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[The Night Haunter]

That's wrong, actually. There was a lot of diversity in a number of cosmopolitan cities in that period. Europe was boil on the ass of human civilization for a long time so people didn't go there all that often, but developed socities were quite cosmopolitan in the middle east and asia. 

If what you mean is East asian people of varying ethnicities travelled to China (I don't know what the capital was 1k years ago) or various Indian ethnicities lived in Vijayanagara then sure. If what you mean is Europeans lived in China or India, then I don't agree. In the 1200-1500's there was little travel beyond trade between nations of any great distance from each other. The largest group of Europeans outside Europe was as part of the Ottoman Empire as remnants of failed crusades and settlers, or as citizens of Byzantine cities conquered by the Ottomans.

In Europe itself it was rare to even get a Russian living in a German city. If you travel a few nations over then the only residents you might see are embassies or royal representatives. Traders would be common enough, but they would come and go, not stay.

[The Night Haunter]

Thedas aint Medieval Europe, you should stop comparing it, it bears no relevance to DA

Actually since Thedas is based off medieval Europe it has quite a bit of relevance. Plus it is the closest the real world was to Thedas, and thus provides our only reference.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Actually since Thedas is based off medieval Europe it has quite a bit of relevance. Plus it is the closest the real world was to Thedas, and thus provides our only reference.

No, the nations in Thedas are based off the cultures in Medieval Europe. Not the same as saying the whole continent is based off of it. There are black people despite there being no Africa equivalent, so why not Asians? 

[Nefla]

Actually since Thedas is based off medieval Europe it has quite a bit of relevance. Plus it is the closest the real world was to Thedas, and thus provides our only reference.

In Medieval Europe the penalty for homosexuality was death, women were property, people **** in the street, people regularly died before the age of 30 because of filthy living conditions and disease, people were stinky, unbathed, had hairy legs and armpits (yes, women too) no one had the perfect hair, skin, and teeth that every DA character has, there was no magic, dragons, elves, Qunari, etc...I think it's safe to say that we've moved well beyond the "medieval Europe" parallel. Why do people only use it as a guideline for things they don't want in the game? "I don't want toothless, hairy women so that can be modern, but I don't want Asians in the game because medieval Europe."

[Lebanese Dude]

I'm Asian, Caucasian, Middle Eastern, Mediterranean, Levantine, and semi-Arab.

I demand the above in DAI.

[efd731]

I'm Irish(via heritage) i demand to have irish accented slaves/servants and orlesian nobility making jokes about our desire for potatoes!!
(irishman's dilemma, do you eat the potato or wait for it to ferment so you can drink it?)

[The Night Haunter]

In Medieval Europe the penalty for homosexuality was death, women were property, people **** in the street, people regularly died before the age of 30 because of filthy living conditions and disease, people were stinky, unbathed, had hairy legs and armpits (yes, women too) no one had the perfect hair, skin, and teeth that every DA character has, there was no magic, dragons, elves, Qunari, etc...I think it's safe to say that we've moved well beyond the "medieval Europe" parallel. Why do people only use it as a guideline for things they don't want in the game? "I don't want toothless, hairy women so that can be modern, but I don't want Asians in the game because medieval Europe."

You're being silly. All I said was Europe was the base they started from. Obviously they start from Europe and expanded. I am not saying everything should match medieval times, I am saying we can draw some conclusions about Thedas based on real world equivalents, unless given information that contradicts it.

But thanks for showing how to make a silly over the top argument that has nothing to do with what I said.

 

And I am not, and never have, argued against Asians in Thedas. I argued against arbitrarily Asian people in Thedas. If they include people who appear to be Asian then they should include a reference to the nation/culture from which they come, so they don't appear out of the blue. Like darker skinned individuals seem to be of Rivaini or Antivan descent (or from some Islands mentioned in WoT). I would be more than happy to interact with individuals matching our version of Asian characteristics so long as there is some back story as to why they appear different (like coming from a different nation).

[The Night Haunter]

No, the nations in Thedas are based off the cultures in Medieval Europe. Not the same as saying the whole continent is based off of it. There are black people despite there being no Africa equivalent, so why not Asians? 

Not saying no Asians, saying no Asians without some type of back story. Darker skinned individuals had a post from Gaider and an entry in WoT about them coming from Islands off the coast of Rivain. They make sense in Thedas because they have a backstory. If Bioware adds a backstory for Asians I would be more than happy to interact with them in the game.

 

My comment only meant we can draw certain conclusions about Thedas by looking at the cultures (and world) from which the basis of Theodosian cultures were drawn. 

