642 réponses à ce sujet

[Barquiel]

That didn't look too intact to me. I suppose you're going to say the same about London. I'd wager that with a combination of damage done, ill will towards the Asari due to them keeping themselves out of the fight and not helping until later, and the fact they had fore-knowledge of the Reapers via the beacon yet failed to act at all will likely see Thessia taking decades, possibly even centuries to recover from the war. And their political influence will never be the same again. None of the races will let them reach that level ever again.
 
 
Seemed to me that dialogue only seemed to confirm that Thessia got hit harder than most.

Don't be too disappointed if Bioware ever makes a sequel, because I can guarantee you that this little fanfiction won't come true. The epilogue, dialogue of various characters and comments of the developers all contradict this. There are also some cut lines from the leaked script, which are not canon of course, but clearly show what casualty numbers the devs had in mind when they wrote the game. And Thessia got off relatively lightly according to these numbers.

[Hazegurl]

The orbital bombardment was a brief phase meant to dissuade the asari guerrilla tactics; the harvesting phase happened more or less as it did on Earth, except it ended sooner thanks to the end of the war.

You keep telling yourself that piece of headcanon.

[Xilizhra]

You keep telling yourself that piece of headcanon.

"As soon as the Reapers landed on Thessia, the harvesting began."

Bekenstein was an example of a planet the Reapers bombarded into ash without bothering to harvest, but they explicitly didn't do so with Thessia.

[KaiserShep]

Whether or not Javik is there doesn't make his observation wrong. Unless I'm mistaken, Shepard can come to a similar conclusion with or without him.

As for apologizing to the asari councilor, I don't see it as being the better person than it being a pointless gesture, as the asari are not even alone in the whole extinction thing. Like yeah, sorry you're on the sinking ship with us. Here, have a tissue.

[Barquiel]

As far as I know even Javik says that the beacon was activated because of the cipher and the presence of a living prothean.

[TheMyron]

So what do the Asari get turned into if only the AY can become banshees?

 

P.S. What became of my original topic?

[KaiserShep]

And yet prothean archives are activated all the time by regular people.

[KaiserShep]

P.S. What became of my original topic?

It guarded the bomb on Virmire.

[Xilizhra]

And yet prothean archives are activated all the time by regular people.

Beacons, however, are not.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

That implies that the beacon was what was used to keep them ahead of the curve, which fails on two levels. First, there's other Prothean crap underneath the temple, and their data were stored in forms other than beacons, that could be read by those without the Cipher, like the Mars archives. Second, everyone based all of their mass effect technology on Prothean hand-me-downs, so the idea that the asari were staggering their advances periodically over time (which was only a conjecture and not stated as objective fact in-game) instead of just diving into it the instant they found it and building their entire society on it, before even meeting the salarians, makes little-to-no sense. Unless the Protheans wrote different examples of their technology using increasingly complex computing formats that it'd take steadily higher levels of technology to crack, which not only also makes no sense, but would require the asari to be technologically advancing on their own anyway.

 

Also, no one joins the fight immediately. And in the actual codex entry that relates the objective facts of the battle, Thessia isn't harmed particularly worse than anywhere except Palaven, thanks to its military not be quite so enormous. Certainly it's not hit worse than Earth.

 

 

Funny, as that certainly isn't the case with any other DLC in the series. Do you have Bioware's confirmation on that?

 

Was there any other technology on Thessia that was hidden away from the public besides the beacon? You're literally making up evidence to white knight the Asari. It's like North Korean levels of detachment from reality.

 

All of the Prothean tech you see is the same as the beacon. It's Occam's Razor to conclude that it's all the same rather than generate a story about how it's different just to paint the Asari in a more sympathetic light. Next, this is a game where the word of characters is law, especially since there's no alternative explanation provided by the game. You're trying to invent a reason and fly it past as canon, but it's not happening. 

 

There's an easier explanation. The Asari (like the Humans) hadn't accessed all the information on the beacon, and once they realized they weren't alone on the galactic community, decided to use newly discovered information on the beacon to put the Asari on top and keep that system going. Every so often, when it looked like another race was making a development, the Asari would use it again to put themselves back on top. And, unlike humanity, who have only had 40 odd years to study the Mars beacon, the Asari have several millenia of experience with their beacon. They know a lot more than they're letting on, and it damn near damns the galaxy due to their selfishness and stupidity. 

