153429 réponses à ce sujet

[Amriah]

The wolfy dragon fresco made me wonder if Solas could take a dragon form too, since that seems to have been something the elven gods could do.  (Angsty boss battle incoming...?)

 

Really loved the bits of artwork around the maps.  My favorites were the mosaics, the first time I saw them in that temple in the Emerald Graves I went around admiring them all.

 

Shhhh no, no angsty sad boss battle please. My poor heart.

 

And the mosaics were great. I spent a lot of time just looking, and then admiring the elven warrior booty paintings in places like the Emerald Graves and the Exalted Plains.

[scintilla]

You guys can be pessimistic and doubtful, but someone, SOMEONE has to have hope, that someone shall be me...I'm good at having hope.

 

We need your optimism, Ajna!

 

I never know when people say they're going to make him an "antagonist" if they're talking about making him the Big Bad or just opposed to the protagonist. The former to me seems impossible - it's too easy to be sympathetic to Solas' character. The latter is probable, though I hope we have an option for him to not be an antagonist. What if my Lavellan thinks it's a great idea to bring back the old gods? She can agree with him on pretty much everything else (blood magic, fade stuff, veil stuff); I'd feel a bit weird if they suddenly made it so I must oppose him unless he's now doing something very, very bad.

 

Would she really want to bring the old gods back after Solas's stories about them in the Temple of Mythal?

 

Cheap as it is, they may be using the "ran off and turns out he was lying about everything lol" ending to justify every Inquisitor not trusting him. He was acting kinda sketchy before he disappeared.

 

Well if his goal is to bring back the old gods/how things were before, that's all sorts of bad for current Thedas.

 

He could be a Big Bad at this point. Whatever he did in the epilogue could've changed him entirely, if that's where Bioware wants to take it. They gave themselves a lot of options (and us a lot of maddening questions, darnit). But I'm fairly positive he'll be on the opposition one way or another. It would be nice to be able to be like "lover boy I would've helped you if you'd asked." 

 

The ambiguity of the stinger gives them lots of room to take the story in whatever direction they want, that's true. I'm hoping they don't reduce Solas to hammy villainy though. If they do take it in that direction, I hope he stays a complex character.

[caridounette]

I feel like Solas learned a lesson from his mistake with Arlathan (whatever that was) but it may not have necessarily been the lesson he needed to learn? Another poster here (madrar?) called it a painful lack of foresight. For someone so intelligent and open minded, he has some impressive blind spots. That's kind of how I see pretty much the entire present for him? His culture was terrible too, he acknowledges this, but he can see the virtues in it. He can't see any virtues in the present for all that he's picked out all of its flaws. I think he's maybe not trying as hard as he could because there's a longing for his time and culture that's clouding his view. If it's true, I'd feel a lot of sympathy for him but at the same time he needs to change.

 

We're certainly hoping that's the case. I'm a pessimist so I'm expecting him to be an antagonist or even more messed up the next time he shows up. Or die. There are a lot of ways this whole thing could go very wrong.

 

He does grab the imagination and run, doesn't he?

 

What you wrote made me think 

 

Maybe were taking the character fron the wrong angle by trying to say 'he's not that bad'.

 

Maybe he used to be that bad. Maybe he used to be an ass of a god, selfish, always getting his way, tricking people. He got annoyed of people not thinking for themselves and locked the gods away so they would have to stop killing each other for bs reasons. 

 

Then 1000 years of Fade and learning, meeting spirits that could teach him virtues. So his compassionate side might have grown, but he never got to practice it for real either. Its like, you know he wants to help the poor and such... he just isnt someone you feel has ever walked in the mud with them. He jsut saw the aftermaths and learned from it.

 

Anyhow, the Solas you get in Inquisition might be his best attempt at understanding others, however flawed it is. And he might actually have made lots of progress from his starting point.

 

You dont see him change his stance that much during the course of the game but he tries. He takes tiny chances then falls back. I dont know how immortal gods learn, but maybe they need to be proved wrong more then once to erase a millenium of believing to be right?

 

All that to say, as flawed a man Solas is, maybe hes actually quite open minded  for a god? 

