823 réponses à ce sujet

[Todd23]

I hope so. There's too many unanswered questions with her and her sister.

[DaySeeker]

I don't know what "that" you are referring to, but you continue to kiss my point. By the end sis is already filled with corruption and it is too late for Velanna to do anything, so again, she will do what she needs to to "protect" her sister who is the proxy of her own humanity. She has no morality. She does what she needs to for her own selfish ends and changes sides whenever she needs to if she can up the body count.

[Pirate Queen Isabela]

Elves are a oppressed minority but why keep bringing that up when Velanna clearly murdered innocents? Her being in a group of oppressed minorities doesn't mean she gets a free ticket to murder humans left and right to scare a whole village just because she sees them as wrong (how can Humans NOT be wrong??). 

 

It isn't an excuse for her to murder, I don't care if she loves her sister or wants to get married or how she feels about the sky being blue, murder is murder. I have nothing against her, but people who choose to kill her for being a murderer (which she is) have a right to. Blathering about how she is a oppressed minority isn't gonna change anything.

[DaySeeker]

It's a discussion thread. This is discussion. We don't have to agree. You also don't get to tell people to go away because you don't like what they're saying.

[Chari]

Elves are a oppressed minority but why keep bringing that up when Velanna clearly murdered innocents? Her being in a group of oppressed minorities doesn't mean she gets a free ticket to murder humans left and right to scare a whole village just because she sees them as wrong (how can Humans NOT be wrong??). 

 

It isn't an excuse for her to murder, I don't care if she loves her sister or wants to get married or how she feels about the sky being blue, murder is murder. I have nothing against her, but people who choose to kill her for being a murderer (which she is) have a right to. Blathering about how she is a oppressed minority isn't gonna change anything.

So what? More than half of our teammates are murderers

You can kill them all if you want to

But I'm willing to give a second chance

Jumping at people who choose to defend her isn't gonna change anything either

 

It's a discussion thread. This is discussion. We don't have to agree. You also don't get to tell people to go away because you don't like what they're saying.

What you're saying is going against canon, so... headcanon away

[Pirate Queen Isabela]

So what? More than half of our teammates are murderers

You can kill them all if you want to

But I'm willing to give a second chance

Jumping at people who choose to defend her isn't gonna change anything either

 

What you're saying is going against canon, so... headcanon away

 

I said I have nothing against her, actually, she is one of my favourite Awakening companions next to Sigrun, I'm just saying if people want to hold her accountable for murder then they can because the evidence is planted right in front of our eyes. Again: part of oppressed minority =/= excuse to murder.

[The Night Haunter]

So what? More than half of our teammates are murderers

You can kill them all if you want to

But I'm willing to give a second chance

Jumping at people who choose to defend her isn't gonna change anything either

 

The problem people keep having is that you keep saying she is justified in her rampage just because her sister is missing. And there is definitely a gap between Velanna and other companions (bar Morrigan). Zev is an assassin, he is simply a tool, and more than likely his every target had to have pissed someone off a whole lot to have earned someones ire enough to make them hire assassins. He mostly kills criminals and politicians/nobles (the most likely target of professional assassins). Leliana doesn't run around murdering people, all we know of her as a Bard suggests she was more into espionage rather than assassination. Sure she kills a few people here and there, but they are guards, getting in her way, not just random peeps. Sten went crazy and killed a family, THEN STOPPED. When the rest of the village came to arrest him, he didn't protest, he recognized he was in the wrong and surrendered. When did Velanna surrender exactly?

 

Velanna isn't particularly worse than other companions you can get, but that doesn't mean she isn't in the wrong, it just means so are some of your other companions.

[Chari]

I said I have nothing against her, actually, she is one of my favourite Awakening companions next to Sigrun, I'm just saying if people want to hold her accountable for murder then they can because the evidence is planted right in front of our eyes. Again: part of oppressed minority =/= excuse to murder.

Never said it was. I said it it an excuse to feel hatred towards the oppressors.

The same can be said about Sten, Lelianna, Zevran, Morrigan, Oghren, Anders, Shale, Isabella... I don't see these characters gets so much critisism

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The reason I refused to take Velanna with me is because even if what she had been tricked into believing was true she still gruesomely slaughtered many people who were still innocent of anything.

