36 réponses à ce sujet

[congokong]

If you refuse, romance or not, she suggests the other male (even Loghain). Of course unless you're some cuckold I don't know why you'd be alright with that when romancing her.

[TheMadHarridan]

I have a screenshot that I think perfectly captures Morrigan's feelings about doing the Dark Ritual with anyone other than the Warden.

 

[Jeffonl1]

I have a screenshot that I think perfectly captures Morrigan's feelings about doing the Dark Ritual with anyone other than the Warden.
 

Excellent!

[Meldread]

Alright, I've finally gotten to the point of the Dark Ritual.  It is successful.  You -CAN- romance Morrigan -AND- have her sleep with Alistair without any negative consequences.  Here is the entire conversation between Morrigan and my Warden.

 

========================================

Morrigan:  Do not be alarmed.  It is only I. 

 

Warden:  I am not alarmed.  I'm glad to see you.

 

Morrigan:  I did not come here to speak of sentimental things.  I came here to speak with you.  I have a plan, you see.  A way out.  The loop in your hole.

 

Warden:  I have no intention of sacrificing myself.

 

Morrigan:  And can you guarantee that another will survive the battle that is to come?  That they will be there to take that blow?  No, you cannot.  So your choices are then to flee as a coward or face the possibility that you may die.  I offer you another alternative.  A ritual... performed on the eve of battle, in the dark of night.

 

Warden:  Just what sort of ritual is this?

 

Morrigan:  It is old magic, from a time before the Circle of Magi was created.  Some would call it blood magic, but I think that means little to one like you.

 

Warden:  Nothing comes without a price.

 

Morrigan:  Perhaps.  But that price need not be so unbearable, especially if there is much to be gained.  All I ask is that you listen to what I have to offer, nothing more.

 

Warden:  Very well.  What is your plan?

 

Morrigan:  What I propose is this:  lay with me.  Here, tonight.  And from our joining a child will be conceived.  The child will bear the taint, and when the archdemon is slain, its essence will seek the child like a beacon.  At this early stage, the child can absorb that essence and not perish.  The archdemon is still destroyed, with no Grey Warden dying in the process.

 

Warden:  So the child becomes a darkspawn?

 

Morrigan:  Not at all.  It will become something different:  a child born with the soul of an Old God.  After this is done, you will allow me to walk away... and you do not follow.  Ever.  The child will be mine to raise as I wish.

 

Warden:  How do you even know this will work? 

 

Morrigan:  This is what my mother intended when she sent me with you.  She was the one who first gave me this ritual and told me of what I was meant to do.  This does not surprise you, does it?  Did you not wonder why Flemeth saved your life, why she aided you?  This is why.  What is important is that I am offering this to you now.  It will work and it will save your life.

 

Warden:  Is this why you've been so... friendly to me?

 

Morrigan:  Caring for you as I've come to... that was not part of the plan.  But I cannot let what I feel interfere with what i must do.  This is important to me.  The fact that I may save your life makes me all the more determined to see it done.  Please do not... cloud the issue.  If you feel anything for me, then accept that it will make what we must do... that much easier.

 

Warden:  Wait... I want to know more about this child.

 

Morrigan:  As you wish.

 

Warden:  The child won't be hurt, will it?

 

Morrigan:  Ignoring that after but one night it could barely be called a child... no, it will not be hurt.  It will be changed.

 

Warden:  Will it be evil?  What will it become?

 

Morrigan:  Allow me to say that what I seek is the essence of the Old God that once was and not the dark forces that corrupted it.  Some things are worth preserving in this world.  Make of that what you will.

 

Warden:  What do you intend to do with this child?

 

Morrigan:  I do not wish to tell you.

 

Warden:  I insist.  I need to know what you plan.

 

Morrigan:  The child will present freedom for an ancient power, a chance to be reborn apart from the taint.  Is that not reason enough to do it?  I will raise the child apart from the rest of society, and teach it to respect that from which it came.  Beyond that you need know nothing else.

 

Warden:  I see.  Enough about the child, then.

 

Morrigan:  Then have you decided?

 

Warden:  You don't think I will actually go through with this?

 

Morrigan:  Consider the possibility that Riordan may not be there to make the final blow as he plans, what then?  Do you run away?  Do you let Alistair, the future king of Ferelden, take the blow instead?  And what if he does not make it to the archdemon, either?  I am glad to make this offer to you, after all we have meant to each other.  Certainly the act of laying together is not such a burden?

 

Warden:  No.  I won't agree to this.