[TheComfyCat]

The ambiguity of the stinger gives them lots of room to take the story in whatever direction they want, that's true. I'm hoping they don't reduce Solas to hammy villainy though. If they do take it in that direction, I hope he stays a complex character.

 

Well, Patrick Weekes hasn't let me down so far. I trust him to write something awesome, even if it ends up being heart-wrenching. Solas's character is about shades of grey and moral ambiguity, so I don't think there's any way Weekes will reduce him to hammy villainy. Weekes seems as attached to his characters as we are.

 

I just have this weird? hope that there's no way to actually kill Solas. It just doesn't sit right with me that the great Fen'Harel could be gone forever. He's such a complex and interesting part of Dragon Age lore. Even if the PC has the option to fight him, I hope he has plot armor, a la Morrigan/ Leliana. 

[scintilla]

All that to say, as flawed a man Solas is, maybe hes actually quite open minded  for a god? 

 

That's a really good point. Or even potentially for an ancient elf, who did everything incredibly slowly. He may actually be learning pretty well for someone used to things like spells taking years.

[Amriah]

What you wrote made me think 

 

Maybe were taking the character fron the wrong angle by trying to say 'he's not that bad'.

 

Maybe he used to be that bad. Maybe he used to be an ass of a god, selfish, always getting his way, tricking people. He got annoyed of people not thinking for themselves and locked the gods away so they would have to stop killing each other for bs reasons. 

 

Then 1000 years of Fade and learning, meeting spirits that could teach him virtues. So his compassionate side might have grown, but he never got to practice it for real either. Its like, you know he wants to help the poor and such... he just isnt someone you feel has ever walked in the mud with them. He jsut saw the aftermaths and learned from it.

 

Anyhow, the Solas you get in Inquisition might be his best attempt at understanding others, however flawed it is. And he might actually have made lots of progress from his starting point.

 

You dont see him change his stance that much during the course of the game but he tries. He takes tiny chances then falls back. I dont know how immortal gods learn, but maybe they need to be proved wrong more then once to erase a millenium of believing to be right?

 

All that to say, as flawed a man Solas is, maybe hes actually quite open minded  for a god? 

 

That's a really good point. Or even potentially for an ancient elf, who did everything incredibly slowly. He may actually be learning pretty well for someone used to things like spells taking years.

 

You two are amazing. I really like this angle on his character.

[cleosilver]

I never know when people say they're going to make him an "antagonist" if they're talking about making him the Big Bad or just opposed to the protagonist. The former to me seems impossible - it's too easy to be sympathetic to Solas' character. The latter is probable, though I hope we have an option for him to not be an antagonist. What if my Lavellan thinks it's a great idea to bring back the old gods? She can agree with him on pretty much everything else (blood magic, fade stuff, veil stuff); I'd feel a bit weird if they suddenly made it so I must oppose him unless he's now doing something very, very bad.

 

My Lavellan was wondering about this ever since the Fade stuff at Adamant. After all, if the anchor can rip open the veil and let her walk in the fade physically could it do the same to the barriers locking away the Elven Gods? Then she started wondering if that was a good idea and if doing so would release the Forgotten ones aswell since they were trapped at the same time and maybe the loss of the gods was the price that had to be paid to get rid of those. Then she started feeling guilty that her people were so busy cursing Fen'Harel for locking their Gods away that they never remembered to thank him for getting rid of the Forgotten ones. Then when she wanted to ask her resisdent elven/fade/magic expert about her thoughts all he wanted to do was talk about Coryfish.

 By this time her head was hurting so she ended up deciding to put up a little Fen'Harel statue outside the Skyhold gates like her Clan used to do and talk to that instead, at least that way she could say thank you for locking the bad guys away. But first she has to go and play nice with the nobles at court all the while pretendig she doesn't know they think her kind are less than the mud on their oh so expensive jewelled slippers, and stop a power hungrey wanna be god from tearing down the walls of the world, and isn't that was she was debating doing earlier and this is why her head just will not stop hurting.

 

i think the poor lass just thinks too much sometimes. 

