120 réponses à ce sujet

[Heimdall]

IIRC devs have said that they came up with the Leviathan idea too late for inclusion in the game.

...And that sort of thing is exactly the kind of problem we've been talking about.  Too little pre-planning.

[AlanC9]

Sure, but it's better to have this stuff in a DLC than to not have it at all.

[Dale]

I still have my finger pointing to Leviathan.   If they can so EASILY extinguish a reapter  (and the "solution" was not their original plan) -- then it seems to me they could either:

 

(1) Reprogram Catalyst to reprogram the reapers.   I can't imagaine a hiper-evolved entity like Leviathan creating something (Catalyst) without any controls on it.   I don't think it is as stupid as the Quarians (with the Geth).

 

(2) Just wipe out both (Catalyst & Reapers) & start over.

 

Although since Leviathn is "supposed" to be a side-issue (DLC), it does answer some questions -- but perhaps the motivations for the Reapers could be revealed.

[Raizo]

I have a million pet peeves with the trilogy but I can't get into all of them at the moment since I'm about go to work so I'll just say this;
After playing ME1, ME2 and ME3 it is evident that there is a strong lack of long term planning in the ME trilogy. These 3 games should have fit together better than they currently do. ME2 in particular has nothing to do with the other 2 and as such ME3 ignores most of ME3 which is where a lot of the ME3 rage begins. I am so angry at the pay off to choices like who you picked to be the human councillor in ME1 and the arachnid situation not to mention how ME2's squad mates were handled. Plan your **** better in the future.

Moving on with my pet peeve list:

Less black and white choices. In the ME games a lot of the really important choices come down yes/no choices and more often than not these result in choices where one choice offers up more content than the other and Bioware is forced to compromise themselves and do things like having audio a always become councillor in ME3 or having a Rachni clone pop up if you destroy the last Rachni queen in ME. Bioware needs to embrace more grey choices and having these different choices leading down different paths.

Another point comes down to fun. Bungie made the the concept of '30 seconds of fun' famous. I play the ME games and there are a lot of things that just aren't fun in there like planet scanning. Seriously, who enjoys this. Never implement a gameplay feature that the gamer would find tedious, time consuming or a chore to play through. Driving the Mako was fun, trying to navigate almost impossible mountains yo climb in however was tedious. The Hammerhead had potential, shirty platforming ruined it when all the gamers wanted to do was just go from A-Z in it and maybe shot the occasional enemy. Hacking in ME and ME2 was an interesting concept, having to do it repeatedly multiple times a level wasn't fun.

Eavesdrop dialogue, NO! To passive for use in the Normandy and the Citadel. Having to pick dialogue options on the dialogue wheel forces the gamer to pay more attention to what us being said. The eavesdrop stuff felt in satisfying, I did not feel sufficiently involved in all the conversations, people where talking in my presence but they weren't talking to me. It got worse on the Citadel when it was npc's speaking, after a while I stopped listening to them because I just did not care, these were nameless/faceless people asking me to fetch random **** and they didn't even have the courtesy to talk to me 1 on 1. You want to use eavesdrop dialogue, use it for squad mates when they on hub world or during combat levels ( like they do in the DA games ), don't use it as the primary way to interact with everyone in the game.

Bring back planet exploration. I missed being able to explore planets in ME3. I also did not care for the fact that most of ME3's died missions took place on boring multi player levels. It was a step up from ME1's generic space warehouses but only just. I want more varied levels, I want to truly feel as if I am seeing something new or at the very least so etching memorable when I am going off the path of the main campaign.

Characters. Casey Hudson defended ME3 having new squad mates while they got rid of all of ME2's squad by saying gamers like meeting new characters and interacting with them and I do agree with him, as much as I love Garus every thing that came out of his mouth felt very familiar and I was bored with Tali, she stopped being facilitating in ME1 and her storyline ran its course in ME2. Having said that you CAN NOT introduce a whole entire cast of characters in ME2, make us fall in love with them and then cast them aside and do next to nothing with them in ME3 and not expect the vast majority of ME fans to freak out and make a big frigging deal about it. I hope that in future ME games they think really long and hard about how they will be using their cast of characters. In many ways this comes back to the first point, better long term planning.

[themikefest]

 

Finally you do NOT have a MEMORIAL service for your hero.   Somebody had sawdust for brains -- and WE (your customers) pay your bills & keep you from holding up cardboard at the intersection.

I would've like closure for Shepard or at least better than what was shown.

 

Its possible that Bioware may of done that just in case they want to bring Shepard back for another game. I'm sure the chances of that happening are nil. Anything  is possible.