 

Morrigan:  I see.  There is, of course, another option.  I speak, of course, of Alistair.  He is a Grey Warden just as you are, and would also serve for the ritual.  The trick, of course?  Would be to get him to comply.  To me he would not listen... but to you?  I think he just might.

 

Warden:  You want me to send you to another man?

 

Morrigan:  If you will not even lay with me to save your own life, why not?  I care for you, and would prefer you to be the father of this child were there a hundred Grey Wardens here tonight.  But if you will not do it, then I must find another.

 

Warden:  You think I would tell Alistair to do this, instead?

 

Morrigan:  You will advise him to do so, and because he trusts you more than he would ever trust me, he will comply.  Consider the alternative.  If Riordan fails, do you think Alistair will hesitate?  The future king of Ferelden?  He will die the hero and you will be overshadowed... just a Grey Warden who accompanied the king.  You have good reasons to tell him to save his own life, if you will not take part in the ritual yourself.  Consider carefully. 

 

Warden:  Very well.  I will talk to Alistair.  

 

Morrigan:  A wise decision.  I shall wait here, then, while you go and speak with Alistair.  I urge you to be convincing.

 

========================================

 

 

Here is the conversation my Warden had with Alistair.

 

 

========================================

Alistair:  I see you can't sleep, either.  I also saw Morrigan outside your room earlier, and the look she gave me... that was icy even for her.  Is something up?

 

Warden:  You can't sleep?  Are you all right?

 

Alistair:  Not really.  All these men look at me and... I see in their eyes:  I'm their king.  Suddenly it feels so real.  But now you're changing the subject.  This isn't about me, this is about Morrigan.  I'm tired but not stupid.  What did she want?

 

Warden:  She brought some important news.

 

Alistair:  This is what I get for becoming king.  Everyone always brings you the bad news.  So what is it, then?  Rats running amok?  Cheese supplies run low?  I can take it.

 

Warden:  What if I told you there was a way to avoid dying tomorrow?

 

Alistair:  You mean with the archdemon, right?  Well, I already said that I'll take the blow if Riordan can't.  So you don't need to worry about it.  Is that what you wanted?  What is this about?

 

Warden:  Your wildest dreams come true:  sex with Morrigan.

 

Alistair:  (Laughs) All right, that's pretty funny.  Nice way to cut the tension.  So what's really up?

 

Warden:  I'm completely serious.  It's part of a ritual.

 

Alistair:  (Laughs)  Cute.  This is payback, right?  For all the jokes?

 

Alistair:  But... you're not joking.  You're actually serious.  Wow, be killed by the archdemon or sleep with Morrigan.  How does someone make that kind of choice?  You're not actually asking me this, are you?  What kind of ritual is this, anyway?

 

Warden:  Don't ask so many questions.  You just need to do it.

 

Alistair:  So... I'm just supposed to go and have sex?  No questions asked?  Even ignoring that I'm going to be king, that's... Look, even if I was willing to do this... and I'm not saying I am... do you really think this is a good idea?  You're my friend, but we're talking about Morrigan...

 

Warden:  Do you think I would ask you to do this if I wasn't sure?

 

Alistair:  I... suppose not.  Not that the idea of sleeping with your woman exactly thrills me, either, now that you mention it...

 

Warden:  You need to trust me.

 

Alistair:  Trust you?  I... Very well.  I do trust you.  (Groans)  Where is she?  Let's go and get this over with before I... change my mind.

 

(They return together to Morrigan.)

 

Morrigan:  'Twould seem your talk is done?  

 

Alistair:  Great.  So this isn't a dream after all.

 

Morrigan:  What is it to be , then?  Has a decision been reached?

 

Warden:  Alistair has agreed to your... request.

 

Alistair:  You know, dinner would have been nice... maybe a bit of wine?  Or you could knock me out, first... 

 

Morrigan:  Tempting.  Still, I am glad to see that it has been done.  Let us go somewhere more private, Alistair.  And believe me when I say you will not hate this quite so much as you believe.

========================================

 

I loaded up Witch Hunt after making my Post-Coronation save, just to make sure the romance was still on, and I got the "harder words were never spoken" line in the opening voice over by Morrigan.  This is supposed to mean the Romance is still active.

 

I still have Morrigan's ring, and my Warden didn't speak to her again after the Dark Ritual.  I plan to play through Awakening now, and then use that final save there to import to Witch Hunt.  I will report back again and let everyone know how it turns out.

