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NWN Vault Restoration


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#101
MerricksDad

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Wait isnt DnD 3.5 open? Or this applies only for a paper version? What about Pathfinder then?

 

Also - if it would still needed the NWN1 to be installed - wouldnt that count only as a fan mod rather than new game?

 

There must be way around that...

 

The big obvious thing with this engine clone idea is that you are only cloning the engine. If you don't release it as a dnd-based engine, and you don't actually release the original NWN content with it, then it is not actually within their ability and rights to claim you can't do it.

 

As an example, say you take everything we know about aurora engine from the outside, without any of us but maybe two people having any knowledge of the actual code inside the engine. Since we are not actually using their protected code (engine code, not script in game), then we are safe because it has to be entirely written from scratch. Furthermore, we don't have access to their exact engine specs, so for like Xoreos, the graphics engine has to be build from scratch and no matter how close it looks to NWN, they can't own it or get you for it.

 

So then what you do is release one of our custom content modules with the open source so it can be used, or alternately, offer no out of the box module at all.

 

What I would also suggest doing is offer multiple engine specs that could be modified, and those specs alone could correct some of the various variants NWN has in relation to DND 3.0/3.5. Also, by offering a set of specs you can choose from, some being similar to Steve Jackson games, or some being similar to d20, or some custom stuff similar to old Final Fantasy engine specs, you could very easily avoid the entire possibility that you might step on WoTC/Hasbro toes.

 

Since bioware released the file specs for their own file formats, there is nothing that says we can't have a 3rd party program that can open their files. Nor did they ever specify that we could not write their file types. Furthermore, there is nothing that says we cannot modify and improve their file types by adding a footer, or header extension, instantly making their file type into our custom file type, removing it from speculation.

 

As 3RavensMore has mentioned, a big hurdle may be finding the set of people who can actually stomach putting work into a clone of an old engine. I know of at least one who has attempted to tackle that very thing before. Others apparently did the same around the same time and I never knew them. Had we simply shared resources during that time, we'd already have been done.

 

Back in early 2000's, I used the Aurora file type descriptions to further chop away at the inner workings of their old Infinity engine. Some of the file types were almost exactly the same. What I did was then create a duplicate of the infinity engine, in nothing more than visual basic 6, with no better graphics assist than directX. It had a few +1's to the infinity engine, in that I could scale BAM animations, and as long as they started as images of even integer sizes, and ended the same, everything was fine. I also improved the conversations a bit, and made some modifications to how equipable items worked in relation to applied effects. After I got bored with that final, but not quite perfect engine, I moved onto trying to duplicate the Aurora, but didn't get as far as the guys working on Xoreos.

 

I am not certain Xoreos is the best choice, but as anybody looking at it can see, it is basically finished minus animation sequences and scripting(er...well...the engine graphics could be much smoother and shaded properly). I know of quite a few people that could get a c# script engine going fairly quickly by simply absorbing those in other open source projects. The NwScript library is fully documented, so duplicating its base functions should be very easy. I would go so far as to change the entire script set and then duplicate NW's functions as secondary calls. Many prefer a more object oriented approach, where you simply ask for data via object.subclass.variable and have set/get methods build for everything, with certain exceptions where needed to prevent misconduct during play. Actually, the work they put into the NwScript engine was actually made harder many fold by dumbing it down and locking certain aspects away from the user (like crit hooks, and direct access to object collections).

 

Edit: oh and network solutions are missing, as well as code to handle object ghosts

 

In all seriousness, I find writing code to produce a larger product more personally rewarding than I do making a 3D model, and doing models gets me pretty happy.



#102
Carcerian

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id love to see a zDoom/WinQuake type client (were they ported over linux improvements to dos/win platforms)

 

there are 2 major hurdles:

 

Source code: they still haven't released nwn's source code (and probably wont, since many major modern  3d games are actually based on the evolution of Aurora the bioware nwn engine, using same/similar style of mdls, tga/dds, armor/body slots, vfx, tilesets, etc.)

 

Programming:  The most successful attempt of a nwn client stalled out when they couldn't find a descent Directx/OpenGl gfx programmer.

Also, new code should be multi-core-friendly/multi-threaded (esp server code) so someone experienced there is a must as well.



#103
MerricksDad

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My concern was that anything I wrote for it would not be usable on all platforms. And I don't know how to go about that. I also know jack about openGL. I thought directX was convoluted but easy in the end. Newer sdk versions are probably better.



#104
MannyJabrielle

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As far as I recall, the d20 open game license restricts primarily things inherently "wotc dungeons&dragons", that is official campaign settings, names, logos, ect.  For example, such a project couldn't be called "Neverwinter Nights Rebirth" or such... and PrCs like "Purple Dragon Knights" would be out due to it being propriety of the forgotten realms campaign setting.

