173 réponses à ce sujet

[TheLittleBird]

Yeah I agree with completely.

If all mages wondered around freely without and templars to accompany them, it wouldnt be long before a lot of them would be attacked by supersticous peasents. This would probably end with either the mage, the peasants or both dead.

Minor spoiler for asunder:

Spoiler

We saw this in asunder with Rhys and co in the tavern while traveling. If Evangeline hadnt been there it probably would have ended with bloodshed.

 

That's not necessarily a problem with the mages themselves, though, but how most non-mages view them. And that'd have to change as well. See, a system like I suggested could never work if the 'common people' are dehumanize mages and see them as nothing more than a threat.

[DrBlingzle]

Of course not i or they would be dumb if i did or they did and well i never expected that from them .It is kill or be killed i treat mages as darkspawn in fact darkspawn is their own creation so well...

 

Well there's hypcritical an then there's this...

[Schreckstoff]

You do as i said broken circle shows that perfectly that you do as well kirkwall. It is like saying that we don't police all we need is weekly cuddle sessions.Mages are extremely vulnerable because of personal power they have and unstable because demonic possession. So nope it was shown in tevinter what it happens when mages end in charge...

You fixate simply on them getting more freedom all the while ignoring the changing circumstances that come with them. Society is the best available regulatory system known to man. Broken Circle happened because of oppression it just escalated because of ambition. Kirkwall had the worst circle and Templar order in all of Thedas.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Well there's hypcritical an then there's this...

It is pretty much what soldiers do i don't see that anyone have problem with that... 

 

 

 

You fixate simply on them getting more freedom all the while ignoring the changing circumstances that come with them. Society is the best available regulatory system known to man. Broken Circle happened because of oppression it just escalated because of ambition. Kirkwall had the worst circle and Templar order in all of Thedas.

 

I love how peoples use word oppression toward guys that live in luxurious conditions well one of the best that peoples in thedas have... please what oppression ulrded just wanted study demonology and his other sinister studies without fear of consequences like mages in tevinter he was arrogant power hungry ah*** nothing more... 

 

Yeah we had 2 abusive templars shown in comprasion to army of insane and power hungry mages that only few be shown motives "because i was abused by templars"

[mikeymoonshine]

Arguing with TKS is a waste of time. 

 

Umm I dunno tbh, I picked "slightly less" because I do believe mages need to be trained and the policing of mages should be more than the policing of mundanes. I don't think they all need to be kept in the circle though, once they can handle their powers and if they are considered sensible and trustworthy enough they should be let free. Keep the Templars to watch over the mages, destroy abominations and hunt the one's that do evil things (like killing people). 

 

I would also take control of the circles away from the chantry but idk the Mages can't be the only ones who run them, maybe they could be overseen by government or something. 

[DrBlingzle]

That's not necessarily a problem with the mages themselves, though, but how most non-mages view them. And that'd have to change as well. See, a system like I suggested could never work if the 'common people' are dehumanize mages and see them as nothing more than a threat.

Yeah, I never claimed the mages were at fault. It's probably mainly due to the chantry constantly going on about the "perils and evils of Magic". That and humans have almost always feared and hated anything which is different. I think an effort by the chantry must be taken to instead teach tolerance and mainly hammer home the  fact that mages are just like anyone else except with exceptional powers and should not be hated for that.

[Kimarous]

Yeah because buddy system worked well with Thrask or Evangeline...  it will make templars only more blined on things that "their" mage is doing by being emotional invested in them not mention it will give even more room for abuse...

 

1) I have no idea who Evangeline is.

2) Thrask's instance took place in Kirkwall, which was a lost cause even before Hawke arrived.

3) As ideal as the notion seems in hindsight, I don't expect it could be instituted at this stage. More of a "what if" idea.

[DrBlingzle]

I would also take control of the circles away from the chantry but idk the Mages can't be the only ones who run them, maybe they could be overseen by government or something. 

 

Well how about a certain organisation originally made to defend against demons 'n ****. Maybe one which name starts with "I" and ends with "N"...

[TheKomandorShepard]

Yeah, I never claimed the mages were at fault. It's probably mainly due to the chantry constantly going on about the "perils and evils of Magic". That and humans have almost always feared and hated anything which is different. I think an effort by the chantry must be taken to instead teach tolerance and mainly hammer home the  fact that mages are just like anyone else except with exceptional powers and should not be hated for that.

