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[Narcosynthesis]

I hope they don't make her two sides completely black and white after 2 years. Softened Leliana isn't a spotless saint feeding the poor and helping old ladies across the street and hardened Leliana isn't a completely heartless sociopath with no morals whatsoever such as Marjolaine. I feel like if they ever pushed the extremes of both sides we'd end up with some weird caricature of Leliana rather than Leliana. 

 

^This. One thing I liked about how the hardening/softening has been handled so far was that I could still see the same person behind both "versions". A few months back, I read a pretty fitting analysis (not sure if it was here or some place else) stating that the aspects of "playing hard/dirty" and "having the greater good in mind" are present in both versions of Leliana - it's the priorities that differ. While a hardened Leli focuses on being brutally effective, that doesn't entail she won't go for a diplomatic route if this is an effective and secure way to achieve the goals in question. "Soft" Leliana, on the other hand, tries to minimize casualties and bloodshed on all sides of the conflict in question, but - in Josephine's words - "Niceness before knives" still does not mean the total absence of knives...

 

(A bit simplified, I know. And it's clear that on a more emotional level the difference affects the personality more deeply, but to summarize what we get to see inside the game it suffices)

 

In my book, it seemed a logical difference so far - and I hope that it will stay like that in the DLC, not some black/white angel/devil kind of character...or rather, as you put it: caricature of a character. 

[N7_Heartfire]

Yeah, Bioware please don't screw up. With both her Spymaster and Divine storyline...

 

I hope they don't limit the two sides of her personality to: hardened = Marjolaine, unhardened = not Marjolaine. They've done a pretty good job so far with her dual personality in both games.

[GrinningRogue]

I'd seriously be disappointed if hardened = Marjolaine. If she's to be a villain, she can be a lot better villain than that. Marjolaine just seem petty to me.

[LadyStoneheart]

Yeah, Bioware please don't screw up. With both her Spymaster and Divine storyline...

 

I hope they don't limit the two sides of her personality to: hardened = Marjolaine, unhardened = not Marjolaine. They've done a pretty good job so far with her dual personality in both games.

 

I think there could also be a "skipped her quest" outcome. They said Cole won't come back at your side in Trespasser if you didn't choose between "more human" and "more spirit", a similar thing could happen with Leliana.

[Narcosynthesis]

I think there could also be a "skipped her quest" outcome. They said Cole won't come back at your side in Trespasser if you didn't choose between "more human" and "more spirit", a similar thing could happen with Leliana.

 

Good point. Though I wonder if the "skipped her quest" outcome wouldn't be equal to "hardened"? I never actually skipped her quest (of course not!), but if I understand correctly if you do she'll come out in the hardened version by default, right?

 

Also, there's the difference between the optional companions and the mandatory advisors to consider. With Cole (as with other companions), there is the possibility that he is not around anyway because he was never recruited/kicked out, so in terms of writing they'd have to account for that outcome in the DLC anyway. Our advisor's roles, however, were firmly tied into the story, so I'm not sure if they'd want/could open up scenarios where they are simply not around in Trespasser. My assumption would be that she's going to be there either way and the main differences will be "hardened/softened" and "Divine/Non-Divine", possibly with a few additional lines of a potential Warden-romance.

 

Or - and maybe that's what you had in mind? - there's a scenario with a Divine Leliana, who'll make an appearence but not actively support the Inquisition because of the skipped quest. I guess, that possibility strongly hinges on the question how big/plot-integral her actual role in the DLC is.

[N7_Heartfire]

I think Leliana, Cass, Cullen and Josie will return no matter what you do. The writers said not returning if you didn't do their personal quest only applies to a couple of your companions, not all of them.

 

As far as the Divine goes, the devs said she returns to help the Inquisitor either way. As for Leliana, I think the biggest focus will be on her harden/unhardened personality. Maybe if you ignored her personal quest she stays hardened by default...

 

And I don't think there will be a scenario where if you ignored Leliana's personal quest she doesn't return, what happens if you ignored her quest and made her Divine?

[LadyStoneheart]

Good point. Though I wonder if the "skipped her quest" outcome wouldn't be equal to "hardened"? I never actually skipped her quest (of course not!), but if I understand correctly if you do she'll come out in the hardened version by default, right?

I'm not sure, but I don't think so. According to the Wiki, if you skip Leliana's quest and she becomes Divine you get this slide in the epilogue:

[Divine Victoria is controversial from the start, several new sects arise, resisting her reforms and declaring her rule a threat to the faith.] She does not fight them, and it is not long before the Chantry's fractures threaten to tear it apart forever.

 

Note that it's very different from the hardened ("Her response is as swift as it is deadly, unity is maintained, but blood runs through the halls of the Grand Cathedral") and the softened ("She meets with their leaders, urging unity. Miraculously her words take root, and - for now - the Chantry remains strong") ones.

