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ME3 Asari Probelm


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#151
ImaginaryMatter

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Well, to start off with, I saw someone on the last page comment that nukes should have been in the game because they wanted to see a Reaper 'melt.' Melt like an ice cube, apparently. 

 

I'm pretty sure that wouldn't happen.

 

I said melt, but not melt like an ice cube.

 

What I'm referring to is a bit by a physicist Dr. John Shilling:

 


"First off, the weapon itself. A nuclear explosion in space, will look pretty much like a Very Very Bright flashbulb going off. The effects are instantaneous or nearly so. There is no fireball. The gaseous remains of the weapon may be incandescent, but they are also expanding at about a thousand kilometers per second, so one frame after detonation they will have dissipated to the point of invisibility. Just a flash.

The effects on the ship itself, those are a bit more visible. If you're getting impulsive shock damage, you will by definition see hot gas boiling off from the surface. Again, the effect is instantaneous, but this time the vapor will expand at maybe one kilometer per second, so depending on the scale you might be able to see some of this action. But don't blink; it will be quick.

Next is spallation - shocks will bounce back and forth through the skin of the target, probably tearing chunks off both sides. Some of these may come off at mere hundreds of meters per second. And they will be hot, red- or maybe even white-hot depending on the material.

To envision the appearance of this part, a thought experiment. Or, heck, go ahead and actually perform it. Start with a big piece of sheet metal, covered in a fine layer of flour and glitter. Shine a spotlight on it, in an otherwise-dark room. Then whack the thing with a sledgehammer, hard enough for the recoil to knock the flour and glitter into the air.

The haze of brightly-lit flour is your vaporized hull material, and the bits of glitter are the spallation. Scale up the velocities as needed, and ignore the bit where air resistance and gravity brings everything to a halt.

Next, the exposed hull is going to be quite hot, probably close to the melting point. So, dull red even for aluminum, brilliant white for steel or titanium or most ceramics or composites. The seriously hot layer will only be a millimeter or so thick, so it can cool fairly quickly - a second or two for a thick metallic hull that can cool by internal conduction, possibly as long as a minute for something thin and/or insulating that has to cool by radiation.

After this, if the shock is strong enough, the hull is going to be materially deformed. For this, take the sledgehammer from your last thought experiment and give a whack to some tin cans. Depending on how hard you hit them, and whether they are full or empty, you can get effects ranging from mild denting at weak points, crushing and tearing, all the way to complete obliteration with bits of tin-can remnant and tin-can contents splattered across the landscape.

Again, this will be much faster in reality than in the thought experiment. And note that a spacecraft will have many weak points to be dented, fragile bits to be torn off, and they all get hit at once. If the hull is of isogrid construction, which is pretty common, you might see an intact triangular lattice with shallow dents in between. Bits of antenna and whatnot, tumbling away.

Finally, secondary effects. Part of your ship is likely to be pressurized, either habitat space or propellant tank. Coolant and drinking water and whatnot, as well. With serious damage, that stuff is going to vent to space. You can probably see this happening (air and water and some propellants will freeze into snow as they escape, BTW). You'll also see the reaction force try to tumble the spacecraft, and if the spacecraft's attitude control systems are working you'll see them try to fight back.

You might see fires, if reactive materials are escaping. But not convection flames, of course. Diffuse jets of flame, or possibly surface reactions. Maybe secondary explosions if concentrations of reactive gasses are building up in enclosed (more or less) spaces."

 

Melting was probably not the right word, but it's a cool image. Given that your frequent back seat psychology is about as accurate as my horoscope for the day, surely you can understand my hesitation to trust you in anything involving scientific matters.


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#152
wolfhowwl

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Really? And why is that?

 

I'm sure an...accomplished intellectual like yourself has already seen how poorly written the politicians are in this series.

 

I would just be repeating something you already know.


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#153
Steelcan

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Boy, I am not sure I even want to look at the slaps in the face to science on the last two pages of this thread....

"I see no reason why oxygen deprivation would cause lasting damage to brain tissue"

"Humans can fall from space and survive the impact"


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#154
Ryriena

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"I see no reason why oxygen deprivation would cause lasting damage to brain tissue"
"Humans can fall from space and survive the impact"

I am just going to keep my mouth shut with this one.....
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#155
Reorte

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Hopefully the portrayal of politicians in the next game isn't so ridiculously one sided. I get that people today tend to have a fairly cynical view of politicians, but someone went more than a little overboard in the Mass Effect series. Nearly all of them are incompetent or unlikable.

Amen to that. For a while I thought they'd finally developed Udina in ME3, going by the conversations with him. Then they had to go and have the coup.


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#156
I Tsunayoshi I

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Amen to that. For a while I thought they'd finally developed Udina in ME3, going by the conversations with him. Then they had to go and have the coup.

 

Udina was still the same ****** he was in the other games, all they did was give a little show to the lack a **** he gave about his job in the first place.



#157
Reorte

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Udina was still the same ****** he was in the other games, all they did was give a little show to the lack a **** he gave about his job in the first place.

At least it was an attempt to make him a bit more human instead of a cardboard cutout villain.



#158
I Tsunayoshi I

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At least it was an attempt to make him a bit more human instead of a cardboard cutout villain.

 

Which did nothing to humanize him at all, mind you.



#159
MassivelyEffective0730

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Which did nothing to humanize him at all, mind you.

 

I thought it made him a very sympathetic character. His personality was always brisk and to straightforward. He is the guy who gets to clean up the mess left behind by others, and they treat him like crap for it because he bothers with the bottom line. 

