The problem with the Ark Theory is that it begins with an ass pull larger than the Crucible.
How so? Even Asari councilor says (after Thessia) that plans for survival of the race/civilization need to be put in motion which at the very least involves freezing at least few Asari in underground bunkers or something. Liara prepares time capsules. Protheans used freezing in multiple parts of the Empire. Ark would be just another survival project
Is it? My "mass effect physics" might be a little fuzzy but Shep had a conversation with a Salarian which confirmed the second half of a ftl journey was spent slowing down. This would imply inertia is not slowing it's progress at all. And also who cares about time dilation effects and relativity any more when you never intend to return from where you came.
That actually could answer my previous question about why they wouldn't just turn around when the reapers were defeated. If they were travelling at ftl WITH time dilation then the distortion would mean thousands of years passed in the milky way while the arkship chugged away obliviously.
The only source of knowledge the prothean's had on the reapers is only found in the beacon's and the only way to understand them is with the cypher and how exactly did they find these not to mention that the laws require that they share any prothean artifacts they found. This brings up another problem if they do find reaper artifacts and avoid indoctrination, how do they know the reaper's killed the prothean's why not share this knowledge with everyone else and prepare for their arrival.
The protheans wost because they were caught off guard and didn't prepare for them, this cycle had the opportunity to prepare for them so it could mean the difference between victory and defeat, a lot of deaths and bad situations can easily be avoided by preparing for them since you know when they'll attack, invest resources on building more warships etc.. prevention is better than a cure.
If they can't convince governments about the reapers other methods of getting the warning across e.g. mind meld with asari so they can try and warn the galaxy instead of giving up, put enough pressure on the governments so they have to do something about it. And tbh I think ark theory is going to have a significant amount of plot hole's to it.
Oh nos! Someone might break the law and keep the discovery to themselves! Like that hasn't happened before... The beacons don't have to be the only warning left if the writers don't want it to be. Like Javik said, the Protheans were scattered and communication was difficult during the war, it's quite conceivable that they might find a unique relic left by some isolated sect that takes experts decades to unravel and tells them what they need to know. And why must they share the information if they (correctly) believed that no matter what they did conventional victory was impossible and spreading the word would only cause a panic?
Good to see a name to something I've been postulating about in a vacuum.
I haven't gone through all 8 pages of this thread, but I really hope that if this is the route that BW takes with the new game that there are enough things in the lore to support something like this so the idea doesn't appear to have come from out of nowhere. Otherwise, this could be a deus ex machina (in the truest sense of the term).
I haven't gone through all 8 pages of this thread, but I really hope that if this is the route that BW takes with the new game that there are enough things in the lore to support something like this so the idea doesn't appear to have come from out of nowhere. Otherwise, this could be a deus ex machina (in the truest sense of the term).
There's enough, barely, and it's still a little bit of a stretch, but its doable.
There's enough, barely, and it's still a little bit of a stretch, but its doable.
They would just need to really stitch it together in a way that makes you go, "aaaaaaaaaaaaah!!! Ok, I see!".
I think I have my own Ark theory.
The citizens of the the galaxy wanted to escape the ending of Mass Effect 3, so they fled the galaxy.
Seriously though. I don't care for the ark theory, but I've come to the conclusion that I don't care what they do with the series, as long as it's not a prequel/ side story. I just want a a good Sci-Fi RPG, with lovable characters, great stories, and lots of stuff to do.
The difference is that with enough preparation the galaxy can defeat the reapers, the protheans never have that opportunity and more lives can be saved altogether. Reapers rely on the element of surprise to order to carry out the cycles, with that gone its a huge game changer and with the knowledge of what the reapers capabilities they stand a better chance than most cycles, so preparing the galaxy for the reapers arrivals hen then have the chance is much better than some ark project that's doomed to fail.Oh nos! Someone might break the law and keep the discovery to themselves! Like that hasn't happened before... The beacons don't have to be the only warning left if the writers don't want it to be. Like Javik said, the Protheans were scattered and communication was difficult during the war, it's quite conceivable that they might find a unique relic left by some isolated sect that takes experts decades to unravel and tells them what they need to know. And why must they share the information if they (correctly) believed that no matter what they did conventional victory was impossible and spreading the word would only cause a panic?
The crucible was already pushing it, ark theory will be a deus ex machina since it came out of nowhere, and it also just be bad writing.There's enough, barely, and it's still a little bit of a stretch, but its doable.
