523 réponses à ce sujet

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Are we going to be able to select multiple specializations per character?

 

I'm interested to hear what a Tempest is though.

[n7stormrunner]

Are we going to be able to select multiple specializations per character?

 

I'm interested to hear what a Tempest is though.

 

 

no, you get one, and there will be some reactivity to it. or at least that was the plan.

[Mockingword]

Not marginalizing your want, truly pondering for pondering's sake;

Does something like Rivaini Seer need a dedicated school of magic or specialization tree? I understand an argument can be made for Dalish Keeper being the same, I grant that, but at the same time...

Wouldn't it be like being a Pirate or a Bandit, both are rogues, one on the sea and one on land? A Fereldan Dog Lord and a Antivan Crow? A New England Patriot and a New York Jet?

They may do things different, believe different methods, but they're football players. Couldn't a Rivaini Seer just be an Arcane and Entropy based "position" on the "magical sports team"? You know something you select from available schools?

Well, lore states that Rivaini Seers willingly allow spirits to possess them. It seems like an altogether different kind of magic, similar to Shapeshifting.

 

The way I personally picture the class working, such a character would invite a particular spirit into their body, in order to acheive a desired affect, like a buff to themselves and/or their whole party. Mechanically, these "possessions" would all work like the sustained abilities in DA2, but you could only have one activated at a time.

 

For example:

 

"Spirit of Valour: Call a spirit of valour into your body. Grants bonuses to magic and strength, but lowers defense and dexterity. Boosts the morale of nearby party members, granting a bonus to attack damage."

 

or

 

"Spirit of Faith: Call a spirit of Faith into your body. Boosts spellpower and regenerates health and mana but reduces attack damage. Creates healing aura from which nearby party members can benefit."

[Laughing_Man]

Well, lore states that Rivaini Seers willingly allow spirits to possess them. It seems like an altogether different kind of magic, similar to Shapeshifting.

 

The way I personally picture the class working, such a character would invite a particular spirit into their body, in order to acheive a desired affect, like a buff to themselves and/or their whole party. Mechanically, these "possessions" would all work like the sustained abilities in DA2, but you could only have one activated at a time.

 

 

I don't know much about them, but I would imagine that a spirit possession is a one-time-deal, not something you change mid-combat.

[Mockingword]

I don't know much about them, but I would imagine that a spirit possession is a one-time-deal, not something you change mid-combat.

Well, I would imagine otherwise, so I guess we're even.

[oceanicsurvivor]

I don't know much about them, but I would imagine that a spirit possession is a one-time-deal, not something you change mid-combat.

 

Maybe changing mid-combat causes a penalty, or it could be like a Blood Mage where it creates a penalty as well as causing massive buffs. And I certainly imagine it would have a long cooldown. But Conner can be unpossessed in Origins and something similar happens in Asunder, so possession isn't a permanent thing every time.

[Laughing_Man]

Maybe changing mid-combat causes a penalty, or it could be like a Blood Mage where it creates a penalty as well as causing massive buffs. And I certainly imagine it would have a long cooldown. But Conner can be unpossessed in Origins and something similar happens in Asunder, so possession isn't a permanent thing every time.

 

My point was that from what we know so far, possession looks like a permanent or at least semi-permanent thing.

Therefore, switching possessions especially mid-battle simply sounds unlikely to say the least.

[andy6915]

As a Rogue, I'm a bit disappointed in Artificer. It sounds like it deals mostly in trap-making which was (hands-down) the most pointless perk set in Origins. Assassin is on that I've never been very fond of though I always used it for my Rogues due to it's sheer strength. I look forward to learning more about Tempest as it sounds like the most mobility-based specialization. That's what I look for with Rogues.

 

Maybe it works like traps on the finesse class of Kingdoms of Amalur, where you can just freely throw traps around at a small cost to mana like any other talent/ability. Pretty much just a standard talent, not crafting needed. This video shows what I mean. Think it will be like this? (starting at 53 seconds will jump right to the part where traps are shown off)-

 

[Wintersbreath]

According to the new interview with Cameron Lee:

 

Pure blood magic in the lore of the game is really supposed to be a very evil power. In previous games it wasn't really perceived to be that way. We talked about it being that way in the lore, we'd talk about crazy mages who went down the blood magic route and how that would have nasty consequences. So in Inquisition if we can't bring that across, that consequence across then we won't do it. We're looking at a couple of different options that still give that quasi-evil kind of fantasy element without trying to go into the nitty gritty of blood magic conflicting with other elements, but we haven't landed on which one's going to be there.

 

So we recognise the problem and we're very cognisant of the fact that we may not be able to do blood magic, but we would certainly replace it with something pretty bad arse.... And if I want to be this bad arse necromancer kind of guy who fiddles with the spirit world I'm going to do it...