 

Personally, I find him infinitely more sympathetic than Anderscum or Hackett.


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#160
MassivelyEffective0730

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"I see no reason why oxygen deprivation would cause lasting damage to brain tissue"

"Humans can fall from space and survive the impact"

 

And not get completely incinerated by the atmosphere. But what do we know, David's a professor in so many studies of academia. He wrote the book on so many studies and topics. Whatever he says is, goes.


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#161
Iakus

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At least it was an attempt to make him a bit more human instead of a cardboard cutout villain.

 

I was actually starting to like him a little until he went full Anders during the coup.


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#162
I Tsunayoshi I

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I was actually starting to like him a little until he went full Anders during the coup.

 

Dont kid yourself. Anders did what he did because of the good he believed would come from it. Udina always wanted more power and its been noticeable from day 1 in ME.



#163
TheTurtle

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Dont kid yourself. Anders did what he did because of the good he believed would come from it. Udina always wanted more power and its been noticeable from day 1 in ME.


I'm pretty sure Anders did what he did for completely selfish reasons. After the bombing on a friendship path he admits that what he did only put the mages in danger.

Udina had a purpose sure it was slightly selfish, but all he ever wanted throughout the entire trilogy was for humanity to get the respect it deserves. Joining Cerberus was the only way he saw that happening and even though he's a dick his heart was in the right place.

Anyways screw Anders he was a whiny bitter asshat whose rage and angst corrupted a semi-decent spirit.

#164
I Tsunayoshi I

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I'm pretty sure Anders did what he did for completely selfish reasons. After the bombing on a friendship path he admits that what he did only put the mages in danger.

Udina had a purpose sure it was slightly selfish, but all he ever wanted throughout the entire trilogy was for humanity to get the respect it deserves. Joining Cerberus was the only way he saw that happening and even though he's a dick his heart was in the right place.

Anyways screw Anders he was a whiny bitter asshat whose rage and angst corrupted a semi-decent spirit.

 

I said believed for a reason. His tune changed after seeing the immediate results due to two of the major faction leaders being witnesses. Hard to put blame on either side about what he did to Justice though, sorta reinforces that only a special individual could become host to a spirit without ill effects. Shame Wynne is dead cause I would have REALLY loved to see the interaction between her and Anders.

 

That said, Udina never thought much of the other races and was always pursuing pro-human interests of any kind that looked remotely promising. With the Council being utterly unwilling to at least give the slightest bit of support, because apparently the only race worth saving is their own and no one elses, he was forced to take Cerberus' offer for aid in a coup. The thing is, his heart may have been in the right place, but he was stupid enough to misuse the power he could have gained out of that. The Codex on the Coup theorizes that he would have sent the Council Fleets to their doom on the same bloody logic the rest of the Council was using to not give aid to anyone else.



#165
Reorte

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Dont kid yourself. Anders did what he did because of the good he believed would come from it. Udina always wanted more power and its been noticeable from day 1 in ME.

Sure, Udina wanted power but there's nothing wrong with having a character who wants power and will play things for himself to reach a point where events are badly affecting him and he's not quite enough of a jerk to be 100% selfish under those circumstances. It's rather more believable than a complete sociopath. The Reaper invasion affected Udina.



#166
I Tsunayoshi I

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Sure, Udina wanted power but there's nothing wrong with having a character who wants power and will play things for himself to reach a point where events are badly affecting him and he's not quite enough of a jerk to be 100% selfish under those circumstances. It's rather more believable than a complete sociopath. The Reaper invasion affected Udina.

 

Well yeah. He got all the power he wanted because of the war and it meant nothing because no one gave a **** about any race but their own. His only way out was to make everyone bend to his will and the only way that would happen is if he had help from an outside organization.



#167
Iakus

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Well yeah. He got all the power he wanted because of the war and it meant nothing because no one gave a **** about any race but their own. His only way out was to make everyone bend to his will and the only way that would happen is if he had help from an outside organization.

 

Even after Shepard secures the aid of the turians and either the salarians or krogan (or both), as well as a boatload of other possible forces Shepard coud have acquired at this point?



#168
sH0tgUn jUliA

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Here's another way the Asari problem could have been written. On Thessia:

 

Shepard: How did you find out about this place?

 

The Illusive Man: From one of the Asari Matriarchs I was banging on a weekly basis. Or did you fail to ask your Shadow Broker about them?

 

Shepard: Liara?

 

Liara: He's right, Shepard, I put a big hint on the terminal on my ship. I figured you didn't think it was important.

 

The Illusive Man: So who's the dumb one here, Shepard?



#169
DeinonSlayer

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@Julia
Need a TIM trollface image to go with that post

rgvtc3.jpg

...close enough.
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#170
I Tsunayoshi I

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Even after Shepard secures the aid of the turians and either the salarians or krogan (or both), as well as a boatload of other possible forces Shepard coud have acquired at this point?

 

Considering that most people are pledging support to Shepard and working with Hackett, I dont think that Udina would have seen the aid that was coming in as anything useful to him since they were not going to do what he wanted when he wanted.



#171
Guest_Magick_*

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I finally worked up the nerve to do this journey through the trilogy since its been over a year and my memory is foggy. As I was going thru the wiki something came back to me. Back in ME1 with helping Sha'ira, the asari consort, if you are a jerk or show hostility to her she'll have sex with you?.....So my question is, was my Shepard raped!?!? Im not interested in sex with aliens no offense to anyone. But seriously was I raped? An how does being a jerk or a inconsiderate bastard get you sex? Am I missing something here?