Leliana is mentioned in the epilogue only if she becomes Divine, but skipping her quest could have consequences in the long run even for Spymaster!Leliana.

 

Or - and maybe that's what you had in mind? - there's a scenario with a Divine Leliana, who'll make an appearence but not actively support the Inquisition because of the skipped quest. I guess, that possibility strongly hinges on the question how big/plot-integral her actual role in the DLC is.

Yes, that's what I meant. If she doesn't even try to placate her opponents right after becoming Divine why would she pick our side when facing a much bigger threat?

I don't know, I can't help thinking that the Advisors' personal quests could play a big role even though (or maybe because) there's no approval system with them. It would be weird if there were no consequences after two years if, for example, we decided to tell Cullen to keep drinking lyrium (a decision that ends a relationship with him if he's romanced).

I could be completely wrong of course, but it's fun to speculate while we wait.

[N7_Heartfire]

Well the devs did say that depending how their personal quests ended, our conversations with the companions/advisers may vary; some funny some sad, etc. I bet the saddest version of Leliana will be the one where we didn't finish her personal quest. I have the same vibe about Cullen as well.

[Narcosynthesis]

I'm not sure, but I don't think so. According to the Wiki, if you skip Leliana's quest and she becomes Divine you get this slide in the epilogue:
[Divine Victoria is controversial from the start, several new sects arise, resisting her reforms and declaring her rule a threat to the faith.] She does not fight them, and it is not long before the Chantry's fractures threaten to tear it apart forever.
 
Note that it's very different from the hardened ("Her response is as swift as it is deadly, unity is maintained, but blood runs through the halls of the Grand Cathedral") and the softened ("She meets with their leaders, urging unity. Miraculously her words take root, and - for now - the Chantry remains strong") ones.
Leliana is mentioned in the epilogue only if she becomes Divine, but skipping her quest could have consequences in the long run even for Spymaster!Leliana.

 

Oh, I really wasn't aware of that, thanks! Okay, with that "new" knowledge I'd agree even more to your initial point since that is truly quite a notable difference - and actually a rather interesting scenario since this "indecisive version" leaves open (more than the other two) whether her she'll actually be successful with her reforms or not. So yeah: I'd very much hope - and even expect - that this outcome is in some way acknowledged in Trespasser as well - at the very least by a few changed lines of dialogue. Or in the way mentioned earlier (her making an appearence, but not joining the Inquisitor).

[introverted_assassin]

I don't have the tie that binds with my Inquisitors. So I have yet to know how I'd feel if death was the only option(and I could actually play this DLC) for them.

With my Warden, Leli was the reason for everything. She was quite tired, mentally and physically, after defeating the Blight but that redhead kept her going. I don't even have a canon romance for DA:I so yeah.

[ThePhoenixKing]

I hope they don't make her two sides completely black and white after 2 years. Softened Leliana isn't a spotless saint feeding the poor and helping old ladies across the street and hardened Leliana isn't a completely heartless sociopath with no morals whatsoever such as Marjolaine. I feel like if they ever pushed the extremes of both sides we'd end up with some weird caricature of Leliana rather than Leliana. 

 

Totally agree with this. Regrettably, I found a lot of Inquisition's writing to be a bit black-and-white, and given how ruthless they seem to be about cutting off the branches to make their future writing easier, I am a bit worried that they might take the easy way out and give a one-dimensional characterization rather than give the time and effort necessary to write Leliana effectively. Still, I have been wrong about their portrayal of Leliana before, so here's hoping they do a good job with her.

 

I don't have the tie that binds with my Inquisitors. So I have yet to know how I'd feel if death was the only option(and I could actually play this DLC) for them.

With my Warden, Leli was the reason for everything. She was quite tired, mentally and physically, after defeating the Blight but that redhead kept her going. I don't even have a canon romance for DA:I so yeah.

 

Agreed. I just don't feel connected to the Inquisitor and Inner Circle the way I did with the Warden and company, or Hawke and her merry band of misfits. Not sure if this says more about me or the game, but the trailer for Trepasser is really the first time I've felt engaged with the Inquisitor and interested in what happens to them.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Wonder how the divine Leliana romance will turn out if you exile the wardens assuming ignore ever mentioned

[introverted_assassin]

Totally agree with this. Regrettably, I found a lot of Inquisition's writing to be a bit black-and-white, and given how ruthless they seem to be about cutting off the branches to make their future writing easier, I am a bit worried that they might take the easy way out and give a one-dimensional characterization rather than give the time and effort necessary to write Leliana effectively. Still, I have been wrong about their portrayal of Leliana before, so here's hoping they do a good job with her.


Agreed. I just don't feel connected to the Inquisitor and Inner Circle the way I did with the Warden and company, or Hawke and her merry band of misfits. Not sure if this says more about me or the game, but the trailer for Trepasser is really the first time I've felt engaged with the Inquisitor and interested in what happens to them.

agree. this is actually a DLC i would buy because it SEEMS more tied to the main story plotline than those other two. plus I know there's more Leli in it and y'all know how I feel about bae. alas...last gen.

