129 réponses à ce sujet

[n7stormrunner]

I actually like the idea of having someone gender neutral as a companion. I just would want them to be treated as such. Or at least have them specify what pronouns to use. (And here's the obligatory reference to Mass Effect)... Legion was what you could consider gender neutral. A geth. Yet, Shepard frequently refers to Legion as 'he', presumably because the voice Legion used to speak with sounded masculine. So, I'd appreciate avoiding that by having the companion either state a preference or something to that effect.

 

Still, I'm always interested in the atypical when it comes to companions. I loved HK-47 so much. So very much. And spent a lot of time calling people meatbags for years after playing that game.

 

 

english really does need a proper gender neutral pronoun besides it or singular they.

 

on legion: it could also be he can, though I understand why people dislike using it, be used as gender neutral.

[Allan Schumacher]

Yet, Shepard frequently refers to Legion as 'he', presumably because the voice Legion used to speak with sounded masculine. So, I'd appreciate avoiding that by having the companion either state a preference or something to that effect.

 

I wonder if this was a symptom of how some of us were taught to write.  I know I was taught to use "he" as gender neutral (I've since started to use "them" more, despite my teachers insistence on docking my marks for doing so), and I think David also echoed something similar in a thread where the discussion came up.

 

In this sense it also complicates gender neutrality, since for some people the gender neutral term is the same word as the male gender term.

 

 

'd by Stormrunner

[Cainhurst Crow]

A fair point. Dare to go beyond the known threshold ey?

[Darth Krytie]

I wonder if this was a symptom of how some of us were taught to write.  I know I was taught to use "he" as gender neutral (I've since started to use "them" more, despite my teachers insistence on docking my marks for doing so), and I think David also echoed something similar in a thread where the discussion came up.

 

In this sense it also complicates gender neutrality, since for some people the gender neutral term is the same word as the male gender term.

 

 

'd by Stormrunner

 

Since language is a beautiful organic thing that grows and changes, I use "they" because I think it's better than defaulting to "he". Although, when asked, I'll use whatever new pronouns someone prefers. However, there are many different ones and nothing close to standard.

[oceanicsurvivor]

english really does need a proper gender neutral pronoun besides it or singular they.

 

http://askanonbinary...ist-of-pronouns

 

'It' is on the list but I've (personally) only ever heard this used in a derogatory fashion. Most of the trans* individuals I know who don't wish to use he/she pronouns use they/them/their.

[Killdren88]

Would it be considered rude to refer to such a companion as "It"?

[Darth Krytie]

Would it be considered rude to refer to such a companion as "It"?

 

Depends on the companion. I would think someone like Legion or HK-47 or Shale wouldn't mind.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Shale didn't have much problem using it for everyone elss, so my guess is no.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

Thanks for scaring me about this being some tumblr spillover about non binary genders and then alleviating it.

[n7stormrunner]

http://askanonbinary...ist-of-pronouns

 

'It' is on the list but I've (personally) only ever heard this used in a derogatory fashion. Most of the trans* individuals I know who don't wish to use he/she pronouns use they/them/their.

 

 

wow thats a lot... and most of them look like they'd be a pain to pronounce. I think I'll stick with they/them/their but good to know people are trying

 

it is generally uses to refer to object, it is more then a little rude to refer to someone as a object.  though it is technically gender neutral, I personally would avoid it.

[PinkDiamondstl]

It was only a matter of time before the forums are once again infested with topics like these.

Gender neutral? Meaning bi?

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

He, they and it have always been considered acceptable gender neutral pronouns.

 

But I don't think that's why Legion is a he, Bioware just seems insistent on forcing gender onto robots, EDI, for example.

[Darth Krytie]

The discussion of 'he' being considered gender neutral reminds me of this comic. (Yes, I'm aware of the way it's been taught in school.)

 

[Killdren88]

It was only a matter of time before the forums are once again infested with topics like these.

Gender neutral? Meaning bi?

 

Nope. It was more referring to a spirit inhabiting a suit of armor as a companion thus making it genderless. Someone just jumped the gun and went straight to Transgender topics.