[kalasaurus]

Woah, just tried a new... uh, flirt... with Blackwall... I lol'ed pretty hard at it XD

 

Lavellan: You're oddly charming for a man I found wandering the forest.

Blackwall: I always thought myself more odd than charming, but I'll take a compliment from a lady.  They're hard to come by these days.

Lavellan: You can have more if you like.  I store them in my private quarters.

Blackwall: Wow, I...uh.  Well (Coughs.)  I was not expecting that.

[Cosmia]

I can see some of our Levellan's feeling this way about Solas after the breakup, though it doesn't apply 100%. 

 

Spoiler

 

[Cezelle]

Woah, just tried a new... uh, flirt... with Blackwall... I lol'ed pretty hard at it XD

 

Lavellan: You're oddly charming for a man I found wandering the forest.

Blackwall: I always thought myself more odd than charming, but I'll take a compliment from a lady.  They're hard to come by these days.

Lavellan: You can have more if you like.  I store them in my private quarters.

Blackwall: Wow, I...uh.  Well (Coughs.)  I was not expecting that.

 

Ha! I'm getting flashbacks of DA2. Wow, I'd rather talk about indomitable focuses being dominated 

[Hedinve]

O.o Kalalala, I'm getting the impression Solas is the only one you can flirt with without sounding like a creep. I'm still reeling from flirting with Cullen. "Hello person I met five minutes ago, drop your breeches now!!!"

[amranthe]

I was left with the impression we got so little of Solas because too many questions/conversations would lead to too many suspicions, opportunities for more questions, and it may have resulted in fewer people being surprised by the stinger. There were so many times when my character would've wanted to call him out on his fishiness (much like you could with Blackwall.) In any case, I kind of hope that wasn't the case, because that's a bit of a cop out... so I'll carry on convincing myself it was a matter of time/budget. I respect PW and all he's done with his characters. 

 

That may be true. It was funny, on my first play through I noticed how many codices kept popping up about the ancient elven gods, there are wolf statues EVERYWHERE (not just in the Exalted Plains or Emerald Graves either), there were several times Fen'harel was specifically mentioned, and how he tricked the gods, etc. So by the end I'm thinking... man this game is kinda elfy, as Sera would say. Then the temple of Mythal happened, and there's a specific convo with Morrigan about the Fen'harel statue, and Solas chimes in, and I'm just like... yea something's going on here with this Fen'harel guy.

 

Now, I knew by then BW was already planning a "Fen'harel wasn't really a bad guy" plot. This seemed obvious to me. So I shrugged and went along with it. 

 

Then the stinger, and I was just like haahahahahaha why didn't I see this sooner? There are so many clues, but damn.

 

I think it helps you to understand how your own Inquisitor could be fooled for so long. Pretty meta really

 

This is GORGEOUS but I'm also a little sad because I was going to have a tarot commission done...of exactly this. XD BUGGER.

 

Random thought on Solas:

 

He lies. A lot. Through his teeth. So when Lavellan asks...begs him to lie about his intentions, he won't. He will not lie about how he feels. The one thing he does not lie about, and it's his love for Lavellan. 

 

ohgodithurts

 

It's weird but I personally don't think he lies, not really, anyway. I've tried to pay attention on subsequent playthroughs, and I don't think anything he says is an outright lie. He says he's an apostate, this is true. He says he lived in a small village, but spent most of his time dreaming in the Fade, I assume this is true based on Leliana's findings. Everything he knows and shares about ancient lore he says he learned from the Fade, which must be at least partially true (omitting that he lived through it isn't really a lie). When he tells you about the orb, he says it must be elven, and nothing he says is a lie, he just doesn't reveal that he knows *exactly* what it is, and that it's his.

 

I guess my point is, he's a master at the Game, and he never really lies. Which is why I personally think it makes his breakup scene all the more heart-wrenching, because even still, after everything, he refuses to sacrifice his ideals and lie to you, even though maybe that would be best in the long run.

 

I dunno, just the way I see it.

[kalasaurus]

O.o Kalalala, I'm getting the impression Solas is the only one you can flirt with without sounding like a creep. I'm still reeling from flirting with Cullen. "Hello person I met five minutes ago, drop your breeches now!!!"

