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[Voragoras]

Oh trust me, I find any romantic scenes between Emma and Hook as cringeworthy. I'm like, "alright, get on with it so we can move on"

 

Rumple and Belle are far easier to accept.

 

They seem to be really pushing Captain Swan, though, which is unfortunate. And don't even get me started on the terribleness of Outlaw Queen and its "oh you killed my wife? it's ok I love you anyway lol" nonsense.

 

I actually sort of liked Rumple and Belle, because both of them were developed as characters, although Rumple obviously moreso than Belle, and the chemistry didn't feel as forced. You could see how she would like him, and why he would like her, whereas with Captain Swan, you either accept it or not. There's no real narrative reason for them to be into each other.

[LPPrince]

Aye. Rumple and Belle are a logical connection, and there's enough there that you can understand any trials and tribulations they have to go through down the line as a pair.

[Heimdall]

I guess they just feel like they need Emma to have a love interest so she can be emotionally conflicted about something besides Henry. Graham, I never got why they were even friends(Though I liked him), Neal... I think he actually worked the best because it supposed to be awkward, relationships with a woman you got jailed who happens to be the mother of the kid you never knew about are supposed to be awkward. Though it may have helped that they never fully pursued the romance arc that I remember.

Hook's just... The flirting was amusing when he was introduced, but it just doesn't... I don't even know how to describe it, none of it comes across as convincing and I find myself checking my email until the scene is over.

[Heimdall]

Aye. Rumple and Belle are a logical connection, and there's enough there that you can understand any trials and tribulations they have to go through down the line as a pair.

Well, Rumple's setting himself up for plenty of tribulations down the road

I think part of the reason Rumple and Belle work is because they were able to coopt the framework of Beauty and the Beast everyone knows and do something clever with it. Take Belle, whose whole thing is showing people they aren't the monster they appear to be, and replace her Beast with probably the most outwardly dark, but arguably the most complicated and layered character on the show. And it just worked

[Heimdall]

Damn cliffhangers...

[LPPrince]

Man, some people stay believing Anna and Elsa's parents were bad parents and I'm sitting here like, "You guys would screw that up SO hard doing it another way"

 

*shakes head*

 

But hey, backstory in this episode. That was nice. Also DAMN THAT WAS COLD. Like, literally cold. As in temperature wise.

[Heimdall]

Okay, I'll say it again, damn cliffhangers...

Spoiler

Well, we know Anna's still alive thanks to Bo Peep's staff so this freezing business is really nothing more than a clever gimmick to keep them from aging during those twenty eight or so years between then and now... I'm okay with that.

[LPPrince]

Okay, I'll say it again, damn cliffhangers...

Spoiler

Well, we know Anna's still alive thanks to Bo Peep's staff so this freezing business is really nothing more than a clever gimmick to keep them from aging during those twenty eight or so years between then and now... I'm okay with that.

 

Spoiler

Which means that The Hans is still alive. EARTHBOUND HAS REASON TO BE EXCITED

[Heimdall]

Heard someone say this season has the best narrative arc since season 1.  I actually think I agree with that statement, with the exception of Rumple's reversing characters development.  Thoughts?

[LPPrince]

I don't think its reversing so much as its proving that he's as chaotic as you know him to be. Be a bit boring if he wasn't.

[Heimdall]

I don't think its reversing so much as its proving that he's as chaotic as you know him to be. Be a bit boring if he wasn't.

I think what he said to Emma helped, but my problem with this plotline is that it came out of nowhere and after the way he's developed throughout the series it just feels incredibly abrupt and arbitrary that he'd show almost no conflict over the idea of killing Emma.  (And its still pretty unclear why he hasn't smote Ingrid by now, why did he trap her instead of doing that this episode?)

[LPPrince]

I think what he said to Emma helped, but my problem with this plotline is that it came out of nowhere and after the way he's developed throughout the series it just feels incredibly abrupt and arbitrary that he'd show almost no conflict over the idea of killing Emma.  (And its still pretty unclear why he hasn't smote Ingrid by now, why did he trap her instead of doing that this episode?)

 

Chaos rarely needs preparation.

[Heimdall]

Chaos rarely needs preparation.

