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[DuskWanderer]

Doesn't matter, the council races were searching everywhere for scraps of any Prothean technology and yet the Asari decided to hide one of the biggest beacons in the galaxy for whatever stupid reason. Hiding tech is a serious crime and laws are laws.

 

The asari didn't know the beacon had a Prothean VI in it even when they sent it to Shepard, they said "With any luck, it can tell you what it is". They did, however, know it was Prothean, a tech they hoarded in known violation of the law and knowing the Crucible was Prothean in origin.
 

The asari just didn't want it to get out that in fact, they were violating the law they strictly enforce. That's all there is too it.

[Farangbaa]

Shepard is considered for Spectre talent long before the first game starts. That is part of his backstory, Akuze/Elysium/Torfan. You may not like it, but there is a reason for it.

That's no reason whatsoever why a Soldier class Shepard can drop Singularities.
Or why an Engineer class Shepard can Warp.
Or why he's, without exception, stronger than anyone else he meets in the entire trilogy, regardless of species, class or experience. Hell, he's even significantly stronger than his own clone.
 

The only time Tali's skills are mentioned is her mechanical and technical skills. Of which quarians are the best when it comes to hacking and computing.

Which is why I don't want to recruit her. Ooooooh wait, I have to.

Shoehorn, forcing a character onto me, the whole shebang, you know.
 

Liara is a college grad with no special talents whatsoever. It's been established that asari and humans are of comparable skill in biotics, and Liara has had, literally, no weapons training at all ever mentioned.

Asari are significantly stronger biotics than humans. And all of them can do it.
Besides, your squad is severely lacking in biotics when you recruit her, unless you're an adept yourself. Even a college grad with no special talents brings more biotic utility to the battlefield than Wrex and Kaidan combined. (ok, that's not completely true. A fully leveled Wrex and Kaidan bring equal biotic prowes to the squad than Liara by herself. If we ignore cooldown times, that is. If we factor in cooldown times Liara wins)

[DeinonSlayer]

Shepard is considered for Spectre talent long before the first game starts. That is part of his backstory, Akuze/Elysium/Torfan. You may not like it, but there is a reason for it.

The only time Tali's skills are mentioned is her mechanical and technical skills. Of which quarians are the best when it comes to hacking and computing.


Liara is a college grad with no special talents whatsoever. It's been established that asari and humans are of comparable skill in biotics, and Liara has had, literally, no weapons training at all ever mentioned.

Minor correction here - ME2 established that Tali received "the best military training the Migrant Fleet had to offer" prior to Pilgrimage. The dialogue comes up if you refrain from hugging her when you find her father's body. She's not only a technical savant.

Liara's area of proficiency is Prothean xenotechnology and archaeology. No combat training is described at any point. Her heel-face-turn transition to her ME2 incarnation is not credible.

@Psych - in ME2, you're perfectly free to threaten to gun down her team, send Veetor to Cerberus and abandon her on Haestrom. You have no less than three opportunities to kill her off. If I want to recruit Samara or Thane, I have to hug Liara, and in ME3 I cannot be rid of her.

I'm not asking for the option to kill her off (though it would put her on equal footing with the other 15 squadmates from the first two games); sending her off to Hackett as we can the VS would be preferable.

[Farangbaa]

Minor correction here - ME2 established that Tali received "the best military training the Migrant Fleet had to offer" prior to Pilgrimage. The dialogue comes up if you refrain from hugging her when you find her father's body. She's not only a technical savant.

Oooh, retcon. We hate those things, right?

Liara's area of proficiency is Prothean xenotechnology and archaeology. No combat training is described at any point. Her heel-face-turn transition to her ME2 incarnation is not credible.

Yeah cause spending a good amount of time on a ship with professional soldiers is not going to have any influence on you whatsoever. You're definetly not going to learn anything.

@Psych - in ME2, you're perfectly free to threaten to gun down her team, send Veetor to Cerberus and abandon her on Haestrom. You have no less than three opportunities to kill her off. If I want to recruit Samara or Thane, I have to hug Liara, and in ME3 I cannot be rid of her.

I know, but that's not my point. My point is that you're railroaded everywhere, you only remember the points where you disagree with the direction.

[Sir DeLoria]

Asari are running the galaxy
 

[DuskWanderer]

That's no reason whatsoever why a Soldier class Shepard can drop Singularities.
Or why an Engineer class Shepard can Warp.
Or why he's, without exception, stronger than anyone else he meets in the entire trilogy, regardless of species, class or experience. Hell, he's even significantly stronger than his own clone.
 

