1530 réponses à ce sujet

[Darkfighter99]

There are a few redundant tiles (Seamus/Ginnis come to mind, since those tiles are always opposite each other) in the name of clarity. Alistair's royal status (or not) is listed in multiple places because it needs to be.

 

While it might not be technically necessary to have a different tile for the non-OGB, it could be a solution to solving some of this confusion. I'm not saying it's the best solution, merely that the idea shouldn't be written off completely as yet.

 

Hmm.... got me there, well in the end, we give ideas to the devs and they determined the best option.

[Brockololly]

 

Personally, I don't think a new option should be added - I do feel however that maybe the tiles should be renamed.  Something along the lines of "The Warden performed a dark ritual" should be vague enough to not give away the plot twist to newcomers.  But it should also be clear enough for people who have played that the option only determines if Morrigan has the OGB.  

 

Honestly though, why in the world are you concerned about spoilers if you're fiddling with the Keep one way or another? I mean, if you're messing around in the Keep you should be spoiled about every little thing related to any possible choice the Keep is covering, in copious detail! That's the point!

 

With something like the Morrigan's Baby tile, it should be offering a whole lot more information and context as to what the tile is actually setting within the Keep- namely, whether its simply setting whether Morrigan had a child or if she had a child as a result of some magical, sexual blood magic Ritual that may have preserved the soul of an Old God. Context is very important here and in this particular case, is completely lacking in The Keep.

 

I just feel like a lot of the choices as they're presented in The Keep are very sterile in terms of giving them any sense of importance or larger narrative context, even if its speculative importance, like the presence of the OGB. There were times in Origins where I'd sit at my computer a while contemplating choices and weighing the pros and cons. The more the Keep could do to capture those feelings, the better. Otherwise its a glorified checklist.

[movieguyabw]

Hmm, I believe I recall hearing that the devs wanted to make sure that using the Keep was not a substitute for playing the game.  Meaning someone who goes through the Keep, who has never played the series before, doesn't sit there after they're done and feel like there is no need to play Origins and 2.  I might be wrong; they may have said nothing of the sort, and I'm remembering something they did say wrong.  

 

However, it's a philosophy that makes a lot of sense.  You don't really want to create a tool that newcomers can use, that's going to deter them from wanting to play your old titles.  And that was why I mentioned how if they were to change the tile names, they probably wouldn't want it to be too spoilery.  Give them just enough information to whet their appetite, and they could come out of the Keep saying "hey, those sound like interesting games.  Maybe I should check them out!"  If you spoil too much, it's likely someone who hasn't played the previous games, but wants to check Inquisition out, is going to get through the Keep and say "hey, now that I know every choice and all of the consequences of those choices from the previous games, why would I ever want to play them?"  

[theflyingzamboni]

Hmm, I believe I recall hearing that the devs wanted to make sure that using the Keep was not a substitute for playing the game.  Meaning someone who goes through the Keep, who has never played the series before, doesn't sit there after they're done and feel like there is no need to play Origins and 2.  I might be wrong; they may have said nothing of the sort, and I'm remembering something they did say wrong.  

 

However, it's a philosophy that makes a lot of sense.  You don't really want to create a tool that newcomers can use, that's going to deter them from wanting to play your old titles.  And that was why I mentioned how if they were to change the tile names, they probably wouldn't want it to be too spoilery.  Give them just enough information to whet their appetite, and they could come out of the Keep saying "hey, those sound like interesting games.  Maybe I should check them out!"  If you spoil too much, it's likely someone who hasn't played the previous games, but wants to check Inquisition out, is going to get through the Keep and say "hey, now that I know every choice and all of the consequences of those choices from the previous games, why would I ever want to play them?"  

It's a tricky line to walk. The way I see it, new players will likely want to understand the choices that they are making for the characters in their world states. You can't understand whether a character would have had a baby with Morrigan if you don't know about DR; you can't make an educated decision about whether you would have killed someone if you don't know exactly what they did and why. There's a decent chance new roleplayers will simply go to the wiki and spoil themselves anyway, but have to take additional steps to do so. So less efficient. Not to mention that if a plot point does come up in Inquisition or future games, it will also be spoiled. Imagine having created a Warden who you think is totally against blood magic, only to have Morrigan mention that the Warden did a blood magic sex ritual with her.

