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[Jacksper]

So, I've never played a game like Dragon Age before.  I kinda got into it because I loved Mass Effect, and SWTOR, and I also have KOTOR for the iPhone.  So, needless to say after a while i stumbled onto Dragon Age II's demo for the Ps3 about two years ago.  I, however, did not buy any Dragon Age game until I bought DA:O (PC) about two weeks ago maybe.  

 

I have no problems starting up or anything, and I understand the story fairly well (used Wikis, forums like this one, etc...) but although my first experience with Dragon Age may have come from DA2 I went with Origins just to go from the ground up.  I hope to get DA2 and maybe pre-order Dragon Age Inquisition.

 

So... After that introduction my question is, what are some really good Mage Builds.. And how do you really work with the tactics for the game?  I never controlled multiple members of a group before, especially not ones that I haven't customized some of their abilities myself with.  So I was wondering, basic builds for Mages, Warriors and Rogues.  I'm most interested in Mages and Rogues, I have yet to try some of the Origins (Dwarven Noble) but I have found one that I really do like (I kinda spoiled DN Origin by watching a playthrough on Youtube.  But it was worth it as it convinced me to buy the game.) But I really love the idea of making a Mage, and having that carry on to me creating mage characters for every Dragon Age game I own.  The only thing is I don't really understand the "role" of a mage, or any of their particular roles... Can Rogues only use backstabs effectively?  Are warriors only to specialize in either Tanking or DPS?  And what does a Mage do for the group besides being the obvious caster?  Is Arcane Warrior any good?

 

Just a basic ratio for stats that I need for each type would be good so I'll have something to build on, I should also note that I am not above playing on Easy mode for the time being..  I hope that doesn't gain too many insults my way.

[rapscallioness]

Hey there, Jacksper! Welcome to the Dragon Age! lol

 

I, too, found DA through Mass Effect. Loved ME so decided to see what else BW made. I haven't tried the Swotor stuff though.

 

That said, I'm not too good on really giving advice on effective builds and all---and I'm so exhausted right now anyway my advice would prolly be all muddled.

 

From what I hear, there is great fondness for the Arcane Mage build....

 

Some folks should be by the thread soon enough to give you great advice on sum optimal builds and tactics. Alot of great insights from the players here.

 

Really, I just wanted to say Hey.."Hey", and welcome you to the DA. Also poke around the threads sum....there's prolly sum threads with the info you're looking for. Otherwise hang tight...help is coming, I'm sure. lol!

 

laterz...I gotta sum sleep. See you around!

[Jacksper]

Alrighty then thanks 

[Blazomancer]

Hail Grey Warden.

As you must have figured it out already, mages in Thedas are powerhouses, so much so that they are locked up and monitored 24x7. The combat mechanics of both DAO and DA2, allows for playstyles that can be considered nothing sort of small scale Nuclear Warfare. Mages in general terms have three basic roles in DAO - the Nuker, the Controller, and the Healer/supporter. The Nuker specializes in wholesale mass slaughter using AoE spells, the Controller specializes in crowd control, and the Healer does just that - heals and buffs friendlies. It is usually better when a single mage can play at least two of the above roles to some extent. Given the way the spells are distributed in the various schools though, it can be expected that a nuker will end up having some CC abilities or a healer will end up having access to a few nukes or CC spells.

The less obvious role of a mage is as a Tank, using either the Arcane Warrior or the Shapeshifter specialization. The typical arcane warrior that wields melee weapons and serves at the vanguard is good in the sense that it can potentially have more survivability than a regular caster mage, but lacks the destructive potential of the latter. That is not to say that the Arcane Warrior specialization itself has no use for the caster mage, it does.

Warriors are mostly tanks, backup tanks or DPSers, yes. Depending on the type of weapon and specialization chosen, warriors can have a handful of CC options though. As for Rogues, it is true that they benefit most from backstabs, although they are certainly not confined to that role. Rogues can also go toe to toe with enemies in the frontlines using quick strikes on single targets or dealing spike damage to a group of enemies using large weapons. Not to mention that both warriors and rogues can be adept archers. They can also be superb off-tanks to certain tougher enemies. One can also equip rogues with bucklers, and two handed weapons, but their usefulness will be very limited since they don't have access to talents geared toward these weapon styles.


