1323 réponses à ce sujet

[Lebanese Dude]

Romances were just starting to be added to roleplaying games in the early Bioware games. I think BG2 was the first of their games to have romances. 3 for men (3 elves, actually) and 1 obnoxious human for women. In Kotor it was 1 for each gender. And, if I remember correctly, Jade Empire had gay options. and that go the ball rolling. Come DA:I and we have an equal amount of options for everyone. Steady improvement, no?

 

It has been an improvement yes. BioWare has greatly improved in this regard.

 

I personally believe that Dragon Age Inquisition's romantic subplots will be a better version of the ME3 design, and that's fine by me, given that it's a fresh start and no potential LIs can be killed off from a previous game.

[Beerfish]

No but they can make a game for everyone. The sooner you quit thinking that people aren't allowed to express dissatisfaction in a product, the better.

Here is the great issue I have with this type of comment.  Look at the games out there, look at all the possible choices.  Now look at BioWare games, they are leaders in a number of ways concerning male or female players, romances, sexual orientation and romances.  They still get blasted for 'not going far enough, not catering to how I want things.'  to be honest I find those type of posts incredibly annoying, not so much that people express some disappointment in an aspect of a game but moreso in how they come across doing so.

 

On this particular issue BioWare is in a 100% no win situation no matter which way they go.

[Ianamus]

 

"Why can't you homos go back to being quiet and letting us ignore you?"

 

The irony is that the person who is essentially arguing against the inclusion of homosexual companions is you.

[Boisterous Bob]

It's not necessarily a valid comparison. 

 

If one Li is all you got, it's all you got. 

 

But it's different when the straight fans get two options and the gay fans get one.

Are you referring strictly to DA? Or ME as well. (Forgive me, I've never played any of the ME games, so I'm not terribly familiar with them...)

When I think of DA2 (Sebastian), it might be worth pointing out that not all straight fans were able to appreciate Sebastian's role as LI. So it's not just a straight/gay breakdown.

I don't mean to sound preachy. I'm trying to keep up with what people are saying, and it's like "11 new replies added" as I'm typing lol

[Former_Fiend]

Here is the great issue I have with this type of comment.  Look at the games out there, look at all the possible choices.  Now look at BioWare games, they are leaders in a number of ways concerning male or female players, romances, sexual orientation and romances.  They still get blasted for 'not going far enough, not catering to how I want things.'  to be honest I find those type of posts incredibly annoying, not so much that people express some disappointment in an aspect of a game but moreso in how they come across doing so.

 

On this particular issue BioWare is in a 100% no win situation no matter which way they go.

 

I agree, they are in a no-win situation. And, this is just my opinion, but I think the best thing to do in a no-win situation is to go with the option that gives everyone the most choices possible.

 

Just my opinion, though, as apparently having choices angers people, too.

[Rawgrim]

It has been an improvement yes. BioWare has greatly improved in this regard.

 

I personally believe that Dragon Age Inquisition's romantic subplots will be a better version of the ME3 design, and that's fine by me, given that it's a fresh start and no potential LIs can be killed off from a previous game.

 

It also adds to the replay vallue of the game, I think. If I want to play through the romance content of someone that is is not into my first character, I will have to play as a female next time. Or as a gay fellow, for that matter. It makes it more fun to create new characters. For me, anyway. I like to create a character to roleplay - not a pixel version of myself. I might be in the minority when it comes to doing that, though.

[Giggles_Manically]

My God...its full of angry posts.....

 

Yeah I got nothing to really add I mean I think people we should just all take a deep breath and wait for more information.

[Fredward]

On this particular issue BioWare is in a 100% no win situation no matter which way they go.

 

That's not really fair. There are oodles of people who appreciate what the devs do and try to do, you often hear the devs talking about it when they mention some of their favourite things about being game developers. It's just that these people are too well adjusted to go on vociferous rants on internet forums all that often.

[Sequin]

I'm extremely interested in seeing how the writing pans out, and remain optimistic in that respect. To me, it felt like the same sex romance option from DA2 was just "there" and during dialogues it felt a bit generic. Maybe I'm just a cynical person, but I couldn't help but wonder at times whether the majority of the dialogue was intended for opposite sex romance. I prefer quality over quantity, and am excited there will be gay/lesbian characters for more reasons than just having them as romance options. I, for one, approve the concept this direction implies... but obviously it's still too early to know how it will pan out. So I remain cautiously optimistic.

