709 réponses à ce sujet

[Steelcan]

I'd be happy if the CC had it so my darker characters didn't look...bleh. Seeing Vivienne I have high hopes.
 
At least SWTOR got that right.

Don't encourage them to look at TOR >_>

[Ryzaki]

Don't encourage them to look at TOR >_>

 

The CC isn't that bad though! If nothing else XD

 

(though I hate how there's only 2 decent eye sets. Why is that almost always the case. You get 2 decent eyes then everything else sucks >_> )

[addiction21]

 if there are Asian NPCs provide an explanation for their origins like there is with the other races.

 

But that is the argument going on. A new ethnicity that has not been present in the previous games, novels or comics should have a reason for showing up.

 

And they do not need to adhere to any stereotypes. Like all Asians are Samurais or whatever else Nefla has said.

[addiction21]

The CC isn't that bad though! If nothing else XD

 

(though I hate how there's only 2 decent eye sets. Why is that almost always the case. You get 2 decent eyes then everything else sucks >_> )

 

Have you ever considered that there are only a few eyes you prefer?

[Nefla]

I'd be happy if the CC had it so my darker characters didn't look...bleh. Seeing Vivienne I have high hopes.

 

At least SWTOR got that right.

I'm crossing my fingers! Jacob looked awesome in ME2 but my poor femshep looked like she sprayed herself with spraypaint. Her skin was like one flat, dull expanse.

[Ryzaki]

Have you ever considered that there are only a few eyes you prefer?

 

but there was only like 8 eye options.

 

 

I'm crossing my fingers! Jacob looked awesome in ME2 but my poor femshep looked like she sprayed herself with spraypaint. Her skin was like one flat, dull expanse.

 

Yeah Jacob didn't look bad at all.

 

Suckage let's hope we can make our lovely dark ladies in DAI.

[Steelcan]

Yeah but Jacob was Jacob


The guy dumps you, runs off, knocks up his girlfriend, after dealing with his father who abandoned him

[Nefla]

Yeah but Jacob was Jacob


The guy dumps you, runs off, knocks up his girlfriend, after dealing with his father who abandoned him

He lured us in with his luscious skin T_T If he had been spraypainted like femshep we would have known he was bad news!

 

I totally wanted the option in ME3 to tell him "I had your baby in prison you deadbeat bastard!" XD

[Ryzaki]

Yeah but Jacob was Jacob


The guy dumps you, runs off, knocks up his girlfriend, after dealing with his father who abandoned him

 

True.

 

Hey I played a dude. He didn't do that to me

 

And yeah I love how his LM seems to have gone completely over his head. *sigh*

 

He lured us in with his luscious skin T_T If he had been spraypainted like femshep we would have known he was bad news!

 

I totally wanted the option in ME3 to tell him "I had your baby in prison you deadbeat bastard!" XD

 

XD I wasn't fond of his face though I admit.

 

I half expected Brynn to pull out a "He's my man now ******." line with a fingersnap and everything with the other cerberus people going "Jerry Jerry!" in the background.
 

[Steelcan]

This is why we play MaleShep and romance Miranda

[Afro_Explosion]

Me3 had way better skin a lot less melted plastic sprayed orange.

[Ryzaki]

This is why we play MaleShep and romance Miranda

 

I romanced her in ME2 but then I realized dumping her in ME3 got her killed D: thankfully there's gibbed.

 

ME3's skin was good (still mad they completely ruined Guardian's face and I don't like ME3 enough to spend the hours fixing it).

 

Edit: Though I really didn't like the texture and I didn't attempt to make a darker Shep so I'm not sure how it looks there.

[Han Shot First]

How is this bizzare theory crafting any better than just having a cosmopolitan society of humans to start with?

 

I would expect Thedas to mirror our own world, with people looking the way they do because their ancestors adapted to the climate they originally lived in.