[Kukuru]

I'm on the same boat, perhaps in a future if the rumor about a Goty version is true, i might get a cheap copy for PC with all dlc included.

For the moment will have to check youtube videos.

[ThePhoenixKing]

I'm on the same boat, perhaps in a future if the rumor about a Goty version is true, i might get a cheap copy for PC with all dlc included.

For the moment will have to check youtube videos.

 

Yeah, thank God for Let's Plays, or more specifically DanaDuchy and FluffyNinjaLlama.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Yeah, thank God for Let's Plays, or more specifically DanaDuchy and FluffyNinjaLlama.

Still remember the day I saved fluffyninjalla. A good day

[N7_Heartfire]

Guys, just a heads up, first spoilers for the DLC are already out. Beware, especially if on tumblr. 

 

There are basically leaked meshes/textures for new costumes for the DLC and well, some of them can spoil a lot. I just saw one unique mesh for the Inquisitor's uniform and literally freaked out!

 

Bioware you went too deep!  How could you!

 

Also it seems depending on who's Divine, their uniforms will vary. There are more than a few textures for the Divine's outfit....

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

Guys, just a heads up, first spoilers for the DLC are already out. Beware, especially if on tumblr. 

 

There are basically leaked meshes/textures for new costumes for the DLC and well, some of them can spoil a lot. I just saw one unique mesh for the Inquisitor's uniform and literally freaked out!

 

Bioware you went too deep!    How could you!

 

Also it seems depending on who's Divine, their uniforms will vary. There are more than a few textures for the Divine's outfit....

 

 

Spoiler

 

So we're going to get our arm chopped off? 

 

Sweet. That's one way to get rid of the mark. 

 

 

[N7_Heartfire]

Spoiler

 

So we're going to get our arm chopped off? 

 

Sweet. That's one way to get rid of the mark. 

 

 

 

I know right! So much angst in this DLC, I love it!

 

Though one thing about some of the meshes that confused me was

 

Spoiler

Wedding dress? Swimsuit? Honeymoon clothing? What is this, Bioware???? And what's interesting is that neither of those outfits have the chopped arm mesh...So the wedding either happens early in the DLC or if you don't get your arm chopped off it seems. I hope Solas is the one to do it, that'd be even more epic.

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

I know right! So much angst in this DLC, I love it!

 

Though one thing about some of the meshes that confused me was

 

Spoiler

Wedding dress? Swimsuit? Honeymoon clothing? What is this, Bioware???? And what's interesting is that neither of those outfits have the chopped arm mesh...So the wedding either happens early in the DLC or if you don't get your arm chopped off it seems. I hope Solas is the one to do it, that'd be even more epic.

 

Spoiler

 

I guess it's possible chopping the arm off might be a choice. Live in pain with the mark for the rest of your life or cut it off and be done with it, but...if your Inquisitor is, say, an archer or a two-hander or anything that needs two arms you'd basically be screwing yourself over forever. 

 

No idea what the wedding, swimsuit and honeymoon even means though. Inquisitor romance stuff? 

 

[N7_Heartfire]

Maybe, but kind of weird Bioware would go in that direction as far as romance is concerned...With so much stuff happening in this DLC will there be enough time to do it properly?

[Todrazok]

Oh dear, leaks already? Guess I'll have to go dark :/

[ThePhoenixKing]

Maybe, but kind of weird Bioware would go in that direction as far as romance is concerned...With so much stuff happening in this DLC will their be enough time to do it properly?

 

Here's hoping. One of the things I really loved about the Citadel DLC for ME3 was how it really gave you the chance to say goodbye to all your favourite characters, and continue your ongoing romance. It would be a shame if they neglected such things here.

[N7_Heartfire]

Here's hoping. One of the things I really loved about the Citadel DLC for ME3 was how it really gave you the chance to say goodbye to all your favourite characters, and continue your ongoing romance. It would be a shame if they neglected such things here.

 

I'm all for that.

 

I don't know what I'm excited about more. My Adaar's reunion with Cass (especially after seeing those leaked outfit meshes for the Inquisitor) or a possible HOF mention from Leliana.

 

I'm skeptical about the latter but it wouldn't be fair if they didn't acknowledge the romance. In some playthroughs, a Leliana who didn't become Divine but was romanced rejoins the Warden. I don't see why she wouldn't mention the Warden to the Inquisitor since she herself said Quizzy's her friend not some sort of distant acquaintance who's poking in her private life.

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

Maybe we'll get a hint that the Warden's finally come back at the end of the game, and she'll finally go off to join him/her.

 

Vain hope but you never know. If we're going north this is probably our last romp across southern Thedas, so I don't really see any reason to keep the Warden swept off to the middle of nowhere anymore. They'd be off-screen next game regardless.