1530 réponses à ce sujet

[Justin Edmond]

 

I found another slightly oddball discrepancy.  One of my friends had a save file I tried to replicate in the keep and wasn't able to do so. She was playing a Human Noble and during the Landsmeet agreed to marry Alistair in order to become Queen. Then, at the end of the game the Warden died to the Ultimate sacrifice. 

 

This was possible in DA:O, and when imported into DA2 there were instances where both these cases were true. At one point, I think it was Zevran, was talking about the Warden he mentioned his lover dying to save the world, and then right after said he was going to return to Ferelden to see his Queen.

 

Obviously, the bug is in DA2, because the timeline is technically right, but it feels like an option is missing somewhere. To me it feels like the timeline should reflect your choices in each game as well as the state of the world. There almost needs to be a new option to select that both choices at the landsmeet as well as an option to select who, at the end of the game, actually rules Ferelden.

 

 

I've been mulling over this one; but basically this is Warden Sacrifice, Alistair Romance, Alistair king (but the lands meet outcome is Alistiar & Warden joint rule)

 

I think this is one of those questions where we'd need to restructure to capture properly. We don't really support specific landsmeet outcomes that are changed by the ending since the "Who rules Ferelden" is from the lens of the end of the game, not the result of the landsmeet.

[Darkfighter99]

I've been mulling over this one; but basically this is Warden Sacrifice, Alistair Romance, Alistair king (but the lands meet outcome is Alistiar & Warden joint rule)

 

I think this is one of those questions where we'd need to restructure to capture properly. We don't really support specific landsmeet outcomes that are changed by the ending since the "Who rules Ferelden" is from the lens of the end of the game, not the result of the landsmeet.

 

"Who rules Ferelden" would be better instead of the "Landsmeet", just because it adds clarification.

the description could be "The ruler of Ferelden after the Battle of Denerim (I think I spelt it right)" or something similar. .

[FrozenSolid]

I've been mulling over this one; but basically this is Warden Sacrifice, Alistair Romance, Alistair king (but the lands meet outcome is Alistiar & Warden joint rule)

 

I think this is one of those questions where we'd need to restructure to capture properly. We don't really support specific landsmeet outcomes that are changed by the ending since the "Who rules Ferelden" is from the lens of the end of the game, not the result of the landsmeet.

 

You're 100% right, but to me the decisions a player made are far more interesting than the end result of those decisions, so from a "browsing other people's timelines" standpoint, I want to know what decisions they made, and learn about how those decisions affected the world. The decisions and end result should both be shown in the Keep.

[Brockololly]

Isn't it implicit?  If you romance Morrigan and don't do the Dark Ritual, isn't it required that she has a baby with the Warden that isn't the Old God Baby?

 

Sure. My only issue is that this isn't currently reflected in the Keep due to the autosolving and the way the Morrigan's Baby tile is linked to the Who Killed the Archdemon tile. Currently it doesn't allow for a situation where you can select Morrigan having had a child with the Warden without having the Warden also be the one who killed the Archdemon, which isn't right, since you could have had Loghain or Alistair take out the Archdemon but also have had Morrigan end up with a baby.

 

 

That's true!

 

Plus this is all easy to track. As long as it wasn't the Warden who killed the archdemon and Morrigan has the Warden's baby, then the baby wasn't the OGB.

 

Except....as I just checked on my Cousland's world state, it's actually impossible to set up the tapestry up that way right now because of the autosolver links.

Exactly!

 

That seems to be the issue with the Keep right now, where it seems like the Morrigan's Baby tile is making an assumption that the Baby is only coming from the result of the Ritual choice, thus why its linked to who killed the Archdemon.

 

I just think the context of the Morrigan's Baby tile could be  better delineated from the Ritual choice, since the existence of a non OGB from a Warden that turned down the Ritual but romanced Morrigan makes them two different things, but the Keep currently makes them seem like they're all one and the same.

 

Not to mention this discrepancy also seemingly makes it impossible for this sort of Warden to choose to go through the Eluvian in the Keep, since that ends up with the autosolver trying to make Loghain killed by the Warden instead of take the killing blow on the Archdemon, since that's tied back to Morrigan's baby.