Which is why I don't want to recruit her. Ooooooh wait, I have to.

Shoehorn, forcing a character onto me, the whole shebang, you know.
 

Asari are significantly stronger biotics than humans. And all of them can do it.
Besides, your squad is severely lacking in biotics when you recruit her, unless you're an adept yourself. Even a college grad with no special talents brings more biotic utility to the battlefield than Wrex and Kaidan combined. (ok, that's not completely true. A fully leveled Wrex and Kaidan bring equal biotic prowes to the squad than Liara by herself. If we ignore cooldown times, that is. If we factor in cooldown times Liara wins)

 

Soldier with Singularity in ME1 is gameplay and story segregation, like the ever immortal "Mommy, why don't they use a Fenix Down on Aeris". That's just a gameplay mechanic, that has nothing to do with anything

 

Shepard is stronger than anyone? Care to back up that assertion? All I see is Shepard actually going to places and doing things. He succeeds because you, as the player, control him.

 

You're basing your entire assertions on gameplay, not story.

[Sir DeLoria]

Asari are significantly stronger biotics than humans. And all of them can do it.

Wouldn't it make more sense then to recruit an Asari who actually has any real combat experience and military training? Like Shiala? Or literally any Asari who served im the military.

This is a military ship after all.

[DuskWanderer]

Oooh, retcon. We hate those things, right?


Yeah cause spending a good amount of time on a ship with professional soldiers is not going to have any influence on you whatsoever. You're definetly not going to learn anything.


I know, but that's not my point. My point is that you're railroaded everywhere, you only remember the points where you disagree with the direction.

Retcons are when you change things. That's not change in ME1, it's just never brought up. She only mentions she can "take care of herself."

 

Any "influence" the professional soldiers gives is going to pale in comparison to Liara's lack of experience. Further, she's treated as immediately combat capable on the next mission.

[DeinonSlayer]

Oooh, retcon. We hate those things, right?

A retcon contradicts, rather than expands on, established material. This is not a retcon. Had we found out that Liara received commando training at some point, I'd be puzzled by her behavior but nonetheless less skeptical of her usefulness in the field.

Yeah cause spending a good amount of time on a ship with professional soldiers is not going to have any influence on you whatsoever. You're definetly not going to learn anything.

Nope. Nowhere near enough to match up. Had some fun chats with Blob about that.

I know, but that's not my point. My point is that you're railroaded everywhere, you only remember the points where you disagree with the direction.

This being one of the more persistent and in-your-face examples, yes. I completely understand Sole Survivors being pissed about being railroaded to work with Cerberus. I roleplayed my Sole Survivor as having been a member since before the events of ME1.

[DuskWanderer]

Wouldn't it make more sense then to recruit an Asari who actually has any real combat experience and military training? Like Shiala? Or literally any Asari who served im the military.

This is a military ship after all.

It would have made more sense for Liara to try and talk sense into Benezia if we were forced to deal with the blue nightmare. But, that's not the case.

[Sir DeLoria]

It would have made more sense for Liara to try and talk sense into Benezia if we were forced to deal with the blue nightmare. But, that's not the case.

Which is one of the reasons why I never take her there.

[dreamgazer]

Wouldn't it make more sense then to recruit an Asari who actually has any real combat experience and military training? Like Shiala? 

 

I like Shiala as a character and would've taken her in under ideal circumstances, but I'm not letting someone who's potentially indoctrinated onto the Normandy.  I'd recruit Tela Vasir in a heartbeat, though. 

[DeinonSlayer]

Which is one of the reasons why I never take her there.

Some of the worst writing AND voice acting in the trilogy prior to ME3 right there. I never took her to Noveria again.

[Sir DeLoria]

Some of the worst writing AND voice acting in the trilogy prior to ME3 right there. I never took her to Noveria again.

Yeah, that scene is just hilarious. Liara forgets her mother just died about aptwo minutes after it happened.

[themikefest]

Which is one of the reasons why I never take her there.

And why I never rescue her till after Virmire and everything else is done that can be done.

[DeinonSlayer]

And why I never rescue her till after Virmire and everything else is done that can be done.

It is rather hilarious.

[Vilio1]

There's no mysogyny up in here.

How else to explain the fact that only female characters get that kind of venom [insert derogatory term here]. A similar thing went on with Ashley in ME1, Morrigan in DA:O, Miranda and Tali after the release of ME2 and now it's Liara. Characters like Kaidan or Jacob are not exactly fan favorites, but even they never receive that kind of venom. It's only a minority of the people who post here, but it's still annoying.

