Do the other LIs do a similar gesture? I know they all do the raised eyebrow thing going out into the balcony. The hand on back, not so sure.
Sigh. Love this picture. At first, I was thrown and really didn't like how Solas looked in that clothing and the goofy hat. Now I love the entire outfit. He looks younger, boyish and dashing. The way he looks really fits with how he acts at the ball. He seems so at ease and just so dang cute. I just want to squish him.
nranola, Miss This or That et Orphelia aiment ceci
Alright, this day has been far too relaxed already, why not risk making enemies:
Oh I know plenty about feminism, and I find that generally, people who make statements like this really do feminism a giant disservice in general.
[...]
This. If I ever said anything like this here, in reverse, so many people would jump on my back and call me sexist. No one did this though for her. In fact, she's got several likes for it.
You can call me what you want. Stubborn? Hell yea. A jerk? Go ahead. But I am not sexist and you'd be hard pressed to prove it.
You know what, I agree. Sexism often results directly from misguided feminism. "You women are all naive" is just as bad as "You men only accept your own opinion". For me, the only thing that matters is equality as in "not discriminating somebody because of his race/gender/religion/opinion/etc.". It often happens that I think "Alright, that womanish crap again". So I guess there's quite a few situations where I am a sexist myself. But I also know that some women are like that, others are different. This discussion won't lead to anything. Those who feel you insulted them will not change their minds, you will not change your mind and I do not even assume any productive or elaborate debate can follow this. If so it would be interesting, but I do not see it coming. So what are your intentions? Proving some people here wrong? Proving that you are not a jerk but just a person with a strong opinion? I acknowledge that and agree. Others might do, too. Others won't. Good enough? Because that's the best you will get. I assume you know that. So, please, get over it.
Collected Discussion (spoilered for size) #mordinscienceteam
Spoiler
So weird thought that came to me right as I was about to fall to sleep and it hit me and I need to write it down so I don't forget it.
We mentioned today the hilarity of June being the betrayer, the one who orchestrated the downfall of the Elvhen Pantheon and how, if he were Sandal, he'd be the last one we would suspect. There are strange things about June. There are few depictions of him. He is said to have created himself despite being called the sibling to Sylaise and Andruil. His tools associated with him changed over time and were clearly foreign to what was common amongst the elves. Moreover, he had few if any depictions or presence within the elven pantheon narrative the further you go back in time. His vallaslin is clearly from a different shape language from the others - it lacks the sinuous, delicate, or fluid hand of the others. His is practically approached with monoline and little line weight variation. The background of his mosaic is practically dwarven in style.
BEWARE ALL WHO CLICK HERE. I have literally no idea what I typed or am typing and this is LITERALLY a pre-sleep thought. I give it NO water. So if you're into tinfoil hat theories to the MAX then open this. If not, please move right along. I will be the OPPOSITE of offended. Grateful, actually.
Spoiler
BED-TIME CRAZY THEORY:
The reason there are two elven pantheon members who aren't listed among the Old Gods (if you subscribe to that theory) is because they weren't there when **** went down. And the reason they weren't there when **** went down is because Fen'Harel had left to hunt the Traitor. The traitor being.. June. Let's entertain the thought that June was a dwarf lifted to the Elven Pantheon, lifted from his people and away from the stone in a way he never truly forgave. Perhaps they plucked him from a failing Titan he had been a part of or lead. Perhaps he was merely the greatest enchanter of his time or the original forger of the Anvil of the Void.
He's the one who convinces Andruil to go off into the Void and hunt the Forgotten Ones - the forgotten Dwarven Gods. We know that worship of the stone is actually relatively new to them and the Primeval Thaig featured places of worship to Gods unknown. Perhaps he hopes to usurp them. Perhaps he hopes that they have the key to either restoring the Titans or to power yet untapped (my vote is restoring the Titans). He helps forge Andruil's armor with his anvil in secret - perhaps is intrigued by the conversion of lyrium to red lyrium but keeps a safe distance and allows her to be his guinea pig. He pretends to be as surprised as anyone when she brings darkness upon their land and Mythal is forced to subdue her. Andruil is defeated, her armor and knowledge of the Void taken from her. Mythal becomes infected.