The stats distribution will vary quite a bit depending on the build. But in a basic sense, for Warriors bulk of the points would go into Strength, and a few in Willpower and Constitution; let's say a ratio of 4:1:1. The warriors bearing Shields and Bows, would require some points in Dexterity as prerequisites for talents though, so that's another factor.

For rogues, one would need at least 20 STR to equip the strongest light armors. If you desire to use heavier armor, then more points in STR would be required accordingly. The remaining points would mostly go into DEX, and CUNN, and a few in WILL and CON; may be with a ratio of 3:2:0.5:0.5.

For mages, most of the points would go into MAG and WILL with a ratio of 2:1, with a odd few thrown into CON.

If you don't find yourself getting knocked out too often, you can avoid investing in constitution completely. If you find yourself running out of mana/stamina, more points can be invested in willpower.

Please note that these ratios are just one way of doing things without straying too far from the standard and in no way optimal. You might want to consult the stickied thread in this section of the forum for in depth advice on particular builds.

[DarthGizka]

Here's a slightly different take.

Warriors are the easiest to learn, they play extremely well with a team, and they have the highest sustained DPS from plain auto-attacks. Rogues are a bit more difficult because they depend more on positioning, tactics and ability use than warriors, but they are also more versatile and fun (stealth!). Mages are the most powerful by far but also the most difficult to learn, and they don't play really well with teams most of the time, except as support.

A first playthrough is probably easiest with a defence-oriented sword & shield tank (strength and dexterity favoured about equally). They are the least complicated of all, and since it is the first time you'll have to learn the game as well and a bit of every other class in addition to your own. They have great survivability, and they lend themselves naturally to leading from the front and 'titanium speartip' tactics. At later levels they get so powerful that they can solo groups of ogres without breaking a sweat.

A good sequence of classes is warrior first, then rogue, then mage. After a rogue, any warrior feels a bit pedestrian. After a mage, everything else feels horribly pedestrian, although a stealthy DW rogue is still plenty fun despite that.

My first rogue was a DEX dual-wielder with daggers, and she is still one of my favourites. Final stats: 20 strength with items, 30 cunning with items (22 base), rest into dexterity. She was my second character overall but the first - a dwarven warrior - died at level 10 when he picked a fight with some big bad boys in the Brecilian Forest, so he doesn't really count.

Combat Movement makes positioning for backstabs easier, and Coup de Grâce turns normal hits against incapacitated opponents into backstabs. The whole Whirlwind line of abilities is so good that I gave it even to my warrior - a sword & shield Reaver(2)/Champion(4) - when she turned twenty and had already perfected all her other abilities.

Mages are great as support for a warrior or rogue Warden - buffing, healing, crowd-control, freezing clusters of enemies for quick disposal by shattering, taking out enemy mages and dispelling hostile magic. The rest of the time they can fire their staves at anything that moves without having to be told, if you set their behaviour to "Ranged".

Things are less golden for mage Wardens. If they play support for a team (eminence grise) then the focus of battles is mostly elsewhere. If they want to hold centre stage as battle mages then they get held back by any friendlies hopping around in the battle zone.

 

Mage + team = micromanagement. A few encounters are easier to tackle with a team but most of the time it is less hassle if they hang back or stay at home.

Against single enemies, caster mages have the lowest sustained DPS of all classes, and even their shatter abilities are not 100% effective where those of the other classes work without fail. However, they excel at crowd control and peak DPS, and usually they can project those DPS on whole groups of enemies simultaneously. A mage can dispatch clusters of enemies just as easily as any single enemy, but the converse also holds: any single enemy requires just as much work as a whole group. Hence, the effectiveness of a battle mage hinges on their ability to herd, channel, and contain the enemy hordes for maximum effectiveness of AoE spells. It's all about positioning, timing and resilient tactics (i.e. not getting stumped by spell failure, and having alternative moves ready).

