94 réponses à ce sujet

[In Exile]

 

That's not fair and incorrect. The Messenger in his Batman role went around saving travelers, it just so happened that as a Darkspawn he inadvertently spread the taint as well in whatever way Darkspawn do. He never abducted people and brought them to other darkspawn to become Broodmothers. Contracting the taint can be lethal or turn you into a ghoul and merely being a female ghoul does not make you into a Broodmother, you must be force fed tainted meat by the Darkspawn.

 

 

It doesn't matter that he doesn't abduct them. Once someone is infected with the taint, they lose control over their will and are drawn, through the call of the old gods, to the Deep Roads and to the darkspawn. People go "willingly" once infected, and he's spreading that infection. 

 

If you carry a virulent disease and you refuse to be quarantined, you're responsible for the effects of spreading your illness. 

[Wolfen09]

of course by the time you learn of you spreading said illness you no longer care because you are a mindless drone by then

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Darkspawn must obey voice of old gods so they are kinda out of their mind in their "normal" state. They can't make decision of themselves so I'd say it's close to indoctrination from ME. They hear voice they must obey. When this voice is cut out from their brain they develop to be more intelligent and have personalities as well. I don't think they can be thought as  mindless monsters in this state. I don't see them as humans but more like race of humanoids since although they are physically really different they have similar mind as humans when voice of old gods doesn't affect them anymore. So I think they are definitely close to humans and other races.

 

I would actually love to free Darkspawn and watch how they develop from there. However I don't agree with Architects plan to change all other races with taint so they can interact with Darkspawn and kills huge percentage of population in the process. I don't think there will ever be safe way for Darkspawn to interact with other races since I doubt they can be freed from their taint. If there was peaceful solution for them and other races to exist they need to stay in Deep roads. Then I don't know how long they can survive without new broodmothers making new darkspawn. I don't also know what are their normal lifespan. If they don't have one would their race just slowly disappear from dying in violence and accidents.. or would some race be ready to give them women for broodmothers.. which would be morally really wrong.

From the sounds of things, Darkspawn are ageless which means they don't die by natural means. So they just have to be careful and avoid causing accidents or war and they should be fine. Kinda like the Geth in ME. 

[Ryzaki]

It doesn't matter that he doesn't abduct them. Once someone is infected with the taint, they lose control over their will and are drawn, through the call of the old gods, to the Deep Roads and to the darkspawn. People go "willingly" once infected, and he's spreading that infection. 

 

If you carry a virulent disease and you refuse to be quarantined, you're responsible for the effects of spreading your illness. 

 

Yeah it's why even my nicest of wardens kill them all. There's no choice. Their very existence is toxic to the other races of Thedas.

[KaiserShep]

I really don't believe in any peaceful solution for the darkspawn. They are quite literally a plague in Thedas, and it would only be a better place if they were eradicated, Old Gods or no. Even if each and every one of them got down on their knees and swore that they'd want to live in peace in the Deep Roads, I'd still say no and wipe them out.

[Panda]

From the sounds of things, Darkspawn are ageless which means they don't die by natural means. So they just have to be careful and avoid causing accidents or war and they should be fine. Kinda like the Geth in ME. 

 

That's good, they don't need broodmothers then to survive as race ^^

[Wolfen09]

That's good, they don't need broodmothers then to survive as race ^^

 

well, im pretty sure some get killed/crushed while digging for the old gods.... crawlers pick them off, ruck eats them, and according to the alphas description, they are not above killing eachother

[Panda]

well, im pretty sure some get killed/crushed while digging for the old gods.... crawlers pick them off, ruck eats them, and according to the alphas description, they are not above killing eachother

 

Naah they just need to be awakened and them learn how to work as civilization ^^ Then there is deep roads darkspawn kingdom with police forces and everything is fine.. until they want to go war with other races and conquer the world : )

[KaiserShep]

well, im pretty sure some get killed/crushed while digging for the old gods.... crawlers pick them off, ruck eats them, and according to the alphas description, they are not above killing eachother

 

And then there's the dwarves. They're always going to be pushing into the Deep Roads to try to reclaim the lost thaigs, so they're always going to battle darkspawn until either they or the darkspawn are wiped out for certain. On top of that, it's become a very powerful tradition for them. Even if the darkspawn population didn't overlap with theirs, the dwarves would just go out of their way to hunt them anyhow.