This isn't truth well not entirely we saw pretty much that population rather often is victim of disasters that mages cause for example redcliffe , blackmarshes , meredith sister that killed 72 peoples, conspiracy in dawn of the seeker, destructive qunari mage in dragon age redemption , blight ,insane blood mages in da 2 , tevinter empire and much more...

 

So blaming chantry is rather out of place it is not that what they are speaking is lie and not that mages deserved love from population...

 

 

 

1) I have no idea who Evangeline is.

2) Thrask's instance took place in Kirkwall, which was a lost cause even before Hawke arrived.

3) As ideal as the notion seems in hindsight, I don't expect it could be instituted at this stage. More of a "what if" idea.

1)Well she is templar in asunder that betrayed templars because of her relations with mage and caused (partly) mage templar war.

2)Well pretty much ferelden wasn't different in that matter and as we saw in dai it didn't chancge corruption will always exist as demonic possession emotional investment always will make you blind and on those.  

3)Well it wouldn't face reality as i said you can't force someone to like someone and if you do in that case often will lead to tragedy...

[DrBlingzle]

1) I have no idea who Evangeline is.

Character in Asunder. Templar moderate.

[mikeymoonshine]

Well how about a certain organisation originally made to defend against demons 'n ****. Maybe one which name starts with "I" and ends with "N"...

 

Good idea. I just think The Chantry does more harm than good with their anti mage rhetoric. You would have to pick an organization that was least likely to be corrupted by either side and have systems in place to remove corrupt leaders from power if that did happen. We don't want another Impirium but we also don't want someone like Meredith in charge. 

[Schreckstoff]

This isn't truth well not entirely we saw pretty much that population rather often is victim of disasters that mages cause for example redcliffe , blackmarshes , meredith sister that killed 72 peoples, conspiracy in dawn of the seeker, destructive qunari mage in dragon age redemption , blight ,insane blood mages in da 2 , tevinter empire and much more...

 

So blaming chantry is rather out of place it is not that what they are speaking is lie and not that mages deserved love from population...

Redcliffe once again was a result of oppression of mages...

[TheKomandorShepard]

Redcliffe once again was a result of oppression of mages...

Yeah i saw that poor mages attached to the trees and torured by templars ups it was only my dream or perhaps yours?

[DrBlingzle]

Redcliffe once again was a result of oppression of mages...

Try not to argue with him. I know its hard but trust me you'll have better chances trying to teach a rock the concept of democracy.

[Uccio]

Tevinter Imperium must return to its former glory and all those peasants will know their place.

[Kimarous]

Redcliffe once again was a result of oppression of mages...

 

Unless you're talking about a different instance, can you really classify Connor's situation as "oppression of mages"? More like "overprotective mother indirectly caused her son to get possessed, which then oppressed the people." Demonic oppression more than mage oppression.

[Schreckstoff]

Yeah i saw that poor mages attached to the trees and torured by templars ups it was only my dream or perhaps yours?

Great idea argue about a situation we have no idea about  and title it Redcliffe despite a prior fully explored incident involving mages already having happened in Redcliffe.

 

I'll take DrBlingzle's advice and stop arguing though.

 

 

Unless you're talking about a different instance, can you really classify Connor's situation as "oppression of mages"? More like "overprotective mother indirectly caused her son to get possessed, which then oppressed the people." Demonic oppression more than mage oppression.

She was overprotective because Connor would have been taken from her and it'd have been doubtful if she were to see him ever again nor if he'd survive the Harrowing.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Try not to argue with him. I know its hard but trust me you'll have better chances trying to teach a rock the concept of democracy.

Well teaching something and telling lies that mages were oppressed in ferelden are two different things show me 3 examples of mages being oppressed in dao...

 

 

 

Great idea argue about a situation we have no idea about  and title it Redcliffe despite a prior fully explored incident involving mages already having happened in Redcliffe.

 

I'll take DrBlingzle's advice and stop arguing though.

 

There is no oppression at all for you same question as above where you have those oppressed mages and how they are oppressed? Connor situation was because his mother refused take him to the circle because she didn't want lost him... Not mention it doesn't have any sense in spite of what i have said as it was reasons why population hate mages...

[Schreckstoff]

Well teaching something and telling lies that mages were oppressed in ferelden are two different things show me 3 examples of mages being oppressed in dao...

