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The games are really globalized?


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#1
Zanata-Gamer

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Hello to all :)
Let me make this topic my request and suggestion to BioWare , do not know if really all that is written here really gets to BioWare , but I would like to express myself .
 
A while ago I created a similar thread in the Bethesda forum , I like video games since my childhood , I grew up watching video game companies grow large , but even after all this technological advancement I have the impression that some companies do not care really with all their fans across the planet.
 
In full in 2014 , only a few games are translated into many languages ​​, this is very bad for the fans who mostly like RPG .
A game in your language will have 100 % success , I 'm sorry to be rude but ... I am not obliged to learn English just to play a game!
It would be like reading a bestselling book in a different language and have no other means of knowledge.
 
It is very difficult for example you make a quest and do not understand the history or having to " decipher " and get lost ... this is too daunting , especially playing RPG .
 
I live in Brazil , and there are few companies that invest in the gaming market here , but anyway I am very honored to see a company dedicated to making not only the language in Portuguese , but also in other languages ​​.
 
So sorry for the huge text, but I leave my request here , even if it does not reach to the top of BioWare people, please close games to be released for this new generation , engaged translations players from different parts of the world, not only public native language to English.
 
Thank you !
 
ps: sorry for the translation, I used google translator.


#2
metatheurgist

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DAO actually supported quite a few languages. Though the translations may have been less than stellar. If there is demand for a game to be made in a given language, developers will supply it. That's economics. If no one is making Portuguese language games it's probably because they're not making enough sales in the region.



#3
Raizo

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metaheugist is right. I do sympathise with your situation Zanata-Gamer but but game localisation has improved a lot in the last few decades, at the very least it is better than the late 1980's when I first became a gamer. 



#4
mybudgee

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I miss game manuals. I was just talking to my son yesterday about the "golden age" of gaming in which games had glorious manuals, full of art and tips. An age in which games didn't require hard-drives or cloud saves. A simpler time...



#5
geth47

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Since you clearly are not proficient in English, I´ll write in both English and Portuguese.

 

Should the moderators be concerned about the content, just let me know and I´ll edit it. But don´t worry, I won´t troll this person nor say anything obscene.

 

"In full in 2014 , only a few games are translated into many languages"

 

Actually, the numbers of translations has greatly increased. Not only the official ones, but also those released by fans by means of patches, some of them tolerated and even supported by the developers. 

 

I´m more concerned however about the quality of the translations. In the old days, I was able to choose and always, always went with the original. Portuguese translations are usually done by very inept individuals. Take Batman Arkham City, for instance. In the very first scene, Catwoman has a dialogue spoken as if she was a male character. This gender problem does not happen in the English original, but thanks to a unforeseen detail about the Portuguese language, this ended up in the translation. I´m guessing the person in charge of translating the game merely had acess to text files, and not saw the game in action with the cutscene, and knowing to be an batman game, deduced it was him talking. 

 

In the old days, I could simply alter a configuration and have my steam version running the English version. But since the migration from windows live, I´m stuck with this corrupted garbage. After so many years since the debate ended between those who would haver have movies subtitled or dubbed (now we can have both with digital files) the dilemma has returned. It seems some parts are concerned about prices being unequal in different parts of the world, and only allow now certain languages in certain regions. So, a person living in North America would not be able to purchase the cheaper Brazilian version and switch it to English. 

 

For us, purists, this is an outrage. Not being able to access a product in its original, unadulterated, pure form. I would rather pay more (the prices practiced in America) to play the true game than being left with this hackney utter trash. To make matters worse, it was the loss of a right. I was used to the idea of playing bac in english, only to find out one day I was no longer able to. 

 

Of course, these problems are not related to the notion of translation in itself, but in the way it´s handled. Also, when done in idiotic ways, it can be problematic for the final user. Take Titanfall, for instance. Thanks to the translations, the game size has largely increased. It would have been much better if a person could download the english version and only then decide which translations (if any) to apply. Since all the voices were translated, the file has become huuuuuuuuuuge. 