 

Of course, there's also the Wardens, who will always exist so long as the darkspawn do, or at least so long as it's possible to successfully get vials of their blood for the Joining.

[Wolfen09]

Naah they just need to be awakened and them learn how to work as civilization ^^ Then there is deep roads darkspawn kingdom with police forces and everything is fine.. until they want to go war with other races and conquer the world : )

 

a police force?  no firemen?

[Panda]

a police force?  no firemen?

 

I'm not sure if they need fire in Deep Roads, they can see in dark I think and I don't think they get cold either ^^

They might need medical deparment though. Idk how they heal from injuries though.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

And then there's the dwarves. They're always going to be pushing into the Deep Roads to try to reclaim the lost thaigs, so they're always going to battle darkspawn until either they or the darkspawn are wiped out for certain. On top of that, it's become a very powerful tradition for them. Even if the darkspawn population didn't overlap with theirs, the dwarves would just go out of their way to hunt them anyhow.

 

Of course, there's also the Wardens, who will always exist so long as the darkspawn do, or at least so long as it's possible to successfully get vials of their blood for the Joining.

Well then the Dwarves are even bigger jerks and idiots than they already are. And no, even if Orzammar fell, there is still the surface Dwarves and those of Kal Sharok. 

 

The Wardens can always do blood drives. I mean, the Architect took some of the Warden's blood but didn't have to kill them. Plus after the death of the last Archdemon, the Wardens wouldn't need the taint anymore. 

[DRTJR]

If the wardens wanted to make a serious dent in the Darkspawn numbers they'd collect a large force of elder wardens and march them from Orzammar to Kal-Sharok, and then onward into the abyss.

[KaiserShep]

The Wardens can always do blood drives. I mean, the Architect took some of the Warden's blood but didn't have to kill them. Plus after the death of the last Archdemon, the Wardens wouldn't need the taint anymore. 

 

Perhaps he could, but then Archie's dead in my playthrough

 

Anyway, if there's one thing I'm certain of, it's that people are very much inclined to assume the worst, and in a worst case scenario, there are more than just 7 Old Gods for the darkspawn to taint. The fact that it takes centuries for a new Blight to begin makes it difficult to determine when the Grey Warden order is no longer necessary.

 

If the wardens wanted to make a serious dent in the Darkspawn numbers they'd collect a large force of elder wardens and march them from Orzammar to Kal-Sharok, and then onward into the abyss.

 

If it was that simple, that probably would have happened already. It's apparent that there are plenty of ancient places beyond the knowledge of even the dwarves that extend for miles and miles. It's a horrible labyrinth of darkness and death. The only way to effectively destroy the darkspawn once and for all is to cut them off at their sources, then pick off what's left. Unless every broodmother is found and killed, there will always be more.

[sunnydxmen]

if it were possible i think something like that would have happen already.

[In Exile]

From the sounds of things, Darkspawn are ageless which means they don't die by natural means. So they just have to be careful and avoid causing accidents or war and they should be fine. Kinda like the Geth in ME. 

 

Except for the fact that simply existing together in large numbers poisons and mutates the land.  

[In Exile]

Well then the Dwarves are even bigger jerks and idiots than they already are. And no, even if Orzammar fell, there is still the surface Dwarves and those of Kal Sharok. 

 

The Wardens can always do blood drives. I mean, the Architect took some of the Warden's blood but didn't have to kill them. Plus after the death of the last Archdemon, the Wardens wouldn't need the taint anymore. 

 

The dwarves went through a horrible genocide. They won't just let that go. And play nice with the unstoppable host of rape abominations is a pretty hard sell at the best of times. Not to mention that as what the darkspawn did to Velana shows, they're not actually all that moral. So that's a big problem for co-existence. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Except for the fact that simply existing together in large numbers poisons and mutates the land.  

Did I ever say the Darkspawn should live with the other races? No. They'd live in an isolated state. The Grey Wardens can act as mediums if needed since they are immune to the taint. 