[Justin Edmond]

Sure. My only issue is that this isn't currently reflected in the Keep due to the autosolving and the way the Morrigan's Baby tile is linked to the Who Killed the Archdemon tile. Currently it doesn't allow for a situation where you can select Morrigan having had a child with the Warden without having the Warden also be the one who killed the Archdemon, which isn't right, since you could have had Loghain or Alistair take out the Archdemon but also have had Morrigan end up with a baby.

 

 

Exactly!

 

That seems to be the issue with the Keep right now, where it seems like the Morrigan's Baby tile is making an assumption that the Baby is only coming from the result of the Ritual choice, thus why its linked to who killed the Archdemon.

 

I just think the context of the Morrigan's Baby tile could be  better delineated from the Ritual choice, since the existence of a non OGB from a Warden that turned down the Ritual but romanced Morrigan makes them two different things, but the Keep currently makes them seem like they're all one and the same.

 

Not to mention this discrepancy also seemingly makes it impossible for this sort of Warden to choose to go through the Eluvian in the Keep, since that ends up with the autosolver trying to make Loghain killed by the Warden instead of take the killing blow on the Archdemon, since that's tied back to Morrigan's baby.

 

I'll forward this to QA

[FenZev1]

I too have noticed a few issues surrounding the Dark Ritual.  You can make it work to what you have in mind, you just can't go about it in a straight line as the tiles are arranged.  Playing around with the end results first will trigger the Keep into changing your Dark Ritual option to what you wanted it to be, but deciding on the Dark Ritual first shows outcomes you don't agree with.

 

Does that even make sense?  Skip ahead and it works, do it in order and it doesn't

 

Maybe having the Dark Ritual so early on in the selections (under Companion instead of near the Landsmeet/Battle tiles) is causing some hiccups.  Not sure, requires a higher pay grade than mine to figure that out!

[Darkfighter99]

Sure. My only issue is that this isn't currently reflected in the Keep due to the autosolving and the way the Morrigan's Baby tile is linked to the Who Killed the Archdemon tile. Currently it doesn't allow for a situation where you can select Morrigan having had a child with the Warden without having the Warden also be the one who killed the Archdemon, which isn't right, since you could have had Loghain or Alistair take out the Archdemon but also have had Morrigan end up with a baby.

 

 

Exactly!

 

That seems to be the issue with the Keep right now, where it seems like the Morrigan's Baby tile is making an assumption that the Baby is only coming from the result of the Ritual choice, thus why its linked to who killed the Archdemon.

 

I just think the context of the Morrigan's Baby tile could be  better delineated from the Ritual choice, since the existence of a non OGB from a Warden that turned down the Ritual but romanced Morrigan makes them two different things, but the Keep currently makes them seem like they're all one and the same.

 

Not to mention this discrepancy also seemingly makes it impossible for this sort of Warden to choose to go through the Eluvian in the Keep, since that ends up with the autosolver trying to make Loghain killed by the Warden instead of take the killing blow on the Archdemon, since that's tied back to Morrigan's baby.

 

I don't think it needs a tile.

 

1. because if you put, let's say the warden didn't have her baby, but did romance her then she has a non-old god baby. the devs

can assume this, because as long as morrigan is romanced, she will always have a baby, regardless if her ritual is done or not.

 

2..also the devs have said before they don't need for everything because some events always happen because

a earlier choice.

For example, if you choose your warden to be a cousland, the devs can assume that

you have a marbai (I think I spelt it right) because a cousland will always have one, you can't choose not to.

[Darkfighter99]

I too have noticed a few issues surrounding the Dark Ritual.  You can make it work to what you have in mind, you just can't go about it in a straight line as the tiles are arranged.  Playing around with the end results first will trigger the Keep into changing your Dark Ritual option to what you wanted it to be, but deciding on the Dark Ritual first shows outcomes you don't agree with.

 

Does that even make sense?  Skip ahead and it works, do it in order and it doesn't

 

Maybe having the Dark Ritual so early on in the selections (under Companion instead of near the Landsmeet/Battle tiles) is causing some hiccups.  Not sure, requires a higher pay grade than mine to figure that out!

