17 réponses à ce sujet

[Jezla]

I'd like to get some feedback, particularly from a player's perspective, on maiking an interesting quest involving speaking to animals.

 

See, I'd always thought that allowing rangers and druids to make use of animal empathy in Shadows of Undrentide was a neat feature.  Since my current project is set in the Dalelands, it's a natural fit to do something similar.

 

My idea is to allow nature classes to bypass the ranger NPC for some quests by using their own skills.  I'd like to know what everyone thinks about how to implement it.  The quest is to find someone; currently it's a matter of "speak with x number of creatures and the hotspot is visible on the WM."

 

Anybody ever run across a more interesting way to design something like this?  What would be interesting as a player?  Keep in mind I'm just asking about concepts, not mechanical execution. We can deal with that later.   

[Arkalezth]

Well, I know of an old lady or two who likes singing to plants...

I also miss animal empathy (or opportunities to use it in the first place), so I think it's a good idea to implement it one way or another. I'm not sure of what to say without involving mechanics, though. Maybe change the "talking to x number of creatures" for doing them a favour in return, or trying to persuade them or something.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I'd rather kill them for an exotic food quest. Bear steaks, rabbit head soup et c.

[-Semper-]

got for it. adding rpg options is always a plus, but be sure that the quest ain't only solvable by the use of this single feat.

 

"speak with x number of creatures and the hotspot is visible on the WM."

 

i'm not really a fan of such design decisions. somehow it feels weird that after speaking to a number of creatures/characters the solution to the quest magically appears at the map. i would rather implement it that the secret place could also be found through sheer luck, the track feat of the ranger, a spot skill check and so on. this way it will be less linear with a more natural feeling.

[Tchos]

If speaking to each animal gives you a clue as to where the location is, and you could find it with a spot check or tracking when you get close enough, that should satisfy the kind of player that likes to figure things out ahead of the characters (which when done poorly becomes mandated metagaming, using player knowledge vs character knowledge).  I do think that after speaking with enough animals, the hotspot should indeed appear on the map, as the character has been given enough information to determine where it is, assuming a certain amount of intelligence or wisdom.  Wisdom will no doubt be high on a druid, and possibly a ranger.

 

At any rate, I support the concept, and wish it were in more modules.  I also support quests that are hidden or inaccessible to any but certain classes.  Much better than "anyone can do anything", though of course in a party situation, if there's a party member of that class, then it should be available.

[Jezla]

I'd rather kill them for an exotic food quest. Bear steaks, rabbit head soup et c.

 

Already got one of those in there, except it's not with animals.

[Jezla]

Arkalezth - maybe if you feed them, they give better info?  That's a posibility.  Oh, I guess some mechanical discussion is okay, I just didn't want to turn this into a script thread.

 

Tchos - The big limitation is the WM.  The location you're looking for is some distance away from the other areas (on the map, at any rate).  Perhaps I could vary the criteria for showing the hotspot based on Int or Wis, or even class level.  The more you have, the less number of creatures you need to talk to. 

 

I like quests like this too, which is why I'm including it.  It always seemed funnny to me to have my ranger be dependent on someone with equal or less skill to guide him by the nose.  I like to give the player a chance to actually use his character class as it's intended to be, not just a series of combat feats.

 

That said, there is an alternative for the bumbling classes.  They can talk to the ranger companion, and be led by the nose. 

[rjshae]

Well, lacking animal empathy, the party could speak with a mysterious hermit, who tells they need to collect the musk from a certain cave creature that is suffering from rabies--putting it out of its misery could be the price they pay. This musk allows the party to approach animals without them attacking or fleeing. Next, certain herbs and mushrooms can be gathered for the hermit, who creates a herbal chew blend that grants animal empathy. Once that's done, they need to figure out how to flash emotive images at the animals, then interpret the result. Perhaps the response is seen as a colored aura about the animal representing emotions, but the players don't immediately know what they mean. Interacting with enough creatures will then give the required clues.

[Tchos]

What are you referring to with "WM"?  Through the context, it's some kind of map, but I don't know what you're abbreviating.

[Jezla]

Sorry, Tchos.  WM = World Map, as in the OC.

[Tchos]

Ah, then I see the difficulty, since you can't just walk around nearby the location.

[Eguintir Eligard]

Sounds fine as you planned it jezla. Make it happen

[Arkalezth]

Arkalezth - maybe if you feed them, they give better info?  That's a posibility. 

 

Yes, for instance. Maybe some kind of mini-quest for each animal: one may need food, another may need healing, another may have lost its cub... Some of those could be done through the SOZ conversation system. Then each of the animals could give a piece of information, as you suggested.

 

As for the persuasion, you could just use conversation skills, or something different. There's a quest in a module where you have to calm an animal and the game checks your amount of ranger and druid levels in order to pass the check. Just an example.

[Jezla]

Lots of good suggestions guys, thanks!  Here's where I'm leaning:

 

More agressive animals need higher class/stat/skill to cooperate, and higher class/stat/skill means fewer animals need to be spoken to to find your answer, however, speaking to the required number of animals will also do the job.  Non-nature class PCs can either have the ranger companion do this, or they can get the answers from him without the bother of chasing bunnies.  I'm toying with the idea of having some animals require a small task (kill the wolf threatening the  rabbits or something).

 

In retrospect, it may have been better to do an overland map vs a world map, but I feel like it would be too much of a switch at this point.

[Dann-J]

I've used conversation-based animal empathy in a previous module (Dragonglade), and also have it on my overland map in the module I'm currently working on. I created a simple GC_ script that checks the PC speaker for the animal companion feat, which means that druids, rangers, and clerics with the animal domain can all benefit from it. All such conversations are 'party chat', so only one party member has to have an animal companion.

 

In my current module I have a plot-specific location on the overland map that can only be revealed by a successful search roll while within a certain search radius. The ipoint that will spawn the usable placeable starts off with a very small search radius and a very high search DC, with a heartbeat script that does the skill checking within the given radius. As you talk to various NPCs or find certain clues, the radius variable on the ipoint gradually gets larger, and the search DC variable gets smaller. A character's search skill determines how many clues they'll need to find in order for the hidden location to be findable - rogues or rangers will need to find fewer clues, while fighters or wizards might need a lot more.

[Jezla]

DannJ, that sounds like a neat system, and is probably how I'd want to do it if I were using an overland map.

[GCoyote]

Should it be a skill or a feat?

[Jezla]

GCoyote - I'd say it should probably be a feat, perhaps one that becomes more powerful as you level up.  I thought about looking up how to do custom feats, but this would more properly be a class feat, and that sounds like more work, so i decided to stay the course.