Falon'Din becomes his next target, his next attempt at using these Elven Gods to achieve his ends, and attempts to do so in a way much more subtle than the last. Falon'Din culls the slaves and followers of other Gods who refuse to worship him, lessening the power of the Gods. What murder and sacrifice he accomplished with blood magic thinning the veil to a breaking point. The other Gods defeat his forces over time, finally cornering and bloodying him in the antechamber of his own temple.
Slaves begin to voice their deep dissatisfaction with the elvhen dreamer gods and how quickly they fall to corruption and madness. Some call for a rebellion. Others for reason. The Elvhen Empire being what it is, takes FOREVER to address their concerns. Public discontent grows over the inaction.
June approaches Ghilal'nain, who he knows is desperate to restore Andruil, and offers to help find a way to restore Andruil to her former self IF she helps him build an army capable of protecting the people should another one of them fall to madness, pointing at symptoms of Mythal's infection. He offers her information about the Titans and their hive mind, convinces her to use a little of the knowledge of the void to make her creation stronger. June endeavours to find a way to control them, to lead, and guide them beyond a force of mass destruction and turns towards the song of the stone or lyrium. Together, they accidentally craft the darkspawn.
The Darkspawn prove more difficult to control, far from the Titan June had hoped to recreate, and he panics. There has to be something, some way he can draw the Darkspawn away from him until he learns to fix it. To regain what was lost. He gets more radical groups of slaves fighting for their freedom to turn to him and the Forgotten Ones in desperation. But it's all a ploy. Another experiment to fix what went wrong.
Cities fall to taint. The possible slave rebellion changes from a noble act of rebellion to a free-for-all as some succumb to June. More gods get infected. **** is going the hell down.
And.. the rest is kind of fuzzy, but maybe infected Mythal from the fight with Andruil was already acting as a beacon to the Darkspawn and they were already seeking her out. Perhaps this is what gets the rest of the pantheon to betray her. Who knows, maybe June was the lover?
But in the end here's my thought: Mythal gets killed, remainder of spirit goes into the dragon. The Darkspawn descend underground immediately after her. Fen'Harel suggests the other gods become dragons as well to keep the darkspawn from overflooding the surface. He gets permission to seal the corrupted Elvhen cities are behind Eluvians to keep them safe from the taint. Fen'Harel is the last member of the pantheon remaining. His last act being to seek out June and kill him for all who had been lost.
June's soul doesn't die however, it passes to someone else, and in time, ends up in Sandal. But the vessel is lyrium addled and thereby unable to continue June's work. Mythal haunts his dreams. Laughs at him and his feeble attempts to escape justice for what he has done. He aids the Hero of Ferelden and the Champion of Kirkwall. But who does he avoid? The Herald. Empowered with the same force as the Gods he once befriended and later betrayed. The Inquisitor. Aided and guided by the very man who killed him once before.
TL;DR I am so sorry for this pre-sleep ramble of text that will make sense to no one. I apologize that I am subjecting you all to it. It likely has so many flaws and no a lick of reference to canon. My dream brain is just super excited by the idea that Andruil wasn't REALLY the big bad we make her out to be. She and her insanity were merely pawns to distract the rest of the pantheon from the one who pulled the strings.
I put no faith in this thing. It's just there. Because I am tired and lacking the prescience to realize this is all a horrible idea. Poke at it. Kill it. SLAY IT LIKE THE DRAGON IT IS. I'll see you all in the morning.
The Ghilan'nain and June working together and accidentally creating the darkspawn makes a certain amount of sense to me. The Blight twisting women into broodmothers and producing corrupted copies that just happen to be born warriors screams 'bio-engineering' to me.
So can we blame it this way?
Andruil: Brought the Taint back from the Void, went crazy. Cured, eventually.
June: Enabled Andruil by building her a crazy awesome Void suit out of curiosity whether he could do it. Red lyrium.
Ghilan'nain: Darkspawn. Jesus. A+ in Biology and a gold star for creativity, but Jesus.
Falon'din: Taking advantage of the chaos to try to usurp power.
Sylvaise: Trying to show-up everyone and seize power.
Dirthamen: Probably with Falon'din.
