200 réponses à ce sujet

[Das Tentakel]

When did I say they had no value?

 

'The Quns policies are the opposite of slavery, they apply value on everyone, no slaver would agree with that world view'

[The Baconer]

The Quns policies are the opposite of slavery

 

Except when they're not. Viddath-bas ftw.

 

 

Being a Mage is the wall that most people hit when disagreeing with them but what people ignore is that despite the qunaris harsh treatment, they genuinely respect them very highly because of their abilities.

 

I think "genuine respect" would be the wrong term. Rather, they have an immense appreciation for their potential usefulness.

[Eleinehmm]

Wait. slaves have no value? Since when that's the case? Bloody hell, you gotta feed 'em. Slaves provide valuable services!

 

 

SerCambria358 argues that the societies of Thedas are not Ancient/Medieval and therefore we shouldn’t use the Roman Empire analogy. (I actually sort of like it myself, but it’s rather hard to work with, considering the fact that the modern ideas of the way slavery worked bled into the setting and that the main religion of the setting is openly Anti-slavery (unlike all the main religions of the Ancient/Medieval times).

 
 

[SerCambria358]

I said they disagree with the notion that value can be applied to everyone, I never said they viewed slaves as worthless.

[Eleinehmm]

Except when they're not. Viddath-bas ftw.

 

 

 

I think "genuine respect" would be the wrong term. Rather, they have an immense appreciation for their potential usefulness.

 

Respect in a sense that they provide a service to the greater whole, yes. And you sort of can’t chose not to be part of it: Appreciation for  your potential usefulnesss is  the only respect you can get in such a system. I don't think we have ever had anything close to it on Earth and it scares us a lot.

[SerCambria358]

Except when they're not. Viddath-bas ftw.
 
 

 
I think "genuine respect" would be the wrong term. Rather, they have an immense appreciation for their potential usefulness.

How is that not respecting them?

[Eleinehmm]

 Heh, it’s just came to me that my only problem with  the DA set-up is that we are expected to ID with Ferelden too much instead of looking at the cluster-F**k  Thedas is without anything grounding us in it.

[Das Tentakel]

Respect in a sense that they provide a service to the greater whole, yes. And you sort of can’t chose not to be part of it: Appreciation for  your potential usefulnesss is  the only respect you can get in such a system. I don't think we have ever had anything close to it on Earth and it scares us a lot.

 

'Valuation' is perhaps a better term than respect in this case. There is a certain similarity here to the value that was given to particular types of slaves. Ethnicity X is better for task Y, that sort of thing. There may be other similarities as well, for instance with a well-run slave plantation / estate, where everybody has his or her job.

[Das Tentakel]

Heh, it’s just came to me that my only problem with  the DA set-up is that we are expected to ID with Ferelden too much instead of looking at the cluster-F**k  Thedas is without anything grounding us in it.

 
 
Well, the truth sets you free, and all that  .
 


Ahem, back to those loveable Magisters...

[The Baconer]

Respect in a sense that they provide a service to the greater whole, yes. And you sort of can’t chose not to be part of it: Appreciation for  your potential usefulnesss is  the only respect you can get in such a system. I don't think we have ever had anything close to it on Earth and it scares us a lot.

 

Sure, in the same sense that the body of a fit slave in their prime would be "admired" for the potential labor... thus commanding a high price at the market. Something to consider when speaking of "value", given that slaves are a rather expensive commodity, both in our world and in Thedas.

 

Sure, it's a different philosophy, but let's not pretend the relationships are different when you strip all the bull****.

[Eleinehmm]

Sure, in the same sense that the body of a fit slave in their prime would be "admired" for the potential labor... thus commanding a high price at the market. Something to consider when speaking of "value", given that slaves are a rather expensive commodity, both in our world and in Thedas.

 

Sure, it's a different philosophy, but let's not pretend the relationships are different when you strip all the bull****.