 

The first flirt with Cullen isn't so bad (and the goofy Inquisitor smile is pretty priceless even with Cullen's reaction), but asking about if he is chaste or not is a bit much O.o

[Tielis]

That may be true. It was funny, on my first play through I noticed how many codices kept popping up about the ancient elven gods, there are wolf statues EVERYWHERE (not just in the Exalted Plains or Emerald Graves either), there were several times Fen'harel was specifically mentioned, and how he tricked the gods, etc. So by the end I'm thinking... man this game is kinda elfy, as Sera would say. Then the temple of Mythal happened, and there's a specific convo with Morrigan about the Fen'harel statue, and Solas chimes in, and I'm just like... yea something's going on here with this Fen'harel guy.

 

Now, I knew by then BW was already planning a "Fen'harel wasn't really a bad guy" plot. This seemed obvious to me. So I shrugged and went along with it. 

 

Then the stinger, and I was just like haahahahahaha why didn't I see this sooner? There are so many clues, but damn.

 

I think it helps you to understand how your own Inquisitor could be fooled for so long. Pretty meta really

 

 

It's weird but I personally don't think he lies, not really, anyway. I've tried to pay attention on subsequent playthroughs, and I don't think anything he says is an outright lie. He says he's an apostate, this is true. He says he lived in a small village, but spent most of his time dreaming in the Fade, I assume this is true based on Leliana's findings. Everything he knows and shares about ancient lore he says he learned from the Fade, which must be at least partially true (omitting that he lived through it isn't really a lie). When he tells you about the orb, he says it must be elven, and nothing he says is a lie, he just doesn't reveal that he knows *exactly* what it is, and that it's his.

 

I guess my point is, he's a master at the Game, and he never really lies. Which is why I personally think it makes his breakup scene all the more heart-wrenching, because even still, after everything, he refuses to sacrifice his ideals and lie to you, even though maybe that would be best in the long run.

 

I dunno, just the way I see it.

 

Lying by omission is still lying in my book.

[Missy_MI]

I've also got a treat for you guys. Was playing with Flycam today and made a whole bunch of snapshots. If you're interested, you guys can see them here: http://s1382.photobu...with Flycam Fun

I love this thread and I'll never catch up, but just wanted to say thanks for those snapshots! I swear, all the romance scenes with Solas look like they are from a freaking painting. The softly falling snow, sun behind the mountains, waterfalls. Just beautiful.

 

Also, I really love the English-accented Inquis voice in those scenes (Alex Wilton Regan?). Her voice gets all sweet and soft, it fits perfectly with the body language. And when Solas is hurt in battle her 'Solas needs help!' scream sounds genuinely panicked. Good stuff.

 

Has anyone tried romancing Solas using the American-accented voice (Sumalee Montano)? I've started a new play through but am trying to avoid Solas at all costs.

[kalasaurus]

Lying by omission is still lying in my book.

 

Lavellan: Why didn't you tell me you were Fen'Harel!?!?

Solas: ...You never asked?

 

Maybe Solas has a thing or two in common with Alistair XD

[Hedinve]

That's the one who had me hiding under a blanket for 15 minutes. Sumalees voice did not make it any better!

[Amriah]

It's weird but I personally don't think he lies, not really, anyway. I've tried to pay attention on subsequent playthroughs, and I don't think anything he says is an outright lie. He says he's an apostate, this is true. He says he lived in a small village, but spent most of his time dreaming in the Fade, I assume this is true based on Leliana's findings. Everything he knows and shares about ancient lore he says he learned from the Fade, which must be at least partially true (omitting that he lived through it isn't really a lie). When he tells you about the orb, he says it must be elven, and nothing he says is a lie, he just doesn't reveal that he knows *exactly* what it is, and that it's his.

 

I guess my point is, he's a master at the Game, and he never really lies. Which is why I personally think it makes his breakup scene all the more heart-wrenching, because even still, after everything, he refuses to sacrifice his ideals and lie to you, even though maybe that would be best in the long run.

 

I dunno, just the way I see it.

