481 réponses à ce sujet

[Nefla]

You do realize I am writing those examples from an in universe point of view that's asserting potential worst-case scenarios (gossiping idiots who'd say the woman looked like a cow) and not saying "hey, every women that isn't 90-60-90 with D-cup breasts and a face like *insert latest sex idol* is an ugly cow", right?

 

 

There's more to reading comments than just taking them at face value, like say the post where I had called myself a misogynic pig to parody my own opinion. It entails more than just looking at the words. Reading the context is important. Something you don't seem to do, if your first "old wrinkled lady" interpretation is anything to go by.

 

 

And that is the friendly analyzation, the other one being you'd deliberately overlook those contextual clues to bash me for alleged over sexualized anti-women comments. Which would be quite ironic if you'd go back through the thread and read my opinion about oversexualization of females by example of ME2 Miranda, which should actually be cue enough to dispose of any ideas you might have about me wanting "the game to be filled with a bunch of sexy babes with implants but some of us actually want a realistic female fighter for a change. Don't worry the humans and elves will still be sexy and I'm sure you can dress them in some kind of midriff baring boob cup armor".

 

If you want people to glean some kind of subtext, you'll have to do a better job at writing. Your posts are full of misspelled words, sweeping generalizations, illogical assumptions, awkward grammar, etc...Seriously read your own posts and tell me how I'm supposed to come to a conclusion that you don't even hint at.

 

-Why would you assume anyone would gossip about you giving someone "ugly" directions? There's no precedent for that in the games (or in real life, I mean who gossips about someone because they gave an ugly stranger directions?) so the logical assumption is that you yourself would gossip about someone who talked to an "ugly" person. And if they would gossip about you giving any Qunari directions than what's the point of bringing it up or concocting that scenario? It has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

[KBomb]

Female characters we've had in the past have had no muscle tone, stick thin arms, and looked like lingerie models (which requires sizeable amounts of fat on the breast, hips, and butt) this would be ok for a mage, maybe passable for an archer, but definitely not believable for a warrior who wears heavy armor and can lift a two handed sword the size of a surfboard or an acrobatic double dagger rogue. Show me any kind of female athlete that looks like DA2 Hawke. It would also be fine if the stylistic choice carried over onto male characters and they were all skinny with no muscle tone as well.

I watched a documentary once on Vikings , there was a medieval weapon specialist discussing the weight of armors. He used Joan of Ark as an example, considering a lot of historians believed that her wearing and fighting in armor was unlikely, given that she was small in stature and not a trained solider. He stated that the armor Joan would have been wearing looked heavy, but actually only weighed about 30lbs and would have been entirely possible for her to not only wear it, but to fight in it. Also, he discussed long swords and how they were made to be as light as possible and this was done by using what is called a "Fuller" (might be wrong about that word, but I am pretty sure it's correct). A fuller is a groove down the middle of the sword that balanced the weight, making it not much more heavy than a regular sword. I'll look for the name of the documentary when I get home. I know it was on Netflix then and it was about these rare swords vikings made and used-- if anyone knows the name, I would appreciate it. 

 

Furthermore, who are you to set the standard for what a female warrior should look like? I want all my female characters to be slim and small of stature, who are you to tell me they are only suited for rogues and mages? Not that I care what you think, but you're being awfully narrow-minded for someone who likes to accuse others of being well.....narrow-minded. 

 

I am glad you have the option to choose a character that fits your view of bad-ass, strong and whatever adjective works for you, it's good to have options. However, why do you have to dismiss any other version of it? 

[CDTheBookMan]

We've already seen a Qunari female: Granted she was actually an elf and an assassin, but Dragon Age 2 had a DLC Mark Of The Assassin that had a female Qunari.  Remember, it's a philosophical belief rather than a true race.  Still nice to see more expansion on the universe.