[themikefest]

It is rather hilarious.

It is.

 

Its also the one time, if playing as a renegade, you can put her in her place when back on the ship

[Sir DeLoria]

How else to explain the fact that only female characters get that kind of venom [insert derogatory term here]. A similar thing went on with Ashley in ME1, Morrigan in DA:O, Miranda and Tali after the release of ME2 and now it's Liara. Characters like Kaidan or Jacob are not exactly fan favorites, but even they never receive that kind of venom. It's only a minority of the people who post here, but it's still annoying.

People just don't like Liara, that has nothing to do with her gender.

[dreamgazer]

Characters like Kaidan or Jacob are not exactly fan favorites, but even they never receive that kind of venom.

 

Probably because their personalities are far closer to boring than irksome.  

 

This isn't a gender thing. Let's not go that route. 

[Farangbaa]

Wouldn't it make more sense then to recruit an Asari who actually has any real combat experience and military training? Like Shiala? Or literally any Asari who served im the military.

This is a military ship after all.

Yes it would. But as happens time and time again in the Mass Effect trilogy you have no choice whatsoever.

Soldier with Singularity in ME1 is gameplay and story segregation, like the ever immortal "Mommy, why don't they use a Fenix Down on Aeris". That's just a gameplay mechanic, that has nothing to do with anything

Fine.

Shepard is stronger than anyone? Care to back up that assertion? All I see is Shepard actually going to places and doing things. He succeeds because you, as the player, control him.

All Shepard's background stories have him doing impossible stuff.

'You are an anomaly'

You're basing your entire assertions on gameplay, not story.

Nope.

[DuskWanderer]

How else to explain the fact that only female characters get that kind of venom [insert derogatory term here]. A similar thing went on with Ashley in ME1, Morrigan in DA:O, Miranda and Tali after the release of ME2 and now it's Liara. Characters like Kaidan or Jacob are not exactly fan favorites, but even they never receive that kind of venom. It's only a minority of the people who post here, but it's still annoying.

Tali never got the vitriol you're talking about. Ashley was disliked because of her "racism" comment (I'll agree with you, though, that they seemed to excuse it coming from Wrex), Miranda was disliked for the way she justified Cerberus treating Jack. Morrigan was disliked for, among other things, netting disapproval for doing quests, and for complaining for utterly petty reasons.

 

Miranda (and Kaidan) were liked a lot more once they returned in ME3. Jacob couldn't rise to the amount of hate Liara did because he was boring (and cheated on you, but very few people romanced Jacob), while Liara is shoveled onto us as the Mary Sue.

 

I'll agree that, in this fandom and others, a lot of females get vitrolic treatment. But that's usually due to the fact that females are given the Mary Sue treatment more often.

[DuskWanderer]

Shepard is an analomy because he rallied the people and succeeded. He was just the figurehead, something someone could physically look at and say "this is the one driving it" At beast, he violently killed a Reaper fetus.

 

You are basing your assertions on gameplay.

[themikefest]

The asari didn't know the beacon had a Prothean VI in it even when they sent it to Shepard, they said "With any luck, it can tell you what it is". They did, however, know it was Prothean, a tech they hoarded in known violation of the law and knowing the Crucible was Prothean in origin.
 

The asari just didn't want it to get out that in fact, they were violating the law they strictly enforce. That's all there is too it.

You can also add they wanted to keep their #1 ranking. Nothing else mattered. It was only when the reapers were threatening their homeworld, they revealed they had a Prothean artifact.

[Farangbaa]

Shepard is an analomy because he rallied the people and succeeded. He was just the figurehead, something someone could physically look at and say "this is the one driving it" At beast, he violently killed a Reaper fetus.
 
You are basing your assertions on gameplay.

Yeah, his background stories are gameplay.

Wait, what?
 

You can also add they wanted to keep their #1 ranking. Nothing else mattered. It was only when the reapers were threatening their homeworld, they revealed they had a Prothean artifact.

Humanity would've done exactly the same had they been number one. They only play along because they are not.

Also, when humanity's homeworld is attacked, it expects all the other council species to give up their own homeworld to save theirs. Not just Shepard, but also Udina (who should really know the political game better) and Anderson. And everybody else in the game you talk to that is human.

And then people dare call the Asari stupid/bimbos, while all they do is play the power game to perfection.

That, my fellow BSN'ers, is why you hate the Asari.