132 réponses à ce sujet

[favoritehookeronthecitadel]

This almost made my day. http://ilikelookinga...ashley-williams

[Bardox9]

Loves me some Ash 

[RZIBARA]

lol shots fired. These are frigging gold my friend. The hypocrisy is strong in much of the fanbase, but yeah...

 

[DeinonSlayer]

Nice.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Yes, Ashley, I part of the reason I dislike you is because you're religious. I don't hold this against Thane or Liara or Garrus or Asari or Turians or the Hanar because they don't make a judgement on you. 

 

By making you judge her based on her religion, she is judging you and trying to hedge a response. 

[DeinonSlayer]

Yes, Ashley, I part of the reason I dislike you is because you're religious. I don't hold this against Thane or Liara or Garrus or Asari or Turians or the Hanar because they don't make a judgement on you.

By making you judge her based on her religion, she is judging you and trying to hedge a response.

To be fair, I don't recall her judging Shepard on the basis of religion, simply asking if her personal (unspecified) faith was a problem. Granted, my memory is fuzzy on how the subject came up. Talking about her dead father, right?

There are things I won't defend (like her absurd leap in rank), but I don't see the issue here.

[PCThug]

You can dislike something in one character and like it another. I don't think that's necessarily hypocritical.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

To be fair, I don't recall her judging Shepard on the basis of religion, simply asking if her personal (unspecified) faith was a problem. Granted, my memory is fuzzy on how the subject came up. Talking about her dead father, right?

There are things I won't defend (like her absurd leap in rank), but I don't see the issue here.

 

She directly brought it up and started off on an awkward note; The first thing she asks is whether I have a problem with it or not. That's pretty confrontational, and I don't know very many religious people that start off any topic of their faith like that. When that gets brought up, its like she's hedging for an answer. You might even say she's looking your validation and approval in that regard, and she does react negatively if you tell her how you feel about it (and it's in an atheistic manner). It's the kind of judgement I do on here all the time (yeah I'm a hypocrite). You say something, judge the responses, then criticize them.

 

Along with that, I came off as rather miffed when she suggested that there was more to my survival on Akuze than just my own skill.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Also, Ashley's 'speciesism' comes off as a lot more mean-spirited and spiteful towards aliens than cynical and jaded with their politics. Her... ire towards aliens seems more irrational and inborn than someone who has had to deal with them and gotten the short-end of the stick. It is borderline xenophobia/racism.

[General TSAR]

Nice.

(Clap Clap Clap)

[DeinonSlayer]

Fair enough. I'm working my first Shepard through ME1 who could be considered a more confrontational athiest (JayneShep was religious, my canon simply waved off the topic ("I'm your commanding officer, not your moral compass")), so I guess I'll see the dialogue when I get there.

She's free to think whatever she wants of Shepard's background IMO so long as she doesn't let personal judgment compromise her performance.

*I know, I know, insert Citadel standoff here*

[DeinonSlayer]

Also, Ashley's 'speciesism' comes off as a lot more mean-spirited and spiteful towards aliens than cynical and jaded with their politics. Her... ire towards aliens seems more irrational and inborn than someone who has had to deal with them and gotten the short-end of the stick. It is borderline xenophobia/racism.

Didn't really come across that way to me, at least in ME1. She's a human nationalist, but not a xenophobe, and her "bear-and-dog" analogy proved to be 100% right. Her reaction if taken to meet Saricino is hostile (even unprofessionally so).

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Didn't really come across that way to me, at least in ME1. She's a human nationalist, but not a xenophobe, and her "bear-and-dog" analogy proved to be 100% right. Her reaction if taken to meet Saricino is hostile (even unprofessionally so).

 

It's a correct analogy, but I believe it's motivated by an irrational belief. She comes off as patriotic to a fault. A huge fault. Like 'can't see the real problem because the alliance can't see it' fault. Granted, that was arguably flanderization in ME2. Still, her opinions of aliens in general (not the politics or politicians as I said) seems to be a lot darker. 

[Bardox9]

Her religious beliefs never factored in for me. She's not some larger than life super powered character out to save the universe. She's just a grunt thrown into a war. Considering what she must face and that she never hesitates no matter how freaky the monster is... that's a bad bi^ch. Loves me some Ash!

 

I was disappointed she hadn't really done anything note worthy in her time away from Shepard, Her big accomplishment though out the trilogy is not dying. Assuming of course you save her instead of Kaidan in ME1. Which prior to ME3 I always did. Kaidan is just annoying, but by ME3 he has become the head on a unit training the next generation of biotic soldiers, which will be very hand in the war. Ashley is still, more or less, the same grunt she always was. And the rank jump was insane.

[PCThug]

Was there a reason they needed Ash to have that rank jump story wise? Or was it more because the writers felt she needed to keep pace with Kaidan?

[Kurt M.]

Fair enough, but I still prefer Kaidan

[DeinonSlayer]

It's a correct analogy, but I believe it's motivated by an irrational belief. She comes off as patriotic to a fault. A huge fault. Like 'can't see the real problem because the alliance can't see it' fault. Granted, that was arguably flanderization in ME2. Still, her opinions of aliens in general (not the politics or politicians as I said) seems to be a lot darker.

I'm gonna go with flanderization and writer-change-itis. There seemed to be a lot less substance to the character in later titles.

[Daemul]

 

It never fails to make me smile whenever Massively goes on his Ashley hate triad. Keep hating. 

[Iakus]

Also, Ashley's 'speciesism' comes off as a lot more mean-spirited and spiteful towards aliens than cynical and jaded with their politics. Her... ire towards aliens seems more irrational and inborn than someone who has had to deal with them and gotten the short-end of the stick. It is borderline xenophobia/racism.

 

Citation needed.

 

her ire seems to be summed up in her own quote "I don't think we should turn down allies.  I just don't think we should count on them staying allies"

 

How's that different from Lord Palmerston's saying: " We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow"

[TheTurtle]

I love these a lot, but like Peter said shots fired. There is no way this thread is gonna turn out good.

[Barquiel]

You can dislike something in one character and like it another. I don't think that's necessarily hypocritical.

 

Yep, that's how I see it too. It simply depends on the presentation/writing, the background of the character, etc.

[themikefest]

All I know is that she is a mini tank when it comes to missions. Thats all I care about. The other stuff I don't give a crap about.

[Kurt M.]

I think calling Tali "she's like a sister to me" calls off all xenophobia accusations from her part.

 

I wish people started someday to distinguish between racism/xenophobia and wanting to protect what you are, and the people and the world you care about.

[Daemul]

I love these a lot, but like Peter said shots fired. There is no way this thread is gonna turn out good.

Nah, it will be alright, most Ash haters are long gone or don't voice their hate of her that much anymore, people are focusing more on hating Liara. 

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Why wouldn't the Alliance be able to consider the Hierarchy, Republics, Union, Protectorate, Primacy, or Courts as long-term allies? 

All of them have been together for 1000+ years.