[Gtdef]

I'm not calling everyone a misogynist, just those who make misogynistic statements. Even if the spy had to seduce,(and I hate the trope of "men fight, women seduce") you would want to use a human or elf viddithari (just not posed as a servant) who could still be sexy but not stand out to the extreme. Iron Bull is a spy and is posed as a mercenary, why aren't you guys arguing that he should be more attractive because no one will tell him anything or say or do anything around him because he's not a hot babe?

 

Oh you hate the trope, because it came out of some male late night fantasy and it's totally irrational and based on fiction.

So just because it doesn't fit into your cosmotheory we should pick the not so good for the job. Why not, at least even if we lose the war, we earn some moral victory, I think.

 

I love how you switch from specific to general just to make some point. If I'm not mistaken, we were talking about a general scenario and how some would respond to a situation. The example that was given is tried and true because most people respond favorably to attractive people (plus there is the effect of someone trying hard to please someone he is attracted tom which is how women get free drinks in the club). You denied it on some moral principle and gave a counterargument that covers an entirely different concept and now you want me to do what, convince myself that there is absolutely no chance that a female qunari can be conventionally attractive to a member of a different race so I should apply the same thinking to Iron Bull? I'm pretty sure that there is a vast amount of people that think that Iron Bull is attractive to humans.

[Nefla]

I watched a documentary once on Vikings , there was a medieval weapon specialist discussing the weight of armors. He used Joan of Ark as an example, considering a lot of historians believed that her wearing and fighting in armor was unlikely, given that she was small in stature and not a trained solider. He stated that the armor Joan would have been wearing looked heavy, but actually only weighed about 30lbs and would have been entirely possible for her to not only wear it, but to fight in it. Also, he discussed long swords and how they were made to be as light as possible and this was done by using what is called a "Fuller" (might be wrong about that word, but I am pretty sure it's correct). A fuller is a groove down the middle of the sword that balanced the weight, making it not much more heavy than a regular sword. I'll look for the name of the documentary when I get home. I know it was on Netflix then and it was about these rare swords vikings made and used-- if anyone knows the name, I would appreciate it. 

 

Furthermore, who are you to set the standard for what a female warrior should look like? I want all my female characters to be slim and small of stature, who are you to tell me they are only suited for rogues and mages? Not that I care what you think, but you're being awfully narrow-minded for someone who likes to accuse others of being well.....narrow-minded. 

 

I am glad you have the option to choose a character that fits your view of bad-ass, strong and whatever adjective works for you, it's good to have options. However, why do you have to dismiss any other version of it? 

That's cool and all, but the fact that the researchers were surprised points towards her being an exception. Also we don't know what her muscle tone was like. Some people are more compact but still have toned muscle. I would be totally fine if they let us customize our characters bodies (like in SR) others could make their characters look very skinny, short and frail, and I could make mine look big and tall and muscular but they don't. The three other races women are ALL idealized and aside from the dwarf being a bit thicker, the proportion is very similar on all of them (not much muscle tone, hourglass figure) I don't get a choice, I never get that choice. You and people who want a slim, short, non muscled woman get three other choices in this game (and that's the default look for a woman in 99.999% of games in general) people like me who want a woman who actually looks like she could heft a giant battleaxe finally get one single option and people freak out, call her ugly, "unbangable" argue that she should be sexy too because of selective breeding (even though that's not how selective breeding works and there would be no reason to breed for beauty) and that female Qunari should be used to seduce information out of people (wtf).

[durasteel]

I don't like her. I don't know what it is exactly, but I just have an aversion to her. I think she must in some way remind me of someone I strongly disliked but now cannot remember, because something about her makes me want to dislike her as a person, which is obviously a ridiculous reaction to a PC.

 

I suppose it is a credit to the engine and to the character design that she is able to evoke an immediate and visceral response, though.

[Rel Fexive]

I've run out so I just wanted to "like" these here.

 

^Helped by proxy

 

I know I am a bit late on this, but I am not entirely sure what you are saying here...

[Elena]

...needs better hair options. Other than that, its great.

[Nefla]

Oh you hate the trope, because it came out of some male late night fantasy and it's totally irrational and based on fiction.