[Nefla]

You're being silly. All I said was Europe was the base they started from. Obviously they start from Europe and expanded. I am not saying everything should match medieval times, I am saying we can draw some conclusions about Thedas based on real world equivalents, unless given information that contradicts it.

But thanks for showing how to make a silly over the top argument that has nothing to do with what I said.

 

And I am not, and never have, argued against Asians in Thedas. I argued against arbitrarily Asian people in Thedas. If they include people who appear to be Asian then they should include a reference to the nation/culture from which they come, so they don't appear out of the blue. Like darker skinned individuals seem to be of Rivaini or Antivan descent (or from some Islands mentioned in WoT). I would be more than happy to interact with individuals matching our version of Asian characteristics so long as there is some back story as to why they appear different (like coming from a different nation).

And I'm saying if you use "because ___ wasn't in medieval Europe" as your argument, you can't just pick and choose which things you want to conform to that based on your own tastes.

 

So if they threw in a line in a codex entry that said "___ people are the equivalent of East Asians and come from the jungle" that's all it would take to satisfy you? Why is this necessary, especially if it's not shown in the game? Why does the fact that Orlesians speak with hammy French accents but don't speak French (or any other language that we've seen) and this is never explained, why is this ok but someone who looks Asian needs an explanation for being there. Why did BioWare make (ugly) Asian presets for DA2 which included an Asian Gamlen, Leandra, Bethany, and Carver without explanation? Why was this ok? 

 

I really hate when fantasy worlds always default to white as normal, and any black, Asian, middle eastern, etc...looking people are "from a strange and far off land" and rather than being normal and the same as the default white guys they're "exotic" and require an explanation for being there. I hate that it can never just be "some relatives of mine moved here generations ago and I was born" but always has to be "I am a spice trader/mercenary/elephant trainer/whatever from the mysterious East, your ways are strange to me."

[The Night Haunter]

And I'm saying if you use "because ___ wasn't in medieval Europe" as your argument, you can't just pick and choose which things you want to conform to that based on your own tastes.

 

So if they threw in a line in a codex entry that said "___ people are the equivalent of East Asians and come from the jungle" that's all it would take to satisfy you?

I never used 'because ___ wasn't in medieval Europe'. All I said was Europe was the base upon which The DA Setting was built.

 

And yes. If they threw in a codex that said "The People of Nation X were markedly different than other Theodosians with their shorter stature and unique facial features. Many scholars believe Nation X to be the original inhabitants of the area, having lived here before the mass migration in the year -10k." then I would indeed be satisfied. As long as the world remains consistent with itself and doesn't introduce random anomalies with no context then I am happy.

[Nefla]

I never used 'because ___ wasn't in medieval Europe'. All I said was Europe was the base upon which The DA Setting was built.

 

And yes. If they threw in a codex that said "The People of Nation X were markedly different than other Theodosians with their shorter stature and unique facial features. Many scholars believe Nation X to be the original inhabitants of the area, having lived here before the mass migration in the year -10k." then I would indeed be satisfied. As long as the world remains consistent with itself and doesn't introduce random anomalies with no context then I am happy.

So no change is shown in the world, no characters explain this in the game, but as long as someone makes a footnote somewhere you're happy? Why couldn't you just imagine some back story like that? It would have the same effect: none.

[The Night Haunter]

So no change is shown in the world, no characters explain this in the game, but as long as someone makes a footnote somewhere you're happy? Why couldn't you just imagine some back story like that? It would have the same effect: none.

Because a writer making the note = official reasoning. Maybe some character could reference it, but why would they? If you are introduced to a new coworker who is African-American no-one says, "Oh and his ancestor's came from Africa, that's why he has a different skin tone." People just know that (except awkward kids lol). In DA2 no-one asked why Isabella was dark skinned, and I doubt anyone will ask Vivienne why she is ebony colored. Codex entries in DAO and DA2 told us that people from Antiva and Rivain were darker skinned and WoT told us even darker skinned individuals came from islands. That is all that is needed in order to keep the universe consistent with itself.

 

As for why I can't 'invent' a backstory, why should I have to? I doubt genetics work differently in Thedas than here. People of different ethnicities come from different parts of the world, their environment effected the long term physical developments of the peoples in those regions. I don't see why Thedas would be different in this, rather minor, aspect.

 

If Asian people just show up I'm not gonna throw a hissy fit. I might be mildly dissappointed if there is no context (like telling us Isabel came from Rivain), but it is hardly world shattering.

[javeart]

(...) Codex entries in DAO and DA2 told us that people from Antiva and Rivain were darker skinned (...) 