 

Also if Thedas was populated by a diverse set of peoples who weren't seperated by tribal borders, over the millenia any physical differences between those peoples should have lessened or even vanished. It just doesn't make sense to have the Orlesians for example, range from European to Asian to African in appearance, and have that just be the way its always been. If Orlais was originally settled by many diverse peoples with a broad range of skin tones, those peoples should have mixed over the millenia to the point that the 'modern' Orlesian would have inherited features from all those diverse groups. In short, they should probably look biracial or multiracial rather than white, black, or Asian. I'd expect the Orlesians in that case, to look more like the Rivaini than the people of Ferelden.

 

That isn't to say that there should be some sort of in depth population history in the lore. Just that it makes more sense to have an Asian character come from a new culture, or old one like the Fex that there isn't much lore on, then to roll out an Orlesian knight descended from a long line of Orlesian knights, who just happens to look Korean for whatever reason.

 

Also, and most importantly from my point of view, is that the Orlesian knight that looks Korean would be boring. He'd be completely identical to every other Orlesian knight in every way except appearance. It just seems that if you are going to create an Asian character, giving him a background identical to every white Orlesian knight would be a missed opportunity to expand the world and the lore.

 

I'm also not quite sure why people are opposed to going that route. Was Skyrim racist for having the Nords be all pasty-white blondes and gingers, while the Reguards are dark-skinned and have African features? What about A Song of Ice And Fire, where the First Men and Andals have a European appearance, the Dothraki resemble Mongols or Huns, and the Summer Islanders are black?

[caradoc2000]

I misread the title as "More Aslans in Thedas", and thought:

there are witches and wardrobes in Thedas, but I haven't seen any lions. Guess I do need new glasses.

 

On topic:

Diversity is good, but only when done well, most DA2 elves (yes I am looking at you, the one next to the Qunari compound) were

[DooomCookie]

I don't really care about the ethnicities of Thedas, but I think it is important Bioware supports Mongoloid facial features in the CC, for people who want to create themselves in-game.  Especially since they've now made such a massive improvement in displaying Negroid features.  (Vivienne looks AMAZING.)

 

Personally, I'd put it well above implementing long, flowing hair as so many people are obsessed with, for a variety of reasons.

[Mockingword]

Real people have a "identity" and it consists of more then the color of their skin and hair, the shape of their eyes, or facial features.

 

And that's what I see here. Some people asking that they should be given more consideration then tossing them in the game for diversity for the sake of diversity.

I see people making excuses for why diversity shouldn't happen. Because that's what's actually going on here.

 

What "real people" do or do not have is totally irrelevant, because Thedas is not the real world, and there are no "real" people in it. "Real people" live in mingled societies, and have done for ages. Many people who may have "Asian" features grew up outside of Asia, have never spent any time in Asia, and don't particularly "identify" with Asian culture.

 

People insist on rejecting the concept of "diversty in Thedas" completely out of hand, because they see parallels to "real history" that aren't actually there, and they insist that Thedas has to reflect that, as if human culture can only develop on a straight line. As if there aren't infinite paths that the development of human civilization could have taken (and has taken, because European history is not the world's history). 

 

But Thedas doesn't reflect real history, and it never can. It is a creation of the contemporary era, and as such, it reflects not on the past, but on the present.

 

What the people who are asking for "more consideration" of the issue are actually saying is "I can accept the existence of elves, dwarves and dragons without issue, but people of colour need special permission to exist in my fantasy media".

[Han Shot First]

 

What the people who are asking for "more consideration" of the issue are actually saying is "I can accept the existence of elves, dwarves and dragons without issue, but people of colour need special permission to exist in my fantasy media".

 

Not everyone who prefers that Thedas mirror our own world in some ways is against a diverse cast of characters. I would love to see a more diverse cast in the next Dragon Age game. I just would rather there was some rhyme and reason to it. And I'd rather see the borders of the known world in the DA setting be pushed back father.

