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Hahaha.
Actually, I'm pretty sure Kaidan was retconned from the writers' original intent for him.
I just don't think the retcon in any way conflicts with what was previously revealed about his character.
And I fully support the retconning of character sexualities if it increases visibility for marginalized groups.
"Character integrity" can get hit by a bus.
y'all please stop being so quality i woke up five minutes ago and i'm gonna run out of likes
I think that there is a correlation between the people who don't think that Anders, Kaidan, and (possibly) Cass were retconned and LGBT folks and allies. I wonder if it's because people who have really had to struggle with their own sexuality are more aware of the variety of ways that sexuality can be manifested? Like, if I were a straight guy, I might never have had to really confront my own sexuality since I fall within the "norm". And if that were the case, I might not be able to relate to a character or person whose sexuality appears to "change". But since I'm gay, I had to address my own sexuality consciously and, because like tends to attract like, have numerous LGB friends so I've seen that it's very realistic for a person to change how they outwardly represent their sexuality to the world or even how they self-identify.
Perhaps that this is one reason why it seems like it's often straight guys one side of this discussion and LGBT folks on the other side.
You make a good point, as a straight guy, I never had to confront it because as you said, I fall under the "norm". So, that's probably why I look at it differently.
Just for the record: I have nothing against Sera beign gay. If anything, I'm glad, since it made choosing between her and Cass so much easier 
And it motivates more to create a female character as well.
My only problem is double standards, I just can't stand those. But I guess most of us don't 
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Dave!
Hahaha.
Actually, I'm pretty sure Kaidan was retconned from the writers' original intent for him.
I just don't think the retcon in any way conflicts with what was previously revealed about his character.
And I fully support the retconning of character sexualities if it increases visibility for marginalized groups.
"Character integrity" can get hit by a bus.
There is cut content from the first ME1 that would have had Kaidan as a bisexual romance. In the disc files, you can find the audio for it. 
There is cut content from the first ME1 that would have had Kaidan as a bisexual romance. In the disc files, you can find the audio for it.
Yeah, the cut content from ME 1 has been debated by some people who say that it's just because they had both Meer and Hale record all of the lines for simplicity's sake. However, I cannot watch the dialogue intro shot between a male Shep and Kaidan, when Shep walks up and Kaidan is bent over and then he stands up and wipes the sweat from his brow and turns to Shep and they stare at each other for a moment before beginning to talk........(whew, where is that gif of Blanche squirting herself with the water bottle from Golden Girls? What was my point?).
Oh yeah, I refuse to accept that this animation, plus the "losing you is like losing a limb", plus the fact that Kaidan filled the LI role in the ME 2 opening if you are a male who didn't romance Liara, and NOT think that he was bisexual the whole time.
Yeah, the cut content from ME 1 has been debated by some people who say that it's just because they had both Meer and Hale record all of the lines for simplicity's sake. However, I cannot watch the dialogue intro shot between a male Shep and Kaidan, when Shep walks up and Kaidan is bent over and then he stands up and wipes the sweat from his brow and turns to Shep and they stare at each other for a moment before beginning to talk........(whew, where is that gif of Blanche squirting herself with the water bottle from Golden Girls? What was my point?).
The animation and dialogue for a femShep was identical. I think I'm the only one that didn't see that as a flirt. I just thought he was working away, and not like that. Then I came to the forums and I guess I certainly saw it as a lot more innocent that a lot of others did. Which is strange, since I'm usually a giant pervert.
He also fills the role if you didn't romance anyone in ME1 either, even for femSheps.
The animation and dialogue for a femShep was identical. I think I'm the only one that didn't see that as a flirt. I just thought he was working away, and not like that. Then I came to the forums and I guess I certainly saw it as a lot more innocent that a lot of others did. Which is strange, since I'm usually a giant pervert.
He also fills the role if you didn't romance anyone in ME1 either, even for femSheps.
I think that this is what has always made me think that, despite their protests, the ME team always saw Kaidan as an m/m option. He's the "main" male LI in the series and he fills the same roles for males and females (who he can romance). It always felt to me like there was something between them.
Of course, my initial thought when I played ME was "Holy ****! That's the male LI? And they aren't giving that handsome man to us gays? WTF?!?" (followed closely by, "Aw crap, is that Carth.....?). So maybe I am just biased.
He does have awfully neat hair.
It's like... is there a vat of gel in his locker or what?
Right... 9 companions, 3 females, 1 of them is lesbian. It would be foolish to make all characters romanceable. So only 1 left for male gamers to romance. Lmao @ men getting owned.
There are 12 possible LIs including the advisers. In total there are 5 women. Leliana won't be a romance and Sera is gay leaving 3 possible romance options for straight male gamers.