[Chari]

The problem people keep having is that you keep saying she is justified in her rampage just because her sister is missing. And there is definitely a gap between Velanna and other companions (bar Morrigan). Zev is an assassin, he is simply a tool, and more than likely his every target had to have pissed someone off a whole lot to have earned someones ire enough to make them hire assassins. He mostly kills criminals and politicians/nobles (the most likely target of professional assassins). Leliana doesn't run around murdering people, all we know of her as a Bard suggests she was more into espionage rather than assassination. Sure she kills a few people here and there, but they are guards, getting in her way, not just random peeps. Sten went crazy and killed a family, THEN STOPPED. When the rest of the village came to arrest him, he didn't protest, he recognized he was in the wrong and surrendered. When did Velanna surrender exactly?

 

Velanna isn't particularly worse than other companions you can get, but that doesn't mean she isn't in the wrong, it just means so are some of your other companions.

Zevran enjoyed killing. He admits killing innocent. Lelianna as well enjoyed the Game. Sten's crime is supposed to be terrible and technically unforgivable (kids, ya know) as mentioned by M.Kirby. 

Why should she? She is like a wounded wild wolf. She will fight till the end regardless with whom

 

Next time I'll see so much biased hatred towards any of them I'll say it is fair. So far, Velanna gets the worst reaction

[The Night Haunter]

Never said it was. I said it it an excuse to feel hatred towards the oppressors.

The same can be said about Sten, Lelianna, Zevran, Morrigan, Oghren, Anders, Shale, Isabella... I don't see these characters gets so much critisism

Because the magnitude of their crimes is different.

Sten is the only one who committed a comparable crime of slaying innocents, but he stops after he realizes what he's done (only takes a single family for him, whereas it takes ... every human possible for Velanna).

Oghren only kills a single individual that he shouldn't have, and he gets all mopey drunk later, he is guilty.

Isabella is a sociopath so....

Shale is a lyrium addled rock who is so far removed from humanity as to not clearly understand morals.

Zev is an assassin, he doesn't have any malice towards those he kills, and he only kills those he is ordered to, completely different scenario.

Anders is a mass-murderer, he does indeed get a whole lot more criticism than Velanna, bad example on your part.

Leliana only kills when she has to, as she mentions to the Warden she prefers a more refined approach.

[The Night Haunter]

Zevran enjoyed killing. He admits killing innocent. Lelianna as well enjoyed the Game. Sten's crime is supposed to be terrible and technically unforgivable (kids, ya know) as mentioned by M.Kirby. 

Why should she? She is like a wounded wild wolf. She will fight till the end regardless with whom

 

Next time I'll see so much biased hatred towards any of them I'll say it is fair. So far, Velanna gets the worst reaction

Patently false, just search Anders on this forum and you'll see thousands of posts calling him a mass-murderer.

 

Zevran is indeed not good, but his crime is of a different magnitude, he kills those he is ordered to. Velanna kills every human she can possibly get her hands on. Zev doesn't say 'I hate humans, I'll kill some' he just kills people, while Velanna kills humans.

 

She isn't a wounded wolf. If you stand back and allow a wounded wolf to flee, it will. Then it will lick its wounds and continue on with its life. Velanna murders everything in her path, and goes out of the way to slaughter everyone. Not a wounded wolf in the slightest. The loss of her sister might excuse her attack on a single group, not her systematic and calculated slaughter.

[Chari]

Because the magnitude of their crimes is different.

Sten is the only one who committed a comparable crime of slaying innocents, but he stops after he realizes what he's done (only takes a single family for him, whereas it takes ... every human possible for Velanna).

Oghren only kills a single individual that he shouldn't have, and he gets all mopey drunk later, he is guilty.

Isabella is a sociopath so....

Shale is a lyrium addled rock who is so far removed from humanity as to not clearly understand morals.

Zev is an assassin, he doesn't have any malice towards those he kills, and he only kills those he is ordered to, completely different scenario.

Anders is a mass-murderer, he does indeed get a whole lot more criticism than Velanna, bad example on your part.

Leliana only kills when she has to, as she mentions to the Warden she prefers a more refined approach.

Killing children automatically is worse than murder of any grown up man or woman (unless tortured). Literally ripping them apart with bare hands is even worse. 

Still, technically, a murderer

So what? An excuse?

She used to be a dwarf. Granted, it was not her fault her master played too much with his control rod...