 

Seems like everyone is willing to join. Except the Asari. They are the only ones who boycott their war summit in favor of pretending they're too high and mighty and above the Reaper threat. I don't see anything in the codex relating information about Thessia after the invasion. Dialogue all points to a very different picture.

 

Yes. It's called the story DLC. It's all canon if you have it. And if you don't and choose to ignore it, that doesn't mean that the events surrounding it don't happen. Not recruiting Javik does not miraculously mean that everything he says about the Asari never existed.

[KaiserShep]

Anyway, as for Ashley, I think her character gets more flack than she deserves. Other companions can say much worse, but she gets the most of fans' ire because she has the perspective of a regular person. Frankly, I think it's all bullsh*t.

[KaiserShep]

Beacons, however, are not.

There is no clear distinction on this in the game. The hardware on Thessia is identical to the Martian archives.

Did Saren have the cipher *before* hitting Eden Prime?

[Barquiel]

And yet prothean archives are activated all the time by regular people.

As far as I understood it the artifact on Thessia is not an archive, but a beacon which belonged to a scientist and was locked for one reason or another. Javik says it's "the memory of one of his people".

[TheMyron]

Over-opinionated chick vs. completely boring guy? hmm...

 

Goodbye Kaiden.

[Xilizhra]

Was there any other technology on Thessia that was hidden away from the public besides the beacon? You're literally making up evidence to white knight the Asari. It's like North Korean levels of detachment from reality.

Ask Hazegurl and that video.

 

All of the Prothean tech you see is the same as the beacon. It's Occam's Razor to conclude that it's all the same rather than generate a story about how it's different just to paint the Asari in a more sympathetic light. Next, this is a game where the word of characters is law, especially since there's no alternative explanation provided by the game. You're trying to invent a reason and fly it past as canon, but it's not happening.

Ah, yes, because Sovereign's declaration that the Reapers had no beginning and no end was true. In any case, the bit about "same as the beacon" is clearly wrong, as humans were able to extract information from the Mars archives without the Cipher, and Vendetta clearly had not yet been activated prior when we first saw it.

 

There's an easier explanation. The Asari (like the Humans) hadn't accessed all the information on the beacon, and once they realized they weren't alone on the galactic community, decided to use newly discovered information on the beacon to put the Asari on top and keep that system going. Every so often, when it looked like another race was making a development, the Asari would use it again to put themselves back on top. And, unlike humanity, who have only had 40 odd years to study the Mars beacon, the Asari have several millenia of experience with their beacon. They know a lot more than they're letting on, and it damn near damns the galaxy due to their selfishness and stupidity.

They couldn't have accessed anything at all on the beacon. If they got it from somewhere else, it still makes no sense for them to stagger it like that, especially since any scientific discoveries that could have come out of Prothean tech would had to have been released by the conspiracy itself, otherwise the information would have gotten out. So they would have needed to ensure that at least one asari scientist of the proper specialization was on the conspiracy every single time some new advance was made by someone else... and quite frankly, this whole thing already seems to have too many moving parts to have stayed secret for thousands of years. Also, there was no Mars beacon; the beacon on Eden Prime, when it's described at the beginning of ME1, is clearly differentiated from the "small data cache" that had been found on Mars.

 

Seems like everyone is willing to join. Except the Asari. They are the only ones who boycott their war summit in favor of pretending they're too high and mighty and above the Reaper threat. I don't see anything in the codex relating information about Thessia after the invasion. Dialogue all points to a very different picture.

Dialogue is all depressed about losing Vendetta, and the war summit was boycotted because it was a political disaster waiting to happen (which was true, by the way).

 

Yes. It's called the story DLC. It's all canon if you have it. And if you don't and choose to ignore it, that doesn't mean that the events surrounding it don't happen. Not recruiting Javik does not miraculously mean that everything he says about the Asari never existed.

Maybe, but it means I don't have to hear him talk about it.

[KaiserShep]

As far as I understood it the artifact on Thessia is not an archive, but a beacon which belonged to a scientist and was locked for one reason or another. Javik says it's "the memory of one of his people".