 

 

The dwarves went through a horrible genocide. They won't just let that go. And play nice with the unstoppable host of rape abominations is a pretty hard sell at the best of times. Not to mention that as what the darkspawn did to Velana shows, they're not actually all that moral. So that's a big problem for co-existence. 

By that logic, we should completely eradicate any nation even after peace is established. I mean, said nation once committed atrocities to ours. 

[General TSAR]

There is nothing remotely "normal" about Darkspawn, sentient or not. 

[KaiserShep]

By that logic, we should completely eradicate any nation even after peace is established. I mean, said nation once committed atrocities to ours.

The darkspawn aren't like a warring nation that decimates its enemies and conquer their lands. They are a parasitic life form that can only propagate through rape and torture. Even a conquering nation can eventually coexist peacefully and cultures can intermingle, but the same isn't true of the darkspawn. For over 1000 years they have been nothing but a pestilence, and their very presence spreads disease and death. The only reason to not bother eradicating them would be because they're too far out of reach in some deep crevice far from civilization, but a kill-on-sight policy is likely never going to go away and with good reason.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The darkspawn aren't like a warring nation that decimates its enemies and conquer their lands. They are a parasitic life form that can only propagate through rape and torture. For over 1000 years they have been nothing but a pestilence, and their very presence spreads disease and death. The only reason to not bother eradicating them would be because they're too far out of reach in some deep crevice far from civilization, but a kill-on-sight policy is likely never going to go away and with good reason.

 

They aren't parasitic. In fact, the opposite. They don't need us as sustenance at all. The Taint sustains them.

Also, there is no clear evidence that rape is involved in making Broodmothers. 

[KaiserShep]

So Hespith made it all up?

Broodmothers are corrupted humans, dwarves , elves and qunari. No one in the universe, save for the absolutely deranged, would agree to such a thing. This makes them parasitic.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Broodmothers are corrupted humans, dwarves , elves and qunari. No one in the universe, save for the absolutely deranged, would agree to such a thing. This makes them parasitic.

par·a·site  (păr′ə-sīt′)

n.

1. Biology An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

2.

a. One who habitually takes advantage of the generosity of others without making any useful return.

b. One who lives off and flatters the rich; a sycophant.

3. A professional dinner guest, especially in ancient Greece.

 

How does the Darkspawn/Broodmother relationship fit the definition?

 

 

[In Exile]

Did I ever say the Darkspawn should live with the other races? No. They'd live in an isolated state. The Grey Wardens can act as mediums if needed since they are immune to the taint. 

 

Their isolated state would become unlivable. That's the point. The darkspawn, by their very existence, are walking, talking biological weapons. They can't be anything other than that.

 

Not to mention that, again, the idea of a darkspawn state requires them to be pacifist to such a level that it would be comically utopian. They'd need to have a society that's completely violence free. Not just in terms of foreign wars, but murder. If the darkspawn have murders, their numbers go down. And that's ignoring accidents.

Which, again, leads them to require finding women to rape and mutate into broodmothers.

 

By that logic, we should completely eradicate any nation even after peace is established. I mean, said nation once committed atrocities to ours.

 

I'm not saying the dwarves are right. I'm saying that the dwarves won't just let things go because the darkspawn promise to play nice. IRL we have a lot of serious cycles of violence we can break because of these historical hatreds. Since dwarves are going to kill darkspawn, the darkspawn have a problem: slowly allow their numbers to decline over generation on a slow grind to extiction or reproduce. And their reproduction is just plan vile.

 

The other problem, like I said, is that darkspawn have shown to have large groups that aren't moral. So what's the response going to be when horrible rape abominations burn villages to kidnap women to mutate? Even if they were a sovereign state, their method of reproduction requires a declaration of war.

[In Exile]

 

par·a·site  (păr′ə-sīt′)

n.

1. Biology An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

2.

a. One who habitually takes advantage of the generosity of others without making any useful return.

b. One who lives off and flatters the rich; a sycophant.

3. A professional dinner guest, especially in ancient Greece.

 

How does the Darkspawn/Broodmother relationship fit the definition?

 

The bold and underlined definition. The darkspawn need the use of a foreign species that they mutate and kill to reproduce. It's like a wasp that has to lay its eggs inside a living host, except in our case the darkspawn need to physically abuse and alter that host to even get to the egg-laying stage.