So just because it doesn't fit into your cosmotheory we should pick the not so good for the job. Why not, at least even if we lose the war, we earn some moral victory, I think.

 

I love how you switch from specific to general just to make some point. If I'm not mistaken, we were talking about a general scenario and how some would respond to a situation. The example that was given is tried and true because most people respond favorably to attractive people (plus there is the effect of someone trying hard to please someone he is attracted tom which is how women get free drinks in the club). You denied it on some moral principle and gave a counterargument that covers an entirely different concept and now you want me to do what, convince myself that there is absolutely no chance that a female qunari can be conventionally attractive to a member of a different race so I should apply the same thinking to Iron Bull? I'm pretty sure that there is a vast amount of people that think that Iron Bull is attractive to humans.

I was responding to the specific example given: would you give an attractive person directions? Would you give an ugly person directions? I would give both directions. Then it was switched to "would you give a suspicious person information that could obviously lead to a crime?" I would not give either person that information. This is not some hard moral choice. What are you even trying to argue? I never said Qunari couldn't be conventionally attractive to humans, I said she would stand out too much because she's a Qunari so the whole "seduce to get information" reason for female Qunari to be bred for sexiness makes no sense. A human or elf convert could be sexy AND not arouse suspicion. Even then, the Qunari spies are a small percentage of the population (and like Iron Bull might not even NEED seduction) so if there was selective breeding going on it would be for useful traits like intelligence and strength.

 

You must have lived in a well educated and cosmopolitan neighbourhood then. Because whereever I live, people gossip all the time and are usually not friendly about it. For that you should be grateful and I envy you. That is however not sufficient reason to equate obviously exaggerated hypotheticals with my own stance regarding any such real occurences.

 

 

And my point, admittedly a bad example on top of being evidently misunderstood, is that attractiveness IS a factor to how people react. I simply made the mistake of trying to give examples instead of just saying: "it's proven by science, deal with it".

 

 

But okay, I can do just that.

It's proven by science. Attractiveness does significantly change how individuals react to other individuals. That's why selective breeding for attractiveness is a philosophically practical concept, biologically viable or no.

Oh I know people respond more positively to attractive people, but the difference is not extreme enough to warrant trying to breed the entire species female population to be beautiful (and again, that's not how selective breeding works). People respond better to people who are nice to them and ugly than to people who are awkward, rude, etc...and beautiful. Beauty might help in a small percentage of scenarios which require seduction. Keep in mind that the vast majority of Qunari women are NOT spies, many spies don't use seduction, and the only spy we've seen has been an elf convert (which makes waaaay more sense because she can be beautiful when she wants to and blend in when she wants to. A Qunari isn't going to pass unnoticed). If they could magically separate the father's traits from the mother's traits (ex: a strong intelligent father wouldn't have strong intelligent daughters as is likely in real life) and bred for beautiful females, there would be a giant population of beautiful females who are subpar at their jobs/ "roles" it would be more logical and likely that if for whatever reason they didn't want to use human and elf converts for their super sexy spy missions they would simply collect Qunari women who happened to turn out beautiful, perceptive, and intelligent from amongst the larger population who were bred for specific useful purposes.

 

I just find this whole "they would selectively breed all the women to be sexy and seductive because a few of them might be a spy and might need to seduce someone!" a crappy excuse to say that you just want Qunari women to be sexy. Elves and Humans are already sexy, you can change your Qunari protagonist's features (who will not be a seducing spy btw).

[KBomb]

That's cool and all, but the fact that the researchers were surprised points towards her being an exception. Also we don't know what her muscle tone was like. Some people are more compact but still have toned muscle. I would be totally fine if they let us customize our characters bodies (like in SR) others could make their characters look very skinny, short and frail, and I could make mine look big and tall and muscular but they don't. The three other races women are ALL idealized and aside from the dwarf being a bit thicker, the proportion is very similar on all of them (not much muscle tone, hourglass figure) I don't get a choice, I never get that choice. You and people who want a slim, short, non muscled woman get three other choices in this game (and that's the default look for a woman in 99.999% of games in general) people like me who want a woman who actually looks like she could heft a giant battleaxe finally get one single option and people freak out, call her ugly, "unbangable" argue that she should be sexy too because of selective breeding (even though that's not how selective breeding works and there would be no reason to breed for beauty) and that female Qunari should be used to seduce information out of people (wtf).