Who says any level of preparation would have been enough? The Protheans gave this cycle a better shot than any before it when they sabotaged the Citadel Relay, even so all the militaries of the galaxy managed to accomplish was slow them down marginally. Conventional victory was never a possibility against such a numerous foe that so totally outclasses them in technology.The difference is that with enough preparation the galaxy can defeat the reapers, the protheans never have that opportunity and more lives can be saved altogether. Reapers rely on the element of surprise to order to carry out the cycles, with that gone its a huge game changer and with the knowledge of what the reapers capabilities they stand a better chance than most cycles, so preparing the galaxy for the reapers arrivals hen then have the chance is much better than some ark project that's doomed to fail.
I don't think that term means what you think it doesThe crucible was already pushing it, ark theory will be a deus ex machina since it came out of nowhere, and it also just be bad writing.
Who says any level of preparation would have been enough? The Protheans gave this cycle a better shot than any before it when they sabotaged the Citadel Relay, even so all the militaries of the galaxy managed to accomplish was slow them down marginally. Conventional victory was never a possibility against such a numerous foe that so totally outclasses them in technology.
Even if you believe conventional victory was possible, doesn't mean this cabal did.
They could started on the crucible and have it ready by the time the reaper's arrive, the war could be avoided altogether, prevention is better than a cure. Or they could just build massive numbers of ships and use numerical superiority, there are many possible way's to prepare for them and defeat them.
I don't think that term means what you think it does
A plot device that's comes out of nowhere very suddenly and without explanation, ark theory would pretty much fit this.
My major issues with the Ark Theory is not so much it's feasibility; I mean the fact that we just happened to discover plans to the Crucible, just as the Reapers were invading is way more contrived then a stasis ship slowly leaving the galaxy. My problem is in how all of the established infrastructure, locations, and races are going to be completely trashed.
How many species are going to the new galaxy? Is it just going to be humans and asari? What about all of the races that allied with us in ME 3, like the Batarians, the Rachni, and the Geth are they going to be abolished from the setting? What about the Genophage and the Quarian/Geth conflict? Are we going to rehash all of those plots again since a hypothetical ark would have to leave before all of those issues are dealt with? Are we going to get to the new galaxy and encounter the not-Rachni, or the not-Volus; a hand wave that gives us the exact same character (but not really) like Padok Wiks as a stand in for Mordin and the Geth VI in place of Legion?
What about the Mass Relays? How are the races going to travel long distances spanning the breadth of the galaxy? If there is Mass Relays, then why is the ending explosion not affecting the new galaxy? If the new galaxy is cut off from the Milky Way, then who built the Relays? If the Reapers built them, then where are the Reapers operating in the new Galaxy, since they would have avoided the ending explosion as well?
Who says they would know about the Crucible? It's quite a presumption to think the number of ships that could be constructed, even over a ten year period, would be enough to turn the tide in the face of an enemy that can destroy them with a single shot (See Sovereign). This is all of course assuming they didn't try to warn anyone. Maybe they did and were written off as crazy conspiracy theorists. We are talking about the same government that disbelieved the Reapers even after one attacked the Citadel.They could started on the crucible and have it ready by the time the reaper's arrive, the war could be avoided altogether, prevention is better than a cure. Or they could just build massive numbers of ships and use numerical superiority, there are many possible way's to prepare for them and defeat them.
A plot device that's comes out of nowhere very suddenly and without explanation, ark theory would pretty much fit this.
There were people other than Shepard who knew the repaers were real such as the shadow broker and that Salerian specter they could used them to influence events and find information that could save the galaxy to stop the reapers and a few decades of preparing for the reapers could make a lot of difference. Seeing as how this ark theory comes out of nowhere, has no build up and somehow saves species of the galaxy, it's not far feached for it to be compared to the crucible, share a good number of issue's that the crucible plot had and be called a deus ex machina.Who says they would know about the Crucible? It's quite a presumption to think the number of ships that could be constructed, even over a ten year period, would be enough to turn the tide in the face of an enemy that can destroy them with a single shot (See Sovereign). This is all of course assuming they didn't try to warn anyone. Maybe they did and were written off as crazy conspiracy theorists. We are talking about the same government that disbelieved the Reapers even after one attacked the Citadel.
A Deus Ex Machina is a plot device that comes out of nowhere AND solves all problems. The Crucible is a DEM and far more contrived than an ark would be.