Mythal: Having the audacity to be murdered at a crucial moment. Probably in charge of quarantining corrupted gods and Elvhen.
Elgar'nan: Spent most of his time putting down rebellions and brooding in a manly fashion. Maybe he actually took down Barindur with a volcano as retaliation for Mythal? If you subscribe to the Elgar'nan=Dumat theory, that is. Or even if you don't, and Dumat just got the credit because Dumat and Elgie share a certain grand old god style.
Fen'harel: Tossed all of the gods and the Blight away in prisons and hoped for the best. Took a nap.
If June crafted the darkspawn, it could explain why they originated in the Deep Roads- the dwarven territory. It could also explain why the prisons of the old gods are located in the deep roads- because if June was intentionally infecting other gods, it would make sense that he would have a "convenient" solution to their problem: a prison of his own making to lock them away in his own territory.
I am totally enabling this and that's totally ok. Because crazy bed-time theories are awesome.
EDIT: So like after he infects the old gods and they get locked away in his prisons, they become like his pets now.
I'm really curious as to what the Old God prisons actually looking like. How do the darkspawn break in? Or is just touching the prison enough to wake up the Old God and corrupt it? (Pretty awful prison, if you ask me.)
If the Wardens ever could marshal the forces to cut their way to an Old God without alerting them, how would they break in?
I like the idea that June screwed up and caused a ton of problems, and then teamed up with Solas in desperation to prevent the end of the world.
The line Solas has talking about the flaw in sharing power, "I can still see the lines of her face," or something like that makes me suspect either Andruil, Ghilan'nain, or Sylvaise. But Andruil doesn't strike me as a full on villain. A jackass, certainly. Tainted by the Void and the Blight, yes.
So Sylvaise foolishly manipulating the other Creators, June just experimenting with runes and magic, and Ghilan'nain going full cackling mad-scientist. Maybe June was trying to make an alternate source of magic, as the Taint?
Banalhan. Place where the Blight originates. Also the place of nothing, yes? Sounds like the elves attribute the Blight to the Void.
I think it's getting close to my crazy theory bedtime too.
SANDAL AS JUNE:
End of Origins.
Darkspawn attack Sandal en masse.
"YOU FOOLS, I MADE ALL OF YOU! I CAN UNMAKE YOU JUST BY SCRATCHING MY BUTT! *one-shot multi kill*"
Demons attack in DA2.
"I overthrew the gods. You're just lickspittles."
Sandal as an evil mastermind is wonderfully weird and hilarious to think about.
OH GOD NO. I REGRET EVERYTHIIIIIIING~!!
But seriously. I think all of my other thoughts I've brought to the table are far more well researched and grounded in some form of reality. Look there first! This one is just a thought that I shared perhaps way too prematurely before cutting out the excess/ trimming the fat of bad concepts.
In fact, Caddius likely did that for me with June + Ghilal'nain = darkspawn. That's the only one I feel good about because of how it makes SENSE when you compare:
"Oh hey, let's make Golems... BUT WITH FLESH!" ---> Harvesters
to
"Oh hey, let's make Titans ... BUT WITH FLESH!" ---> Darkspawn
On that topic.
Golems of Amgarrak.
The Fade portals, the golems, the magic, the Harvester.
Everything.
I feel like Golems of Amgarrak was the Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets of Dragon Age and its DLC. It seems like a cool side-story with some creepy stuff, but it doesn't seem to relate directly to the main story.
Until later.
It's been awhile since I've played that. I just remember being frustrated that it wasn't expanded upon later, even with Orsino's random transforming into a Harvester.
Maker's breath guys, I missed all the eureka moment but wow this is an exciting chain of events!
Summary time? (mainly to line it all up in my head):
> June, a dwarf, is raised to the elven pantheon in recognition of his extraordinary talents
> For his own reasons, June convinces our poor Andruil to venture into the void and hunt the Forgotten Ones (forgotten dwarven gods?)