 

So, there´s a risk. Instead of attracting new fans, translated games, if handled in improper way, can not only dissuade buyers (unwilling to have so much disk space occupied by the game) but also to irritate the hardcore audience. 

 

 "this is very bad for the fans who mostly like RPG ."

 

Actually, the vast majority, the nearly totality of thew rpg audience is proficient with English. 

"A game in your language will have 100 % success"

 

No, it won´t. Not necessarily. I can´t picture, for instance, some japanese games suddenly becoming hits only because they were translated. Also, have in mind that translating an action oriented game with few texts or spoken dialogues is way, way easier than translating titles like dragon age or mass effect. There would probably be a lot of difficulties because it would require the game to be reprogramed in order to make a lot of dialogues reflect the differences in treatment regarding females and males in situations that simply would not exist in an English-spoken world. Not only the translation would be hard and costly in itself, it would require additional work in order to fit in game. Lots of npcs would need to record their voices twice, or have two texts based on the gender of the protagonist. A translation could be more of a problem than being worth. 

 

"I 'm sorry to be rude but ... I am not obliged to learn English just to play a game!"

 

Well, you can always try to play it, but don´t be frustrated if you fail at it. It´s the company that is not obligated to translate the game in order to please a minority.

 

You should consider learning English. If not for the pleasures of gaming, for all the other benefits it will offer, culturally and socially. 

 

And trust me, reading a translation is not really reading the book, but an attempt of adapting it. Anyone who had access to an original will never return to mere translations. This is not true only to Shakespeare or Biblical texts, but any material. Do you think radio stations should only broadcast international musics that had been translated and are being sung in Portuguese? Good luck with that. :)

 

"It would be like reading a bestselling book in a different language and have no other means of knowledge."

 

There are many, many instances of books that were never translated. You can either ask someone who read it for an explanation, try to secure a translation, or learn the language. Or go read a book or play a game you can understand. Trust me, English is easy, way easier than Portuguese. The age of technology should helps us embrace and expand knowledge, and not limit ourselves in secure zones. Do not wait for the mountain to come to you. Go to the mountain. It´s terrible, having to rely on translations, mostly done by people with no familiarity with the source material. It can be even more confusing than dealing with an original you can´t understand. In the second case, you the problem is in you. In the first, it can be with the product itself.  

"It is very difficult for example you make a quest and do not understand the history or having to " decipher " and get lost"

 

Yes, it is hard. That´s why you should stick with what you can understand, or start to learn the language. So many people became motivated to learn English thanks to their fascination and enthusiasm with rpgs during my age. The vast majority of the Internet content is in English. There´s a wonderful world of possibilities out there just waiting for you to find it. And it won´t come to you otherwise. 

 

Also, even if the game is not translated, there are guides in Portuguese teaching how to beat it. And you can always ask around. There are people willing to help you. But most of all, it should be upt to you, better than anyone, to help yourself, and learning English is one of the most beneficial things you could do. It opens so many doors that in retrospect a person thinks of him or herself as someone who was blind and then became able to see. A lot of rewards for what isn´t a big effort.  

 

"I live in Brazil , and there are few companies that invest in the gaming market here"

 

I´ve been around Brazil for 33 years. Not only the market is increasing, but a lot of translations are being done. With different rates of success and failure. Much akin to what happens with movies, comic books, tv series. While some are handled properly, others are simply laughable. 

 

 "but anyway I am very honored to see a company dedicated to making not only the language in Portuguese , but also in other languages ​​."

 

 

While Brazil has a big (and expanding) economy, and is one of the biggest markets in the world, English is indeed the universal language. There are logistical and technical facts that need to be taken into account, and they should be done prior to create a game in order to better handle the situation. Spanish if far more reaching than Portuguese, and a good window for you that only speaks Portuguese. 

 

By the way, games like Baldur´s Gate Enhanced (look at the official forums) are using fan-translations supported by the creators. 



