268 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr.House]

Somebody liking something you don't like is incomprehensible?

[bussinrounds]

That you think D&D is a good ruleset is incomprehensible but that's a debate for another thread. But this just brings the hypocrisy out to the forefront: you ostensibly say that you care about gameplay, yet you somehow think that the fact that a game has romances means that developers will design a wholly different ruleset, or make the game cinematic, or have action combat? Even if you're right about the relative cost, the time/effort/money that went into the ME romances would go to (i) writing more plots (which you don't seem to like); (ii) having other cinematics for those plots (which you seem to think are useless); and (iii) having VO for other lines. 

 

Do you think that Skyrim and Oblivion became increasingly less complex in their mechanics, and more shallow in their question design because of romances too? 

You make it sound as if I'm completely against story elements in rpgs at all. In the hands of decent writers.   I can get down with some Planescape, Bloodlines, MotB.. but it's a short list of those that can stand on that aspect alone.      And yea, despite me not being in love with the gameplay/systems in ME, they could of been improved/expanded on, no ?  

 

   Skyrim/Oblivious was dumbed down to appeal to the casuals/akshun gamers/ make more money, duh.

[In Exile]

Somebody liking something you don't like is incomprehensible?

 

I didn't say that. I said thinking that it's a good ruleset is incomprehensible, not liking it. 

[In Exile]

You make it sound as if I'm completely against story elements in rpgs at all. In the hands of decent writers.   I can get down with some Planescape, Bloodlines, MotB.. but it's a short list of those that can stand on that aspect alone.      And yea, despite me not being in love with the gameplay/systems in ME, they could of been improved/expanded on, no ?  

 

   Skyrim/Oblivious was dumbed down to appeal to the casuals/akshun gamers/ make more money, duh.

I'm not saying you're against story elements. I'm just saying that if it's gameplay that matters to you, romances don't affect the quality of the gameplay, because the stuff that gets invested in them is totally orthogonal to the stuff invested in gameplay. TW2, for example, has a pretty involved romance with Triss all things considered that's pretty central to the plot (if the player follows it) but it also has the best choice and consequence system of any modern RPG. 

[spirosz]

KotoR ?   You can't be serious.   I played on the hardest difficulty possible (the first time playing) and I had to keep checking back in the options because it was so easy I couldn't even  believe it.   Likewise with DAO, I had to play on nightmare and severely handicap myself. (no healer/healing spells, no op DLC weapons/armors, no auto resurrections, no spells like that storm one indoors...  

 

I come from a time where RPGs were MUCH tougher than any of this stuff...Dark Heart of Uukrul, Deathlord, Wizardry 4, Chaos Strikes Back, certain D&D Gold Box games like Pools of Darkness, Bards Tale 1/2, Realms of Arkania series.. None of that cheating & looking **** up on the net either back then. 

 

My sides. 

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

To be fair, I'd rather replay Star Trail than DA:O or KotOR. Nothing against those games, but there's a charm in text based games I enjoy over cinematic ones. Plus it's one of the few games/series where travel/exploration isn't trivial and a game into itself.

Also, I get the impression the list isn't particularly popular here. That's fine. But ignore the order - what does everyone think about the actual commentary/user reviews? Are there any games you would add to the list, or take out? Why/why not?

To be honest, I wouldn't mind a similar list from BSN with commentary on each game so you could have an even comparison between the tastes of he two sites.

[bussinrounds]

  Great Idea.  Lets see what you got BSN !!  

 

  

Cue a list of RPGs from the last decade only, except for the older obvious/mainstream JRPG here and there (FF6, Chrono Trigger..)

 

 

Speaking of which, here's the console list from last year.  Keep in mind, Codex is much more of a PC site. (for those that don't know)

 

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

My favorite kind of RPGs are Might & Magic and Wizardy. That's shameful that Devs/Publs don't make many of these kind of games these days.

At least New Vegas and Skyrim in 1st person somehow have similar gameplay.

 

Then comes NWN/KOTOR/JE/DAO kind of RPG.

 

Then ME2 kind ...

[Susty Randusky]

Great Idea.  Lets see what you got BSN !!  
 
  
Cue a list of RPGs from the last decade only, except for the older obvious/mainstream JRPG here and there (FF6, Chrono Trigger..)
 
 
Speaking of which, here's the console list from last year.  Keep in mind, Codex is much more of a PC site. (for those that don't know)
 

Get a load of this guy. Such a HK

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

My favorite kind of RPGs are Might & Magic and Wizardy. That's shameful that Devs/Publs don't make many of these kind of games these days.

At least New Vegas and Skyrim in 1st person somehow have similar gameplay.

 

Then comes NWN/KOTOR/JE/DAO kind of RPG.

 

Then ME2 kind ...

 

Have you played Might and Magic X - Legacy, Arian? Or Paper Sorcerer?

 

You're right in that there aren't many blobber dungeon crawlers out there now, but they're not completely extinct. 