 

In the end, my major decisions in Origins lead to the most pro-mage ending that I could think of... I got rid of Anora and made hardened Alistair king.  As my Warden's boon he asked for the mage circle to have independence (unfortunately the game doesn't recognize this, as Alistair gave it - it's a bug).  I helped Dagna - the dwarf female who wanted to go to the Circle to study magic - which in turn ended up inspiring mages to establish a Circle of Magi in Orzammar... one that was outside of the Chantry's power completely.  This lead to the Divine contemplating a new Exhalted March on Orzammar.  However, I made Bhelen king, and gave him the Golems.  This allowed him to reclaim some lost thaigs.  Unfortunately, he and Branka had a falling out and she cut off his golem supply.  Even so, he still has some golems, good trade relations with Ferelden, and an entire Circle of Mages living in his city.  I imagine he worked out an agreement with them to support his continued war to reclaim more lost thaigs, and in exchange he offers them protection from the Chantry and Templars.

 

So, yeah.  This is the most pro-mage ending I could think of from Origins.  

 

I'm off to play Awakening, and then Witch Hunt.  I will report back if my Warden makes it through the Eluvian to help Morrigan raise Alistair's baby.  I'm crossing my fingers that a future game (hopefully Inquisition) will have the Old God Baby in a position to take the throne.

[TheMadHarridan]

Glad to see it worked. If you got the "harder words were never spoken line" in Witch Hunt, the romance is definitely still on. I know this for certain, as I just played Witch Hunt yesterday with my Warden who romanced Morrigan. It was such a lovely ending, and they walked off into the Eluvian to raise the OGB.

[Jeffonl1]

Glad to see it worked. If you got the "harder words were never spoken line" in Witch Hunt, the romance is definitely still on. I know this for certain, as I just played Witch Hunt yesterday with my Warden who romanced Morrigan. It was such a lovely ending, and they walked off into the Eluvian to raise the OGB.

Glad you finally got your happy ending.

[Meldread]

Alright, I've just completed Awakening and Witch Hunt.  I can report that everything has gone exactly as I had planned it.  My character was able to romance Morrigan, let her perform the Dark Ritual with Alistair to get pregnant with his child without ending the relationship.  My character was then able to successfully complete Awakening, get the proper Epilogue where it says he went off to chase the dark haired sorceress.  I was then able to successfully complete Witch Hunt, and walk through the Eluvian with Morrigan to raise the Old God Baby - heir to the Ferelden Throne. 

 

I was also able to confirm that Morrigan recognized the child as heir to the throne by choosing the proper dialog selections, proving that she recognizes it as Alistair's child and not my Wardens.  To make sure, I asked about the child to get the following dialog exchange:

 

Warden:  Tell me where the child is.

 

Morrigan:  He is safe, and beyond your reach. All you need know is that the child is an innocent. He knows nothing of the destiny that lies before him.

 

Warden:  That’s not good enough.

 

Morrigan:  Then what is your concern? That the child will claim Ferelden's throne? I will not share my plan with you. I dare not. If your trust is insufficient, then your anger will have to do.

 

...and so, my Warden has successfully put a hardened Alistair on the throne as the sole ruler, has pushed for the Ferelden's Circle of Magi's independence, set into motion a free and independent Circle being established in Orzammar, which is undergoing a renaissance under King Bhelen, reclaiming a number of lost thaigs, Kal'Hirol among them.  The plate that honors the casteless that died to defend Kal'Hirol was no doubt political gold for Bhelen, aiding him further in his reforms when it came to re-integrating the Castless back into dwarven society.

 

Meanwhile, the Wardens become fully embraced by the people of Amaranthine.  They begin replenishing their numbers in peace time, Vigil's Keep becomes a trading hub that even eclipses the city of Amaranthine itself.  There was also the formation of the Silver Order, the non-Grey Warden soldiers of Vigil's Keep who became one of Ferelden's most renowned military forces, and the formation of a new Knightly Order by Ser Alec the Valiant.

 

The Messenger, the Architect, the Mother, and every other darkspawn encountered were killed in an effort to prevent the "awakening" of more darkspawn... my Warden did not believe it was possible to co-exist with them, due to their nature.  As a result, he was committed to their genocidal destruction. 

 

Meanwhile, it was clear that the seeds for Dragon Age 2 were planted.  Anders, Justice, and Nathaniel formed my core group of Wardens.  As a result, Anders and Justice spent a lot  of time together, and their banter gave insight into what is ultimately going to happen.  

