46 réponses à ce sujet

[themikefest]

If Tali, Garrus, and Ashley/Kaidan are dead, Liara will be the one to show up.

[CrutchCricket]

Haven't you heard? ME2 squadmates are the devil.

 

How much must we throw Liara at you before you get the point?

[SwobyJ]

Bioware needs to realize, if they haven't more recently already, that so many people play their games almost solely for the characters. Sidelining ones that seem set up for greatness, for example, just seems silly.

 

They make a LI for the protagonist - that should matter.

 

Citadel DLC slightly helped. At the very least, I went from disliking Miranda (oh yes, I did since ME2) into really liking her (watching my bf's character romance her) and wishing that there's another game with her (I know, I know) that continues her story, whatever that would be.

 

It's not all about the romance itself, but about interaction with characters in dynamic ways. Characters, setting, plot. All with priority, not just plot.

 

 

I like Liara, but she's like, only in the middle of the list if I were to rank either characters or specifically LIs. No matter how much they focus on her. She's cool, I'll engage with her and invest my emotions into her story, but there's so much more out there.

[Iakus]

Haven't you heard? ME2 squadmates are the devil.

 

How much must we throw Liara at you before you get the point?

 

I'm having ME2 flashbacks now...

 

Mainly because I wondered about the ME1 cast in much the same way back then

[SwobyJ]

ME2 treated Liara fine imo. Yes, even before LOTSB. I know many complained though.

 

VS? Lol..yeah. Would have wanted at least 1 more significant event involving them. I don't mind character friction, but the way it was presented wasn't appealing.

[Ryriena]

ME2 treated Liara fine imo. Yes, even before LOTSB. I know many complained though.
 
VS? Lol..yeah. Would have wanted at least 1 more significant event involving them. I don't mind character friction, but the way it was presented wasn't appealing.

I don't mind character friction either, as long, as they do the friction well. In this story, they did not do the rift well. They merged two characters and so all they did was making me think it was a clone and we find them on the ship or something.

[Farangbaa]

When they say "party members" they don't mean guests to the party, they mean literally Squadmembers.

Miranda is not a ME3 squadmate outside of Armax Arsenal Arena. hence she can't show up.

 

This made me laugh so hard

[NoMoreCalibrations]

"Oh yeah, you know how in ME2 your love interests from ME1 never show up and leave you alone?? Maybe you wanna drown your sorrows in somebody new in ME2?

 

WELL HAVE FUN BEING ROMANCED IN ME3 LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL."

[Darkstar Aurora]

I still think it should have been the case that your non-squad member romance would come to rescue you, i.e. making them a temporarily selectable squad member for the mission. I do not think it could have been THAT hard to pull off.

However, after the rescue your love interest interacts with Brooks back at your apartment. Since Miranda has worked with Brooks before, and she clearly looks the same as she did then, Miranda would have been able to recognize her--thus shutting down the conspiracy. Given that Brooks & co were hacking into your comm channels its possibly she would have taken steps to ensure Miranda (and other Cerberus operatives, past and present) is not on the Citadel or unable to reach you when the plan is set into motion.

[Nightwriter]

Well she was sidelined. This is kinda what sidelining means. No story participation, no being there for those kinds of moments, no experiencing your journey with you.

 

Fans don't oppose character sidelining just because they want their favorites to be leads, but because historically sidelining is a death sentence. It's a death sentence to romance, and in worst cases can even be a death sentence to the love interest him/herself. In either case the LI is removed from your PC's "life", and you're basically left with two choices: hold a candle for them and settle for meager content, or move on to one of the love interests who are actually still a part of your experiences.

 

It's a bummer that this extended even into the Citadel DLC where I was really hoping they could include ME2 characters in the story, same as they include any non-squadmate characters who play roles in their DLC's. But I guess it just wasn't in the cards. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt there -- it just may not have been possible or practical. The fact that they did include content for the ME2 characters, much of it of good quality and attentive craftsmanship, tells me that they did care about addressing the issue of ME2 LI treatment, and this wasn't all just a matter of malice/indifference on their part.

[Bob from Accounting]

I really hope BioWare ignores most fan feedback on this issue and stays away from romance interests having more of a role in the story. Particularly story choices.

[Steelcan]

I really hope BioWare ignores most fan feedback on this issue and stays away from romance interests having more of a role in the story. Particularly story choices.

Considering most fans are asking for Liara to take a back seat instead o0f being thrown at us at every opportunity....

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Considering most fans are asking for Liara to take a back seat instead o0f being thrown at us at every opportunity....