 

I've noticed that too. the reason is because the choices aren't chosen by you.

when you start a new world state. All the choices are grey, meaning default. If you change a

choice, this changes the color from grey to sepia.

if a choice (sepia) you make conflicts with a default choice (grey) it won't be recognize

by the auto solver. But if you change/approve the conflicting default choice to another/same choice that

still conflicts with the previous choice, it will be recognized by the auto solver.

 

tl;dr if a choice made by you conflicts with a default choice, it won't be

recognized by the auto solver.

[The Bear Muse]

For example, if you choose your warden to be a cousland, the devs can assume that

you have a marbai (I think I spelt it right) because a cousland will always have one, you can't choose not to.

 

On a related note, the autosolver should link to automatically change the mabari in the prologue to "never met" for Couslands, but does not currently do that.

 

Apparently I misremembered; please disregard. ^^

Modifié par The Bear Muse, 30 juillet 2014 - 03:21 .

[FenZev1]

For DA2, in making the ultimate loner idiot, I opted to not recruit Fenris from the beginning.  When I select that Aveline and Hawke had disagreements, it's saying I must have recruited Fenris.  I've never done this in game (the joys of DAK, can do things I would never do!), so it's not possible for Aveline to disagree with Hawke in the final battles if you don't have Fenris?  

 

I get that they are both warriors, but if my Hawke is a Warrior, I don't need either of them.  If I can head to the Archdemon with only Alistair, I should be able to head to the final battle in DA2 with just Varric, no?

 

My Warden/Hawke combo are lonely lonely souls lol.

[Darkfighter99]

On a related note, the autosolver should link to automatically change the mabari in the prologue to "never met" for Couslands, but does not currently do that.

no, that's fine as it is.

It possible for a cousland warden to meet an another mabari (just like the other wardens) in ostagar, and heal him, but not recruit him.

For the cousland, it's just another quest.

[The Bear Muse]

no, that's fine as it is.

It possible for a cousland warden to meet an another mabari (just like the other wardens) in ostagar, and heal him, but not recruit him.

For the cousland, it's just another quest.

 

Oh good - I misremembered then. Thank you for correcting!

[Darth Krytie]

Oh good - I misremembered then. Thank you for correcting!

 

It's probably because you actually need to pick up the flower in the wilds (without prompting) to get the quest in the first place. You pick it up, Daveth, I believe, tells you the Kennel Master is looking for that for the dogs, then you give it to him and get offered a reward.

[The Bear Muse]

It's probably because you actually need to pick up the flower in the wilds (without prompting) to get the quest in the first place. You pick it up, Daveth, I believe, tells you the Kennel Master is looking for that for the dogs, then you give it to him and get offered a reward.

 

That might be why I don't actually remember meeting the dog! Daveth DID say that, though.

 

Thankfully, the tile is good as it is regardless - all descriptions refer to curing the mabari rather than meeting it. A+ wording.

[vengeance1337]

I'm kind of shocked that Flemeth being killed by the Warden (or not), is not included? It was even mentioned in DA2 and I would think that she's a pretty important character. Hmm, maybe there's a default canon for that. 

[DragonRacer]

I'm kind of shocked that Flemeth being killed by the Warden (or not), is not included? It was even mentioned in DA2 and I would think that she's a pretty important character. Hmm, maybe there's a default canon for that. 

 

That's... a good point, actually.

 

I guess it didn't even dawn on me because she very clearly doesn't "permanently" die, given how DA2 plays out.

 

But if the choice were left off the Tapestry due to that, then it seems interesting that Leliana's "death" would be on there.

 

Hmmm...

[FenZev1]

I'm kind of shocked that Flemeth being killed by the Warden (or not), is not included? It was even mentioned in DA2 and I would think that she's a pretty important character. Hmm, maybe there's a default canon for that. 

 

It would be nice when meeting Flemeth in DAI that there's some mention of how "even the Warden thought he/she could kill me, yet here I am" or something along those lines.

[FenZev1]

I wonder if some of the issues of the auto solver could be fixed by allowing all of the choices to be made first, then "submitting" the options, and that's when it tells you the things you've selected are in conflict.  Having it go option by option sometimes gets confusing because I *know* you can do it, but the choice later down the line hadn't been selected yet.

[Justin Edmond]

I wonder if some of the issues of the auto solver could be fixed by allowing all of the choices to be made first, then "submitting" the options, and that's when it tells you the things you've selected are in conflict.  Having it go option by option sometimes gets confusing because I *know* you can do it, but the choice later down the line hadn't been selected yet.