 

In DA:O, blood magic could be used to enter the Fade and save the Arl's son. We understood that blood magic can be used without killing anyone, and for good - a means to an end. I guess what Cameron is refering to as "pure blood magic" is when mages sacrifice (i.e. kill) people in the act but even so, if it's supposed to be a "very evil power," obviously they've done it wrong.

 

If this is the case, then, in DA2, I think they kinda tried to rectify the perception that blood magic is not necessarily pure evil? By showing us a lot of cray cray mages. But that didn't really work, did it? We still see blood magic as a means to an end, with huge risks, sure, but not pure evil. At least I did. And I believe Merrill and Irving would agree. Now in DAI, I think either they're gonna retcon it (if they want to stay true to their lore) or show us even more cray cray people, which I don't think will work tbh.

 

So basically, the article pretty much cements the fact that blood magic won't be available to the PC, and is replaced by necromancer because it's supposedly less sinister and evil. Unless I'm convinced, later on, that blood magic is really pure evil, I would be displeased that they cut blood mage as a specialization, or a school of magic as it could have also been. And I was really looking forward to seeing people's reactions to my blood mage Qunari Inquisitor.

[ProfessionalPirate]

According to the new interview with Cameron Lee:

In DA:O, blood magic could be used to enter the Fade and save the Arl's son. We understood that blood magic can be used without killing anyone, and for good - a means to an end. I guess what Cameron is refering to as "pure blood magic" is when mages sacrifice (i.e. kill) people in the act but even so, if it's supposed to be a "very evil power," obviously they've done it wrong.

Except Isolde died. If you went the blood magic route to save Conner, she dies. Yes, she gave her life willingly for her son, but she still ended up dead. Very dead. Lol.

[darkiddd]

I'm hyped for the rift mage. I guess it will be a very destructive specialization, tearing your enemies apart by creating small rifts to the fade that close soon after. Heavy risk, but the prize...

[LobselVith8]

According to the new interview with Cameron Lee:

 

In DA:O, blood magic could be used to enter the Fade and save the Arl's son. We understood that blood magic can be used without killing anyone, and for good - a means to an end. I guess what Cameron is refering to as "pure blood magic" is when mages sacrifice (i.e. kill) people in the act but even so, if it's supposed to be a "very evil power," obviously they've done it wrong.

 

Except Duncan counters the mage protagonist saying it's evil by pointing out that some Grey Warden mages use it to give them an edge against the darkspawn, so I don't get the impression that it was supposed to be evil. Clearly, it's been used for malevolent purposes, but that's because of the misuse by the user, not the magic itself.

 

If this is the case, then, in DA2, I think they kinda tried to rectify the perception that blood magic is not necessarily pure evil? By showing us a lot of cray cray mages. But that didn't really work, did it? We still see blood magic as a means to an end, with huge risks, sure, but not pure evil. At least I did. And I believe Merrill and Irving would agree. Now in DAI, I think either they're gonna retcon it (if they want to stay true to their lore) or show us even more cray cray people, which I don't think will work tbh.

 

Irving is willing to buy the flimsy "Grey Warden magic" excuse in the cut scene with Wynne, so I wouldn't be surprised. We also had Merrill and Alain, so even the plethora of homicidal lunatics was (somewhat) balanced out, and the danger was still from the respective people using their abilities for harmful reasons. I'm also hoping we don't see anymore one-dimensional mages; it would be preferable if both mages and templars were fleshed out, three-dimensional characters, and hopefully, we encounter some blood mages in the vein of Merrill and Alain, rather than asinine caricatures like Decimus and Grace.

 

So basically, the article pretty much cements the fact that blood magic won't be available to the PC, and is replaced by necromancer because it's supposedly less sinister and evil. Unless I'm convinced, later on, that blood magic is really pure evil, I would be displeased that they cut blood mage as a specialization, or a school of magic as it could have also been. And I was really looking forward to seeing people's reactions to my blood mage Qunari Inquisitor.

 

Are there going to be any reactions to the specializations available?

[zambingo]

Re: Rivaini Seer

Thanks for the info, Mockingword. Is that lore from a book? I do not mean that with snark. I peruse the in game codexes sometimes and I don't recall seeing info about it. Of course, I could have missed it.

With the Seers relying on Spirit Possession, then yeah, I agree that would need some type of additional thing in game. A tree or specialization at the least.

[Mockingword]

Re: Rivaini Seer

Thanks for the info, Mockingword. Is that lore from a book? I do not mean that with snark. I peruse the in game codexes sometimes and I don't recall seeing info about it. Of course, I could have missed it.

With the Seers relying on Spirit Possession, then yeah, I agree that would need some type of additional thing in game. A tree or specialization at the least.

There's some info about the Seers of Rivain here: http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Rivain

 

Not very much has been revealed about them, though.

