life? Not anymore."
We know Leliana is a woman quite distant to the Inquisitor, she's hurt by Justinia's death, and she isn't the kind of person that would look for a quick nookie to cheer herself up, and that's with the unromanced Leli scenario, it would make no sense for a romanced Leliana. That kind of scene would make me think immediately "Who are you and what have you done with Leliana?"
"Eventually we’ll settle on a final list— but chances are it won’t look much like when we started. The concepts we began with probably won’t be recognizeable any longer. Does Morrigan still talk in an ethereal, dreamy fashion like Delirium from the Sandman comic? Nope. Is Alistair still the grizzled veteran Grey Warden, distrustful of others due to his bitterness at being an unwanted bastard? Nope. Is Leliana still the free-wheeling adventuress from a long line of dragon hunters? Umm… no. Is Shale the unfeeling automoton who talks in a monotone and to whom you must prove the value of human life? Not anymore."
Quite interesting, maybe they reused part of their original ideas for the first Dragon Age somewhere else: a long line of dragon hunters... like Cassandra?, Shale talking in a monotone, like an elcor?
Anyone else wish there was less Justinia attached to Leliana's character in this game?
What little we talked to her was so focused on frickin Justinia.
Under Her Skin is a breath of fresh air since we can see our spymaster at work. Otherwise, her content in the game was rather disappointing.
It may be possible. In his blog he did make passing reference to some of the first concept designs that some characters started off as I still have a screen below. Part of her concept seems to gotten rolled into Cassandra's character. Not much to go off though.
Spoiler
"Eventually we’ll settle on a final list— but chances are it won’t look much like when we started. The concepts we began with probably won’t be recognizeable any longer. Does Morrigan still talk in an ethereal, dreamy fashion like Delirium from the Sandman comic? Nope. Is Alistair still the grizzled veteran Grey Warden, distrustful of others due to his bitterness at being an unwanted bastard? Nope. Is Leliana still the free-wheeling adventuress from a long line of dragon hunters? Umm… no. Is Shale the unfeeling automoton who talks in a monotone and to whom you must prove the value of human life? Not anymore."
Well, we do know where they partly got an inspiration for Cassandra's character...
But, Leliana being from a long-line of dragon hunters sure is an interesting concept, which they may not have left out entirely. Just like how they included the part about being an unwanted bastard to Alistair's final character design, who's to say they brushed off Leliana's dragon hunter heritage as well?
Her having dragon blood kind of fits with her resistance to the Blight in Inquisition. Maybe she is a descendant from a dragon-slaying family like the Pentaghasts or even distant relatives to Alistair's family. From her father's side at least.
The supposed resistance to the Blight comes off to me as simply an explanation as to why Leliana, and the rest of the Origins party didn't get infected by it during the Fifth Blight. The devs have stated in the past that they had the idea to let the party members get infected, and you would then have the choice to make them Grey Wardens.
I doubt Leliana has some kind of dragon blood in her like Alistair, not sure what the point of it would be too.
I don't know, being possibly raped by a demon might be worth it to sleep with Leliana one more time... were it not for the fact that you'd have to side with the templars for it.
Speaking of which, I've always found it funny that a mage PC can, in fact, rape Connor's desire demon.
being possibly raped by a demon might be worth it
raped by a demon
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