 

That was actually very similar to our first implementation, but we ran into issues : 

 

It got really confusing for early users when they would get the summary of changes to be made; They got confused over which question was causing the problems, or how to fix them. We tried a lot of ways to try to sort or explain these problems but we have a lot more luck with the current process where at least there is an immediate understanding of cause and effect.

[FenZev1]

That was actually very similar to our first implementation, but we ran into issues : 

 

It got really confusing for early users when they would get the summary of changes to be made; They got confused over which question was causing the problems, or how to fix them. We tried a lot of ways to try to sort or explain these problems but we have a lot more luck with the current process where at least there is an immediate understanding of cause and effect.

 

Gotcha, that makes sense.  Thanks

[Buckwheat530]

 

1. because if you put, let's say the warden didn't have her baby, but did romance her then she has a non-old god baby. the devs

can assume this, because as long as morrigan is romanced, she will always have a baby, regardless if her ritual is done or not.

 

 

I just wanted to point this out before it gets buried. In my canon save, I romanced Morrigan early, but left her by the mid-game for Leliana. At the end of the game, I was informed that she was pregnant with my child, despite my Warden sacrificing himself and not taking the ritual.

 

In Keep, I have no way of indicating that I romanced Morrigan early, so the option that Darkfighter is suggesting doesn't actually work.

 

I'm very excited to see Morrigan with my child working for the same Inquisitor as Leliana, the woman I chose over partaking in the Dark Ritual to legitimize the child I had concieved without my knowledge... though that may not happen if this isn't fixed.

[Darkfighter99]

I just wanted to point this out before it gets buried. In my canon save, I romanced Morrigan early, but left her by the mid-game for Leliana. At the end of the game, I was informed that she was pregnant with my child, despite my Warden sacrificing himself and not taking the ritual.

 

In Keep, I have no way of indicating that I romanced Morrigan early, so the option that Darkfighter is suggesting doesn't actually work.

 

I'm very excited to see Morrigan with my child working for the same Inquisitor as Leliana, the woman I chose over partaking in the Dark Ritual to legitimize the child I had concieved without my knowledge... though that may not happen if this isn't fixed.

 

I did realize that, I just didn't mention because we can't have multiple romances, if they ever do add

a choice for multiple romances like "The warden's dalliance with morrigan ended since he fell for the

red-headed bard, Leliana" Then it would work like I said, but if they don't.... then yeah they need to add a an option

for a non-old god baby. Then they can also assume that the warden romanced morrigan at one point, even if we

choose someone else in the romance tile.

 

I think a multiple romance tile would be better though imo.

[Chanda]

I'm surprised that the Ostagar prisoner is on the tapestry, and with so many choices to choose from... Whether you kill him in his cage, or steal the guards lunch and give it to him, or talk the guard into giving you the lunch, etc, and whether or not you get the key. Is that prisoner really going to be so important in DAI or future games? Or the stuff that was in the chest? I honestly didn't know you could even get a key from that prisoner that would open up the chest. I always get him lunch, but I never picked the right dialogue choices to get they key. Once I read it here on the Tapestry, I went and tried it out for myself.

[Rogue Roxy]

I'm surprised that the Ostagar prisoner is on the tapestry, and with so many choices to choose from... Whether you kill him in his cage, or steal the guards lunch and give it to him, or talk the guard into giving you the lunch, etc, and whether or not you get the key. Is that prisoner really going to be so important in DAI or future games? Or the stuff that was in the chest? I honestly didn't know you could even get a key from that prisoner that would open up the chest. I always get him lunch, but I never picked the right dialogue choices to get they key. Once I read it here on the Tapestry, I went and tried it out for myself.

 

I actually knew about the possibility of getting the key from a dev video released before DA:O came out. It was very popular at the time, showing that the game had many conversational options which could affect how the game played out. I'm a little surprised that anyone hadn't seen it.

[serenai]

I just finished a huge reply to the "world state manager" topic and the topic got locked and hidden.. lol..

 

What was that email address we could send notes and bugs to? Because I can no longer file a bug in the Keep itself.

 

Edit: I found it