[Iakus]

To make a better game:

 

Don't spend five years getting a player invested in a character and a setting, only to tear apart one or both of them as the player helplessly watches.

 

Also:  Remember that not everyone has the same standards of "bittersweet" as you.

[AlanC9]

I still have my finger pointing to Leviathan. If they can so EASILY extinguish a reapter (and the "solution" was not their original plan) -- then it seems to me they could either:

(1) Reprogram Catalyst to reprogram the reapers. I can't imagaine a hiper-evolved entity like Leviathan creating something (Catalyst) without any controls on it. I don't think it is as stupid as the Quarians (with the Geth).

(2) Just wipe out both (Catalyst & Reapers) & start over.

Killing one Reaper doesn't mean you can kill lots of them. That Leviathan planet is quite vulnerable. As for the stupidity... they were that stupid.

Although since Leviathn is "supposed" to be a side-issue (DLC), it does answer some questions -- but perhaps the motivations for the Reapers could be revealed.

They're exactly what the Catalyst said they were. He wasn't lying about anything. Mistaken? Maybe.

[themikefest]

Or have the third game as a starting point in a trilogy.

[Dale]

I would've like closure for Shepard or at least better than what was shown.

 

Agreed.   This science fiction & fantasy.   The ending could have had a "light being" (Shepherd) show up to his crew and explain everything -- then say "I'll drop by now and then for a visit".   Then a private time with whomever he was romancing  -- then vanish.

[Dale]

Also:  Remember that not everyone has the same standards of "bittersweet" as you.

 

That is implied -- otherwise I wouln't be asking for everyone's input on this thread.

[AlanC9]

Moving on with my pet peeve list:
I play the ME games and there are a lot of things that just aren't fun in there like planet scanning. Seriously, who enjoys this. Never implement a gameplay feature that the gamer would find tedious, time consuming or a chore to play through. Driving the Mako was fun, trying to navigate almost impossible mountains yo climb in however was tedious.

Hmmm... if you're going to actually integrate exploration into the game the way ME2 and ME3 did, I'll take scanning over the Mako. At least it's over faster; all the scanning in ME3 takes under an hour.

[Iakus]

Also:  Remember that not everyone has the same standards of "bittersweet" as you.

 

That is implied -- otherwise I wouln't be asking for everyone's input on this thread.

It's still important to remember.  if the attempt is for a "bittersweet" outcome, then it should be acknowledged that this is a moving target.  What's bittersweet for one will be an unmitigated tragedy to another, which will be a rainbows and unicorns ending for a third

 

Basically, it's a call for more varied endings.  Not just in worldstate, but in outcomes for the protagonist.

[Raizo]

Hmmm... if you're going to actually integrate exploration into the game the way ME2 and ME3 did, I'll take scanning over the Mako. At least it's over faster; all the scanning in ME3 takes under an hour.

I do not consider planet scanning to be planet exploration. To me planet exploration is going somewhere and exploring it, with planet scanning you never leave the Normandy and you're not really getting an opportunity to see the sights that make each planet unique . All that we really get out of it is some text describing some of each planets history, we can get that with the scanning.

[dreamgazer]

Or have the third game as a starting point in a trilogy.

 

ME2's much more guilty of this than ME3, though. ME3 actually did pull together plot points from both games into the finale. 

[Jaulen]

Moving on with my pet peeve list:
*snip*

Eavesdrop dialogue, NO! To passive for use in the Normandy and the Citadel. Having to pick dialogue options on the dialogue wheel forces the gamer to pay more attention to what us being said. The eavesdrop stuff felt in satisfying, I did not feel sufficiently involved in all the conversations, people where talking in my presence but they weren't talking to me. It got worse on the Citadel when it was npc's speaking, after a while I stopped listening to them because I just did not care, these were nameless/faceless people asking me to fetch random **** and they didn't even have the courtesy to talk to me 1 on 1. You want to use eavesdrop dialogue, use it for squad mates when they on hub world or during combat levels ( like they do in the DA games ), don't use it as the primary way to interact with everyone in the game.

*snip*

 

 

Well, to be fair the eavsdropping wasn't them asking you do do something for them, it was more of Shep overhearing something and then *finding* the item while out questing....and returning it to them.

 

What bothered me more was the *buttinsky* Shepard who when overhearing two people arguing about something decided to have a say....and both parties agreed with whatever side Shep took. (although I was O.o about that, I still did them....needed those war assets after all)

[Farangbaa]

I think we can safely conclude here ME2 should have been a different game.

