546 réponses à ce sujet

[Rawgrim]

XD

 

This honestly makes me want a BW game where you choose to have a spouse at the beginning or not. If you choose no that's it. You don't get another LI option. You could get one night stands sure but that's it. If you choose to have one they're involved in the plot (not as a companion mind) and certain moments in the plot shift because of it (say instead of bad guy attacking you he/she attacks the spouse). And there's only 2 spouse (male and female) you pick which one you have and that's it. There could be a lot of depth in a such a relationship since that's the only romance they'd have to worry about.

 

A 4 chapter game + an ending bit. Playing one of the spouses in each chapter. Each with their own main quest that is linked to the other persons quest. And both having their own followers. And it all comes together in the end.

[llandwynwyn]

Can you think of an example of a lesbian or gay character that was well written and well representative of that group?

 

In DA, in Bioware, game or what?

 

Steve and Samantha were a bit awkward. I'm willing to give another chance since DAI has a longer dev cycle, thus I'm expecting better writting from them. Weekes, at least, improved his skill if DAME is an indication, if he's writting another lesbian character I feel kinda safe.

 

Arcade and Veronica were well written in NV (Obsidian), sadly, not romanceable.

[Ryzaki]

A 4 chapter game + an ending bit. Playing one of the spouses in each chapter. Each with their own main quest that is linked to the other persons quest. And both having their own followers. And it all comes together in the end.

 

No no. The spouse you don't choose simply doesn't know your character and aren't in the game would be my preference (or they're just some random NPC). Maybe the spouse you pick is the leader of an intelligence agency or a random guard or something. But they're not running around the world. They have a job and they stick with it. Thus why it's so easy for the big bad to capture them or kill them (if you take too long).

[ahellbornlady]

Eh bisexuals always will get more options. That's what happens when you're not restrictive. XD

I quite enjoy being bisexual for exactly this reason.

[Mes]

In DA, in Bioware, game or what?

 

Steve and Samantha were a bit awkward. I'm willing to give another chance since DAI has a longer dev cycle, thus I'm expecting better writting from them. Weekes, at least, improved his skill if DAME is an indication, if he's writting another lesbian character I feel kinda safe.

 

 

Preferably DA, but ME works too (haven't played other Bioware games).

 

I thought you might say Steve as an example. Yes he was gay but.... was he actually written well? Or well representative of the gay community? Compared with other characters, he was an afterthought.

 

My point is that I don't think making a character gay automatically adds any kind of merit. A well written bi or playersexual character can have a lot of potential too.

[Bekkael]

I'd like to point out that all players, in this case, are getting an equal amount of "choice" taken away, assuming an equal split between straight, gay, and bi.

 

Those in favor of this change probably feel that a character's sexuality should be independent of the player's desires, which isn't really an argument in favor or against any particular sexual orientation. It's simply a statement about to what degree the PC should dictate facts about a character, which most likely extend beyond sexual orientation into other aspects of the character.

 

You don't know that it's equal. Cullen is almost certainly a non-companion romance, and unless there are 2 additional male companion LIs for my female Inquisitor to romance, I may have less choice and less content compared to a player who gets to romance 2 female companions with their male Inquisitor.

 

Color me cynical, but as a female gamer who often has NO choice as to my playable character, and who has gotten totally shafted as my FemShep did in ME3 with regard to romance, I think I am justified in being worried. So are all the other players who enjoy same sex romances, and now don't know if their preferred romance will be an option.

 

I just can't see how taking choice away, or severely limiting it can be a positive experience for the majority of DA players, whether it's "equal"or not.

[Mihura]

In DA, in Bioware, game or what?

 

Steve and Samantha were a bit awkward. I'm willing to give another chance since DAI has a longer dev cycle, thus I'm expecting better writting from them. Weekes, at least, improved his skill if DAME is an indication, if he's writting another lesbian character I feel kinda safe.

 

Arcade and Veronica were well written in NV (Obsidian), sadly, not romanceable.

 

Arcade is kinda I think, not sure now, Veronica nop but than again we explore her past with DLC and she is one of the center character in a way. 

But I am expecting a lot more dept in DA:I, New Vegas is an open world with more dept on other things. Nor really the ideal thing for a more linear story and contain story line. 

[jellobell]

They did say the romances would be more complex. So maybe it would be harder to romance a templar as a mage, and easier as another class? Just a thought.

 

I'd be totally okay with that. I don't want a character's opinions on mages/templars/whatever completely overlooked. It should be there and dealt with. In fact, dealing with differences in background or character or temperament is one of the things that appeals to me in a romance. A romance between two people who are too similar is boring (that's why I went out of my way to romance Fenris as a mage). For example, I really liked how Garrus's romance addressed the whole "interspecies awkwardness thing". It was a nice acknowledgement of how a relationship between two people of different species could be tricky to navigate, but that they wanted to make it work despite that because they really cared for each other. 