 

 

 

 

There is no oppression at all for you same question as above where you have those oppressed mages and how they are oppressed? Connor situation was because his mother refused take him to the circle because she didn't want lost him... Not mention it doesn't have any sense in spite of what i have said as it was reasons why population hate mages...

Oppression is the exercise of authority or power in a burdensome, cruel, or unjust manner.

 

Taken from your home, taken from your family, permanent house arrest, forcefully undergoing a ritual that could cost you your life, forcefully made tranquil (which equals slavery), ...

[KainD]

Since I am always a mage when I roleplay, my answer is mages should rule.

[TheKomandorShepard]

 

Oppression is the exercise of authority or power in a burdensome, cruel, or unjust manner.

 

Taken from your home, taken from your family, permanent house arrest, forcefully undergoing a ritual that could cost you your life, forcefully made tranquil (which equals slavery), ...

 

So if child is taken form mother by court it is oppression? So prisons are oppresive as well?

Not mention that every circle practice is "justified" and have reason behind that... and no devs said already that circle isn't slavery same rule for tranquil...

and it is for those who can't handle harrowing not mention that harrowing is single moment in ther lives...

[Chernaya]

I chose freedom. We've seen how well the other methods "work". But to be honest it's more a morality issue for me than that or anything else. 

[Incantrix]

Keep the circles. Give the mages more Autonomy. 

 

-Make it law that all children attend the circle (just like they already do)

 

-Allow parents to visit their children at any time, Send them things and visitations with a Templar chaperon for a limited time. 

 

-Circles train the children till they are of age, let's say...18

 

-Go through the harrowing. If the mage doesn't make it, tranquilize him like usual

 

-If the student makes it through the harrowing, allow the mage to live out in with the public with their families or on their own while their phylacteries are still within reach within the circle should they need to be tracked

 

-Also allow the option of the mage to stay within the circle for free to live as a tutor, teacher and other magical studies beneficial to thedas

 

-Allow noble mages to retain their status, however, he/she cannot be put into a place of authority (like king, queen, Viscount, etc) but can still remain nobles, prince and princesses. This is for their own good, to prevent any backlash from having a mage as a King or Viscount.

 

-Maintain a council of magi to discuss issues, new magics, chantry-mage relations, etc.

 

In this case. Less apostates because they'd realize they'd be living an oppression free life while learning how to control their magic. Happier mages because nobles get to stay noble and regular mages get to have families while being able to control their magic.

 

And the best part! NO BLOOD MAGIC. As we've seen from non-tevinter mages: Blood magic was always a last resort out of desperation. In this case, mages have no need to be desperate.

[Schreckstoff]

So if child is taken form mother by court it is oppression? So prisons are oppresive as well?

Not mention that every circle practice is "justified" and have reason behind that... and no devs said already that circle isn't slavery same rule for tranquil...

and it is for those who can't handle harrowing not mention that harrowing is single moment in ther lives...

Unjust not illegal, you seem to have problems with the meaning of words. 

 

Just because the law permits it doesn't make it not oppression or would you say Jews weren't oppressed for hundreds of years, women aren't oppressed in Islamic many countries?

 

Prison is for those who have shown they are dangerous for society by their own actions. A child is taken from its mother in case the mother is considered a danger for the child. 

[TheKomandorShepard]

Unjust not illegal, you seem to have problems with the meaning of words. 

 

Just because the law permits it doesn't make it not oppression or would you say Jews weren't oppressed for hundreds of years, women aren't oppressed in Islamic many countries?

 

Prison is for those who have shown they are dangerous for society by their own actions. A child is taken from its mother in case the mother is considered a danger for the child. 

Legal and justified isn't the same... as i said there is good reason for everything in circle so well it is justified as everything have reason behind it...

 

As i said there is no oppression it isn't law thing it is it have reason behind it not just because well woman are worse because... everything is to keep control over mages.

Same is with mages they showed they are always danger to society no matter their motives circles are to separate them from normal peoples that mages are danger for and protect non-mages when it comes to magical threats.If there was nuke-man i would bet that he would end same as mages did...

 

Simple child is taken from mother because child is danger for everyone around (which is true as connor and meredith sister show) where they are teaching how to have better control over their dangerous nature and put onto tests to show if they have at least small chance of resist their dangerous nature if not they have choice die or live as tranquil for sake of society... so please...