[Raizo]

It's still important to remember.  if the attempt is for a "bittersweet" outcome, then it should be acknowledged that this is a moving target.  What's bittersweet for one will be an unmitigated tragedy to another, which will be a rainbows and unicorns ending for a third
 
Basically, it's a call for more varied endings.  Not just in worldstate, but in outcomes for the protagonist.

I can't remember which ME developer said this but one of the said that they learnt from the reactions to ME3's ending that there is a big difference to watching a film/TV show with a bittersweet ending and then having a ( supposedly interactive ) a game series where the gamer has invested 100's of hours of gameplay with a bittersweet ending. It is sliding scale or a moving target as you said. Maybe Shepard's death would have been better accepted if he had a chance to say good bye to his crew and it felt like a accomplished more at the end of the day. At the end of ME3 I felt like I had failed and my consolation prise was that I got to pick 1 of 3 terrible choices that I did not feel comfortable with and I went with he one that made me less sick to my stomach.

[dreamgazer]

I think we can safely conclude here ME2 should have been a different game.

 

Good luck with that train of thought. 

[Jaulen]

I can't remember which ME developer said this but one of the said that they learnt from the reactions to ME3's ending that there is a big difference to watching a film/TV show with a bittersweet ending and then having a ( supposedly interactive ) a game series where the gamer has invested 100's of hours of gameplay with a bittersweet ending. It is sliding scale or a moving target as you said. Maybe Shepard's death would have been better accepted if he had a chance to say good bye to his crew and it felt like a accomplished more at the end of the day. At the end of ME3 I felt like I had failed and my consolation prise was that I got to pick 1 of 3 terrible choices that I did not feel comfortable with and I went with he one that made me less sick to my stomach.

 

I would agree with this....

 

It's one of the reasons I liked the ending to DA:O. A choice how the game would end, including a number of 'bittersweet' choices.

 

Although with the ME series, I kind of figured that 99% of the time, no matter what Shep did, they were going to die, I went into ME3 expecting it. Shep was kind of a Messiah character. I just kind of hoped that if every choice had been done properly through all three games, and even possibly the story-DLC, that there was a *SLIM* and very unlikely chance that Shep would get the rainbows and unicorns ending and remain alive. (the ending fix extrapolation lets at least lets the high EMS destroy player assume that's what the scene ment).

 

And my first reaction when I hit the ending to ME3 (pre-fix) was "There has to be more" I fully expected that with how much hype the game had gotten, the online push, the ANN feeds on twitter/FB and the like, the app, that once the game released aouple of weeks later, they would be putting out ANN news flashes about the status of the war and Shepard, and then *bam* "Download the ending" (free ending 'dlc'). I was excited thinking "What a ballsy move! this would be video gaming HISTORY!" A true integration of what they were doing with the online stuff and the game.

I thought it would be possible due to the script leaks earlier in development, that they would want to keep the ending 'secret' until a little after release...since the game isn't released same day everywhere. My wishful thinking.

 

(oh, and the 'real' ending due to integration of RL and ingame as a PLANNED event.....not due to needing to re-write due to fan reactions)

[RoboticWater]

Reinstate the ME1 radar screen in the lower-right to show where enemies are (red triangles).   Also include the MAP screen for the bigger picture.  In some games (like Dead Space), you are given a 3D map that you can rotate & view from any direction.  This is awesome when navigating multiple floors (instead of the "stairs" icon -- duhh).

Reinstate mission TASK DETAILS (as in ME1 & ME2).  It was piecemeal & nonexistent in ME3.   Some games give an option to show the current objective HUD (one line).

 

Agreed, situational awareness and navigation should be a priority for the UI team. Dead Space is actually a perfect example. If Bioware isn't just full of hot air, then we're going to need some sort of topographical map and possibly a holographic path (similar to Dead Space's) to get around these supposed landscapes.

 

As for a mini map, I think Bioware  would only need one of their levels aren't very linear. So for God's sake Bioware, please need a mini map.

 

 

 

Reinstate the ME1 planet exploration missions.   That really gave some variety.   Prefer Mako over Hammerhead.  Heck, use both!  Scanning planets (ME2) for minerals was the biggest WASTE of time in any game.   Think about it:  the SR2 cost billions.   Resurrection of Shep cost billions -- yet we've got to fiddle fart scurrying around finding this & that to upgrade our hand-held weapons!  (ludicrous)

Hacking only when something important.