Do it right and you can dispatch most enemies faster on your own than a whole team of 'physical' fighters can, without needing any potions except a few during some mass battles and some boss fights. Do it wrong and it will take forever - team or no team - and you'll go through stacks of potions like there's no tomorrow. Steep learning curve. My first High Dragon was a drawn-out, epic battle that took about 50 potions of all kinds. The last one was toasted with one lesser health pot and one lesser lyrium (working in a team with a golem, a healer and a rogue).

A battle mage's bane are groups of fire-proof elites like ash wraiths and drakes, and melee bosses like alpha ogres and revenants. They require special care and tactics, even the odd bit of kiting; everyone else gets pwned and waltzed over.

Viability at very low levels depends on picking spells for synergy, so that you can cover all tactical necessities with the few spells you are allowed to take. Fireball plus Mind Blast works well, so does Cone of Cold plus Walking Bomb. The latter is slower but easier than playing with fire; combat tactics are completely different. Or you can ride on the coat tails of team mates all the way from the Harrowing to the endgame, after slaying five wisps and one wolf on your own.

 

Stats allocation is the easiest of all classes: all points into magic. Lowish mana and hitpoints can be compensated with potions and items, insufficient spellpower and damage cannot. I posted a soloable spellbook a while ago; the containing thread discusses the merits of various spells and combos.

[Mike3207]

I'll cover mage because that seems like what you're most interested in starting with. Stat distribution should be all/most magic, but depending on your specialization you may put more points in another stat. Spirit healers will want more willpower, Arcane Warriors some dexterity and willpower, Shapeshifters-maybe a bit more strength, and Blood Mage more Constitution.

 

Spells-likely you'll want at least one line of Destruction, one or two lines from Spirit, at least the basic Heal spell, some CC spells like Sleep or Glyph of Paralysis, and maybe look at some Entropy.You'll also need to decide how much of the Arcane Line you want to do.Also, if you go 4 deep on your specializations, it might mean less spells overall.I'd definitely look at defensive magic as well like Spell Shield, Arcane Shield, and Rock Armor.

 

Gear-focus on defense/dodge gear that also contains magic resistance if possible. Enemy mages will focus on you and enemy warriors will head straight for you. The more you're able to dodge physical/magical attacks, the better.

 

Finally, decide what you want to do once the enemy gets into melee range. If you want to melee them, look at Arcane Warrior or Shapeshifter. If you want to run away to get to range again, you might pick something else.

[DarthGizka]

Finally, decide what you want to do once the enemy gets into melee range. If you want to melee them, look at Arcane Warrior or Shapeshifter. If you want to run away to get to range again, you might pick something else.

Assuming they get so close, which most don't... Mind Blast plus Flame Blast or Fireball, or drop a Glyph of Repulsion on yourself and watch them fly away. Take a few steps in the other direction, upgrade to Paralysis Explosion and do unto them whatever you want for twenty seconds. Of freeze them with Cone of Cold, inject one with (Virulent) Walking Bomb and explode the bunch of them. There are plenty of options that involve neither melee combat nor running away.

 

 

[Mike3207]

Assuming they get so close, which most don't... Mind Blast plus Flame Blast or Fireball, or drop a Glyph of Repulsion on yourself and watch them fly away. Take a few steps in the other direction, upgrade to Paralysis Explosion and do unto them whatever you want for twenty seconds. Of freeze them with Cone of Cold, inject one with (Virulent) Walking Bomb and explode the bunch of them. There are plenty of options that involve neither melee combat nor running away.

 

 

Spells have a casting time,  and during that times foes will likely be stunning you or knocking you down, keeping you out of the fight for a while. If you do get that spell off, it's possible the spell will be resisted. It all comes down to your mindset-do you think spells are your best option at that point-or will you be better off to melee or retreat?I favor melee myself at that point, but it's up to the individual player.

[DarthGizka]

Yes, timing is critical. Which is what makes Sleep so much more useful in practice than Blood Wound and Mass Paralysis, both of which take two seconds to cast cold.

 

My remark was only intended to clarify that melee combat and running away are not the only options by any means.

 

And for some enemies - like rage demons and desire demons - it is actually preferrable to have them close taking puny swings at you. At range they are apt to cast big nasty spells instead, and those hurt much more.