[javeart]

It also adds to the replay vallue of the game, I think. If I want to play through the romance content of someone that is is not into my first character, I will have to play as a female next time. Or as a gay fellow, for that matter. It makes it more fun to create new characters. For me, anyway. I like to create a character to roleplay - not a pixel version of myself. I might be in the minority when it comes to doing that, though.

 

This argument has been brought up before quite a few times and doesn't make sense: just beucase you're replaying the game as female or as a male everytime you're not replaying it less

[Former_Fiend]

Are you referring strictly to DA? Or ME as well. (Forgive me, I've never played any of the ME games, so I'm not terribly familiar with them...)

When I think of DA2 (Sebastian), it might be worth pointing out that not all straight fans were able to appreciate Sebastian's role as LI. So it's not just a straight/gay breakdown.

I don't mean to sound preachy. I'm trying to keep up with what people are saying, and it's like "11 new replies added" as I'm typing lol

 

I was referring to DAO as being the primary culprit there. Want your Warden to be a lesbian but don't like Leliana? Too bad. Want him to be gay but don't like Zevran? Tough luck.

 

Mass Effect, likewise, included only one S/S option for two games, both of them being for the femshep, and the second one hardly qualifying as an LI.

 

A lot of people found DA2 to be a step in the right direction as, Sebastian excluded(and I've never seen any real angst over his inclusion in this matter), everyone has an equal amount of options. 

[Mockingword]

The irony is that the person who is essentially arguing against the inclusion of homosexual companions is you.

I never said there could not/should not be homosexual companions. You have completely misread me.

 

But the LIs should be available to everyone.

 

But no, I'm not as concerned about the inclusion of homosexual characters as I am about the inclusion of homosexual players. You know, the real people?

 

And if straight players can learn to share their LIs with us (although honestly that remains to be seen), then gay players can learn to share their LIs with bisexuals and pansexuals and demisexuals and so on.

 

Especially since nothing on the surface would actually change.

[Chari]

Hetero, bi and ****** sexual romance options confirmed?

Diversity and representation confirmed?

YUSSSS

[Ianamus]

I agree, they are in a no-win situation. And, this is just my opinion, but I think the best thing to do in a no-win situation is to go with the option that gives everyone the most choices possible.

 

Just my opinion, though, as apparently having choices angers people, too.

 

I always thought that 6LI's in a 2/2/2 formation was the win/win because characters could be given a variety of sexualities while still giving everyone an equal number of options. 

 

It should be win/win, and I still don't see why it isn't. 

[Joseph Warrick]

They're distancing themselves from DA2. It's understandable.

 

In DA:O, Morrigan had a friendship path for female wardens that was an alternative to the male-exclusive romance. Maybe there will be more of that now.

[Chari]

I never said there could not/should not be homosexual companions. You have completely misread me.

 

But the LIs should be available to everyone.

 

But no, I'm not as concerned about the inclusion of homosexual characters as I am about the inclusion of homosexual players. You know, the real people?

 

And if straight players can learn to share their LIs with us (although honestly that remains to be seen), then gay players can learn to share their LIs with bisexuals and pansexuals and demisexuals and so on.

 

Especially since nothing on the surface would actually change.

That doesn't make any sense 

If a NPC likes only opposite sex - they are straight

If a NPC likes only same sex - they are gay

If a NPC likes both sexes - they are bi

Making every LI playersexual automatically either makes them bi, or strips them out of their own agency, since player's choice is way more important than character's preferences

Thus there would be no ****** or hetero sexual LIs

It's that simple

[Ianamus]

 

I never said there could not/should not be homosexual companions. You have completely misread me.

 

But the LIs should be available to everyone.

 

But no, I'm not as concerned about the inclusion of homosexual characters as I am about the inclusion of homosexual players. You know, the real people?

 

And if straight players can learn to share their LIs with us (although honestly that remains to be seen), then gay players can learn to share their LIs with bisexuals and pansexuals and demisexuals and so on.

 

Especially since nothing on the surface would actually change.

 

I have not misread you at all. Homosexual companions who are LI's are practically confirmed and you're arguing that they should be bisexual instead. 

[Lebanese Dude]

Here is the great issue I have with this type of comment.  Look at the games out there, look at all the possible choices.  Now look at BioWare games, they are leaders in a number of ways concerning male or female players, romances, sexual orientation and romances.  They still get blasted for 'not going far enough, not catering to how I want things.'  to be honest I find those type of posts incredibly annoying, not so much that people express some disappointment in an aspect of a game but moreso in how they come across doing so.