The way I see Keep working is as a tool that should work equally well for new and old players, as far as the decision making processes go. Each should be able to work with (roughly) equivalent knowledge of the choices. Otherwise, new players aren't getting the same out of it. I definitely get what you're saying, because yeah, give to much info and that is a possibility. There has to be a balance in there somewhere, where new players can make informed decisions without feeling that there's no reason to play previous games. Maybe just informing people that this doesn't represent the totality of the choices you can make in previous games. Maybe not. I just think that in some (not all) cases that the current balance between those two is not the right one.

[RilantheFirebug]

I too have one that is literally labeled "worst save ever" that is everything I wouldn't do (and don't have the heart to do in an actual playthrough).

 

But my main is Adriade Mahariel (Dalish rogue) and Adelen Hawke (rogue) annnnnnd (suprise!) I will be probably be the Dalish rogue in my first play of Inquisition. I tend to do groupings... all characters warriors and an Amell family save, etc. 

[Shadowson]

I too have one that is literally labeled "worst save ever" that is everything I wouldn't do (and don't have the heart to do in an actual playthrough).

 

But my main is Adriade Mahariel (Dalish rogue) and Adelen Hawke (rogue) annnnnnd (suprise!) I will be probably be the Dalish rogue in my first play of Inquisition. I tend to do groupings... all characters warriors and an Amell family save, etc. 

 

Fairly similar to me actually,, dalish rogue warden and rogue hawke, going to be a dalish rogue inquisitor also. 

 

Also got the not optimal save thing also lol, i might play it as my 4th or 5th playthrough.

[Feryx]

I created all of my worlds from memory, so hopefully they are accurate. Well, except for the Warden on my "evil" playthrough.  I never did one that was completely evil in Origins, so I made one up who married Anora.  I like the idea of an evil king! 

 

Now I still need to wait for the Keep to load my wardens, so I can get the rest completed.  

[Kantr]

I made the most positive world-state I could, both in Origins and 2.  I mean the game gives me all the options to be evil and I can't bring myself to do it.

 

I don't think I could ever deviate from it, but I like the choices to be evil

[ariarovin]

I've only done two of my world states so far, but I can't bring myself to choose any of the 'bad' options that I meant to in-game? One of my Hawkes is technically pro-Mage but sided with the Templars. Only she didn't, but even in the Keep I can't bring myself to make that choice. :'D

 

In terms of "good" playthroughs, I generally try to make it so everybody who can live mostly unharmed, does? Like for example, my main world state with my Amell, I spared Loghain and had Alistair marry Anora so he wouldn't end up dead/a drunk?

[teenparty]

My most interesting playthrough is my Qunari-playthrough. Hopefully I can play a pro-Qunari Vasoth in DA:I

 

Warden is a traditioalist dward noble who sides with Harramont. Supports templars. Loghain slays Archdemon and Anora and Alistair rule.

 

Hawke hands Isabela to the Qunari and sides with the Templars.

 

I also have a templar-playthrough, a dalish-playthrough and a bloodmage-playthrough.

[empressdots]

I definitely have a worldstate titled "Assholishness experiment" where I'm just picking all the cruel choices to see if anything breaks.

[movieguyabw]

I've only done two of my world states so far, but I can't bring myself to choose any of the 'bad' options that I meant to in-game? One of my Hawkes is technically pro-Mage but sided with the Templars. Only she didn't, but even in the Keep I can't bring myself to make that choice. :'D

 

 

My canon Hawke was like that as well.  He was a bloodmage, himself, and supported the mages throughout 90% of the game.  However it seemed like every time I sided with a mage, they ended up trying to kill me later on anyway.  And Anders seemed to be under the impression I was anti-mage the whole game, for some reason.  0o  He kept making snide remarks about how I always sided with the Templars, when I'm fairly certain I never did.  (I think I told him once that I thought he was a bit extreme though.  Maybe that's why he had all of this hostility towards me)

 

Anyway, by the time Anders blew up the Chantry I just kind of threw my hands up in the air and was like "yep, I don't care anymore." and sided with the Templars because it made me giggle knowing that Kirkwall's new Viscount would be a blood mage - and would likely be giving out orders to Templars in the future.