> Andruil returns infected with the taint
> June forges for Andruil armour of red lyrium, which like Samson, drives her crazy
> Mythal is forced to subdue Andruil, though in doing so Mythal becomes infected, too
> Falon'Din, in order to subdue his rivals and secure the weakened throne for himself, culls masses of slaves in blood magic rituals - weakening the veil
> Elvhen population in disarray, calling for action/mercy/rebellion
> June approaches Ghilan'nain, knowing she is desperate to restore Andruil
> Says he will help her if she helps him build/breed an army which will protect the people, should another fall into madness
> Offers her knowledge of the Titan/Stone's hive mind properties
> Together, they accidentally craft darkspawn - which proves more difficult to control than they anticipated
> Possibly Mythal, already infected, becomes their beacon
> Cue chaos in combined darkspawn attacks and slave rebellion
> Fen'Harel (is granted permission to?) lock them all away... except for June, who escapes. June may have even given Fen'Harel a "convenient solution" to the problem of infected gods.
> June's soul remains intact, hopping from body to body ending up in the lyrium-addled Sandal?
> June/Sandal guides the Champion of Kirkwall to break open the veil, and avoids the Herald (guided by his enemies Mythal/Fen'Harel)
*rolls around hugging herself with glee*
Ossifer, Missy_MI, Miss This or That et 4 autres aiment ceci
That's not a direct quote. Weekes never uses the word "entanglement". You should really listen to the podcast. I have multiple times and I'm still on team optimism. In fact, I think it's rather optimistic overall.
Okay. So I just sat down and listened to it. The bits about Solas anyway. Well, that and the bit about Garrus tasting like Cinnamon.
...I just lost my train of thought.
There it is. Instead of getting a hopeful or dismal vibe from it, I just sorta got frustrated. It's so annoyingly vague. Insufficient. I get that him delivering spoilers is punishable by death. Probably. But, I guess I was hoping for a tone to get a read on, or something subtle that others have picked up to make them feel hopeful. I got nothin'. So I officially don't know what to think anymore. I guess I have to ask myself, am I okay with this being it? Are any of you, really?
If there is no more, if I never see Solas again as my li'l Tiger Festival; if she never gets a fighting chance at happily ever after with him, am I okay with it?
Short answer: No.
Long answer: Hell no.
I think that the Powers That Be know there are a lot of us who would answer the same way. Mr. Weekes did seem to indicate that. However, I still don't believe the odds are actually in our favor. I guess I have to hold onto my team Expecting The Worst flag a little longer.
jellobell, Miss This or That et Sister Squish aiment ceci
My problem with this conversation/argument are the sweeping generalizations people on both sides are making.
I not only do not think the sun shines out of Solas's bare ass, but I'm certainly not projecting myself onto my Lavellan. I would have dropped him for not putting out ages ago.
She was not being unfair. She said "Sometimes I think that some...". You cannot bui.d a sentence less generalised than that.
..oO( Well, okay, maybe you could... "Sometimes I wonder if I or somebody else might think that possibly some people might, or might not, have a tendency to project themselves or somebody else onto..." )
She was not being unfair. She said "Sometimes I think that some...". You cannot bui.d a sentence less generalised than that.
..oO( Well, okay, maybe you could... "Sometimes I wonder if I or somebody else might think that possibly some people might, or might not, have a tendency to project themselves or somebody else onto..." )
Alright, this day has been far too relaxed already, why not risk making enemies:
You know what, I agree. Sexism often results directly from misguided feminism. "You women are all naive" is just as bad as "You men only accept your own opinion". For me, the only thing that matters is equality as in "not discriminating somebody because of his race/gender/religion/opinion/etc.". It often happens that I think "Alright, that womanish crap again". So I guess there's quite a few situations where I am a sexist myself. But I also know that some women are like that, others are different.
This discussion won't lead to anything. Those who feel you insulted them will not change their minds, you will not change your mind and I do not even assume any productive or elaborate debate can follow this. If so it would be interesting, but I do not see it coming. So what are your intentions? Proving some people here wrong? Proving that you are not a jerk but just a person with a strong opinion? I acknowledge that and agree. Others might do, too. Others won't. Good enough? Because that's the best you will get. I assume you know that. So, please, get over it.
Lol I was never under it. I'm not hurt or sadface that they think I'm a jerk. Lol I certainly am when it comes to debating. It's a flaw, but that's just my tone. Hence why even when I say things like "I'm not saying it can't happen, I just find it naive," people will still say I'm stubborn or whatever. Even though, lol, I am, but in that instance, it's certainly not.