I don't know if this has been suggested before but instead of a Council-sanctioned 'ark' on a mission to preserve life what if its more of a 'lost in space'/Star Trek Voyager type accident? While escaping from a Reaper attack near the end of ME3, a ship full of diverse characters, wounded soldiers and refugees (led by the protagonist) find a mysterious relay(or fall into a wormhole/discover a transporting device we've never seen before, whatever) and are transported to the furthest reaches of the milky way / another galaxy. I think a more grassroots, Firefly-style 'little ship-big world' narrative would be really fun start.
Now this I can get behind.
That's similar to what I suggested way back here. If I were gonna do an "ark" thing, the real work of going to another galaxy and building a relay there would have been done 50,000 years ago and discovered in the Mass Effect game time. I'm imagining finding dynasties of Prothean pharaoh-like "god-kings" having created a mythology in the new galaxy based on veneration of and servitude to the Protheans being the only way to keep the giant metal squid-devils from coming to eat your face and take your soul.
It's so much easier to plug your story into an existing infrastructure, as opposed to taking the time to develop all that theoretical science somehow through player interaction.
Maybe, maybe not, that doesn't mean these people wouldn't believe the best way to ensure the continuity of civilization is to escape the Reapers, rather than defeat them, a feat more advanced civilizations haven't ever even approached.There were people other than Shepard who knew the repaers were real such as the shadow broker and that Salerian specter they could used them to influence events and find information that could save the galaxy to stop the reapers and a few decades of preparing for the reapers could make a lot of difference. Seeing as how this ark theory comes out of nowhere, has no build up and somehow saves species of the galaxy, it's not far feached for it to be compared to the crucible, share a good number of issue's that the crucible plot had and be called a deus ex machina.
The protheans altered the keepers response to the reapers signal in order to give the galaxy a chance, not trying to stop them would everything they'd one was for nothing. Specter's and people such as the shadow broker can have huge influences on galactic politics they could ask them to use their influence to prepare for the reapers.Maybe, maybe not, that doesn't mean these people wouldn't believe the best way to ensure the continuity of civilization is to escape the Reapers, rather than defeat them, a feat more advanced civilizations haven't ever even approached.
...Except that it isn't a Deus Ex Machina. It wouldn't be the first somewhat far fetched plot element Mass Effect has introduced even long before the Crucible, but that alone doesn't earn it the label. With at least a decade to work with and far less fantastical results, it isn't anywhere near as far fetched as the Crucible. It doesn't even save the galaxy, it just helps a few people run away.
Why, again, are you so dead set against this?
A lot of assumptions there, the first of which is that these people would believe the Reapers where stoppable, which I have repeatedly explained need not have been the case. Just because you believe all that preparation would make a difference doesn't mean they would. I will no longer comment on this point.The protheans altered the keepers response to the reapers signal in order to give the galaxy a chance, not trying to stop them would everything they'd one was for nothing. Specter's and people such as the shadow broker can have huge influences on galactic politics they could ask them to use their influence to prepare for the reapers.
Bioware didn't do ago job handling LP and the human reaper, the crucible was added at the last part of the trilogy, ark theory will be no better than any of them as it will be introduced with no background on it what so ever and will be compared with those plot points a lot.
There are many problems with ark theory such as wasting all the effort in making an interesting setting (the MW) only to throw it all away by changing the setting they are pretty much creating a new franchise. There is also the issue of it being believable, the criucible was pushing it, LP was poorly handled ark theory will just have as many issues.
A lot of assumptions there, the first of which is that these people would believe the Reapers where stoppable, which I have repeatedly explained need not have been the case. Just because you believe all that preparation would make a difference doesn't mean they would. I will no longer comment on this point.
If anything, Ark Theory provides an opportunity to get away from the plot devices of games past. That's the entire appeal. It serves a purpose, wipes the slate clean, let's the series move on without baggage. It isn't the contrived magic resolution of a poorly handled conflict (Crucible) and it isn't a pointless wreck that exists purely for dramatic effect (Lazarus, seriously a two year coma would have sufficed just as well). Its a fresh start.
All those many problems I have so easily refuted and you refuse to elaborate on? I and others have explained to you numerous times that Ark Theory does not leave the setting behind. If you continue to refuse to elaborate on this position, I'm going to have to assume you're trolling. Like it or not, the Mass Effect setting is going to change dramatically in ME:N whether Ark Theory is true or not. New space, no Shepard, no Reapers. This will not be the Mass Effect of yesteryear.