Maybe on the BSN. Outside, though? She's the most popular character. 

[Zazzerka]

Oh for fuck's sake.

[KaiserShep]

Considering most fans are asking for Liara to take a back seat instead o0f being thrown at us at every opportunity....

 

In fairness, what Bobvid is saying doesn't necessarily relate to Liara. But anyway, if most fans were really pushing to have her relegated to a lesser role, she probably would have been, despite her favor from the writers.

 

But anyway, to the topic at hand, this is, yet again, part of the problem of having so many characters to choose from, especially if they're no longer an official group member. The level of fan-service-y asspulling kind of reached its limit when Wrex came out of nowhere to take down the shuttle. If Jack, for instance, showed up to save Shepard, I mean...how did she know where to go in the first place?

[wolfhowwl]

I really hope BioWare ignores most fan feedback on this issue and stays away from romance interests having more of a role in the story. Particularly story choices.

 

Why?

[Bob from Accounting]

Because content tailored for a half dozen characters instead of just one is far less likely to be great content. The best character moments are specifically built for that character and that character alone. 

 

And because while 'morals' in a story are good and desirable things, which character is 'right' to romance should not be one of them. Romance affecting the story will pretty much inevitably mean a 'best' romance which gives the optimal story outcome. Which not only sends a message of which character is the 'right' romance, but compels players to romance characters they don't actually like to get the story they want. On top of the fact that the player is unlikely to have any clue how romance will affect the story in the first place, and it thus isn't a meaningful choice.

[von uber]

Maybe on the BSN. Outside, though? She's the most popular character.

I wouldn't even say on bsn, judging by some of the old polls that were done.
With garrus right up there too.

[Steelcan]

In fairness, what Bobvid is saying doesn't necessarily relate to Liara. But anyway, if most fans were really pushing to have her relegated to a lesser role, she probably would have been, despite her favor from the writers.

 

But anyway, to the topic at hand, this is, yet again, part of the problem of having so many characters to choose from, especially if they're no longer an official group member. The level of fan-service-y asspulling kind of reached its limit when Wrex came out of nowhere to take down the shuttle. If Jack, for instance, showed up to save Shepard, I mean...how did she know where to go in the first place?

Wrex is more likely to be dead than Miranda is

 

 

just saying

[Steelcan]

Because content tailored for a half dozen characters instead of just one is far less likely to be great content. The best character moments are specifically built for that character and that character alone. 

 

And because while 'morals' in a story are good and desirable things, which character is 'right' to romance should not be one of them. Romance affecting the story will pretty much inevitably mean a 'best' romance which gives the optimal story outcome. Which not only sends a message of which character is the 'right' romance, but compels players to romance characters they don't actually like to get the story they want. On top of the fact that the player is unlikely to have any clue how romance will affect the story in the first place, and it thus isn't a meaningful choice.

We

 

already

 

have

 

that

 

with

 

Liara

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Because content tailored for a half dozen characters instead of just one is far less likely to be great content. The best character moments are specifically built for that character and that character alone. 

 

And because while 'morals' in a story are good and desirable things, which character is 'right' to romance should not be one of them. Romance affecting the story will pretty much inevitably mean a 'best' romance which gives the optimal story outcome. Which not only sends a message of which character is the 'right' romance, but compels players to romance characters they don't actually like to get the story they want. On top of the fact that the player is unlikely to have any clue how romance will affect the story in the first place, and it thus isn't a meaningful choice.

 

The first paragraph: You're making the issue mutually exclusive. Great characters and character moments are not precluded by giving every character great content. The quality is no less, and as many more games than any BW has made has proved, neither is the content.

 

The second paragraph: The morals work best when they aren't presented in a manner where one ideology is clearly more desirable than another. Practical details and reality are all that you get. You can work with what you believe is the better solution there. You can have a practical solution vs. an idealistic solution. Like the choice in ME2 for the missile base side mission: You can take the practical solution and let the missiles destroy the residential colony, leaving the industrial and corporate area intact and viable for recolonization, or you can do the inverse and sacrifice a colony's future for the sake of the innocent people. Romance in the story does not mean what you think it will. That's your strawman against it, and it isn't consistent or true. Go play TOR. Go play Dragon Age. Go play KotOR. There is no compulsion whatsoever to make a 'canon' LI, or to be obligated to romance them. That's just you getting upset at the possibility that you'd have to romance Miranda if the romance had a positive effect on the story. The last point is just plain ridiculous and wrong.

[themikefest]

Wrex is more likely to be dead than Miranda is

 

 

just saying

You can also add that he doesn't have to be recruited in ME1