He admits of enjoying killing people. If you blame him for this, he disapproves. And says an excuse like: "Who is truly innocent?"

I've seen far more fans and supporters of Anders than I have seen ones of Velanna. So point still stands. Double standards, I guess

New Lelianna. Old Lelianna? Freaks out even Zevran

[Hanako Ikezawa]

So how does any of this have to do with Velanna showing up in Inquisition or not? 

[Chari]

Patently false, just search Anders on this forum and you'll see thousands of posts calling him a mass-murderer.

 

Zevran is indeed not good, but his crime is of a different magnitude, he kills those he is ordered to. Velanna kills every human she can possibly get her hands on. Zev doesn't say 'I hate humans, I'll kill some' he just kills people, while Velanna kills humans.

 

She isn't a wounded wolf. If you stand back and allow a wounded wolf to flee, it will. Then it will lick its wounds and continue on with its life. Velanna murders everything in her path, and goes out of the way to slaughter everyone. Not a wounded wolf in the slightest. The loss of her sister might excuse her attack on a single group, not her systematic and calculated slaughter.

Lots of fans. Less haters. The points stands

 

He still wants to continue this job. Even once freed. He likes killing people for money

 

She is a wounded wolf whose injuries may never heal. Losing her clanmates and sister was worse than death. Once she finds out Serani is alive, she does everything in her power to find her. 

Calculated? She was under pure effect of wrath. Calculation require a cold mind. Something Velanna doesn't have even in good mood

[Jedi Master of Orion]

So did Duncan.

 

So did Loghain.

 

This goes back to the whole debate with Alistair, who thinks being a Grey Warden is an honor, not a "punishment".

 

Hell, my own Dalish could have slaughtered innocents in the beginning of their story. Maybe they spend the rest of the game making up for that. In this context, I'd have no place to judge the likes of Velanna (or Sten).

 

My Dalish tended to agree with Alistair and preferred to surround himself with as few sinister people as possible. I didn't take Sten or Loghain with me either.

[Chari]

One person makes a general statement, and it gets carried away from there.

 

But yeah, on topic, I'm not sure where she'd fit, unless it's connected to an Architect storyline. I don't really care otherwise. Any elf could show up or the elf rebellion subplots. That doesn't need to be Velanna.

It seems really fitting for her 

I'm not sure I want her to get involved. I hope she'll stick with grey wardens. It's safer... for now

[Hanako Ikezawa]

It seems really fitting for her 

I'm not sure I want her to get involved. I hope she'll stick with grey wardens. It's safer... for now

The trailer showing the Wardens and Inquisition clashing suggests otherwise. 

[Chari]

The trailer showing the Wardens and Inquisition clashing suggests otherwise. 

As I said: for now. Till DA:I...

[The Night Haunter]

Lots of fans. Less haters. The points stands

 

He still wants to continue this job. Even once freed. He likes killing people for money

 

She is a wounded wolf whose injuries may never heal. Losing her clanmates and sister was worse than death. Once she finds out Serani is alive, she does everything in her power to find her. 

Calculated? She was under pure effect of wrath. Calculation require a cold mind. Something Velanna doesn't have even in good mood

The point doesn't stand. He has people (like me) who consider him (him = Anders) to be a mass-murderer far worse than Velanna. Just because he has others who support him doesn't make him a universally accepted companion.....

 

Sure, Zev is warped by his life so his moral compass sucks, he is probably worse than Velanna in the long run, since his murders are covered by his position as a crow and can go on indefinitely, while Velanna would have eventually attracted enough attention to have been hunted down and killed like the criminal she was.

 

Wrath can only burn so long. Try staying super, super mad at someone for more than a day, wrath burns and fades. She continues her attacks for weeks, that requires calculation, a cold rage. Adrenaline lasts for hours at most, that's why Sten surrendered. He had a similar situation to Velanna's (his break was because he lost his soul/honor/sword, so to us it seems less justified, but thats imposing our view point on him) and yet he stops with his murders.

 

Most of our companions have/continue to murder people. That doesn't excuse any of their actions. Most of them try to make up for it, Velanna has to have her face smashed in the truth before she even considers talking to you. She is as bad as our worst companions (Zev, Issy... alright not as bad as Anders). I would give her a second chance, she is powerful and the greater good says to use that power to fight the darkspawn rather than just execute her, but executing her would be a justified answer.