As did her corpse lying next to an old hut.
True, but I think the idea is that she did this using Mythal's Power. Which I'm pretty sure we're supposed to understand she lost in that scene. If so, then Solas probably also took Urthemiel's power. (Unless Solas didn't know she had that power for him to take, and that was enough to stop him taking it. In which case I could believe that she survived that way...)
Yes...but I wish they could do it the sperm bank way. I don't want to do it the traditional way.... 
Yes...but I wish they could do it the sperm bank way. I don't want to do it the traditional way....
I don't know if that's wise. Loghain and Alistair wear gauntlets. That might pinch.
I chose to not do the Dark Ritual for a simple reason - I did not receive enough information about it.
You cannot seriously expect someone reasonable to take part in a ritual to preserve the soul of a very powerful being and then transferring it into the body of a innocent child without explaining to to them why the soul is worth preserving and what plans does Morrigan have for it.
Indeed, we learn in Inquisition that Morrigan doesn't really know what the Old God soul is. Furthermore, Old God soul Kieran is still viewed by Morrigan as a tool. After the confrontation with Flemeth in the Fade, she mentions that Kieran had a "destiny" and now its gone. Talk about being a high expectation parent. In fact, Old God Kieran reminds me of the Kryptonians from Man of Steel where they would be bred for this singular purpose instead of having the free will to choose their own destiny.
There is also the fact that Morrigan says to the Inquisitor that human Kieran's remarkable nature is due to his father and if she does well by him, it will be to inflict as little damage as possible.
Lastly, if you look at the Keep, the human Kieran is the only choice that has a bright shining light around the baby whereas a dark gloom surround the baby if conceived via the Dark Ritual.
Personally if my character romances Morrigan, I don't bring her to Redcliffe & the Denerim Alienage, I refuse to perform the Dark Ritual, get Loghain to make the killing blow on the Archdemon and then enter the Eluvian with her at Witch Hunt.
Furthermore, Old God soul Kieran is still viewed by Morrigan as a tool.
Not at all.
Morrigan: I can't let you use him!
Flemeth: Did you not use him? Wasn't that your purpose, the reason why you agreed to his creation?
Morrigan: That was then. But now, he... he is my son!
No . i m not gonna be that selfish toward my own son . not gonna make a unborn child do the job for me .
if i was the kid of HOF i would like to be a normal baby and not have to carry an old god soul with me .
You can't say "she cared for Kieran as her son but she still viewed him as a tool ".
Dumbledore?
No . i m not gonna be that selfish toward my own son . not gonna make a unborn child do the job for me .
if i was the kid of HOF i would like to be a normal baby and not have to carry an old god soul with me .
Precisely. Making Kieran shoulder the burden of housing the Old God soul without him having any say on it is no different from Dorian's parents wanting to force him to be someone he is not and his father was willing to use blood magic to make that happen. In many ways, it is no different from parents who treat their children as merely a tool to carry out their dashed hopes and wishes instead of a sentient being that should choose their own path someday.
That is probably the biggest reason of me being against the Dark Ritual. I was the firstborn of an Asian family, the son who was shouldered with all the wishes and hopes of his parents and as such, was never really allowed to choose a life path he wanted until I rebelled and we had massive arguments where I won. I do not want an innocent child to be shouldered with the burden of carrying the soul of a powerful ancient being without him having any choice in it, much in the same way I do not want anyone to be raised and driven to study solely to be a medical doctor that gets married, gets a big house and pops out the typical 2.5 kids and have hobbies that his parents had to approve and control, has to eat food that his parents had to approve and control, etc.
More importantly, I also do not see how one can choose to remain in love in Morrigan and not do the Dark Ritual. She effectively betrays you by leaving her love at the eve of his most important battle (not supporting him or aiding him) because the man she claims to love, the very same man that she could not manipulate, has some shred of ethics. It did not matter if you helped her by killing Flemeth and retrieving the real Grimoire for her. It did not matter if you were able to see past her acerbic nature and her other flaws and loved her. What mattered to her was the Urthemiel's Soul and when she is denied access to it, she throws up a tantrum and leaves.
Precisely. Making Kieran shoulder the burden of housing the Old God soul without him having any say on it is no different from Dorian's parents wanting to force him to be someone he is not and his father was willing to use blood magic to make that happen. In many ways, it is no different from parents who treat their children as merely a tool to carry out their dashed hopes and wishes instead of a sentient being that should choose their own path someday.
That is probably the biggest reason of me being against the Dark Ritual. I was the firstborn of an Asian family, the son who was shouldered with all the wishes and hopes of his parents and as such, was never really allowed to choose a life path he wanted until I rebelled and we had massive arguments where I won. I do not want an innocent child to be shouldered with the burden of carrying the soul of a powerful ancient being without him having any choice in it, much in the same way I do not want anyone to be raised and driven to study solely to be a medical doctor that gets married, gets a big house and pops out the typical 2.5 kids and have hobbies that his parents had to approve and control, has to eat food that his parents had to approve and control, etc.