 

I noticed that on my third playthrough. He never explicitly lies to you but man is he vague and loves to omit all the vital details. Lying by omission I guess, but it's still interesting to see how he does it. You can see where the trickster bit comes in.

[caridounette]

I guess my point is, he's a master at the Game, and he never really lies. Which is why I personally think it makes his breakup scene all the more heart-wrenching, because even still, after everything, he refuses to sacrifice his ideals and lie to you, even though maybe that would be best in the long run.

 

I dunno, just the way I see it.

 

 

I guess it all depends if you consider lying by omission a lie ? You dont need to lie to decieve.

 

He does put everyone's life at risk, and specially Quizzy, by not telling the truth about things like Cory, the Well, etc.

[dragondreamer]

I love this thread and I'll never catch up, but just wanted to say thanks for those snapshots! I swear, all the romance scenes with Solas look like they are from a freaking painting. The softly falling snow, sun behind the mountains, waterfalls. Just beautiful.

 

Also, I really love the English-accented Inquis voice in those scenes (Alex Wilton Regan?). Her voice gets all sweet and soft, it fits perfectly with the body language. And when Solas is hurt in battle her 'Solas needs help!' scream sounds genuinely panicked. Good stuff.

 

Has anyone tried romancing Solas using the American-accented voice (Sumalee Montano)? I've started a new play through but am trying to avoid Solas at all costs.

 

My Lavellan has Sumalee's voice.  She has an earthy, mature quality that fits my Inquisitor well.  Her voice makes me think of chocolate and velvet.

[Tielis]

I guess it all depends if you consider lying by omission a lie ? You dont need to lie to decieve.

 

He does put everyone's life, and specially Quizzy, by not telling the truth about things like Cory, the Well, etc.

 

Jut thought I'd put it out there that RationalWiki seems to agree with my thoughts on lying by omission.  http://rationalwiki....ing_by_omission

 

Annnnnnd I thought that this was an interesting article as well.  http://www.psycholog...borderlines-lie

[TheComfyCat]

It's weird but I personally don't think he lies, not really, anyway. I've tried to pay attention on subsequent playthroughs, and I don't think anything he says is an outright lie. He says he's an apostate, this is true. He says he lived in a small village, but spent most of his time dreaming in the Fade, I assume this is true based on Leliana's findings. Everything he knows and shares about ancient lore he says he learned from the Fade, which must be at least partially true (omitting that he lived through it isn't really a lie). When he tells you about the orb, he says it must be elven, and nothing he says is a lie, he just doesn't reveal that he knows *exactly* what it is, and that it's his.

 

I guess my point is, he's a master at the Game, and he never really lies. Which is why I personally think it makes his breakup scene all the more heart-wrenching, because even still, after everything, he refuses to sacrifice his ideals and lie to you, even though maybe that would be best in the long run.

 

I dunno, just the way I see it.

 

I agree! I think one time he has to lie a bit is during the Winter Palace dialogue, when he loses approval if you ask him why/how he's so comfortable at court. I think he disapproves because he doesn't like to lie, and you sort of inadvertently force him into lying.

[Birdy]

 

I've made it to the end. . .

 

Must post. . .

 

Spoiler

http://masterwaffle....st/104263852012

[Sine_Amore]

Lying by omission is still lying in my book.

At the same time... You can't just come out and say:

 

Spoiler

"Yo, I'm Fen'Harel; that's how I know all this stuff. I've been sleeping for a long time and was too weak to use my own Orb of Power after I woke up so I gave it to Coryphenus to power it up for me. That's totes my mark on your hand--which is why I was the only one able to keep it from killing you outright."

 

Pretty sure that's how you just get killed or thrown into an insane asylum. Especially since he's too weak at the time to do anything about it.

[kalasaurus]

I agree! I think one time he has to lie a bit is during the Winter Palace dialogue, when he loses approval if you ask him why/how he's so comfortable at court. I think he disapproves because he doesn't like to lie, and you sort of inadvertently force him into lying.

 

Before I knew the truth on my first playthrough, I at first thought the disapproval was because it seemed like a stupid question lol.  Why would an apostate elf go to court?  I just assumed he thought it was obvious he was referring to the Fade