 

But yeah, I'm actually real interested to see what the thoughts of BSNers are with regards to the user reviews and perhaps their own best PC RPGs list.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Yes. I've played M&M X. It's a (6/10 ~ 8/10) game. Not finished it yet. Some awesome places, buildings and mazes to clear and the plot is good enough. I prefer M&M 6-8 kind of gameplay but M&M X went retro to M&M 1-5.

 

[bussinrounds]

My favorite kind of RPGs are Might & Magic and Wizardy. That's shameful that Devs/Publs don't make many of these kind of games these days.

 

Get on it

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=xDyXSCd2Lp0

[Blooddrunk1004]

KOTOR II > KOTOR

Fallout: NV > Fallout 3

 

Obsidian are one of those developers that always managed to take a created world and making it better when it comes to story and characters, you can bash them all you want because of bugs and technical problems. However they are miles ahead of pretty much every developer when it comes to writing.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Get on it

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=xDyXSCd2Lp0

 

Is it a game from 1993? jk! The name of the game should be Grimrock anyway! I don't play many old style games anymore. It's FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT that is fascinating!

I don't know if I ever play Might and Magic 3, 4 or 5 (Xeen ones).

[UltimaBACON]

KOTOR II > KOTOR

Fallout: NV > Fallout 3

 

Obsidian are one of those developers that always managed to take a created world and making it better when it comes to story and characters, you can bash them all you want because of bugs and technical problems. However they are miles ahead of pretty much every developer when it comes to writing.

 

Amazingly, the current build of New Vegas is considerably less buggy than Fallout 3's current build.

 

Which leads to this: For all the flack Obsidian gets for bugs, they're actually pretty good about fixing them. Meanwhile, I'm convinced Fallout 3 actually got buggier with each patch. And Skyrim was just as buggy as New Vegas on release, yet all the lousy gaming "journalism" hacks gave Skyrim a pass there.

[Dominus]

But ignore the order - what does everyone think about the actual commentary/user reviews? Are there any games you would add to the list, or take out? Why/why not?

Divine Divinity and its sequel were ones I wouldn't have put in the ranking. I'm not sure either one really had changed the industry or had been satisfying enough to make the list. Though you could argue that it did have some great ideas(Mind Reading, "I Want To Become A Dragon"), I'm not sure it's high enough in quality to make it worth the trip or on my list of favorites. As far as commentary:

I agree with their take on DA:O. I wasn't exactly impressed by the game, but it achieved its concept very well. "Mediocrity done Right". One thing I do disagree with is their take of Deus Ex, or more specifically their issues with Dishonored. While Deus Ex lets you lead your own path, the commentator claims that Dishonored forces you to take one or the other. It affects the ending, but no one necessarily forced me to do go full ghost or slash everything up. S.T.A.L.K.E.R. had done something similar, though informing you how it was affected wasn't made known until it was too late.

Games I would Add?

Valkyrie Profile, Seiken Densetzu 3, and of course Call of Duty: Black Ops 2.

[Deflagratio]

Eh, just another list yelling "Things were better in my day!"

 

Either that or "Yes, put it inside me Chris Avellone!" I mean really? Alpha Protocol makes the list but not Fallout 3? AP is only playable as one build and full of WTF AI and clashing mechanics, Fallout 3 has all those problems, but at least a beautiful world rich with contextual storytelling.

 

Least Morrowind's on there though. And of course, PS:T squatting at the top of the list like it does on every PC list ever created by anyone. Hard to argue with that, but just once I'd love to see something like Fable at top slot with PS:T right below it, just so we finally know what happens when the internet explodes.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

^ Konichiwa, hopeless anime Otaku!

 

Sayonara!

[UltimaBACON]

Either that or "Yes, put it inside me Chris Avellone!" I mean really? Alpha Protocol makes the list but not Fallout 3? AP is only playable as one build and full of WTF AI and clashing mechanics, Fallout 3 has all those problems, but at least a beautiful world rich with contextual storytelling.

 

"Fallout 3" and "storytelling" do not go together. Ever. Also, Alpha Protocol at least has a little something called dialogue.

 

I'm also of the opinion that Morrowind is overrated. It has the best world of the Elder Scrolls series, but the dialogue is cookie-cutter and uninspired (every NPC says the same thing over and over) and the combat is even worse. It's great to wander around in until you have to talk to someone or fight something.

[Mr.House]

SMT III on there eh?

Seeing as Link to the past is on that list.... Ya

[Mr.House]

Eh, just another list yelling "Things were better in my day!"

 

Either that or "Yes, put it inside me Chris Avellone!" I mean really? Alpha Protocol makes the list but not Fallout 3? AP is only playable as one build and full of WTF AI and clashing mechanics, Fallout 3 has all those problems, but at least a beautiful world rich with contextual storytelling.

 

Least Morrowind's on there though. And of course, PS:T squatting at the top of the list like it does on every PC list ever created by anyone. Hard to argue with that, but just once I'd love to see something like Fable at top slot with PS:T right below it, just so we finally know what happens when the internet explodes.

How adorable.