They can call me what they will. I certainly don't care if people like me or not, but I'm going to be honest. And as for them saying I'm sexist? I'm not hurt no, but I'm not going to ignore bullshit when someone presents it.
And just for the record, I didn't say "women" were naive, either. People seem to think that calling A woman naive means I think they all are, instead of just the person or persons that hold that opinion. My intentions were to show a different POV. Which I have, so we can leave it at that. People wanted the discussion to stop so we can leave that here. Or not. People will respond regardless, judging from the last time I tried to leave the discussion.
June did it! Collected Discussion (spoilered for size) #mordinscienceteam
Awsome. One thing I do miss though: what is red lyrium and where does it come from? Surely you can make this work within this overall concept... red lyrium is alive, it's red... lyrium corrupted by the blood of the tainted gods or something? I mean, it's so important to everything but we have nothing about what it actually is, yet.
Good Lord. Who nuked the thread? Please refer to my previous post: both sides are losing here by virture of shoving their own headcanons down the others throat. It's pixel sex. WHO CARES? Sex clearly matters more to some than others here. Just leave it at that and let there be peace. We've had this argument 1000 times in the thread and they go nowhere. The writer has already come down and said 'It's up to the player'. Please let that be enough and just enjoy your fantasies.
Anyways - here's a happy Abelas love story. Because he is definitely my rebound. Y'all need to relax.
I haven't entered this debate until now though I most felt the urge to when I saw people make comments about 'purity' and the relationship being 'above' such things as sex, as well as statements on how experienced Lavellan is. That got to me a bit. If you think they didn't have sex, fine, but that doesn't somehow make that interpretation better or the Inquisitor definitely a virginal, wide-eyed innocent. Lots of people do project themselves onto the character, I know that I do. I played her as an experienced woman over the age of 25 with a flirty streak. For me it would have been out of character for her to not have had sex with someone she was involved with, as it would be for myself. So when it seemed that people were dismissing the idea that they had sex as something that was beneath them, it kind of seemed like a personal insult, as her choice to have sex would have been one that I would have made in her place. Which is why we have to be careful when we make sweeping statements about the player character, because often people identify strongly with the choices they have made and won't react well to other people writing off their choices or interpretations as wrong.
jellobell, nranola, Eivuwan et 8 autres aiment ceci
I understand that, but the fact remains, she got to where she was by being someone's mistress. I don't disrespect courtesans as a rule, I played one in an RP and quite liked her. However Vivienne enjoys a freedom she would deny to other mages and would in fact use her influence to lock all of them up if she could. Some humility about her standing relative to others, and how she got there, would have gone a long way in allowing me to respect her. As it is, she's a hypocrite like Wynne.
Why should she be humble? You don't think playing the Game as skillfully as she has done takes real wits to pull off? Vivienne is smart as a whip, and it's reductive to say that her position is due to "being someone's mistress". She's likely had to weather scandal, intrigue, and plots against her life during her tenure as Court Enchanter. That's just how Orlais operates. Yes, she is selfish. Incredibly so. And she most certainly enjoys a position that many other circle mages do not. However she clawed her way to that position. Do you think that becoming the right man's mistress was an accident? With her being a mage? And then remaining in his good graces for all of those years? All the while maintaining the network of friends and alliances to keep not only herself but the duke in good standing at court? Her position is not a fluke, and she has the right to be proud of what she's achieved in the face of overwhelming odds. She may well be a hypocrite, but that doesn't make her drive to succeed and her ability to do so any less admirable.
I get all that, but have no use for someone like that as a party member. I pity her. If I could change her view, or learn from her, or do anything besides occasionally smirk or eyeroll at her dialogue, that would be different. As far as I'm aware (correct me if I'm wrong), she never changes her views on anything, even in banter with others. Not even Solas is that inflexible and he has far more cause to be confident in his views.