#6
geth47

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"In full in 2014 , only a few games are translated into many languages"

Em verdade, o número de traduções aumentou consideravelmente. Não apenas as oficiais, mas também as lançadas por fãs através de patches, algumas delas toleraradas e até apoiadas pelos desenvolvedores.

Estou mais preocupado, contudo, com a qualidade das traduções. Nos velhos tempos, eu era capaz de selecionar, e sempre, sempre ia pelo original. Traduções para o Português costumam serem feitas por ineptos. Veja o Batman Arkham City, por exemplo. Já na primeira cena, a Mulher-Gato tem uma fala dita como se ela fosse um homem. Este problema relacionado ao gênero não existe no original em Inglês, mas graças a um detalhe não antecipado acerca da língua portuguesa, acabou indo parar na tradução. Suponho que a pessoa encarregada da tradução apenas teve acesso a textos, sem ver a cena em ação, e julgando ser um jogo sobre o Batman, deduziu que seria ele falando.

.
Nos velhos tempos, eu podia meramente alterar a configuração and deixar minha versão steam rodando em Inglês. Mas desde a migração do Windows Live, eu fiquei restrito a este lixo corrompido. Tantos anos após o fim do debate entre os que prefeririam ter filmes legendados ou dublados (podemos ter ambos com arquivos digitais) o dilema retornou. Algumas partes parecem preocupadas com preços serem desigualmente praticados em regiões diferentes do mundo, e só permitem agora certos idiomas em certas regiõs. De modo que uma pessoa vivendo na América do Norte não seria mais capaz de comprar a mais barata versão Brasileira e alterá-la para Inglês.

Para nós, puristas, isto é um ultraje. Não ser capaz de acessar o produto em sua forma original, sem adulterações, pura. Eu preferiria pagar mais (os preços praticados nos EUA) para jogar a versão verdadeira do que ser deixado com este completo lixo ordinário. Para tornar as coisas piores, foi a perda de um direito. Eu estava habituado a jogar BAC em Inglês, apenas para descobrir um dia que eu não mais poderia fazê-lo.

É claro, tais problemas não são inerentes à noção de tradução, mas a forma como são conduzidas. E também, quando são feitas de forma idiota, podem ser problemáticas ao usuário. Veja Titanfall, por exemplo. Graças as traduções, o tamanho do jogo aumentou imensamente. Teria sido muito melhor se a pessoa pudesse baixar a versão em Inglês and só então decidir que traduções desejaria (ou não) aplicar. Já que todas as vozes foram traduzidas, o arquivo ficou imeeeeeenso.

Portanto, há um risco. Ao invés de atrair novos fãs, jogos traduzidos, se manuseados de maneira indevida, podem não só dissuadir compradores (indispostos a ceder tanto espaço em disco para o jogo) como também irritar à audiência estabelecida hardcore.

"this is very bad for the fans who mostly like RPG ."


Na verdade, a vasta maioria, quase totalidade do público de rpgs é proficiente com Inglês.


"A game in your language will have 100 % success"

Não, não terá. Não necessariamente. Eu não consigo imaginar, por exemplo, alguns jogos Japoneses subitamente virando sucessos apenas por terem sido traduzidos. Tenha em mente também que traduzir um jogo centrado em ação com poucos textos ou diálogos narrados é bem, bem mais simples que traduzir títulos como Dragon Age ou Mass Effect. Provavelmente haveria muitas dificuldades porque exigiria que o jogo fosse reprogramado de modo a comportar diálogos refletindo diferenças em tratamento com homens ou mulheres, em situações que simplesmente não existem num ambiente que fala Inglês. Não apenas a tradução seria difícil e custosa em si, como exigiria trabalho adicional de modo a ser inserida no jogo. Vários NPCs teriam que gravar suas vozes duas vezes, ou terem 2 textos baseados no gênero do protagonista. A tradução poderia representar mais problemas do que possibilidades de lucro.

"I 'm sorry to be rude but ... I am not obliged to learn English just to play a game!"