This is never really made clear either. Shepard uses the word beacon, but it's still the huge towering devices like the ones on Mars. I mean, why are beacons so huge now?

[Barquiel]

All of the Prothean tech you see is the same as the beacon. It's Occam's Razor to conclude that it's all the same rather than generate a story about how it's different just to paint the Asari in a more sympathetic light. Next, this is a game where the word of characters is law, especially since there's no alternative explanation provided by the game. You're trying to invent a reason and fly it past as canon, but it's not happening.

If the word of characters is law you should pay attention to them

Liara: I've studied Protheans my entire life. If I'd been shown the beacon on Thessia earlier...
EDI: You would have needed Shepard's cipher to comprehend it.

Ok Ashley... I think Chris L'Etoile's writing was pretty good in ME1, and I always found Ashley to be a very realistic and well crafted character. I simply don't agree with most of her views.

[Xilizhra]

This is never really made clear either. Shepard uses the word beacon, but it's still the huge towering devices like the ones on Mars. I mean, why are beacons so huge now?

Thessia is a hatchet job. I think it's fairly clear that they were running out of time for everything after Rannoch.

[KaiserShep]

...and the war summit was boycotted because it was a political disaster waiting to happen (which was true, by the way).

Except the summit wasn't a disaster. Boycotting the summit was also incredibly shortsighted. Admiral Hackett insisted that they'd pay for holding out, and sure enough he was dead on. In Shepard's position, I would assume that the asari were being wishy-washy and didn't want to be put in a position where they'd have to actually take a stand against their precious salarian allies, though the cure proposition does come out of left field.

I mean, she insists that the disparate groups are doomed to be at odds, but in not attending, a powerful voice that could serve as part of the mediation is denied to the very person who's trying to save their scaly asses.

[Xilizhra]

Except the summit wasn't a disaster. Boycotting the summit was also incredibly shortsighted. Admiral Hackett insisted that they'd pay for holding out, and sure enough he was dead on. In Shepard's position, I would assume that the asari were being wishy-washy and didn't want to be put in a position where they'd have to actually take a stand against their precious salarian allies, though the cure proposition does come out of left field.

I mean, she insists that the disparate groups are doomed to be at odds, but in not attending, a powerful voice that could serve as part of the mediation is denied to the very person who's trying to save their scaly asses.

I will grant that that was a misstep. Though I wouldn't blame Tevos for it, as I'm fairly sure she was just speaking for whomever was controlling the Republics during the crisis, given that neither the turian nor salarian Councilors were involved in the summit.

[Barquiel]

I agree that boycotting the war summit didn't make any sense. But the asari still joined after the coup (they helped before too -> Tiptree), so at the same time as the salarians do...and only one mission after the turians agreed to help. And they contribute more war assets than the Turians, and double the Salarians.

[KaiserShep]

I will grant that that was a misstep. Though I wouldn't blame Tevos for it, as I'm fairly sure she was just speaking for whomever was controlling the Republics during the crisis, given that neither the turian nor salarian Councilors were involved in the summit.

Yeah, I assume that she is basically a mouthpiece for her people's government. Whoever did attend the summit on her people's behalf would certainly not be the councilor.

[Xilizhra]

Yeah, I assume that she is basically a mouthpiece for her people's government. Whoever did attend the summit on her people's behalf would certainly not be the councilor.

They would also probably have been involved in the conspiracy... something to do with that may have been the real reason.

[Barquiel]

Anyway, as for Ashley, I think her character gets more flack than she deserves. Other companions can say much worse, but she gets the most of fans' ire because she has the perspective of a regular person. Frankly, I think it's all bullsh*t.

 

I think she's simply the most controversial character. I mean, everyone knows Javik is a racist...no point to debate it

 

Ashley...she says a few things in ME1/2 which could be construed as racist, but she also hates terra Firma and Cerberus .

[MassivelyEffective0730]

I think she's simply the most controversial character. I mean, everyone knows Javik is a racist...no point to debate it

 

Ashley...she says a few things in ME1/2 which could be construed as racist, but she also hates terra Firma and Cerberus .

 

Neither of whom are overtly racist in establishment. Both are human groups dedicated to human advancement, but they aren't anti-alien groups dedicated to alien extermination/enslavement/oppression.