[Mirrman70]

I think that the existence of so few "sane" blood mages in comparison to the number of "insane" blood mages is important to compare to the idea of people going insane by using blood magic. I think the blood magic works kind of like a drug, the more you use it the more likely it is to destabilize you or cause negative effects. In Merrill and Alain we don't see these destabilizing effects nearly as strongly, Alain shows almost none (I personally don't think he himself used blood magic). Merrill shows an obsession with the mirror, it takes having to mercy kill her mentor and potentially have her entire clan try to kill her for her to even get to the point where she can be convinced that fixing the mirror isn't a good idea. I think this shows a little bit of how Merrill, who's normally very calm and good-natured, was destabilized by the extensive use of blood magic. I am not saying she was "insane" but that it did influence her. If you go from that then you can make the assumption that she had a lot of willpower, one of the perks of being a main character, and do to that willpower she did not become nearly as bad as the other blood mages. another correlation between blood mages and addicts is that blood mages are always seeking more power, like an addict looking for drugs. They develop a need for power and a desire for control.

[LobselVith8]

I think that the existence of so few "sane" blood mages in comparison to the number of "insane" blood mages is important to compare to the idea of people going insane by using blood magic. I think the blood magic works kind of like a drug, the more you use it the more likely it is to destabilize you or cause negative effects. In Merrill and Alain we don't see these destabilizing effects nearly as strongly, Alain shows almost none (I personally don't think he himself used blood magic). Merrill shows an obsession with the mirror, it takes having to mercy kill her mentor and potentially have her entire clan try to kill her for her to even get to the point where she can be convinced that fixing the mirror isn't a good idea. 

 

I think that was a case of developers like Gaider commenting that players sided with mages "by default", and giving us mage antagonists as a response, but making the mistake of giving them no depth or complexity. Decimus, Tahrone, Huon, Quentin, and Grace come across as lunatics, and stupid as well. You could argue this is because of the Band of Three revelation, but a multitude of insane and stupid mages don't make for a compelling argument when you're addressing a schism with sane men, women, and children who possess magical ability, not carboard cutout villains who escaped from Arkham Asylum. It also doesn't help that the majority of these mentally unstable mages were in the Chantry controlled Circle, and in the case of Huon, were sane beforehand.

 

I think this shows a little bit of how Merrill, who's normally very calm and good-natured, was destabilized by the extensive use of blood magic. I am not saying she was "insane" but that it did influence her.

 

Merrill, she thought the Eluvians could fundamentally help her People. She performed research on the lore of the Eluvians and extrapolated data from the shard in order to build one, so I don't blood magic as the reason why she is focused on helping the Elvhen. The plight of the People motivated her. I also didn't think she was wrong to try to create a functional Eluvian.

 

If you go from that then you can make the assumption that she had a lot of willpower, one of the perks of being a main character, and do to that willpower she did not become nearly as bad as the other blood mages. another correlation between blood mages and addicts is that blood mages are always seeking more power, like an addict looking for drugs. They develop a need for power and a desire for control.

 

If that was the case, I think the Grey Wardens would have had a serious problem on their hands by now, given how their mages aren't prohibited from using blood magic.

[Adhin]

I'd also say something that isn't represented, at least from the players side is the idea that blood magic is mostly used just to 'bolster' spells. I could of sworn it was mentioned by some character but it's been so long I can't remember but the idea of using blood magic to bolster basic spells mages do every day was just the most basic, simplest, door entry of the, lets call it craft.

 

Again, from a player perspective blood magic does 2 main things, lets us use are health as a secondary mana source, and has some unique spells. Now the health over mana is a self sacrifice but doesn't let you do anything special. Your spells don't get more powerful it's just a secondary mana source incase you run low or something. So you know, more spells overall.

 

Looking at the more unique stuff DA2 you got Grave Robber, lets you heal your self (only way to do it with blood magic active) via corpses on the ground. So that's not to bad right? Relatively necromantic, I mean they're already dead. Blood Wound/Hemorrhage basically burn the blood of the victims causing crazy damage, that sucks but hey so does a fireball to the face. And that's about where the grey area hits a brick wall.

 

Sacrifice and blood slave(control), one involves you sacrificing your own friends to heal your self to fuel more spells, if they 'pass out' (die, in any other lore) you get a much greater benefit from it. This isn't just a game balance of you removing a party member so of COURSE you should get more... this is showing the nature of the ability. Then you got Blood Slave that doesn't mind control, doesn't magically trick an enemy into thinking his buddies are his enemies. It literally just takes over the blood of a person and forces them to do the casters bidding like they're a toy. in DA2 this skill always kills the enslaved, and an upgrade even makes them explode!

 

And that, my friends is just what the player gets to do. The lore has a lot more screwed up, more long term horrible abusive effects. The only truly grey area as represented by the lore or gameplay is ultimately using blood magic to act as a more hazardous pool of mana. Everything else is generally a bit more screwed up, getting to the point of extremely screwed up. It's hard to look at controlling someones blood to force them into combative slavery till they die as a 'morally grey area'.