7 of them are men, since Sera is gay it is likely that 1 of them will be gay too & at least 1 of them won't be romanable at all (if the third rouge is Cole, then he totally won't be), leaving a possible 5, or more likely 4 (since Blackwall probably won't be romanceable either) for straight female gamers.
Gay male gamers will get 2 possible chooses, between whoever is gay and whoever is bi, as will gay female gamers.
This means for the first time since I've been gaming, there might be a chance of straight woman having more of an LI choice than straight men. And its only a chance, there might be 4 men that are not LIs to keep things balanced.
Gay gamers are still getting the smallest amount of choices.
This is in no way men getting owned. 3 choices is still more than you had in DA:O.
I personally would prefer if everyone had the same amount of choices, (with the obvious exception of Bi - players who always get more, because we're greedy like that ) but if for the first time in the history of gaming its the straight male gamers who get slightly less choice than others then thats better then women or gay players getting the short end of the stick again.
P.S.
Please note, I'm not advocating for discrimination of men for the sake of fairness, simply saying that if all sexual orientations can't have the same choice then maybe for once men get 1 less LI.
There are 12 possible LIs including the advisers. In total there are 5 women. Leliana won't be a romance and Sera is gay leaving 3 possible romance options for straight male gamers.
7 of them are men, since Sera is gay it is likely that 1 of them will be gay too & at least 1 of them won't be romanable at all (if the third rouge is Cole, then he totally won't be), leaving a possible 5, or more likely 4 (since Blackwall probably won't be romanceable either) for straight female gamers.
Gay male gamers will get 2 possible chooses, between whoever is gay and whoever is bi, as will gay female gamers.
This means for the first time since I've been gaming, there might be a chance of straight woman having more of an LI choice than straight men. And its only a chance, there might be 4 men that are not LIs to keep things balanced.
Gay gamers are still getting the smallest amount of choices.
This is in no way men getting owned. 3 choices is still more than you had in DA:O.
I personally would prefer if everyone had the same amount of choices, (with the obvious exception of Bi - players who always get more, because we're greedy like that
P.S.
Please note, I'm not advocating for discrimination of men for the sake of fairness, simply saying that if all sexual orientations can't have the same choice then maybe for once men get 1 less LI.
While I see where you are coming from, there are a few things that I think:
1.) DA 2 had more romance options for straight female players than any other players. Yes, Sebastian was chaste and DLC, but he is in the game and female only romance, so he counts.
2.) We don't actually know that gay and lesbian players are getting less options than anyone else. All we know for sure is that lesbians are getting at least one option in Sera; straight guys and lesbians might get an option in Cassandra; and straight gals and gay guys might get an option in Cullen. That's pretty much all we know right now. Who knows, Cass, Vivienne, Iron Bull, and Cullen might be bisexual and Dorian be gay and suddenly gay/lesbian players get more options than anyone else (okay, okay, I think we all know that this is unlikely, but I hope you get my point).
3.) I do agree that there is nothing to indicate that straight guys will be getting less romances. For all we know, Cass, Vivienne, and Scribe Girl could all be open to straight guys and they might have more options than anyone else. And, even if they do get less options, it's certainly not an indication that Bioware has turned their back on this demographic.
Thing is females clearly want unfairness since they mentioned most games favored men. What good logic
That's not the same thing as "unfairness," that's wanting equality. Was the Civil Right's Movement or Women's Suffrage about wanting more rights or equality?
While I see where you are coming from, there are a few things that I think:
1.) DA 2 had more romance options for straight female players than any other players. Yes, Sebastian was chaste and DLC, but he is in the game and female only romance, so he counts.
2.) We don't actually know that gay and lesbian players are getting less options than anyone else. All we know for sure is that lesbians are getting at least one option in Sera; straight guys and lesbians might get an option in Cassandra; and straight gals and gay guys might get an option in Cullen. That's pretty much all we know right now. Who knows, Cass, Vivienne, Iron Bull, and Cullen might be bisexual and Dorian be gay and suddenly gay/lesbian players get more options than anyone else (okay, okay, I think we all know that this is unlikely, but I hope you get my point).
3.) I do agree that there is nothing to indicate that straight guys will be getting less romances. For all we know, Cass, Vivienne, and Scribe Girl could all be open to straight guys and they might have more options than anyone else. And, even if they do get less options, it's certainly not an indication that Bioware has turned their back on this demographic.
I totally agree with you and I know I made a number of assumptions in my post. I was just trying to illustrate my frustration at people jumping to the conclusion that straight men are being discriminated against simply because Sera has been announced as gay.
I was trying to give the worst possible scenario for male gamers, while still keeping within the bonds of what is likely, to highlight that they will still get lots of choices.
In all honestly I totally forgot about the Sebastian romance, mainly because I only ever have eyes for Isabela 
in DA:2.
