63 réponses à ce sujet

[Ghost]

Blocking is fine in an RPG, as long as the character does it and not the player. When a player does it, it's an action game. Otherwise why have a Dex score? Why have a Defense skill? Just let the player do it. Use the player's reflexes, use the player's gaming skill. Let the player take the action and make it "alive and interesting".
 
There's no end to the possibilities. Why use a Str stat? Controllers are analog, just make the strength of the strike based on how hard you can press the button. Why should character speed depend on Str, Dex and Load? Surely if I can waggle my stick fast enough the character should move faster? Why have levels and icons for spells or an Int stat? They should be button combos so skilful people can cast spells by pulling a left, half circle and X+Y from memory. We can remove the Con stat by wiring up a electric shocker to the console and shock the player when they take damage, ****** with low endurance lose when they pass out!

There's no need for every game to be an action game, there are already plenty of action games.

That's just my position, I accept that other people don't think the same way. I'll not debate it since that's a sure way of disappearing down a rabbit hole. 

Fair enough then. 

[In Exile]

D'oh! Sorry, I kept in mind your posting style can be sarcastic, so I totally read that as if you meant the opposite. My bad

 

No worries. I was kind of sarcastic, just not to you. In hindsight I can see how my using "you" and quoting your post was confusing. 

[AlanC9]

While I think that player-controlled blocking is pretty awful, I don't see why including it would necessarily all that bad for the game, any more than click-to-attack was. Non-controlled characters would have to be able to block on their own, right? As long as I can turn that on for the controlled character, I don't see much of a difference.

[In Exile]

While I think that player-controlled blocking is pretty awful, I don't see why including it would necessarily all that bad for the game, any more than click-to-attack was. Non-controlled characters would have to be able to block on their own, right? As long as I can turn that on for the controlled character, I don't see much of a difference.

 

I think the worry is that those abilities - like the dodge - would never have AI scripts could enough to trigger in a way that's comparable to direct player control. 

[Araceil]

There are so many hacky slashy action rpgs around now, I'm getting kinda sick of it to be honest. I really would rather have something along the lines of Origins combat only with better animations a bit more player involvement for those who want it. 

[Deflagratio]

Something I noticed after re-watching the PAX demo was that the Inquisitor blocked several strikes from Red Templar swords. I'm curious about how blocking strikes will work in Inquisition

Will it simply happen automatically based on stats like in Origins or will we be able to toggle an actual block button to lessen or completely nullify the damage done? I'm hoping for the latter:)

 

I asked this in the Raptr QA but it didn't get answered.

 

To be honest, blocking (Especially with shields) looks passive now, especially because Iron Bull never attempts a parry in the E3 presentation. (I've had to start calling it a Presentation because I get PMs about where to 'download' the demo on XBL)

 

 

I think the worry is that those abilities - like the dodge - would never have AI scripts could enough to trigger in a way that's comparable to direct player control. 

 

If the Dragon fight in Indicative of the telegraphing of heavy attacks, I think the idea (Especially on Nightmare) is to pause and go Tactical when you see the enemy readying a big attack, then to order individually all your companions to bail out of the AOE with a roll or dive. I'm curious if they use invincibility frames making it a true "Dodge" or if it's just designed to move quickly. (IE: no Invincibility frames)

[Nukekitten]

It does look wrong to just have characters smacking each other, standing there taking hits. On the other hand, if I can press a button to block with impunity, then I can probably walk all over everything from level 1 barring boringly huge health pools. Sort of like the roll around and backstab strats from Dark Souls.

I wonder whether it would make more sense to have characters auto-block based on attributes, and make it something that happens most of the time with a reasonable skill spread - i.e. you don't have to min-max just to not be standing there like a numpty - but reduce their relevant attributes proportionally to the attack during the encounter when they do so.

Different aesthetic but similar tactical play.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

I prefer that it happens automatically based on stats like in Origin. The character is the one doing the blocking not the gamer. If the character's defense sucks, no amount of player intervention should be able to block a blow. Also the gamer is controlling a party how would it be possible for the player to control the block and control all the party members if they are selected?

 

PLayer intervention in blocking may work well in a single character player game like Skyrim or Kingdoms of Amalur, but it does not work as well in a game where the gamer can control all the characters at once if selected.

 

Then why not just have the entire fight play out as a cutscene based on stats? The character is the one doing the attacking not the gamer.

 

Player intervention is already there in rolling, which is probably more preposterous than blocking. The AI controlled characters should block themselves (just like enemies?). And there can be an easy mode or toggle for actioncombatevilsdiemikelaidlaw players to have the computer block for them so everybody wins.

[Realmzmaster]

Then why not just have the entire fight play out as a cutscene based on stats? The character is the one doing the attacking not the gamer.

 

Player intervention is already there in rolling, which is probably more preposterous than blocking. The AI controlled characters should block themselves (just like enemies?). And there can be an easy mode or toggle for actioncombatevilsdiemikelaidlaw players to have the computer block for them so everybody wins.

 

You mean like the old games Wizard's Crown, Eternal Dagger, or newer games like Spartan or  The Last Remnant. I love that type of game. Also Temple of Elemental Evil and Pool of Radiance: Myth Drannor. I love tactical crpgs.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

Lol, i've never seen them. The closest ive seen to "fights as cutscenes" are the telltale games games. Except there are no stats

[Boss Fog]

To the OP - why can't there be both?  You can still have your automatic defensive abilities based off your stats AND there could be an ability that blocks the next 4 attacks.

[Gtdef]

Active block without elaborate mechanics to support it? Either exploitable or useless..

A better idea would be to have a skill with a relatively long cooldown so it won't be spammable, self buff lasting 2-3 seconds, that makes you immune to damage. Still exploitable in a "look ma, no friendly fire" way, but whatever. It's not like the previous games had any need for very active play to avoid ff. You just got forcefielded.

 

I really hope they will make the defensive cooldowns a bit more involved and less in number. Shield Wall, Shield Defense, Shield Cover, Shield Dog, Shield Cat, Shield Whatever. 2 specialized toggles are more than enough.

[rocsage]

When was blocking not considered to be part of an RPG? 

timing a specific button to defend against incoming damage is typically not an rpg feature.

having this feature substantially raises skill ceiling and takes away some of the intrinsic appeal of an rpg--that you don't need fast reflexes or precise coordination to excel.

at the same time, this encourages additional pausing and squeezing actions/commands.

with the extraordinarily "due or die" type rogues and mages epitomized by Sky Horror and Bartrand, most strategies become meaningless and winning the encounter essentially becomes an issue of simon says, "go here, stay away, etc..."

super-technical blazing reflexes isn't the way to go, even in the fighting game arena.

For example,SF 3.3 parrying system meant full damage nullification and ability to retaliate immediately; capcom has since backed away from that approach and introduced a mechanism of gradual health recovery that no longer allows feats such as the much immortalized umehara parry-fest.