 

Shits evil, and most the folks who aren't batshit insane who use it in the past games rarely used it for anything other then fueling normal spells. And often times, story wise, when they did it had some awful consequence (like said mother dying from it). As for grey wardens using it on the Darkspawn? They're the blight, they're ravenous ghouls. Being used by a group of people who have willingly shortened there lives and exist only to kill said blight. Doesn't really make up for the human sacrifice/experiments with some of that crap but... yeah blood slave on a darkspawn who cares.

[Lebanese Dude]

Man...now I'm not sure if I want to run a sword & board warrior or healer paladin-style knight enchanter mage for my first playthrough.

 

THE POSSIBILITIES ARE ENDLESS

[KainD]

or it could be like a Blood Mage where it creates a penalty as well as causing massive buffs.

That's not how blood magic works. It doesn't create any penalties and doesn't cause any buffs.

[oceanicsurvivor]

That's not how blood magic works. It doesn't create any penalties and doesn't cause any buffs.

Oh my bad. I thought it was exchanging health for mana? So you lose health but it increases your spell casting ability? I haven't played as a blood mage though, thats how I thought it worked though, sorry.

[KainD]

Oh my bad. I thought it was exchanging health for mana? So you lose health but it increases your spell casting ability? I haven't played as a blood mage though, thats how I thought it worked though, sorry.

Its a resource, so its like saying that mana descrecment is the penalty for spellcasting.
Its not a penalty.

[WidePaul]

I'm quite excited by all these, though it would have been nice if warriors could have had at least one entirely new spec. I hope this means I get to do 9 playthroughs, so I can try everything at least once.

[luckyloser_62]

I'm quite excited by all these, though it would have been nice if warriors could have had at least one entirely new spec. I hope this means I get to do 9 playthroughs, so I can try everything at least once.

Honestly, despite the names being the same the warrior specs may be almost completely different from the ones we have known. Champion has definitely been reworked. Since we have knight enchanter (which I am super excited about) that seems to somewhat bridge the gap between mage and warrior, I hope the other classes have specs that add similar class variety. With warriors I am hoping that Templar will have more quasi magical spirit attacks like the one from DA2, or maybe some powers along the lines of spirit warrior (without the spirits). I wouldn't be too upset until we see more from the unrevealed specs.

[Laughing_Man]

According to the new interview with Cameron Lee:

 

In DA:O, blood magic could be used to enter the Fade and save the Arl's son. We understood that blood magic can be used without killing anyone, and for good - a means to an end. I guess what Cameron is refering to as "pure blood magic" is when mages sacrifice (i.e. kill) people in the act but even so, if it's supposed to be a "very evil power," obviously they've done it wrong.

 

If this is the case, then, in DA2, I think they kinda tried to rectify the perception that blood magic is not necessarily pure evil? By showing us a lot of cray cray mages. But that didn't really work, did it? We still see blood magic as a means to an end, with huge risks, sure, but not pure evil. At least I did. And I believe Merrill and Irving would agree. Now in DAI, I think either they're gonna retcon it (if they want to stay true to their lore) or show us even more cray cray people, which I don't think will work tbh.

 

So basically, the article pretty much cements the fact that blood magic won't be available to the PC, and is replaced by necromancer because it's supposedly less sinister and evil. Unless I'm convinced, later on, that blood magic is really pure evil, I would be displeased that they cut blood mage as a specialization, or a school of magic as it could have also been. And I was really looking forward to seeing people's reactions to my blood mage Qunari Inquisitor.

 

So instead of taking the deeper and more meaningfull route, and showing that you can't judge something by its looks, and that even an unpleasent or dangerous tool can be used for good - Bioware is going to cop out and make all blood magic the domain of cardboard villains and cliche'd cackling maniacs?

 

Very disappointing.

[Lebanese Dude]

So instead of taking the deeper and more meaningfull route, and showing that you can't judge something by its looks, and that even an unpleasent or dangerous tool can be used for good - Bioware is going to cop out and make all blood magic the domain of cardboard villains and cliche'd cackling maniacs?

Very disappointing.

Or....OR

Given that "Blood Mage" is just the name of a mage who uses blood magic, we aren't sure that blood magic itself won't be used to power spells in the Necromancy tree or be a standard mage tree.

Combat has no health regeneration beyond healing and potions, so using health as a pool from magic can create some serious balance issues. This can be resolved by scrapping the Blood Mage specialization and just incorporating blood magic into a new specialization that uses it but without the "sacrifice health" aspect.

Necromancy is likely tied to the Spirit and Entropy tree, but I not see why thy would exclude elements of blood magic.

Be disappointed if you wish, but until we have the full info, you are missing many pieces of the puzzle.