You're right. People might be too sure of his positive motivation. Keeping in mind there's the chance he's faking it is a reasonable approach.
You, howewer, displays the opposite behaviour, since you seem sure that he has malicious intentions.
I'm certain it had malicious intentions. Those intentions are demonstrated over and over again in the murders it committed. What I am uncertain of is if, why, and how those intentions have changed.
It read to me as "Cole doesn't care about his sexuality" haha. xD Which makes perfect sense. He is a fade spirit. They are curious about human emotions but they don't experience them themselves. While Cole may be an anomaly, I am 100% sure he wont be a romance and as a spirit it makes complete sense.
As much as I would love an asexual romance, I doubt it'll ever happen. Like I've said before I wish they would just come out and say he isn't though. I think they don't want to announce who isn't though as that narrows down who is. xD
Indeed. He didn't kill the girl trapped in Adamant, despite sensing her despair nor Pharamond who desperately wanted to die. He killed his last victim in the beginning chapter, and didn't the entire rest of of the book.
Well, technically he killed those templars to rescue Rhys from the Pit at the end, but that was for combat more than murder (like is being implied in this whole tangent) and Leliana would have killed them if he had not anyways.
Funny enough, going by Minsc and HK popularity, I always just though that BioWare fanbase liked insane and homicidal companions...
The difference is how it's framed. Cole's serial killings were framed seriously, while Minsc and HK were always supposed to be comedic.
Cole is a prime example that spirits are not straight forward. May be the simple ones like hunger and rage are but Cole is more than that. It has repeatedly been stressed that Fade spirits do not really understand our world, just try to mimic it from what they see in mortal's minds, which is why the reflection of the real world is distorted in the Fade. When Justice first came across from the Fade and inhabited Kristof's body he found it difficult to adjust. Had he not had the Warden there to help anchor him and give him a diary (Kristof's memories) to help him, he might well have become like Cole was at the beginning of Asunder - possessed of an identity but not really recalling who that person was. It was taking Cole back to the Fade that caused him to recall those memories that the person Cole would rather have forgotten. The turning point for Cole really was in the Fortress when he doesn't kill the girl. That makes him realise he doesn't have to kill to be real and he starts on the path to a human morality. If kills anyone after that, then he is responsible for his choice in human terms, but before that, in the White Spire, he cannot be held morally responsible for what happened because he doesn't understand that it is wrong. At least that is how I see it. I think he is also gradually acquiring more and more complex human emotions and so becoming less and less the one dimensional spirit that came to the boy Cole in the dungeon.
Strangely enough the thought occurred to me this morning whilst driving home from the shops that may be Cole is the DA version of EDI, both starting out as conditioned by their programming, but gradually becoming self aware and truly alive. At which point I stopped drawing the analogy because it occurred to me what ultimately happened at the end of ME3 and I decided I really didn't want DAI to go that way.
Funny enough, going by Minsc and HK popularity, I always just though that BioWare fanbase liked insane and homicidal companions...
Statement: These meatbags might have some potential afterall master!
Query: Should I terminate one to celebrate?
Well, technically he killed those templars to rescue Rhys from the Pit at the end, but that was for combat more than murder (like is being implied in this whole tangent) and Leliana would have killed them if he had not anyways.
The ones it spares only demonstrate that it is cunning enough not to murder when it cannot get away with it.
Well, technically he killed those templars to rescue Rhys from the Pit at the end, but that was for combat more than murder (like is being implied in this whole tangent) and Leliana would have killed them if he had not anyways.
Yeah I don't count them as well... that was a "kill or be killed" situation. Lelianna would have killed them, and they would have tried to kill Cole and Leli. I don't find it comparable to preying on people that wish to die.
Strangely enough the thought occurred to me this morning whilst driving home from the shops that may be Cole is the DA version of EDI, both starting out as conditioned by their programming, but gradually becoming self aware and truly alive. At which point I stopped drawing the analogy because it occurred to me what ultimately happened at the end of ME3 and I decided I really didn't want DAI to go that way.
That's actually a very good point.
I'm curious about how tranquils will react to Cole. Will his presence re-vitalize them? (I'm taking him on any quest that could involve tranquilized mages because man, I want to see that)
EDI was defending herself. Not the same.
@Fortlowe I think most of us just have more empathy towards Cole's character than you. We all know of the atrocities that he has commited, but most of us also read the parts of the book with his viewpoint as sincere, which you did not apparently. I think it's safe to say we just fundamentally view Cole differently and got different views/info from the book. We could debate this into infinity and probably no one will change their opinions. 