[CronoDragoon]

You don't know that it's equal. Cullen is almost certainly a non-companion romance, and unless there are 2 additional male companion LIs for my female Inquisitor to romance, I may have less choice and less content compared to a player who gets to romance 2 female companions with their male Inquisitor.

 

Gaider has said they would only abandon the DA2 style of they could make it fair for everyone. No, I don't know it's equal. But I would be shocked if it wasn't.

 

As for the possibility that non-companion romances have less content, I suppose that's possible. However, that seems like an issue that's separate from sexual orientation, and more concerned with the quality of non-companion romances in general.

 

I just can't see how taking choice away, or severely limiting it can be a positive experience for the majority of DA players, whether it's "equal"or not.

 

The majority of DA players probably don't care one way or another, if they even care about romances at all.

[AddieTheElf]

While I am a bit bummed about the whole LI not all being bi thing, I'll deal with it and get over it. Though, my girlfriend and I are hoping for Sera to be a lady's love interest as either bi or completely gay - I'm more interested in her than Cassandra (sorry Cass fans, I'm not that into the "serious" type of person) - I wanted Sera to be my main playthrough's love interest for my lady elf..... my girlfriend also has her heart on romancing DramaticHands man after seeing him in the trailer and is hoping he's not the male only love interest as she doesn't like playing as a man (I don't have this problem but never completed a straight romance as a male character, tried with Morrigan and ended up with Zevran)

[Zu Long]

@Rawgrim: Here's a link to the the post I was talking about.

 

I'll quote it as well.

 

To me, it’s never been about letting players romance “whoever they want to”. I do not believe any player has a right to romance whoever they like with whatever character they happen to be playing.

 

The point of the bisexual (or “playsexual’, whatever you want to call them) romances in DA2 was to ensure that anyone playing a character of a certain gender or sexuality had options. That’s it. Were there more characters with romance arcs, I’d have been just as happy making some specific to particular genders. Seeing as that wasn’t the case, I was okay with sacrificing what some saw as “realism” (I think what they really mean is “verisimilitude”, though I disagree even so) to allow more options for everyone. The writers wrote each character with a specific idea in mind for how they worked, and the only thing that changed from one PC to the next was the player’s perception of them— which is interesting to note, and doesn’t disqualify it in any manner from being real as they see it, even if I wouldn’t prioritize that over basic fairness.

 

What will be perhaps frustrating (and no doubt inevitable) if we ever do provide a larger number of romances and thus have no need to make them all bisexual/playersexual, is that the complainers will undoubtedly cry victory (“we made them change it!”) and at least some of those who liked how it worked will then complain that we either caved or that they have had their right to romance anyone they wish removed. Or both, I suppose.

 

But such is life.

[TKavatar]

In DA, in Bioware, game or what?
 
Steve and Samantha were a bit awkward. I'm willing to give another chance since DAI has a longer dev cycle, thus I'm expecting better writting from them. Weekes, at least, improved his skill if DAME is an indication, if he's writting another lesbian character I feel kinda safe.
 
Arcade and Veronica were well written in NV (Obsidian), sadly, not romanceable.

I always liked how Arcade and Veronica were portrayed in FNV. They were awesome people who just happened to be gay.

[Grieving Natashina]

@Rawgrim: Here's a link to the the post I was talking about.

 

I'll quote it as well.

I think he knows the posters a little too well after years of interacting with us.  

[Maria Caliban]

I find not knowing Cassandra's sexuality perversely incentivizes my hanging around the forums in the hopes that information will be revealed at some time in some place. This means I end up soaking up other spoilers that I otherwise wouldn't get.

 

Gaider has said they would only abandon the DA2 style of they could make it fair for everyone. No, I don't know it's equal. But I would be shocked if it wasn't.

 

Having read the quote provided, I am not sure that 'fair for everyone' means equal representation of each sexual orientation for each gender.

[Zu Long]

Another one from Gaider on romances and fairness: (bolding mine)

 

So, no, I’m quite fine with selecting a few characters and having them be romantic options and letting the rest be simply what they are. My preference is that the romances cover a range of styles and sexualities as evenly as we can, and that they have comparable levels of content, and leave it at that. If someone doesn’t find something to their liking in that particular game, chances are we’ll have a whole different batch in the next game (I do find it rather amusing how people always assume we’ll write exactly the same characters in the next game as the current one— even though we never have, the assumption is the same after every game). In the meantime, there are hopefully friendships and rivalries among the followers that you can develop, and reasons to appreciate each of them beyond whether they can be sexed to your liking, as well as that whole other thing we wrote.

[Zu Long]

I think he knows the posters a little too well after years of interacting with us.  