 

Not on the level of quasi-religion though. A well-run plantation is not perceived by the people running it as an emergent entity, while a Qun society is.

 

 

 

No need to convince me, though I am an individualist, and am not likely to accept such a view.

[The Baconer]

Not on the level of quasi-religion though. A well-run plantation is not perceived by the people running it as an emergent entity, while a Qun society is.

 

Could it not be? I mean, obviously it doesn't work that way in Tevinter, but if that's what makes some people feel comfortable...

[Eleinehmm]

Could it not be? I mean, obviously it doesn't work that way in Tevinter, but if that's what makes some people feel comfortable...

 

I am honestly  not comfortable with either of them. Yet I do see the difference.

[Eleinehmm]

 
 
Well, the truth sets you free, and all that  .
 


Ahem, back to those loveable Magisters...

 

The truth is no matter how much we will write about Ancient history/Moral philosophy, the romance threads will always be longer then this one
There is something liberating in this fact, no questions here.
 

[Das Tentakel]

The truth is no matter how much we will write about Ancient history/Moral philosophy, the romance threads will always be longer then this one
There is something liberating in this fact, no questions here.

Oh, rest assured, the Cullen thread, among others, will survive the heat death of the universe  .

[Eleinehmm]

Oh, rest assured, the Cullen thread, among others, will survive the heat death of the universe  .

 

All right, It’s getting late in my current time zone so have fun all of you.  I love productive and interesting setting-related discussion with little to non personal attacks present.
Good night

[myahele]

As far as I know when Hessarian converted Tevinter into Andrasteism it was pretty decent but once he passed it slowly became the tevinter that we know today.

[leaguer of one]

If it isn't executed it is myth as well. Simple word corruption you can have laws but whether they function or just are there to look pretty.As i said many times both tevinter and orlais are corrupted well i would say more their system promotes corruption. That is why i don't have love for them.

And can you say the same about the Templers due to them having the same issues?

[KainD]

Until you were unceremoniously poisoned or challenged to a duel for being a threat to a rival Magister...

 

 

No, not until. I wouldn't mind a challenge. 

[Nyeredzi]

All you people saying Tervinter is justifiably, you would make good dictators...jks

[leaguer of one]

All you people saying Tervinter is justifiably, you would make good dictators...jks

Know one is say Tevinter is Justifiable.

[LilyasAvalon]

People have different opinions of things. And that's ok. Culture and personality vary very largely from person to person. I'm half Asian and half Western so I've seen it from both sides of the coin.

It's the same thing with the Qunari vs Tevinter vs anyone else.

Some people see the Tevinter as hell itself, but honestly it seems closer to Ancient Rome or the Middle Ages then anything else. Please also remember that until 150 years ago, slavery was still a norm in the US.

The Qun may seem like a great option too, but state over self, being pigeon holed into a lifestyle, told what to do, stripped of personality and name in public eyes. Is that necessarily any better?

Recently the Dragon Age media has taken to showing as that the Dalish and Arlathen are not the paradise some make them out to be either.

Arlathen was arguably no better then Orzammar or Fereldan by the sound of things.

[Altima Darkspells]

Tevinter isn't justifiable. Slaves take too much effort, and it sounds like Tevinter spends quite a lot of its resources fighting amongst itself.

Plus all the power-mad blood mage Magisters, and the Black Divine sounds like the worst of the bunch...it's just a whole mess.

It's much better to have a disenfranchised, lower class for cheap labor, so they can worry about their own food, shelter, and so on.

[Typhrus]

The people that are arguing about the slavery issue are not necessarily pro-tevinter or justifiable to our modern day senses. Merely that it is justifiable to the Tevinters in the universe of Dragon Age and that is an important note to keep in mind.

 

Oh and I'm done with posting in this thread. I'd rather not defend something more than I have to, to a practice that I dislike.

[Anaeme]

I have always speculated around how Tevinter came to ruin

 

http://forum.bioware...ypha-of-intaku/