 

Justice was clearly starting to develop desires beyond justice even while inhabiting Kristoff's body.  It was hinted that this could corrupt him, making him more like a demon.  Ander's actually questioned him on this fact, which angered Justice.  Meanwhile, Justice bantered to Anders wondering why he doesn't fight the Templar's rather than constantly running away.  On top of all of this my Warden went anti-Templar at every opportunity with Anders, and encouraged Justice to embrace his desires more when the opportunity presented itself.

 

Ultimately, Justice abandons Kristoff's body, so that Aura - Kristoff's wife - can have a body to mourn.  The spirit obviously goes into Anders.  Who remained with the Grey Wardens for a time, helping train more mages, until he was called to the Circle of Magi to deliver a lecture on the nature of the Architect.  He then returns to the Warden and tells him that his time with them is over... it was likely around this time that Justice entered him, and likely when he set off for Kirkwall.

 

...it's at this point that Justice becomes twisted into a spirit / demon of Vengeance.  This in turn twists and corrupts Anders, leading him to perform the acts he does in Dragon Age 2.

 

Ultimately, all the ripples of the events that lead to the Mage vs Templar war can be traced back to my Warden.  He's responsible for what happened with the Ferelden Circle, and what happened in Orzammar with the independent circle there.  He also played a role in corrupting Justice.  I imagine that Justice - who considered both Anders and the Warden a friend - once seeing the world through Ander's eyes... what he had to endure as a mage... what the Warden endured... people that he cared about... that this corrupted him, turning him from a spirit into a demon.

 

So, yeah.. anyway.  Ultimately, my Warden was successful.  He's now off with Morrigan presumably raising Alistair's kid with her...

 

Personal Achievement Unlocked:  The Hand That Rocks the Cradle Rules The World

 

 

Now it's time to play Dragon Age 2 with this save as a male Hawke who romances Anders, and plays hardcore anti-templar at every opportunity.  It will be interesting to see how all these events go into shaping what happens in Inquisition.  

 

[Jeffonl1]

Well that's one option explored ... never thought of going down that road myself, but DAO is certainly flexible enough to accommodate a lot of different choices

[Jeffonl1]

Now it's time to play Dragon Age 2 with this save as a male Hawke who romances Anders, and plays hardcore anti-templar at every opportunity.  It will be interesting to see how all these events go into shaping what happens in Inquisition.  

 

I don't believe these choices will carry into DAI via a save game ... apparently you have use a utility called Dragon Age Keep (not released yet) where you will make your 'choices' (that reflect your world view)

[Meldread]

I don't believe these choices will carry into DAI via a save game ... apparently you have use a utility called Dragon Age Keep (not released yet) where you will make your 'choices' (that reflect your world view)

 

Yeah, I know about the Keep.  However, I needed a saved game to import into Dragon Age 2.  I also needed a refresher on Dragon Age 2, since I only played through it once several years ago when it first came out.  Meanwhile, I've played through Origins five or six times.  Unfortunately, I lost all my saved games for Origins due to a hard drive failure, which is the reason I was forced to do another play through.  

 

As a result, I thought it'd be interesting to begin building my own canon in preparation for Inquisition.  If I am not mistaken the Keep will become open to the public before Inquisition comes out.  Once I get access to the Keep I'm going to go through all the plot flags and set things up to mirror what I did in my previous games.  I'm really digging the idea of the Keep, because it means I don't have to go back and re-play the old games unless I really want too.  

 

I'm really curious as to how things ultimately work out for the Dwarves.  I think the Dwarves ended up with probably one of the best outcomes in the game, just short of what can be accomplished by playing a Dwarf noble.  Their culture is modernizing, they've increased their trade relations, they've started reclaiming lost territory, and regaining lost knowledge.  In my canon the Dwarves have really just stepped into a renaissance period.  Although, it did come at the price of putting a tyrant on the throne, but it's hard to imagine the conservative dwarven culture changing without Bhelen being there literally breaking arms and likely assassinating rivals to make it happen.  Hopefully, Bhelen has a long vision for the Dwarven people, and ultimately re-establishes the Assembly.  However, he packs it full of people who support his modernizing efforts, individuals who have an invested interest in securing and maintaining his legacy.   Otherwise, when Bhelen dies the dwarves risk a conservative like Harrowmont taking the throne, and reversing all the gains Bhelen made.

[Xetykins]

The bhelen and haramount situation is one thing in the game that really gave me pause. I faking hated bhelen even more when I played dn. But that quest with that woman whos father told her she should leave her kid in the deep roads cuz of cast crap made me feel a little bit better for putting him on the throne.

With morrigan's ritual I accepted it once out of selfishness. But accepted it more when dalialynn's wedding mod came out :-)

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Nice, Meldread! Thanks for reporting back on that.