 

On this particular issue BioWare is in a 100% no win situation no matter which way they go.

Samara: If there are three humans in a room, there will be six opinions.

 

Unanimous agreement is very very rare in human social networks. The BSN is no exception

[Mockingword]

They're distancing themselves from DA2. It's understandable.

 

In DA:O, Morrigan had a friendship path for female wardens that was an alternative to the male-exclusive romance. Maybe there will be more of that now.

That's not an "alternative", the friendship path is the base content that everyone gets. The male-exclusive romance content was a special extra that Bioware added just for you. There's no equivalent for that.

[Former_Fiend]

I always thought that 6LI's in a 2/2/2 formation was the win/win because characters could be given a defined sexuality while still giving everyone an equal number of options. 

 

It should be, and I still don't see why it isn't. 

 

All the LI's being bisexual is defined sexuality.

 

I haven't been arguing simply for equal options, I've been arguing for maximum options. 

 

I think that if a lesbian player wants their character to be a lesbian and have a relationship with Cassandra, they should be allowed to do that. I don't think Cassandra being bisexual has any affect on the core of her personality; who she is, a driven, determined, no-nonsense, pragmatic woman of religious conviction who has dedicated her life to the cause of serving the chantry and protecting people, that doesn't change regardless of what set of genitals her romantic partner has.

[NUM13ER]

I think this is a good decision. Having every companion be coincidently bisexual was silly. Like Hawke was somehow a magnet for the most sexually liberated companions in all of Thedas.

Now they can focus on romances tailored to each orientation. In DAII with most characters (bar Isabella of course) you never got the impression they were really bi anyway, just "playersexual." 

[Rawgrim]

This argument has been brought up before quite a few times and doesn't make sense: just beucase you're replaying the game as female or as a male everytime you're not replaying it less

 

Maybe I wasn`t clear. It "makes" me create a character I might not normally create. In order to experience content that would otherwise be unavailable to me. So if Varric is only available to Dwarfen females, for example. I would have to play as a dwarven female to romance him. Stuff like that. More of an observation\musing than an argument, though. For me, as a player, I feel it adds t the replay vallue and the fun of creating different characters.

[Kidd]

"We want equal options" is an understandable argument, but when it becomes "Every LI must be available to me!" It crosses the line into self-entitled whinging.

I made a post here with a hypothetical warden. Do you believe DAO is a better game because this mage is barred access to content that would fit her greatly but has been put behind a gender check? I know that had that mage been my first warden, I would have been very disappointed upon learning that Morrigan was an option for male characters.

This is my biggest issue with not having playersexual LIs. Representation and inclusivity have their fair parts in there as well, however.

 

The straight males who are advocating the LI's having a set sexuality come out with less options as well if it is the case.
 
Don't be so condescending.

While I don't agree with his tone, I strongly empathise with his point. Getting rejected by Traynor as a straight player is in my opinion not at all the same thing as being barred from Alistair as a gay player. In an ideal world, they'd be the very same thing. But we're not in that perfect world. We still live in a world where many even run out to buy subpar media just because it happens to have LGBT content in it (I've bought my fair share of crap, not gonna lie), cause LGBT players are all-too used to being invisible and ignored. When Alistair is denied, this pattern is repeated. When Traynor rejects a BroShep, it's merely an individual happenstance where somebody doesn't reciprocate another's romantic intentions.
 
 

Games have a long way to go before they achieve actual equality. Give me a game like Witcher where the PC is only gay and let's sit back and see if you won't mind it as well. Yea I thought so.

Let me add to this.

Even in such a game like The Gaytcher, it's just one game out of the thousands out there. It's probably interesting for many who are not homosexual men to play such a game (and I'm happy we feel that way! don't get me wrong) cause it gives them insight into something they're not used to seeing. It's nice variety.

Thing is, not everyone have the luxury of considering non-straight romance as "nice variety."

[Lebanese Dude]

 

In DA:O, Morrigan had a friendship path for female wardens that was an alternative to the male-exclusive romance. Maybe there will be more of that now.

 

I hope so too. 

They have already stated that friendship paths won't necessarily be any less deeper than romantic involvements. I approve of this.

 

(Mostly because I want my gay male character to kii with Vivienne about DHMG while giving his BFF Cullen dating tips over beer)

[KaiserShep]

Ah yes, the "Samara wasn't a romance" argument

 

 

We've since dismissed that claim.

 

I never realized just how much the Citadel DLC really added. That's pretty awesome.