[JoltDealer]

Technically Justice was gender neutral.  It was Kristoff's body and his voice actor that caused us to perceive him as "male."  Other than that, Justice was only the spiritual embodiment of...well...justice.

[Killdren88]

Technically Justice was gender neutral.  It was Kristoff's body and his voice actor that caused us to perceive him as "male."  Other than that, Justice was only the spiritual embodiment of...well...justice.

 

Just as a suit of armor the way to get around it in my mind would be to use a Male, and female voice actors and have them speak the lines at the same time and mesh them together.

[JoltDealer]

Just as a suit of armor the way to get around it in my mind would be to use a Male, and female voice actors and have them speak the lines at the same time and mesh them together.

 

Although I admire your creative idea, it's an impractical one that wouldn't likely happen.  Take into account the number of lines and the amount of dialogue a voice actor has to record for a companion character.  Now take into account that the average hourly wage is $120-$200 per hour and then double the overall amount.  It would get very expensive.  This would mean we would be paying the price of two companions for just one.  From an acting perspective, both actors would be limited in terms of the performance they could give due to them having to match any inflections or intonations with one another.  I just don't see it working in a cost effective manner.

[n7stormrunner]

Just as a suit of armor the way to get around it in my mind would be to use a Male, and female voice actors and have them speak the lines at the same time and mesh them together.

 

 

I don't see them doing that as they would have to pay two people for one character,

 

 

I'ld prefer people cut it out with the preconceived notions about what gender neutral would sound like.. which would probably sound ether male or female to most people.

 

or heavily distort the voice actors voice.

 

another would be use a male voice with a female body or vise versa.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

Cant see how you could invent a new gender withe anyone going "thats just an analogue of this gender", unlike invented races, religions, or cultures which have more ambiguity and room to debate. Because, as the others posted brought up, it'd be better to have evil characters only be capable of antagonizing a made up gender in their full evil play through then allow them to target actual irl genders.

I dont think anyone would be unable to understand someone without a gender we get. But at the same time, there are so many gender identities irl and gender identity is such a specific trait, that I'd be hard to make an analogue that doesn't fit any of them.

 

I especially don't see bioware doing it of all people. Look what a great job they did with the Asari. In fact every single Alien, (and robots) in Mass Effect panders to the characteristics of human genders

[Kidd]

2. Why not allow the player to be mean to this trans-character? We can be mean to everyone else, regardless of what they are. We can mock leiliana's religious faith, sten's qun, fenris's slavery, anders mage struggle, morrigans upbringing, merrils elvishness and life choices, zevrens attitude, isabela's life style, pretty much everything has been on the table for the player character to do when it comes to companions, even telling them to get lost.

Because we don't get to mock Isabela's skin colour, nor Wynne's gender. It's simple tact to not let the PC be mean to underprivileged groups the player is likely to identify with or have friends who identify with.

 

Just as a suit of armor the way to get around it in my mind would be to use a Male, and female voice actors and have them speak the lines at the same time and mesh them together.

That's overdoing it, I think. There are actors who can put on a voice that is very difficult to gender according to our traditional cultural bias, after all. First person that comes to mind for me is Kujira, the Japanese voice actress who lends her voice to Orochimaru in Naruto (who was cast partially because of how much the studio could use her voice to screw with gender conventions according to how the character himself does).


Narration mostly by Kujira, so I figured it would work as an example =) Skip to 16 seconds.

[Solas]

It was only a matter of time before the forums are once again infested with topics like these.

Gender neutral? Meaning bi?

its hardly infested, there is like one. people are just discussing gender, binary trans* stuff and the idea of a character outside the binarry. in da and games in general. if it bothers you so much that you see it as an infestation you are free to go elsewhere.

[Solas]

btw re the "by spirit of honor you mean valor" discussion spirits of honor are a thing now in thedas too

 

[Kidd]

btw re the "by spirit of honor you mean valor" discussion spirits of honor are a thing now in thedas too

Really? Where did you hear that? =)