You don't think having the perspective of someone who supports the circle is worthwhile? The fact that the circle has moulded who she is doesn't make her experiences any less valid. She represents the many many mages who have grown up in the circle, who have internalized chantry discourse, and who know nothing else and are afraid of what the outside world will see them as without the circle's protection. And she may well be right to be apprehensive, because the outside world sees mages the same way they do; dangerous abominations waiting to happen. Vivienne knows what it is to fear mages, and to be feared. She knows the precarious position circle mages are in, and the ways in which the circle has left them ill-prepared to live outside of it.
And aside from that, whose views in this game truly go through any change? Cole, obviously. Iron Bull. Solas to a certain extent. And Cass. Everyone else, though? Can you change Sera's view of mages? Or Varric's view on anything? Just because a character doesn't undergo some dramatic change in perspective doesn't mean that they aren't worthwhile to have around.
madrar, coldwetn0se, Miss This or That et 2 autres aiment ceci
I did not claim you were. In fact I assume that you are rather relaxed and that you don't actually care much. People who like debate don't usually get all personal.
I'm not hurt or sadface that they think I'm a jerk. Lol I certainly am when it comes to debating. [...] They can call me what they will. I certainly don't care if people like me or not, but I'm going to be honest. And as for them saying I'm sexist? I'm not hurt no, but I'm not going to ignore bullshit when someone presents it.
I did not say (or expect) you were hurt. I only meant that this discussion is only going in circles, not leading anywhere.
And just for the record, I didn't say "women" were naive, either. People seem to think that calling A woman naive means I think they all are, instead of just the person or persons that hold that opinion.
I did not say that, either. I responded directly to the quoted lines. Your post mentioned an inequity, saying her remark generalising men was accepted while your remarks were called sexist. I agreed, nothing more.
I did not claim you were. In fact I assume that you are rather relaxed and that you don't actually care much. People who like debate don't usually get all personal.
I did not say (or expect) you were hurt. I only meant that this discussion is only going in circles, not leading anywhere.
I did not say that, either. I responded directly to the quoted lines. Your post mentioned an inequity, saying her remark generalising men was accepted while your remarks were called sexist. I agreed, nothing more.
Ah k, my bad then on all counts Read too much into "Please get over it." All good.
Why should she be humble? You don't think playing the Game as skillfully as she has done takes real wits to pull off?
Sure, and it still all amounts to being a snake in a pit of snakes, and I don't respect her goals, so I don't really need to respect her as a person either.
You don't think having the perspective of someone who supports the circle is worthwhile?
We've got voluminous Chantry types around in the game. I don't think Lavellan needs a primer anymore than I do. Vivienne doesn't bring anything new. In that way she's rather a disappointment.
And aside from that, whose views in this game truly go through any change? Cole, obviously. Iron Bull. Solas to a certain extent. And Cass. Everyone else, though? Can you change Sera's view of mages? Or Varric's view on anything? Just because a character doesn't undergo some dramatic change in perspective doesn't mean that they aren't worthwhile to have around.
Plenty of them. Since it is the Solas thread, Solas learning to work with a group of people is a huge step for him.
There it is. Instead of getting a hopeful or dismal vibe from it, I just sorta got frustrated. It's so annoyingly vague. Insufficient. I get that him delivering spoilers is punishable by death. Probably. But, I guess I was hoping for a tone to get a read on, or something subtle that others have picked up to make them feel hopeful. I got nothin'. So I officially don't know what to think anymore. I guess I have to ask myself, am I okay with this being it? Are any of you, really?
What's important to keep in mind here is that it's made undeniably clear that Solas does love Lavellan, and that he was this close to dropping all of his plans to be with her. That, to me, says that he isn't beyond saving, and it makes me hopeful.
I honestly think that Weekes was trying to comfort us with that little bit of information. He must have known how devastating it would be for people who chose to romance Solas.
Miss This or That, DragonNerd, Kittn et 1 autre aiment ceci
Question for our lore people, while I dig my way out of thread backlog: I seem to remember someone getting twitter/tumblr confirmation from one of the Makers that the scar on Solas' forehead was just a random visual interest thing- no significant meaning, no plot point hint.
Does that sound familiar to anyone? Or am I totally making that up?
Ah k, my bad then on all counts Read too much into "Please get over it." All good.
And I just realised that I missed my chance to proclaim "Why do you men always have to take things so personally?" Dammit. I'll bang my head against a wall for the rest of the day.