Bom, você sempre pode tentar jogar, mas não fique frustrado se acabar falhando. É a empresa que não é obrigada a traduzir o jogo de modo a agradar uma minoria.

Você devia considerar aprender Inglês. Não apenas pelos prazeres dos jogos, mas por todos os benefícios que isto renderá, cultural e socialmente.

E creia-me, ler uma tradução não é realmente ler aquele livro, mas uma tentativa de adaptá-lo. Quem quer que já tenha tido acesso a um original jamais retorna a meras traduções. Isto vale não apenas para Shakespeare or textos Bíblicos, mas para qualquer material. Você acha que estações de rádio deviam apenas tocar músicas internacionais que foram traduzidas e estão sendo cantadas em Português? Boa sorte com essa. ;)

"It would be like reading a bestselling book in a different language and have no other means of knowledge."

Há muitos, muitos casos de livros que jamais foram traduzidos. Você pode indagar a quem tenha lido, pedindo explicações, tentar providenciar uma tradução, ou aprender o idioma. Ou ir jogar algo ou ler um livro que você compreenda. Mas confie, Inglês é fácil, bem mais que o Português. A era tecnológica devia nos ajudar a abraçar e expandir conhecimentos, e não limitar-nos em zonas de segurança. Não espere a montanha vir até você. Vá até a montanha. É terrível ficar na dependência de traduções, em sua maioria feitas por pessoas sem familiaridade com o material. Pode ser mais confuso até que lidar com um original que você não entenda. No segundo caso, o problema está em você. No primeiro, pode estar no produto.

"It is very difficult for example you make a quest and do not understand the history or having to " decipher " and get lost"

Sim, é difícil. Por isso você devia ater-se ao que compreende, ou começar a aprender o idioma. Tantas pessoas tornaram-se motivadas a aprender Inglês graças à fascinação e entusiasmo que tinham com rpgs na minha época. A vasta maioria do conteúdo da Internet é em Inglês. Há um mundo maravilhoso de possibilidades lá fora esperando para ser descoberto por você, mas que não virá até você.

Também, ainda que o jogo não seja traduzido, há guias em Português ensinando a como jogar. E vocÊ sempre pode sair por aí perguntando. Há pessoas dispostas a ajudar. Mas acima de tudo, devia caber a você, mais do que a qualquer outro, ajudar a si próprio, e aprender Inglês é uma das coisas mais benéficas que você poderia fazer. Abre tantas portas que em retrospecto uma pessoa julga-se como um cego que passou a ser capaz de enxergar. Muitos benefícios para aquilo que não é um grande esforço.

"I live in Brazil , and there are few companies that invest in the gaming market here"

Eu vivo no Brasil já por 33 anos. Não apenas o mercado está aumentando como muitas traduções tem sido feitas. Com níveis diversos de sucesso e fracasso. Assim como ocorre com cinema, gibis, séries de tv. Enquanto algumas são bem realizadas, outras são simplesmente risíveis.

"but anyway I am very honored to see a company dedicated to making not only the language in Portuguese , but also in other languages ​​."

Embora o Brasil tenha uma economia grande (e em expansão), e seja um dos maiores mercados do mundo, Inglês é de fato a língua universal. Há fatos logísticos e técnicos que precisam ser levados em conta, e devem ser feitos preferencialmente antes da criação do jogo de modo a melhor comportar a situação. Espanhol é mais abrangente que Português, e uma boa ponte para você que só fala Português.

A propósito, jogos como Baldur´s Gate Enhanced (veja os fóruns oficiais) estão usando traduções de fãs apoiadas pelos criadores.



#7
Zanata-Gamer

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Since you clearly are not proficient in English, I´ll write in both English and Portuguese.

 

Should the moderators be concerned about the content, just let me know and I´ll edit it. But don´t worry, I won´t troll this person nor say anything obscene.

 

"In full in 2014 , only a few games are translated into many languages"

 

Actually, the numbers of translations has greatly increased. Not only the official ones, but also those released by fans by means of patches, some of them tolerated and even supported by the developers. 