 

I'm personally curious about this, where does it say so?

[Nefla]

I'm personally curious about this, where does it say so?

"The Rivaini have skin tones ranging from dark tan to ebony"

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Rivain

 

It doesn't actually say they're black though. Many races can have dark skintones, including Asians.

[Boss Fog]

Because a writer making the note = official reasoning. Maybe some character could reference it, but why would they? If you are introduced to a new coworker who is African-American no-one says, "Oh and his ancestor's came from Africa, that's why he has a different skin tone." People just know that (except awkward kids lol). In DA2 no-one asked why Isabella was dark skinned, and I doubt anyone will ask Vivienne why she is ebony colored. Codex entries in DAO and DA2 told us that people from Antiva and Rivain were darker skinned and WoT told us even darker skinned individuals came from islands. That is all that is needed in order to keep the universe consistent with itself.

 

As for why I can't 'invent' a backstory, why should I have to? I doubt genetics work differently in Thedas than here. People of different ethnicities come from different parts of the world, their environment effected the long term physical developments of the peoples in those regions. I don't see why Thedas would be different in this, rather minor, aspect.

 

If Asian people just show up I'm not gonna throw a hissy fit. I might be mildly dissappointed if there is no context (like telling us Isabel came from Rivain), but it is hardly world shattering.

 

Especially since we have comments from characters in the game world about people's "looks" and "nationalities."  A perfect example is the first time Isabela meets Hawke; she says, "you're Ferelden aren't you?  You have that look about you."  

 

The developers created this world this way on purpose.  Saying the people of Dragon Age shouldn't have to have explanations of where they are from or what ethnicity they are is simply a preference for the mentality to simply not exist in the first place.  Too bad, because this is the world Bioware has created and that mentality simply does exist.

[Mihura]

Especially since we have comments from characters in the game world about people's "looks" and "nationalities."  A perfect example is the first time Isabela meets Hawke; she says, "you're Ferelden aren't you?  You have that look about you."  

 

The developers created this world this way on purpose.  Saying the people of Dragon Age shouldn't have to have explanations of where they are from or what ethnicity they are is simply a preference for the mentality to simply not exist in the first place.  Too bad, because this is the world Bioware has created and that mentality simply does exist.

 

She says that to any character you created, with any features. How does she know I am this or that If a look way more different that the average, for example.

The concepts of white, black and asian are to center on a north-american mentality. In Europe since even before being know as Europe people come from all over the place. They were never white as people like to think, a lot of Europe's populations comes from indo-european migrations and so on.

[TheWhitefire]

I'll turn this question into something that'll be easier to answer -- can you name some examples of Orlesian characters that aren't just crude caricatures with thick accents? There's Leliana who benefits from extra exposure as player's companion, but other than that?

 

The Divine Justinian, Empress Celene, Regalyan, most of the nobility attending Duke Prosper's party aside from the Duke himself, Liselle the shop keeper, Ser Michel, Briala, Gaspard... should I go on?

[Boss Fog]

She says that to any character you created, with any features. How does she know I am this or that If a look way more different that the average, for example.

The concepts of white, black and asian are to center on a north-american mentality. In Europe since even before being know as Europe people come from all over the place. They were never white as people like to think, a lot of Europe's populations comes from indo-european migrations and so on.

You're getting the fact that Bioware likes to let players make their characters look however the hell they want mixed up with the fact that Hawke is supposed to look a certain way.  It's pretty obvious that comment was meant for a default Hawke seeing as how the game doesn't recognize when you make your Hawke look like they could be from Rivain or Antiva.

[Mihura]

You're getting the fact that Bioware likes to let players make their characters look however the hell they want mixed up with the fact that Hawke is supposed to look a certain way.  It's pretty obvious that comment was meant for a default Hawke seeing as how the game doesn't recognize when you make your Hawke look like they could be from Rivain or Antiva.

 

Hum no, there are fereldens with different pigmentations and features in the game and if the game is base on Europe, than the majority is not even "white".

[Boss Fog]

Hawkes supposed to look however the player feels he/she should look, how he/she looks dont stop the fact there Ferelden, being Ferelden aint a skin color

Again, another case of mistaking player agency for default appearances (which the game recognizes despite a customized appearence).  Why would Isabela say Hawke "looks Ferelden" if I purposely made him to look Antivan?

[Mihura]

Again, another case of mistaking player agency for default appearances (which the game recognizes despite a customized appearence).  Why would Isabela say Hawke "looks Ferelden" if I purposely made him to look Antivan?

 

And how does the Antivan look?