Well, I think it does go against some of his dialogue, like his appreciating the heady mix of politics, intrigue and sex at the ball.
This I did the ball thing a few days ago with romanced Solas and one of the first thing he mentions when you ask him what his impressions are is sex (and BTW IB is fully in agreement with him)... Now this to me screams out loud and clear that you have done the deed...
OTOH, I get with the people who say chaste. My headcanon on this would be that he dude has plenty, plenty on his plate already, he's a god or demi-god that has been compelled to become a mortal, at least for a time and he has godly or demigodly things he needs to repair... What he doesn't need is additional complications and I guess physical entanglements would fall under that heading... So it just might be he stops short.
Sure, and it still all amounts to being a snake in a pit of snakes, and I don't respect her goals, so I don't really need to respect her as a person either.
We've got voluminous Chantry types around in the game. I don't think Lavellan needs a primer anymore than I do. Vivienne doesn't bring anything new. In that way she's rather a disappointment.
Plenty of them. Since it is the Solas thread, Solas learning to work with a group of people is a huge step for him.
I don't agree with the majority of what you said about Viv, but I do agree she doesn't bring much to the table. I mean, I can always use a good mage I guess, but beyond that, she seems more useful as an advisory role. But barely, since you're not there to deal with nobles, and Cassandra already shares her POV more or less.
Definitely less, but you get the point. With Cullen there, Cass there... there's not much reason for Viv to be around just looking at that, and then using someone like her in a combat role feels rather odd as well, which is why I find myself using Solas and Dorian more times than not even though I like her. Solas has a lot to say obviously about things related to the plot. He, Cole, Dorian, all have a place, while I honestly do not see Vivienne's.
And I just realised that I missed my chance to proclaim "Why do you men always have to take things so personally?" Dammit. I'll bang my head against a wall for the rest of the day.
Because a lot of us are prideful. No reverse sexism there or anything, it's just the truth.
I found her perspective a bit refreshing. This game made it a little bit harder this time around to side with the mages. They are frightened idiots who really don't seem to have any idea of what they want for themselves beyond 'not being in the circle'. It goes to Solas' whole impassioned speech to Sera about not understanding what her goals are. They have no real endgame which causes a great amount of strife. I did agree with her. Magic is a force to be respected, not feared, but certainly respected and people that forget that fact do the world a disservice. Now, I will always side with the mages just because at my very core I believe all people should be free. I also believe all the circle did was create fear of magic because they removed mages from normal society.
The more I got to know Viv, the more I liked her. She has a boatload of flaws but so does every other companion. It would be wrong to cast her aside because she's selfish. She's incredibly shrewd and plays the Game like no other. There appears to be a lot of mistresses in Orlais, yet she is the only one that is on the edge of becoming Divine. As the Inquisitor, she would probably be the one person out of all your companions that you would WANT to be close friends with. Even if you detest the position of power your elf is in, you are still in that position of power. Might as well have someone on your side that can actually help you effectively use it.
What's important to keep in mind here is that it's made undeniably clear that Solas does love Lavellan, and that he was this close to dropping all of his plans to be with her. That, to me, says that he isn't beyond saving, and it makes me hopeful.
It made me very hopeful, too! I loved listening to his perspective(and, well, Garrus and cinnamon forever!)
But I was actually troubled about "dropping all his plans to be with her". To do what, exactly? Domestic bliss? Possibly losing his immortality? Being figureheads of the Inquisition that may eventually turn out worse than the Templar Order or the corrupted Seekers? Or leaving the Inquisition and just wandering around exploring the ruins and freeing an occasional dozen of elven slaves? Neither is appealing to me. My character never asked for this and never wanted this. In fact, I think it's a really, really bad idea. I mean, ahem, Solas and Lavellan being together is an awesome idea! But... not like this. Not if the price is abandoning the truth of what and who he is.
Time for a break from this thread for awhile. Someone call me when the forts and tinfoil theories are back.
For those who want graphics to help.
Spoiler
The chart predicts that we are in tent and cat stage. I don't like cat kisses so I'll wait until tinfoil theories. There are no apologies in the tinfoil stage.
Retour en haut
Read too much into "Please get over it." All good.