 

 

I'll be honest, though - I really liked the justification he gave Merrill as to why he sided against the mages.  Basically, the citizens of Kirkwall were going to see Anders' actions as a Circle attack, regardless of whether it was true or not.  There was just so much bad blood building up for years that they wouldn't differentiate the actions of one man from the whole group.  The citizens were going to turn on the mages, and the mages were going to fight back in defense; and everyone would lose.  By siding with the Templars, Hawke could attempt to minimize casualties.  And as he can establish later on in the mission, he doesn't have to kill all of the mages - only the ones who give him no other choice.

 

Granted, this argument falls apart once you know that if Aveline marries Donnic, you can still protect the citizens of Kirkwall while siding with the mages.  But ignoring any metagaming, and looking at it strictly from a roleplaying perspective - I felt that justification worked shockingly well for my diplomatic blood mage. 

[Lieutenant Kurin]

Perhaps my favourite worldstate that I've ever done (that can only be partially represented by the Keep), is my 'traumatic playthrough'.

 

I start off with a Dwarven Noble Rogue, who, like all others, had her older brother be murdered, had been betrayed by her younger brother, got exiled, and had her father die as a result. Well, this was bad, though she truly did not understand how bad until after Ostagar. See, with Lothering behind her, she rushed home. To Orzammar, and saw the mess that had happened thanks to Bhelen. Nevertheless, she stood by his side. Defeated Caridin (Shale died too), and then came home with the crown. Realizing who Bhelen truly was, she gave the crown to Harrowmont. And slowly went mad. Following Dagna's request, she went off to the circle. Her actions lead to the destruction of the Circle of Fereldan, and the Templars won. Telling Dagna the circle was destroyed, she went to the Dalish. Hating magic, at this point, and seeing a corrupt leader in the clan's Keeper, she chose the werewolves. Her actions continued to haunt her. Wanting nothing more to do with humans, or magic, or the rest of the world, led to the death of Isolde, and despite romancing Leliana, killed both her and Wynne after poisoning the Urn of Sacred Ashes. She ended all this, by letting Anora take the crown, not preparing or helping Redcliffe to fight, and committing suicide via Archdemon.

 

The Warden-Commander, Orlesian of course, was an elven blood-mage by the name of Blossom. She was very chipper. She made typical Warden decisions, inviting everyone to become a Grey Warden, defending Vigil's Keep, and allowing the Architect to stay alive. She also chose to protect the fields, rather than Amaranthine.

 

Follow that with Malcolm Hawke (Jr.), a warrior who started off normal. Was rather diplomatic in Act 1 and 2. Romanced Isabela. Mostly stuck to sending mages to the circle, thanks to Bethany, who said she was happy there. Let Petrice do what she had to to get  the Qunari out. And his mother died. Aggressive since, sided with the Templars and killed everyone in his way, crying all the while. Kept Charade away from Gamlen, to protect her from his doomed family, and even let Meredith kill Bethany. Became viscount, but I doubt he's a good one.

 

Origin ID: HighLawyer

[riverbanks]

You wanted feedback; I'm giving it to you. I'll drop a short list of things I noticed were missing off the bat (pun). I'm assuming they're all being worked on as I type and if not hopefully I've reminded somebody somewhere that these were indeed options we had in the previous DA titles.

 

Are you sending these as plot suggestions tickets via the Keep's Feedback tool? Just posting on the forums won't do, the team needs them tickets to track suggestions/feedback on their end.

 

And send your thoughts anyway, even if you think other people may have already suggested it. It's important to get feedback, specially if it's a lot of people feeling the same way about this or that.

[Lieutenant Kurin]

Yeah I've been using the tool. I reported each of those instances individually. I thought I'd put it up here too. To be safe.

Try putting it in 'Ask a Question' instead, they don't look for feedback here, it's mostly "See my awesome worldstate" "Course! See mine!".

[movieguyabw]

Perhaps my favourite worldstate that I've ever done (that can only be partially represented by the Keep), is my 'traumatic playthrough'.