Well, she wasn't an adult woman. I don't see her being too muscular.  

 

I would love to see a CC like that of SR, but I don't see how the options Bioware gave to us were "idealized". Just because people say, "Oh, I don't like her. She isn't attractive to me at all. I won't be playing her." does not always translate into, "Omg! She is too ugly for any game ever! Bioware, remove her from the game entirely! Nefla is going to have to do without her massive female warrior!" You still have her. You can still pick her as your PC regardless of who feels she is beastly.

 

Also, I don't really see anyone "freaking" out because she isn't attractive. Voicing an opinion on her looks, whether they deem her as bangable or not, isn't freaking out. I get it. It's annoying at times that all anyone talks about is how sexy someone is or isn't. You seem to be taking it personal, though. 

[Rel Fexive]

I said that I helped by proxy. Which means that I went back through the topic, found the quoted posts and liked them in your stead as you were apparently out of likes to give (that limit doesn't make sense!).

 

Well, thanks!

 

 

 

Unrelated, I wish everyone would just get along, you know?  Enjoy the things you like, play things the way you want to, don't ****** on everyone else's enjoyment.

 

It's all good.

[JerZey CJ]

We've already seen a Qunari female: Granted she was actually an elf and an assassin, but Dragon Age 2 had a DLC Mark Of The Assassin that had a female Qunari.  Remember, it's a philosophical belief rather than a true race.  Still nice to see more expansion on the universe.

No, no, qunari is the race. It also just happens to be the name of theose who follow the Qun as well.

 

qunari = the race

 

Qunari = followers of the Qun

[Nefla]

Well, she wasn't an adult woman. I don't see her being too muscular.  

 

I would love to see a CC like that of SR, but I don't see how the options Bioware gave to us were "idealized". Just because people say, "Oh, I don't like her. She isn't attractive to me at all. I won't be playing her." does not always translate into, "Omg! She is too ugly for any game ever! Bioware, remove her from the game entirely! Nefla is going to have to do without her massive female warrior!" You still have her. You can still pick her as your PC regardless of who feels she is beastly.

 

Also, I don't really see anyone "freaking" out because she isn't attractive. Voicing an opinion on her looks, whether they deem her as bangable or not, isn't freaking out. I get it. It's annoying at times that all anyone talks about is how sexy someone is or isn't. You seem to be taking it personal, though. 

I'm just tired of all of this double standard crap on the forums. People saying they will kill Sera because she has ugly hair or kill Cassandra because she has a "manly" face, treating the male characters as characters but female characters as sex objects. "Is she bangable? No? I'm gonna kill her, she doesn't deserve to be in the game!" The only criteria for a female character is apparently that she be hot, even a customizable player character that they never have to see or play as. People come into the "can we please see more of the lady inquisitor?" thread and screech and holler that every tiny scrap of publicity a female hero gets means less of the male hero who we are already oversaturated with.

[Stormy]

Since it's a fantasy, you'd have no problem with all the male characters looking like this

 

 

I,as a female, have no problem with this!  Didn't Fenris look something like this but blonde, slightly more armor coverage and a an attitude?  Rawr.  LOL 

[ClassicBox]

I, personally, love how she looks. I am happy she doesn't just look like an Amazon woman with horns, grey skin, and white hair. She looks unique and feminine while still badass.

 

What I don't understand is how people are getting so worked up over seeing ONE character. Seriously you guys, there is a character creator. That's like looking at one human in the game trailer that you don't find attractive (even though I personally think this qunari is still plenty beautiful) and crying "all humans are ruined! They are ugly and it's not what I want!" The body will be the same (which is still not too far-off from human) but everything else can change. If you want to play a petite character there are elves. 