 

I´m more concerned however about the quality of the translations. In the old days, I was able to choose and always, always went with the original. Portuguese translations are usually done by very inept individuals. Take Batman Arkham City, for instance. In the very first scene, Catwoman has a dialogue spoken as if she was a male character. This gender problem does not happen in the English original, but thanks to a unforeseen detail about the Portuguese language, this ended up in the translation. I´m guessing the person in charge of translating the game merely had acess to text files, and not saw the game in action with the cutscene, and knowing to be an batman game, deduced it was him talking. 

 

In the old days, I could simply alter a configuration and have my steam version running the English version. But since the migration from windows live, I´m stuck with this corrupted garbage. After so many years since the debate ended between those who would haver have movies subtitled or dubbed (now we can have both with digital files) the dilemma has returned. It seems some parts are concerned about prices being unequal in different parts of the world, and only allow now certain languages in certain regions. So, a person living in North America would not be able to purchase the cheaper Brazilian version and switch it to English. 

 

For us, purists, this is an outrage. Not being able to access a product in its original, unadulterated, pure form. I would rather pay more (the prices practiced in America) to play the true game than being left with this hackney utter trash. To make matters worse, it was the loss of a right. I was used to the idea of playing bac in english, only to find out one day I was no longer able to. 

 

Of course, these problems are not related to the notion of translation in itself, but in the way it´s handled. Also, when done in idiotic ways, it can be problematic for the final user. Take Titanfall, for instance. Thanks to the translations, the game size has largely increased. It would have been much better if a person could download the english version and only then decide which translations (if any) to apply. Since all the voices were translated, the file has become huuuuuuuuuuge. 

 

So, there´s a risk. Instead of attracting new fans, translated games, if handled in improper way, can not only dissuade buyers (unwilling to have so much disk space occupied by the game) but also to irritate the hardcore audience. 

 

 "this is very bad for the fans who mostly like RPG ."

 

Actually, the vast majority, the nearly totality of thew rpg audience is proficient with English. 

"A game in your language will have 100 % success"

 

No, it won´t. Not necessarily. I can´t picture, for instance, some japanese games suddenly becoming hits only because they were translated. Also, have in mind that translating an action oriented game with few texts or spoken dialogues is way, way easier than translating titles like dragon age or mass effect. There would probably be a lot of difficulties because it would require the game to be reprogramed in order to make a lot of dialogues reflect the differences in treatment regarding females and males in situations that simply would not exist in an English-spoken world. Not only the translation would be hard and costly in itself, it would require additional work in order to fit in game. Lots of npcs would need to record their voices twice, or have two texts based on the gender of the protagonist. A translation could be more of a problem than being worth. 

 

"I 'm sorry to be rude but ... I am not obliged to learn English just to play a game!"

 

Well, you can always try to play it, but don´t be frustrated if you fail at it. It´s the company that is not obligated to translate the game in order to please a minority.

 

You should consider learning English. If not for the pleasures of gaming, for all the other benefits it will offer, culturally and socially. 

 

And trust me, reading a translation is not really reading the book, but an attempt of adapting it. Anyone who had access to an original will never return to mere translations. This is not true only to Shakespeare or Biblical texts, but any material. Do you think radio stations should only broadcast international musics that had been translated and are being sung in Portuguese? Good luck with that. :)

 

"It would be like reading a bestselling book in a different language and have no other means of knowledge."

 

There are many, many instances of books that were never translated. You can either ask someone who read it for an explanation, try to secure a translation, or learn the language. Or go read a book or play a game you can understand. Trust me, English is easy, way easier than Portuguese. The age of technology should helps us embrace and expand knowledge, and not limit ourselves in secure zones. Do not wait for the mountain to come to you. Go to the mountain. It´s terrible, having to rely on translations, mostly done by people with no familiarity with the source material. It can be even more confusing than dealing with an original you can´t understand. In the second case, you the problem is in you. In the first, it can be with the product itself.  