Well, when you think about it he's usually more about meticulous long term planning than chaos.  His actions this season have seemed unusually reckless.

[LPPrince]

Well, when you think about it he's usually more about meticulous long term planning than chaos.  His actions this season have seemed unusually reckless.

 

Think long-term. Chaos doesn't have to be reactionary. It simply "is" what it is.

[Isichar]

I'm actually enjoying the 2nd half of season 3 more then I was expecting. Only got about 5 more episodes left. Well the witch may not be as good as some of the other villains she is still decent, imo largely thanks to the actress playing her.

I *really* wish the witch would stop using the word wicked though. It's painful because she'll be like: "I'm not evil.." And at that point I'm already groaning because the next cheesy line is painfully obvious "I'm wicked" this is right up there with characters that never shut up about getting their "happy endings" people don't talk like that in real life. The idea of a happy ending works in a story because the story needs to be able to wrap things up and deliver some emotional payoff which can be hard to do since people, like myself, become overly attached to characters. I've never heard someone claim they wanted a "happy ending" irl, like what does that even mean in the real world?

[LPPrince]

They're characters from fairytales brah, they're not used to our customs.

[Isichar]

They're characters from fairytales brah, they're not used to our customs.

Sorry but I don't buy it. The story jumps back and forth between that mentality and the "these are more then just fairy tales" mentality. Either treat the characters like they're real or don't.

[Isichar]

The thing is even in fairy tales characters don't speak like that. I've never actually heard someone say "I want my happy ending" in anything but this show. It's something the author says at the end of the story to wrap things up.

I'm pretty sure there has never been a character even within Disneys own works that has actually said that. IMO it only works when the narrator uses it.

[metatheurgist]

The characters are in the meta situation of knowing they are fairy tale characters. They've seen the book of their lives. If all they knew was the life they had in the Enchanted Forest they'd probably reference it less. And I have heard RL people ask for "Happy Endings" and not just the dirty kind.

[Isichar]

The characters are in the meta situation of knowing they are fairy tale characters. They've seen the book of their lives. If all they knew was the life they had in the Enchanted Forest they'd probably reference it less. And I have heard RL people ask for "Happy Endings" and not just the dirty kind.

Actually they've used it in flashbacks before they got brought over, and before they could have known so I don't think the "they're just self aware" excuse quite works here, but even if it did I'd still feel it gets used a bit too much.

I'd be curious to know what context people said that in because I couldn't see someone using it in any other way but as a joke (again, can't really think of any other piece of work, fairy tale or otherwise off the top of my head that has actually used that phrasing either in any other form but a narrative pov) but eh, not a big deal, just a minor thing I feel they could cut down on. Doesn't really have any strong impact on my opinion of the show one way or another.

[metatheurgist]

Usually in the aftermath of a bad breakup. Tends to be paired with Prince Charming too. People who are happy tend not to use that phrase in my experience.

[Isichar]

I can't deny that there probably are people out there that do use it. I certainly don't think I've ever met one. I've definitely heard prince charming many, many times before though *shrugs*

 

It's odd how the show can at one moment be laying the cheese on pretty thickly (the good will prevail, just cause...  kind) and then the next have those really good moments and lines that are actually pretty well thought out, and feel like good life advice which at times have managed to catch me off-guard. That's why I like the "villains" a bit more in this show. They're always big players in the story that seem to feel a bit more even balanced as characters, and they're noticeably less cheesier, Emma is mostly good as well.

[metatheurgist]

Villains have always seemed cooler. That's part of the trap. (See above post about bad breakups)

[Isichar]

Not cooler, more human and less "things will work out just cause..." Crap speeches like the ones Snow and Charming dish out on a near episode bases.

The villains are not bad people, they've just made bad choices and they're more prone to having to deal with that. But then you got times like when Charming lied to Snow about her having this magic sword that can defeat Regina, putting her life at risk but they are allowed to walk away without consequences because faith > magic. It's not just lame, it's painfully stupid and idealistic.

I honestly consider those two to be some of the worst characters I've seen in fiction in quite a while.

[Isichar]

S3 E19

 

Spoiler

What do you know.. Charming gets to live despite having his heart ripped out and crushed because FAITH and BELIEF. How surprising