You've been great at pointing out the romances people forget about the past few days. Well done! 
I totally agree with you and I know I made a number of assumptions in my post. I was just trying to illustrate my frustration at people jumping to the conclusion that straight men are being discriminated against simply because Sera has been announced as gay.
I was trying to give the worst possible scenario for male gamers, while still keeping within the bonds of what is likely, to highlight that they will still get lots of choices.
In all honestly I totally forgot about the Sebastian romance, mainly because I only ever have eyes for Isabela
You've great at pointing out the romances people forget about the past few days. Well done!
Did they lower the "like" quota recently? I've never run out before and I've seen a bunch of other people say today that they are out of likes. Anyway, "imaginary like".
Yeah, I actually sat down and wrote out all of the romances in Bioware games and who they are open for because I wanted to approach these conversations with facts in mind. So I have a handy, go-to list that I can always refer to (I did with my reply to you because I couldn't remember if DA 2 was the only one with more straight female options).
I feel a bit like a know-it-all sometimes because I'm always like, <in nerd voice>, "Well, actually, Juhani was a lesbian companion.....blah, blah, blah!"
Bianca(crossbow) is the 4th female companion, and romanceable.
Did they lower the "like" quota recently? I've never run out before and I've seen a bunch of other people say today that they are out of likes. Anyway, "imaginary like".
Yeah, I actually sat down and wrote out all of the romances in Bioware games and who they are open for because I wanted to approach these conversations with facts in mind. So I have a handy, go-to list that I can always refer to (I did with my reply to you because I couldn't remember if DA 2 was the only one with more straight female options).
I feel a bit like a know-it-all sometimes because I'm always like, <in nerd voice>, "Well, actually, Juhani was a lesbian companion.....blah, blah, blah!"
Dammit, I'm out of likes again today. When do they reset? I only used a couple today after running out of likes in 5 minutes last night.
Any way, here is a big like for you.
We've only officially announced Cullen, Sera, and Cassandra as possible romances. Stay tuned for more updates.
Does anyone want to estimate who will be announced next as a romance? I think it will be Dorian, probably as a gay love interest.
Bianca(crossbow) is the 4th female companion, and romanceable.
Would romance.
We've only officially announced Cullen, Sera, and Cassandra as possible romances. Stay tuned for more updates.
Does anyone want to estimate who will be announced next as a romance? I think it will be Dorian, probably as a gay love interest.
Well, the only romance of the three with a confirmed sexuality was Sera with her being only interested in female Inquisitors.
Dunno, but introducing a male as an option makes sense to me. If he's gay or straight or something else entirely, that works.
Dragon Age @dragonage
We've only officially announced Cullen, Sera, and Cassandra as possible romances. Stay tuned for more updates.
Does anyone want to estimate who will be announced next as a romance? I think it will be Dorian, probably as a gay love interest.
I like the idea someone proposed that they could announce whoever the gay male love interest is at GaymerX, which is in mid-July.
I like the idea someone proposed that they could announce whoever the gay male love interest is at GaymerX, which is in mid-July.
Didn't think of that, but THAT is cool.
Well, the only romance of the three with a confirmed sexuality was Sera with her being only interested in female Inquisitors.
Dunno, but introducing a male as an option makes sense to me. If he's gay or straight or something else entirely, that works.
I have a feeling Cullen will be bisexual, and Cassandra will be heterosexual. Although, I still have a remnant of hope that she will be available for women too. If not, the other gals and I who like Cassandra will have to find a way to make do without her.
*cries in corner rancorously*
I have a feeling Cullen will be bisexual, and Cassandra will be heterosexual. Although, I still have a remnant of hope that she will be available for women too. If not, the other gals and I who like Cassandra will have to find a way to make do without her.
*cries in corner rancorously*
Cassandra is going to be straight and Vivienne bisexual, I think. Or perhaps the order will be reversed. Given that the lesbian romance option is confirmed (Sera), and that we only have three female companions, I think must be a safe bet that Vivienne and Cassandra will be LIs and fill the roles of straight and bisexual female LIs.
Cassandra is going to be straight and Vivienne bisexual, I think. Or perhaps the order will be reversed. Given that the lesbian romance option is confirmed (Sera), and that we only have three female companions, I think must be a safe bet that Vivienne and Cassandra will be LIs and fill the roles of straight and bisexual female LIs.
Cassandra is going to be straight and Vivienne bisexual, I think. Or perhaps the order will be reversed. Given that the lesbian romance option is confirmed (Sera), and that we only have three female companions, I think must be a safe bet that Vivienne and Cassandra will be LIs and fill the roles of straight and bisexual female LIs.
I agree. But it could be that Scribbles is the straight romance, and both Cassandra and Vivienne are bisexual. But that's purely my speculation and/or hope.
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