 

Yeah, it's terrifying how accurate he got it, isn't it?

[The Hierophant]

I find not knowing Cassandra's sexuality perversely incentivizes my hanging around the forums in the hopes that information will be revealed at some time in some place. This means I end up soaking up other spoilers that I otherwise wouldn't get.

Admit it, you enjoy this?

[Grieving Natashina]

I would figure that, closer to release time, they would do a couple of subforums, one for spoilers and one without.  Pretty much like they did on the old BSN.  It might not be as feasible with the new set up though.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

I'm just gonna post my opinion from the other thread..

 

I just want a good story behind each romance.

 

I played Amalur recently, as a female toon. The DLC had me join a female ships captain to a pirate island.  Most of the interaction I had with her was quest related, no chatting, certainly no romance. Imagine my surprise when, at the end of the quest line, she announces we are now dating. Huh? When? How.. Huh?

 

Back to the DA world, each companion, while romancable, in DA2, was a cardboard cutout to me. very shallow storyline. Compare to DAO where we learn each LI's past history and love life, to some extent at least. (the obvious counterpoint being Isabela. We heard all about her past, it was all she would talk about, nothing else)

 

So yeah, realistic choices or not, gimme a good story for each one. Give me a REASON to want to romance them.

[Maria Caliban]

Admit it, you enjoy this?

 

Enjoy what?

[The Hierophant]

Enjoy what?

Hanging around waiting for the info you're interested in?

[Bekkael]

Gaider has said they would only abandon the DA2 style of they could make it fair for everyone. No, I don't know it's equal. But I would be shocked if it wasn't.

 

As for the possibility that non-companion romances have less content, I suppose that's possible. However, that seems like an issue that's separate from sexual orientation, and more concerned with the quality of non-companion romances in general.

 

 

 

The majority of DA players probably don't care one way or another, if they even care about romances at all.

 

 

I think you may underestimate just how popular BioWare's romances are. That said, this is all just speculation and I might even be worrying for nothing. DAI could have the best romances of any BioWare game to date, and manage to satisfy the majority of us. Hope springs eternal!

[Giantdeathrobot]

Lets say Cassandra's straight, Sera's bi, Scribbles is lesbian(not sure how it'll break down, but for the sake of argument).

 

I'm a straight male, I'm going to play a male character and romance a female character, and my preference is Cassandra; she's the only one of the female LI's I'm remotely interested in. Well, I'm in luck. Now let's say there's a lesbian player who wants to play a female inquisitor, and, like me, Cassandra's the only one of the LI's that appeals to her. She is plum out of luck.

 

Cassandra being exclusive to me doesn't benefit me at all. I wouldn't lose anything from a lesbian player being able to romance Cassandra with her preferred inquisitor. Cassandra's character would in no way change or be harmed by being attracted to both men and women. 

 

So ultimately the decision to make Cassandra straight is completely arbitrary.

 

That that she's a warrior is also arbitrary. Everything about her character is arbitrary. She's an amalgam of pixels and voice files.

 

I dunno, but forcing you to choose and imposing consequences on choices (in that case, your gender) is a staple of RPGs for me, and I like that Bioware is moving towards that. I don't want to start the ''what is a RPG', circlejerk, but being able to romance anyone who's potentially available no matter your gender just seems overly convenient to me.

 

I do think it's a shame that, on the other hand, it limits options for the people who want stuff like that. But ultimately, I also think it makes for better gameplay, and that's what matters most.

 

I'm also not certain at all that sexuality has no bearing whatsoever on your character and your interactions wih others. Sure, that doesn't mean we should use stereotypes like butch lesbians and wimpy gay people all the time, but you are going to treat a person differently if you're attracted to them.

[Mes]

That that she's a warrior is also arbitrary. Everything about her character is arbitrary. She's an amalgam of pixels and voice files.

 

I dunno, but forcing you to choose and imposing consequences on choices (in that case, your gender) is a staple of RPGs for me, and I like that Bioware is moving towards that.

 

Regarding your first sentence, what is your point? The entire game is an amalgam of pixels and soundbites. So should we stop discussing Dragon Age entirely?

 

Regarding your second sentence, I think choice and consequence in terms of points distributions, skills selections, and weapon equipment is the staple of RPGs. Restricting romances based on gender isn't, in my opinion.

 

But restricting romances based on the actions you take throughout the game and the dialogue choices you make is perfectly fine and in line with what it means to play an RPG.

[CronoDragoon]

I think you may underestimate just how popular BioWare's romances are. That said, this is all just speculation and I might even be worrying for nothing. DAI could have the best romances of any BioWare game to date, and manage to satisfy the majority of us. Hope springs eternal!

 

I agree that it's important the genders and orientations are evenly represented, at least. I suppose I just took it as a given having read what Gaider's said in the past.