[Mockingword]

Not everyone who prefers that Thedas mirror our own world in some ways is against a diverse cast of characters. I would love to see a more diverse cast in the next Dragon Age game. I just would rather there was some rhyme and reason to it. And I'd rather see the borders of the known world in the DA setting be pushed back father.

The fact that you feel this method would "mirror our own world" just demonstrates how very little you know about it, which was kind of my point.

 

The different cultures and ethnicities in "the real world" have been interacting with each other since before recorded history.

 

Besides which, it's established in the lore of Thedas that all the humans initially came from elsewhere. There's literally no reason why Asian-looking people could not have been mixed in with that initial migration, and it makes even less sense that the dark-skinned people would mostly sequester themselves in one area (Rivain) and let whitey crawl all over the rest of the continent.

[Cainhurst Crow]

But that is the argument going on. A new ethnicity that has not been present in the previous games, novels or comics should have a reason for showing up.
 
And they do not need to adhere to any stereotypes. Like all Asians are Samurais or whatever else Nefla has said.

That's another question though, why do the theoretical asian analogues have to be japanese? Why not korean? Or vietanese? Or mongolian? Or indian? Heck, why not tibetian or chinese? Why is it only japanese who get represented?

It doesn't need to be a new country anyway. Anderfels, Kal-sharock, whatever that third country was, even par vollen itself, could all have asian people in them. That'd be ideal if they are looking to add a new racial analouge into the game and don't want to invent a new country at all.

[Han Shot First]

The fact that you feel this method would "mirror our own world" just demonstrates how very little you know about it, which was kind of my point.

 

The different cultures and ethnicities in "the real world" have been interacting with each other since before recorded history.

 

Besides which, it's established in the lore of Thedas that all the humans initially came from elsewhere. There's literally no reason why Asian-looking people could not have been mixed in with that initial migration, and it makes even less sense that the dark-skinned people would mostly sequester themselves in one area (Rivain) and let whitey crawl all over the rest of the continent.

 

Nope.

 

If you had a diverse group of people migrate into this virgin continent and intermingle, rather than having separate tribal or cultural borders, what you'd end up with after several centuries is a multiracial or multiethnic people.

 

Lets use the United Kingdom as an example. Originally it is settled by pre-Celtic peoples during the Stone Age, whose languages are now lost to us. Eventually during the Iron Age Celts bring their languages and culture to the Britain. Then the Romans came. Then the Angles, Saxons, and Jutles. Later the Vikings and Normans. With each new wave of invader or immigrant the previous cultures did not vanish into thin air. They passed their genes on to the next generation, just as the new arrivals did. And they intermixed. They've all left a genetic footprint in Britain to varying degrees. (the Romans less than the others) Now granted, with the exception of some of the Romans they all might have been Europeans..but you get the idea.

 

If Orlais was settled by three different tribes, one who looked European, one who looked African, and one who looked Asian, and these seperate groups merged into a single tribal or national entity...over the millenia you would not have these physical differences. Those populations would have merged and mixed just as those Britons and Saxons and Normans did, and the 'modern' Orlesians would have physical characteristics of all three of those groups. 

 

So its not very realistic to have a diverse nation that remains diverse for thousands of years, unless its getting a steady stream of immigration from elsewhere. Without new arrivals the physical characteristics that originally made that population diverse will gradually vanish as assimilation takes place.

 

On that note, if you are going to add in an Asian character it just makes more sense that have that character, or his or her recent ancestors, come from elsewhere. It also has the added bonus of expanding the map and the lore.

[Cainhurst Crow]

-snip-

I agree. But I would also like to point out that regional isolation, a phenomena common in our world in a lot of "pre-industry" countries, has a profound effect of sparking different forms of physical traits, features, and of course cultures and identities. Its entirely possible that the humans who first arrived at thedas could have all been the same. But then, over a period of thousands to perhaps even hundreds of years, given that it was before tevinter began recording its history and so it could have been tens of thousands to even hundreds of thousands of years ago, people settling in other regions of thedas could have developed in rapidly different ways, physically, mentally, and of course socially.