[Gtdef]

I'm just tired of all of this double standard crap on the forums. People saying they will kill Sera because she has ugly hair or kill Cassandra because she has a "manly" face, treating the male characters as characters but female characters as sex objects. "Is she bangable? No? I'm gonna kill her, she doesn't deserve to be in the game!" The only criteria for a female character is apparently that she be hot, even a customizable player character that they never have to see or play as. People come into the "can we please see more of the lady inquisitor?" thread and screech and holler that every tiny scrap of publicity a female hero gets means less of the male hero who we are already oversaturated with.

 

 

This sounds to me like a case of boys being boys. Just like you taking "offense" is girls being girls. That's what makes the forum great ;p . We don't have to be misogynistic to say misogynistic things. If everyone was agreeing that would be the dullest place on the internet.

[Nefla]

This sounds to me like a case of boys being boys. Just like you taking "offense" is girls being girls. That's what makes the forum great ;p . We don't have to be misogynistic to say misogynistic things. If everyone was agreeing that would be the dullest place on the internet.

Yeah, if everyone treated each other like human beings it would be so boring...

[KBomb]

I'm just tired of all of this double standard crap on the forums. People saying they will kill Sera because she has ugly hair or kill Cassandra because she has a "manly" face, treating the male characters as characters but female characters as sex objects. "Is she bangable? No? I'm gonna kill her, she doesn't deserve to be in the game!" The only criteria for a female character is apparently that she be hot, even a customizable player character that they never have to see or play as. People come into the "can we please see more of the lady inquisitor?" thread and screech and holler that every tiny scrap of publicity a female hero gets means less of the male hero who we are already oversaturated with.

Yeah, I get that. I haven't seen anyone say they want to kill Sera because of her hair, but this is the BSN, so I believe you. It's probably best just to ignore those people and not get into discussions with them. You will get no where and end up with being frustrated. 

 

When all you know about a character is their looks, you have to expect that is what most will be discussing. I do it myself. I cannot wait to know more about Solas because as of now, he looks like Nosferatu and it's creeping me out. It doesn't mean I won't love his character once I get to know it. I think most people are like that. I mean, this topic is about her appearance, so you have to expect that's what will be discussed and you have to expect not all opinions will match your own.

 

Personally, I don't care if the female inquisitor is ever shown in advertising. It's nice to see, but meh. I remember first playing Origins and hating-- I mean hating the way every single elf in the CC looked. I didn't play an elf for a long time because I just did not like the way they looked. I have yet to play a dwarf because they are too short. I mean, I like small statures, but that was too much for me. Are all these things shallow? Yep. It's my money that bought the game. My system. I can be shallow if I want to be. Just keep that in mind. It's going to be your game and you're going to love playing your strapping warrior. Don't let others ruin that for you and don't take it personal. 

[Maclimes]

Hey guys. Did you know that some people have opinions that differ from your own? You shouldn't let this upset you. Just enjoy the things you like, and they will enjoy the things they like.

 

It's okay.

 

Don't let some random stranger ruin something you like, just by virtue of not liking it themselves.

[Nefla]

I, personally, love how she looks. I am happy she doesn't just look like an Amazon woman with horns, grey skin, and white hair. She looks unique and feminine while still badass.

 

What I don't understand is how people are getting so worked up over seeing ONE character. Seriously you guys, there is a character creator. That's like looking at one human in the game trailer that you don't find attractive (even though I personally think this qunari is still plenty beautiful) and crying "all humans are ruined! They are ugly and it's not what I want!" The body will be the same (which is still not too far-off from human) but everything else can change. If you want to play a petite character there are elves. 

I agree, I can't wait to see what heavy armors and horn options I can get for my Lady Qunari (I wonder if we can have side horns like IB?)

[KBomb]

I agree, I can't wait to see what heavy armors and horn options I can get for my Lady Qunari (I wonder if we can have side horns like IB?)

I most likely will never play as a qunari (unless Varric is a LI, for the lols), but I am interested in what CC options will be available.