"It is very difficult for example you make a quest and do not understand the history or having to " decipher " and get lost"

 

Yes, it is hard. That´s why you should stick with what you can understand, or start to learn the language. So many people became motivated to learn English thanks to their fascination and enthusiasm with rpgs during my age. The vast majority of the Internet content is in English. There´s a wonderful world of possibilities out there just waiting for you to find it. And it won´t come to you otherwise. 

 

Also, even if the game is not translated, there are guides in Portuguese teaching how to beat it. And you can always ask around. There are people willing to help you. But most of all, it should be upt to you, better than anyone, to help yourself, and learning English is one of the most beneficial things you could do. It opens so many doors that in retrospect a person thinks of him or herself as someone who was blind and then became able to see. A lot of rewards for what isn´t a big effort.  

 

"I live in Brazil , and there are few companies that invest in the gaming market here"

 

I´ve been around Brazil for 33 years. Not only the market is increasing, but a lot of translations are being done. With different rates of success and failure. Much akin to what happens with movies, comic books, tv series. While some are handled properly, others are simply laughable. 

 

 "but anyway I am very honored to see a company dedicated to making not only the language in Portuguese , but also in other languages ​​."

 

 

While Brazil has a big (and expanding) economy, and is one of the biggest markets in the world, English is indeed the universal language. There are logistical and technical facts that need to be taken into account, and they should be done prior to create a game in order to better handle the situation. Spanish if far more reaching than Portuguese, and a good window for you that only speaks Portuguese. 

 

By the way, games like Baldur´s Gate Enhanced (look at the official forums) are using fan-translations supported by the creators. 

 

 

I agree on many things you mentioned, but as you said there are translations made by fans, but they are only for PC, I like to play on my Playstation 3, and I'll be honest here in an official BioWare forum I could use these translations on consoles, but there could only use if a pirated or copied game, and I do not support piracy. 
I do not quite understand how it works translations into the games, but for example: The Elder Scrolls: Skyrim PC reaches 2,695 kb size. 
A translation subtitles would just say too big? BioWare could use PSN or LIVE (not sure what microsoft) to a download for downloading versions on consoles.
when you say purist I also total agree with you, BioWare called by famous actors to use their voices in saga Mass Effect Mass, Effect 2: as Martin Sheen, Yvonne Strahovski and many another great artists ...
and the voiceovers used by BioWare in their games are excellent at this point I would not want to remove original voiceovers.
I remember playing Dragon Age 2 and early on the begining of the game recognized the voice of Flemeth, that's pretty cool.
Only the translated subtitles, I trust BioWare and believe she hire a good team for translation :)
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Concordo em muitas coisas que você mencionou , mas como você disse há traduções feitas por fãs, mas eles são apenas para PC , eu gosto de jogar no meu Playstation 3, e eu vou ser honesto aqui em um fórum oficial da BioWare, eu até poderia usar essas traduções em consoles, mas só poderia usar em um jogo pirata ou copiado, e eu não apoio a pirataria.
Eu não entendo muito bem como funciona as traduções , mas por exemplo : Em The Elder Scrolls : Skyrim PC atinge 2.695 tamanho kb.
Acredito que apenas as legendas não seriam arquivos tão grandes, BioWare poderia usar a PSN ou a LIVE (não sei o que a Microsoft ) para download as versões dos consoles .
Quando você diz purista eu também concordo totalmente com você, A BioWare usou as vozes dea tores famosos na saga (Mass Effect) Em  Mass Effect 2 eu lembro de: Martin Sheen, Yvonne Strahovski e muitos outros grandes artistas ...
As dublagens utilizadas pela BioWare em seus jogos são excelentes neste eu realmente não gostaria de remover as dublagens originais.
Lembro-me de jogar Dragon Age 2 e início no começo do jogo reconhecer a voz de Flemeth , isso é muito legal.
Apenas as legendas traduzidas, eu confio como uma grande empresa que é a BioWare e acredito que ela iria contratar um time forte de tradutores :)