[mousestalker]

Unless you are soloing, you also have the option of shifting one of your companions to take on the meleeing enemy. Almost all of the warrior/fighter types have some form of taunt as does Shale. You can also simply have someone else attack the bad guy. Morrigan excels at annoying enemies right out of the box.

[Jacksper]

I think Morrigan excels in annoying people in general

[Jacksper]

Thanks everyone 

[Dovakiin_N7]

Same as you OP. I take this opportunity to share my thoughts too. I moved from Mass Effect to DA a couple of months back, even though I had the game for like 2 years. Somebody told me *combat system is not good*. I deciphered it as combat is *easy*. Big mistake. LOL.  Started on normal mode as mage and boy, did I get my butts kicked seriously in Tower of Ishal. Every battle was nightmarishly difficult. I did not know how to micromanage, did not understood tactics well or even spells. Unless Mass effect enemy were spawning behind me, around me, on top of me. When the Ogre showed up, I literally gave up. Until a friend told me to kite the ogre with tank and rest hold position. It was tedious but in the end I won. So I kept playing and my interest kept on rising. Even then when it looked like I was having fun, a Arcane Horror, a Reverent, or just plain 15 wolfs would show up and I am back to raging in frustration again. On top of that, I went to Orzammer before getting Wynne. I had several nightmares about Jarvia, Branka and the Broodmother afterwords. End boss easier because I learnt a in the process.

Did a few mistake again and started playing Golem of Amgarrak before Awakening. Gave up on final fight and completed Awakening first.

My second play-through is now as Dwarven commoner rogue. Raised difficulty to Hard. And it's mostly breeze barring a few fights. I dont even need Wynne now. I have upgraded Morrigan to have Mana Clash. Set her tactics *Enemy class mage -> Use Mana clash*. That is just plain ridiculous. I was sent to a dungeon by the Slim Couldry. While my rogue was slashing though Archers and warriors with ease, I saw corpses of mages while moving to next area. Poor fools had no chance before *sadist* Morrigan. They were dead before they could raise a hand. Unchecked , 2 mages are a death sentence to the entire squad in matter of seconds. Now she kills the mages in an blink of an eye and I dont even notice, if i dont take control of her.

Even in my this better going gameplay, I completely missed on the Specialization until the start of Final assault. So Alister was not a champion. There is so much to learn in this game. So Now I will be taking Leliana to the final battle whom I left in the camps all the time, with her Bard-Ranger specialization.

Tips on Morrigan (or Wynne). If you are playing as warrior or rogue. Be careful when you set her to attack with massive damage ability like Curse of Mortality on Warrior/Rogue Elite or higher boss enemies. That will turn their agro to her and they can kill your mage in one hit. Ser Cautherine chased and killed both in one hit in the most difficult battle I faced. Use debuff hexes (careful with Death hex though, I am not sure but it seems to attract agro, horror does not. I might be wrong), winters grasp etc and save massive damage spell for mages and lieutenants and Area Spell for group of enemies. I dont agree with advice on keeping them home though. Without then, the Arcane Horror that spawned in further corner behind mutiple critters would decimate entire party before they could reach you. And the one in Brecilian ruins teleports. Although I agree Mages takes most time to learn, but they are super powerful once understood.

[Elhanan]

Perhaps not mentioned but recommended, are some mods if playing on the PC. Extra Dog Slot, Character Respec, and Lock Bash are my top choices.

Mage: Try to get Mana Clash; helps with opposing casters and demons, if I recall correctly. But you may wish to deactivate the FX Buffer effects for this and some graphics like the Fade.

Rogue: besides the typical Cunning/ DEX rogues, one may also acquire STR to don heavier armors; helps vs Grabs, Overwhelms, etc. There are many pieces and sets for various designs, though I most often use Evon the Great's Heavy mail and Wade's Dragonscale combo.

Warrior: As noted above, it is fairly basic. However, the 2H Warrior offers some pleasure derived from the durability and power displayed. Attempt to get the Sunder talents as soon as possible to aid combat speed, and that should prevent feeling sluggish compared to other choices.