 

I start off with a Dwarven Noble Rogue, who, like all others, had her older brother be murdered, had been betrayed by her younger brother, got exiled, and had her father die as a result. Well, this was bad, though she truly did not understand how bad until after Ostagar. See, with Lothering behind her, she rushed home. To Orzammar, and saw the mess that had happened thanks to Bhelen. Nevertheless, she stood by his side. Defeated Caridin (Shale died too), and then came home with the crown. Realizing who Bhelen truly was, she gave the crown to Harrowmont. And slowly went mad. Following Dagna's request, she went off to the circle. Her actions lead to the destruction of the Circle of Fereldan, and the Templars won. Telling Dagna the circle was destroyed, she went to the Dalish. Hating magic, at this point, and seeing a corrupt leader in the clan's Keeper, she chose the werewolves. Her actions continued to haunt her. Wanting nothing more to do with humans, or magic, or the rest of the world, she let Connor stay possessed, led to the death of Isolde, and despite romancing Leliana, killed both her and Wynne after poisoning the Urn of Sacred Ashes. She ended all this, by letting Anora take the crown, not preparing or helping Redcliffe to fight, and committing suicide via Archdemon.

 

The Warden-Commander, Orlesian of course, was an elven blood-mage by the name of Blossom. She was very chipper. She made typical Warden decisions, inviting everyone to become a Grey Warden, defending Vigil's Keep, and allowing the Architect to stay alive. She also chose to protect the fields, rather than Amaranthine.

 

Follow that with Malcolm Hawke (Jr.), a warrior who started off normal. Was rather diplomatic in Act 1 and 2. Romanced Isabela. Mostly stuck to sending mages to the circle, thanks to Bethany, who said she was happy there. Let Petrice do what she had to to get  the Qunari out. And his mother died. Aggressive since, sided with the Templars and killed everyone in his way, crying all the while. Kept Charade away from Gamlen, to protect her from his doomed family, and even let Meredith kill Bethany. Became viscount, but I doubt he's a good one.

 

Sounds like a really interesting worldstate.  XD

 

One thing though - I thought the only way you could keep Connor possessed was to play a mage character  0o  Any other mage you send into the Fade refuses to side with the demon.

[Wissenschaft 2.0]

Question? I think I found a missing choices conflict, how do I report it?

The missing conflict:

Under a Paragon of her Kind:

You are to complete Rogek's Lyrium Deal even if you have recruited with the Templars.

In Origins you are not able to complete Rogek's Lyrium Deal if you recruit the Templars because the mage contact in the circle tower will be gone.

[Lieutenant Kurin]

Sounds like a really interesting worldstate.  XD

 

One thing though - I thought the only way you could keep Connor possessed was to play a mage character  0o  Any other mage you send into the Fade refuses to side with the demon.

If I remember correctly, Jowan is totally cool with it.

TheDarkKnightReturns, on 18 Sept 2014 - 5:31 PM, said:

    Should I just copy/paste? Not trying to make it look like I'm spamming a wall of text.

 

Go ahead! I doubt they'd mind.

 

Edit: What the quotemess?

[riverbanks]

Question? I think I found a missing choices conflict, how do I report it?

(...)

In Origins you are not able to complete Rogek's Lyrium Deal if you recruit the Templars because the mage contact in the circle tower will be gone.

 

At the Tapestry, in the top bar right hand side there is a button saying "Beta Feedback" - that's where you submit all bugs, plot suggestions, etc.

 

However, for this specific case, it is actually possible to complete this quest and side with the Templars in the same playthrough; you just have to go to Orzammar first and strike the deal with Rogek before starting Broken Circle. You'll meet Godwin while going through the tower later, and the quest will complete before you choose who to side with. Since there's no right order to do the main quests, this is still a valid option.

[movieguyabw]

Question? I think I found a missing choices conflict, how do I report it?

The missing conflict:

Under a Paragon of her Kind:

You are to complete Rogek's Lyrium Deal even if you have recruited with the Templars.

In Origins you are not able to complete Rogek's Lyrium Deal if you recruit the Templars because the mage contact in the circle tower will be gone.

 

Click the "Beta Feedback" button at the top, then "Submit Feedback" 

 

Edit:     'd

[Lieutenant Kurin]

By the way Origin ID is HighLawyer (no I don't know why either), so add me!

[movieguyabw]

If I remember correctly, Jowan is totally cool with it.

 

But if Isolde is sacrificed, Jowan can't enter the Fade...  0o

 

-------

Okay, had to check, curiosity got to me - especially since someone brought up the other day that the Keep allowed for this, when it wasn't possible.  From the wiki:

 

If the Warden cannot go or chooses not to, there will be no option to bargain with the demon. Once the choice is made, the ritual can begin.