Any form of preparation is better than doing nothing and letting everything that their people hold dear be destroyed.
The thing about ark theory is that it's not necessary, making the destroy ending canon and setting it at least a hundred years after the trilogy will get the same results and it also gives the dev's something to work with. There will be enough change with the new protagonist and time period, a new galaxy isn't needed.
No matter what Bioware does people won't be happy so they may as well work with what's already there instead of starting from square one.
well, i'm gonna go back and review these pages. see what all the hub bub is about. fwiw, however, it's mighty good to see sum spark of life back in these old ME forums. A lil spark of life; a lil imagination and sum good old fashioned speculation. and ofc, the requisite bickering. 
ah, this place has been a cold, stale biscuit too long.
welcome back ME. buckle up, I think we will indeed be in for one hell of ride. (tho we still have a long way to go before there's sum good fuel for the fire--nevertheless, off to a fun start.)
well, i'm gonna go back and review these pages. see what all the hub bub is about. fwiw, however, it's mighty good to see sum spark of life back in these old ME forums. A lil spark of life; a lil imagination and sum good old fashioned speculation. and ofc, the requisite bickering.
ah, this place has been a cold, stale biscuit too long.
welcome back ME. buckle up, I think we will indeed be in for one hell of ride. (tho we still have a long way to go before there's sum good fuel for the fire--nevertheless, off to a fun start.)
This is BSN nothing stays stale for long.
whew. okay. .lessee
to me making an "ark" would be common sense. if you're facing annihilation--a good old time religion biblical Deluge--you'd want sum to escape to prevent extinction. What i'm unsure of is Why it would have to be out of the MW? (maybe this was covered. i did have to start scanning). From what i understand, there are vast regions within the MW that are pre spacefaring and without active relays. So, the question is, would the Crucible Beam affect literally the entire galaxy? Or just the regions connected to the relays?
Seems it would be easier to ark ppl out to one of those regions. assuming the beam doesn't affect those areas. and ofc the Reapers weren't interested in pre space faring species and regions. that would still be a pretty hefty trip. the MW is vast.
i think the question of whether or not everyone knew abt the crucible is irrelevant. it doesn't matter cuz even if they knew abt it, they didn't know if it was gonna work, or kill them all and reapers. if they waited around to see---and the crucible killed everyone or didn't work on the reapers, then they kinda missed their chance. a chance that may be tied to needing an energy source capable of catapulting them out of danger. (whether that's sum far flung region of the MW, or another galaxy altogether)
Heck, maybe the Crucible was that energy source. harnessed sum way to catapult them into a one way trip. cuz it would have to be a one way trip. with everyone understanding that and willing to take that chance. otherwise, the idea of why they didn't come back to see what happened is problematic.
regardless, it would have to be a giant energy source and a one way trip. (Ah, but i could see a plan to try to get to another galaxy because maybe ppl did not know whether, or not the beam would affect the entire MW galaxy, or just the relay connected ones. you know the crucible was really as big a threat--if not more so than the reapers. a complete unknown. so, maybe they would indeed try for another galaxy?)
i would find it hard to believe, tho, that other species over the years did not also attempt arks. millions of years this reaping has been going on. so, we could run into descendents of previous species that escaped to these far flung places. But man, the memory of how and why they got there would be long gone. a distant, distant myth at best. cuz they would have been there for potentially 50,000 years and even hundreds of thousands of years. evolved completely differently. the whole thing. not to mention native species to the regions.
I'm tired now, but there's sum interesting stuff here. And imo plausible. Obviously no one has Any Idea what BW is gonna do, but sum kinda ark would make sense to me. simply because of the desire to preserve the species in the face of total annihilation. it would be foolish not to. and BW does like its religious mythology..
i'm, personally, okay with not seeing the citadel;omega...etc again. especially the citadel. i would like to see a new giant hub world and all that. buuut idk if that's what BW is abt. they said ME next would be fresh and new, but still recognizable. ark theory is fresh and new, but i'm not certain how "recognizable" they could make it in this hypothetical situation.
i like it. i think it's a good idea. not cuz of the endings of mass3. i could give a crap all abt those. it just sounds like it could be quite a grand adventure.
but don't get your hopes up.
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