I'm curious about how tranquils will react to Cole. Will his presence re-vitalize them? (I'm taking him on any quest that could involve tranquilized mages because man, I want to see that)
I've thought about this as well. The affect Justice had on Anders friend was quite sudden.
He might get his own faction of tranquilized mages that follow him around all the time to keep their emotions.
The devil you know...
We already discussed the topic. You (like others) think he enjoys killing. Me (like others) believe he didn't, and that he thought he had to kill people to survive. It's obviously a matter of interpretation.I'm certain it had malicious intentions. Those intentions are demonstrated over and over again in the murders it committed. What I am uncertain of is if, why, and how those intentions have changed.
I don't follow.
Knowing a quick end is at hand is a viable option when you suspect a long agonizing demise may be the likely alternative. Of course we know these mages would have at least been given a chance to prove they could be viable members of the Circle (and Cole did, too) but they did not. Another convenient omission on Coles part.
So what I mean is, a quick death at the hands of Cole might have seemed better than some unknown torment.
We already discussed the topic. You (like others) think he enjoys killing. Me (like others) believe he didn't, and that he thought he had to kill people to survive. It's obviously a matter of interpretation.
So do you think It's possible that his intentions changed into positive ones?
No, I do not. I think it does what it has to (lie, omit, manipulate, endear), so it can do what it wants to (murder the helpless).
No, I do not. I think it does what it has to (lie, omit, manipulate, endear), so it can do what it wants to (murder the helpless).
Then you're no different to those that believe he surely has positive intentions.
I'm different in that there is an objective account of the actions I am pointing out. Those that believe it has become benevolent believe so because of what it claims not because of what it has done.
Technically, they believe it becuase his writer said so.I'm different in that there is an objective account of the actions I am pointing out. Those that believe it has become benevolent believe so because of what it claims not because of what it has done.
That is absolutely hilarious. I hope they made screenshots/video!
Also, I find that very curious that they didn't give that a straight answer. Either they're just teasing the fans and he is asexual (likely) or they're hinting at a future romance (therefore possibly implying that he's matured mentally enough for one?).
It wouldn't be OOC to assume they're teasing though as they might just not want to show their hand too quickly in regards to the romancibles.
Personally, I read his response as "he's gotter bigger problems on his mind. His sexuality isn't even a concern to him" - nor will romance be. Bloody BW.
Personally, I read his response as "he's gotter bigger problems on his mind. His sexuality isn't even a concern to him" - nor will romance be. Bloody BW.
That's what I meant by "they're deliberately teasing". Besides, I still think it's sincerely really unlikely he ever will be romancible. Otherwise I wouldn't have made Team Friendzone with him in it.
Edit: Jsyk, it's Team Friendzone as in "a zone full of friends" way, not in the dumb way. A team full of characters that I don't think can be romanced. Cole is #1 on the list.
I'm different in that there is an objective account of the actions I am pointing out. Those that believe it has become benevolent believe so because of what it claims not because of what it has done.
Ok. We get it. You don't like Cole. You believe he's an evil, malicious demon not able to change. We however have different views. No point in going around in circles when you will never change our views - nor will we change yours
I do not necessarily believe that he (not it, he) has become benevolent but PW states certain aspects of his character and since he has written him, I must assume they are correct, unless PW is deliberately trying to mislead us. He still appears to be drawn to human emotions, can sense them, and he seems to be drawn to people who are in distress and requiring comfort. When he first came to Cole, he was a terrified child, shut up in a dark dungeon and "I held his hand in the darkness until it was over." The prime motivating force as a pure spirit was compassion, bringing comfort to one who needed it.
However, he has developed since then, He advanced from his state at the beginning of the book until the end. He is no longer a pure spirit and since it is clear neither we, nor the majority of inhabitant of Thedas, have any real idea of the nature of spirits, or how they can interact with the material world, it is difficult to know truly what he is. It would certainly be wise to tread warily where he is concerned because he is still finding his way and is very impressionable, but to prejudge him as being totally untrustworthy and trying to deceive would be unfair, unless you are going to take that view about every companion.
The thing is PW states that you do not have to take him as a companion. If you feel like you do about him Fortlowe, just tell him to get lost the first time you meet him and he will oblige. To be honest that does not strike me as a character that is out to deceive you by pretending to be benevolent because such a character would not just walk away.
Retour en haut