Personally, I don't buy the sudden arrival story. I think there are too many holes and while some in game theorist believe humans migrated south from par vollen, I suspect a much different and darker origin.

Regardless, It doesn't make sense for orlais to have this tri-divided racial dynamic with the groups in question looking so wildly different from one another. Usually in situations like this, the difference isn't physical but cultural, or its over a minor trait. Scottish, Irish, Welsh, and English, are an example, but their divide is much more regional and cultural than about physical characteristics, for which they share much more similarities then differences. To have a dark pigment, light pigment, and off color pigment section, be so divided in appearance but not in any other aspect at all, to the point they identify each other as being one united identity of "Orlesian" and not some nitpicky difference like "Northern Orlais, Southern Orlais, and Central Orlais" makes that theory pretty much fly out the window in my book.

One thing in particular though I agree with,

On that note, if you are going to add in an Asian character it just makes more sense that have that character, or his or her recent ancestors, come from elsewhere. It also has the added bonus of expanding the map and the lore.

Everyone wins in this scenario, so I don't get what all the resistance to it is about.

[Mockingword]

Nope.

 

If you had a diverse group of people migrate into this virgin continent and intermingle, rather than having separate tribal or cultural borders, what you'd end up with after several centuries is a multiracial or multiethnic people.

 

Lets use the United Kingdom as an example. Originally it is settled by pre-Celtic peoples during the Stone Age, whose languages are now lost to us. Eventually during the Iron Age Celts bring their languages and culture to the Britain. Then the Romans came. Then the Angles, Saxons, and Jutles. Later the Vikings and Normans. With each new wave of invader or immigrant the previous cultures did not vanish into thin air. They passed their genes on to the next generation, just as the new arrivals did. And they intermixed. They've all left a genetic footprint in Britain to varying degrees. (the Romans less than the others) Now granted, with the exception of some of the Romans they all might have been Europeans..but you get the idea.

 

If Orlais was settled by three different tribes, one who looked European, one who looked African, and one who looked Asian, and these seperate groups merged into a single tribal or national entity...over the millenia you would not have these physical differences. Those populations would have merged and mixed just as those Britons and Saxons and Normans did, and the 'modern' Orlesians would have physical characteristics of all three of those groups. 

 

So its not very realistic to have a diverse nation that remains diverse for thousands of years, unless its getting a steady stream of immigration from elsewhere. Without new arrivals the physical characteristics that originally made that population diverse will gradually vanish as assimilation takes place.

 

On that note, if you are going to add in an Asian character it just makes more sense that have that character, or his or her recent ancestors, come from elsewhere. It also has the added bonus of expanding the map and the lore.

This is all completely and utterly irrelevant, because we are talking about a universe full of magic and dragons.

[Mockingword]

Everyone wins in this scenario, so I don't get what all the resistance to it is about.

No, actually. In this scenario, people that want to see Asian representation are left hanging forever, for something that might never come. And if it ever does, then Asian players have to deal with (most likely) being presented as some sort of monolithic, threatening, alien "other" that they can't actually identify with.

 

"Minorities" have waited long enough to see fair and equitable representation in media. They should never have been made to wait in the first place. Multi-ethnic representation is something that all media should have always been doing. Waiting several more years for BioWare to maybe correct their thoughtlessness with a Dragon Age IV is not an acceptable compromise.

[Cainhurst Crow]

This is all completely and utterly irrelevant, because we are talking about a universe full of magic and dragons.

What does magic and dragons have to do with human evolution? We can travel to the moon in a spaceship, does that mean humans can give birth to chimpanzees?

Just because something fantastical exists in the universe, doesn't negate the existence of common sense, nor decades of proven evolutionary and behavioral science.

[Ryzaki]

What does magic and dragons have to do with human evolution?

 

So you know for sure Thedas humans evolved the way Earth humans did?