More importantly, I also do not see how one can choose to remain in love in Morrigan and not do the Dark Ritual. She effectively betrays you by leaving her love at the eve of his most important battle (not supporting him or aiding him) because the man she claims to love, the very same man that she could not manipulate, has some shred of ethics. It did not matter if you helped her by killing Flemeth and retrieving the real Grimoire for her. It did not matter if you were able to see past her acerbic nature and her other flaws and loved her. What mattered to her was the Urthemiel's Soul and when she is denied access to it, she throws up a tantrum and leaves.
yeah . everyone have the right to choose his own life . not what his parents want him to be . thanks for the reply .
i m also the firstborn child i know that felling
It's simple. Morrigan either loves her son or she doesn't. You can't say "she cared for Kieran as her son but she still viewed him as a tool ".
Those don't go together.
No way, you literally have no reason to trust Morrigan for most of the game, in fact, I've wondered if you shouldn't just send her on her way.
Kind of a weird trend in Dragon Age: Origins, Sten? Very possibly might rage and kill everyone at any possible moment. Leliana? So dependent, might rage and quit the moment you do something she doesn't like. Morrigan? So shifty it's entirely possible she is simply trying to get everyone killed.
Part of why the Dog is literally like they key character for me lol, I think that was kind of joke but it's actually sort of true.
Precisely. Making Kieran shoulder the burden of housing the Old God soul without him having any say on it is no different from Dorian's parents wanting to force him to be someone he is not
I still remember my first playthrough of Origins and how shocked I was when it was revealed a Grey Wardens life must be sacrificed to kill the Archdemon... I chose every dialogue option to say "I'm not going to die for this BS" and then when I retired to my chambers, almost having accepted my fate... there she was. My canon Warden gladly accepted Morrigan's ritual. He never liked the Grey Wardens and cheating death was a very appealing idea to him. Also, raising an Old God as your own son? Who could refuse such an opportunity...
One thing is certain: If the grey wardens ever found out that the HoF did this ritual, he would be at least demoted from Warden Commander. And Kieran would be hunted down.
I didn't want my Warden or Loghain (and honestly even the Old God) to die at the end and I romanced Morrigan so there was only one choice I could make. Witch Hunt and Inquisition made things better and more interesting for me (wonder if the Old God soul is with Solas or what Flemeth sent through the Eluivan before Solas absorbed Mythral).
(and honestly even the Old God) to die
What would be the inherent value in preserving the old god beside the inherent risks that his barely existence pose to the world?
Until now there are no negative effects from his removal beside the sacrifice of one warden but then again allow Loghain to return to be an hero of Ferelden shouldn't be so negative
That's for sure in fact they did sent questions in DAO if this happen.
Now i think that since the Inquisitor discover this in an import DR-state the wardens should degrade the HoF and remove the position of warden commander since it's realistic to have this as the flip coin of the ritual ,they did not completely take responsibility than they should not be Commanders.
Yes...but I wish they could do it the sperm bank way. I don't want to do it the traditional way....
Odds are that the grey wardens wouldn't just kick him out of the Order. They would try to kill him as punishment for betrayal (at least in their eyes).
They would be foolish to even try. Not only because they have no chance against the Hero, but also because the Hero has so many powerful friends. Leliana could be the Divine and Alistair could be king of Ferelden. The Wardens would pay a heavy price for betraying their savior.
Also, aren't the Wardens willing to do what ever it takes to stop the Blights? How is the DR any different?
They would be foolish to even try. Not only because they have no chance against the Hero, but also because the Hero has so many powerful friends. Leliana could be the Divine and Alistair could be king of Ferelden. The Wardens would pay a heavy price for betraying their savior.
Entirely possible.
Also, aren't the Wardens willing to do what ever it takes to stop the Blights? How is the DR any different?
The DR doesn't make it possible to end the Blight. Merely to dodge the consequences of doing so. This is not in and of itself a bad thing, but it does so at the cost of the Old God in charge continuing to exist. It might be that if its host gets Tainted, it becomes an Archdemon again. It might be that Solas now has it after the epilogue of Inquistion. It might even be that it's a threat on its own merits, without needing either. A Warden who eliminates these possibilities, even at the risk or cost of their own life, is following "whatever it takes" better than one who does the DR.
I always do because I want Loghain to live because of his story in DAI, and seeing her son and the different version of meeting Flemeth, I feel it suits the storyline better. I can't help but meta game now because of it.
They would be foolish to even try. Not only because they have no chance against the Hero, but also because the Hero has so many powerful friends. Leliana could be the Divine and Alistair could be king of Ferelden. The Wardens would pay a heavy price for betraying their savior.
Also, aren't the Wardens willing to do what ever it takes to stop the Blights? How is the DR any different?
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