 

Here's a copy of the open game license page I found on d20srd.org:

OPEN GAME LICENSE Version 1.0a
The following text is the property of Wizards of the Coast, Inc. and is Copyright 2000 Wizards of the Coast, Inc ("Wizards"). All Rights Reserved.

Definitions:
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"Distribute" means to reproduce, license, rent, lease, sell, broadcast, publicly display, transmit or otherwise distribute;
"Open Game Content" means the game mechanic and includes the methods, procedures, processes and routines to the extent such content does not embody the Product Identity and is an enhancement over the prior art and any additional content clearly identified as Open Game Content by the Contributor, and means any work covered by this License, including translations and derivative works under copyright law, but specifically excludes Product Identity.
"Product Identity" means product and product line names, logos and identifying marks including trade dress; artifacts; creatures characters; stories, storylines, plots, thematic elements, dialogue, incidents, language, artwork, symbols, designs, depictions, likenesses, formats, poses, concepts, themes and graphic, photographic and other visual or audio representations; names and descriptions of characters, spells, enchantments, personalities, teams, personas, likenesses and special abilities; places, locations, environments, creatures, equipment, magical or supernatural abilities or effects, logos, symbols, or graphic designs; and any other trademark or registered trademark clearly identified as Product identity by the owner of the Product Identity, and which specifically excludes the Open Game Content;
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#105
Lazarus Magni

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Bless you Rolo.



#106
Verilazic

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I did nothing but give myself a headache trying to learn openGL. =(



#107
Gruftlord

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I was in mid-moonlight-module-migration when i noticed it go down, http://vnfiles.ign.com/ fileserver layer for the IGN vaut, its the part that failed second last night, screenshots went first, about 15 min before, and main page gfx went down a little bit after rest (~2:00 AM PST or so)

 

Rolo said something main folder was ~ 558 GB i think or so? (off-hand guess)

So Half a Terra-Byte or 5580 MB?

 

Your upload speed will most likely be 20-30% as fast as download rating if lucky, or 10% average, if that...

 

Check your UP/DOWN ratio with a few internet speed tests to measure your "real" connection rates: https://www.google.c...rnet speed test

 

Just for a fast local ISP ping/up/down test, im trying http://www.speedtest.net:  I averaged ping 7, standard for a near-ish ISP , but while I am

@ a promised 30 Mega-Byte-Per-Second, testing to a city 10 miles away, im getting 9.45 Mbps raw DL speed, and 4.31 mbps raw upload speed.

(my aging router's ceiling slows dl speeds, but not upload, so im getting speeds @ a little more than 30% download and 15% upload rate ATM)

 

The rule-of-thumb is to expect only 10-50% of what your ISP claims the connection speed is, as far as DL speeds go, and expect upload to be around 5-25% rated speed tops realistically...

 

timex_sinclair_1000_ad.jpg

 

(The old 56k dial-up modem that gave only 5-10k

actual dl speed still pretty much also todays same

1/5-10 ratio, unless you live next door to your isp)

 i get 93 Mbps (i think thats bit with a small b here, not byte which would be a big B, in germany at least, connection speeds are listed in bits per second) down 66 up to the next city, and 50Mbps down 11 up to a sever in NYC. i'm here on campus in Konstanz (southern germany) during work hours. sure, it takes a while for 500 GB (and i currently lack the space for the whole vault), but maybe if we started sharing, we could get a small seeder network up in a few days, which would get the vault spread around within a few weeks, and then more people could start uploading.

 

alternativelly: rolo are the 500GB compressed or uncompressed? i think if they come down to a more reasonable size when compressed, it may be futile to upload compressed archieves to a host like mega, so people could get it. you may need a few days to upload during night hours or something, but then more people could help with uploading.



#108
Carcerian

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Some surprisingly good sounding news (from modules post)

 

Some extremely and unexpectedly good news: IGN co-founder and General Manager Peer Schneider, who I'd tagged on my tweet, replied to it with the following:

 

"We were surprised, too. Technical issue + unfortunate redirect. Hopefully we can restore!"

 

His reply also went to the others in IGN management that I'd tagged on my tweet.

 

While I don't think this means for certain that the Vault will be restored (there is still that word "hopefully" in his response), this is the most positive news I've seen yet.

 


#109
Rolo Kipp

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<popping up again...>

 

Just a screenie I haven't seen posted recently where Bioware explicitly encourages 3rd part "enhancements and tools":

dakT6dm.png

 

Also, while it is no where near as far along as xoreos in many respects, I am very interested in using the jMonkeyEngine for a cross-platform, opensource engine that uses both nwn1 & 2 resources. 

 

<...like a bad penny>


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