 

You bring up another good point; Bioware needs to throw out pointless tedium and half-baked ideas. I don't want to be scrounging around for resources so I can use the cool upgrade I found exploring a level. That's just a waste of my time. Same with the hacking mini-games. Bioware had it right in ME3, they just got rid of those lame matching games. Sure, they weren't that bad, but if there's no reason to have them in, don't waste time on them.

 

Of course, half-baked also covers exploration. I would much rather have 5 interesting, meduium sized planets with lots of stuff to do on them, than 10 large planets with practically nothing on them (no, surveying minerals doesn't count).

 

 

 

Show characters in CASUAL wear instead of ALWAYS same (usually combat) garb.   ME1 showed both.  Shep's apartment (ME3) was a good start -- but not quite there.

 

It's not a priority in my mind, but it makes squad mates seem more like real people. And anything that does that is certainly worth considering.

 

 

 

Tali's face plate *MUST* be transparent.  Remember 300 years ago they didn't wear suits.   Though in the flotilla she says "I've never shown my face to anyone".   Is she GOD?  Will we drop dead if we see her face?   Okay, if they're picky around other Quarians, then the face place can be temporarily obscure -- but around the rest of us -  CLEAR!   It would be really NICE if she had a special (germ-free) decontaminated private room where she could entertain visitors outside her suit.   Her immune systems are improving, aren't they? 

When it comes to Council, politicians, admirals, etc --  IRON-CLAD admission that they ROYALLY screwed up (or exposed as such).  I was really hoping at the start of ME3, that Shep would FINALLY get to tell the Alliance Command "You stupid idiots!  I told you so!"  Perhaps that was implied -- but it needed to be said explicitly.

 

Hopefully Bioware does neither of these because they won't be dealing with the old plotline.

 

But it reminds me. Bioware needs to stop trying so hard to be terrible. They had 2 options: show Tali's face or not. Somehow they found a 3rd, even worse option; take a stock image and photoshop it very poorly. So please Bioware, think about things before you do them.

 

 

 

How about some SURPRISES in the game?  Totally void in the entire trilogy.   Kaiden (ME1) could have at the last moment discovered an elevator & underground tram to take him a couple miles away while Shep and Saren blabbed for 3 minutes.   With all the planets surveyed & visited (ME2), you'd think Tali could have stumbled across some alien (Prothean) technology to bring her immune systems back to normal. IE: various Star Trek episodes.    How about a little PROGRESS folks  -- instead of the same old same old?

 

Though I approve of a more volatile plot, I don't really agree with your examples. The first would see like a cop out and the second would just add to the very long list of things attributed to Prothean magic. We don't need more deus ex machina.

 

But something like being betrayed by a squad member later on in the game, or being jumped by pirates while exploring out in space.

 

 

Team should be able to swap weapons (with each other) in the field (not just at the armory).

 

As long as it doesn't break the balance I'm down with it, though I'm with Bioware for now. Like other RPGs weapon restrictions are there mostly (if not entirely) to make sure no one class is too over powered. 

[AlanC9]

I do not consider planet scanning to be planet exploration. To me planet exploration is going somewhere and exploring it, with planet scanning you never leave the Normandy and you're not really getting an opportunity to see the sights that make each planet unique . All that we really get out of it is some text describing some of each planets history, we can get that with the scanning.

Then yank the whole thing. That would work too.

Sightseeing for sightseeing's sake doesn't strike me as being a useful investment of resources. I don't particularly mind ME1's implementation since I don't have to bother with that part of the game, and it was cheaply made. But no way would I have wanted that in ME2 or ME3 if I was actually getting something useful from landing on those planets.

[Steelcan]

plan ahead, know what your series is and is not

[AlanC9]

Although with the ME series, I kind of figured that 99% of the time, no matter what Shep did, they were going to die, I went into ME3 expecting it. Shep was kind of a Messiah character. I just kind of hoped that if every choice had been done properly through all three games, and even possibly the story-DLC, that there was a *SLIM* and very unlikely chance that Shep would get the rainbows and unicorns ending and remain alive. (the ending fix extrapolation lets at least lets the high EMS destroy player assume that's what the scene ment).

Of course it meant that. What else could it mean?

[dreamgazer]

Of course it meant that. What else could it mean?

 

That the designers made a glimpse at Shepard's demise to be the most difficult thing to obtain in the game, because morbidity.

[Heimdall]

For another tidbit, they should toss the Paragon/Renegade system. The artificial morality scale didn't really fit the setting (In KOTOR and Jade Empire, they were actually things that existed in the universe, not something that exists only for Shepard) and seemed awefully contrived, especially since the writers didn't seem certain exactly what they meant either.