Foreshadowing how the writers torpedo a perfectly good character? Probably. In all seriousness, I think in certain ways yes. Or he could be a nice mirror. Solas actually walks away from the edge.
ROFL indeed.
But yes, Solas would be the example of how non amateurs do things.
Though while writing this, I think even if Solas and Fen'Harel were separate once, I don't think it's possible to separate them again. Take Anders. Even when you're on his rival path, and it looks like Anders wants to get rid of Justice, they still can't separate. It might be different with a god's soul, but if both Solas and Fen'Harel are willing parties to their binding, I don't think there's any way to force them apart if they don't want to.
I want to be a fly on the wall for a conversation between Solas and post-possession Anders. I think it would be utterly fascinating. On one hand, Anders is a spirit healer, and more familiar with the Fade than most Circle mages. On the other hand, he has very rigid, black-and-white ideas about the world thanks to Justice, and a surprisingly strong Andrastian bent to his thinking. Solas is all for allying with the mages, but even he admits that the templars have their place if you go that route. It'd be fascinating to watch. Maybe a little explosive 
I don't wanna be that guy, (I think I might be the only guy here actually, lol), but Anders could be foreshadowing for a lot of this stuff.
The difference with Anders' story arc is that we met both Anders and Justice before they merged. We got to see the before and after, and IMO that's part of what made DA2 Anders so sad even if I wanted to throttle him most of the time 
With Solas, we only see the version of him after Arlathan, after any potential spirit shenanigans with Fen'Harel. Same thing with Flemeth really.
AND This is where I have an issue with Fen'Harel posessed someone else because of what we know of Anders. Yes, Anders says "I don't know where I start and he begins". That is true but at the same time there was a seperation there. He was able to block off Justice from parts of himself. He was able to try to cling to the last shreds of what made him Anders because there was certainly intimation that Justice was changing who he was. We've also seen how posession wreaks havoc on a person's mental state. EVERYONE in the game that has been possessed is NUTS. Even Mythal/Flemeth. It is not natural and we have been told this in every single Dragon Age game.
There was NEVER any point in time that I thought Solas was losing his marbles. Solas comes off as way too confident. Way too calm and collected. We see him get angry a grand total of once and you're able to stop him from making a rash decision.
Because Solas is not possessed. And because Fen'Harel is not a spirit. And because Justice had no other option, he had to go with Anders and could not choose somebody "better".
There was never any point in time where I thought Flemeth had lost her marbels either. If she's not confident, calm, and collected I don't know who is. And I've seen Solas get angry at least twice (personal quest, Wardens). I am not sure about the Templars anymore but I think he was pretty pissed about that, too.
I don't wanna be that guy, (I think I might be the only guy here actually, lol), but Anders could be foreshadowing for a lot of this stuff.
But why would they foreshadow something about Solas with...another character who is not Solas? 
All of the foreshadowing we actually get from Solas during DA:I points to him truly being Fen'harel. The anger over some unspecified betrayal in his past. His hatred of slavery. His interest in Dwarven tricksters in literature. His talk about war with Blackwall. Most of his conversations with Cole... I could go on.
Do we really know that? I mean, maybe that was the deal. Mythal gets to use Flemeth's body but Flemeth's original soul passed on a long time ago. It's not like is still alive after Mythal left.
Sorry, missed this. Ultimately we don't know, but it wouldn't make much sense for Mythal to refer to herself exclusively in the third person if she was the only entity that inhabited Flemeth. I do think that both of them are together.
Furthermore- we know from Keiran that even when two souls are born together, they can still be separated into two separate entities. Its possible, even likely, that the situation with Keiran was a bit different than Solas/Mythal's situations might be. But as far as lore goes, even an intimate connection that those two had could still be spooled apart by magic.
The times where we see a body inhabiting another without the host soul remaining appear to be corpses.
But why would they foreshadow something about Solas with...another character who is not Solas?
Not the character, but the lore of spirits and mortals bonding. Before that point, all we saw of such a thing was horribly deformed abominations. Anders was the first to show that those weren't the rule and that beings could exist with a mortal without actually controlling it. With Flemeth, we only could guess.
I am not sure about the Templars anymore but I think he was pretty pissed about that, too.
He's only ticked if you ally with the templars. He was fine with my Lavellan who conscripted them.
All of the foreshadowing we actually get from Solas during DA:I points to him truly being Fen'harel. The anger over some unspecified betrayal in his past. His hatred of slavery. His interest in Dwarven tricksters in literature. His talk about war with Blackwall. Most of his conversations with Cole... I could go on.
I'm also not saying he isn't truly fen'harel:
And that's something we can all hope to get answers for later.
For me, I imagine this merging happening a long long time ago. I like to think that the gods were ethereal forms of some kind and got volunteers to give them shape. So Solas would have experienced all of the ruling and godding it up as Fen'harel in that form, not the "possession" stuff some others were saying.
That would allow him to organically change.
Not the character, but the lore of spirits and mortals bonding. Before that point, all we saw of such a thing was horribly deformed abominations. Anders was the first to show that those weren't the rule and that beings could exist with a mortal without actually controlling it. With Flemeth, we only could guess.
Wynne was also bonded to a spirit, with no ill effects as far as we can tell. So I would say Anders is more of a response to the negative consequences of that union.
Not the character, but the lore of spirits and mortals bonding. Before that point, all we saw of such a thing was horribly deformed abominations. Anders was the first to show that those weren't the rule and that beings could exist with a mortal without actually controlling it. With Flemeth, we only could guess.
Yes, Anders does indeed show that spirits and humans can coexist within the same body (though not very happily in that case). However, all indications point to this not being the case with Solas.
I want to be a fly on the wall for a conversation between Solas and post-possession Anders. I think it would be utterly fascinating. On one hand, Anders is a spirit healer, and more familiar with the Fade than most Circle mages. On the other hand, he has very rigid, black-and-white ideas about the world thanks to Justice, and a surprisingly strong Andrastian bent to his thinking. Solas is all for allying with the mages, but even he admits that the templars have their place if you go that route. It'd be fascinating to watch. Maybe a little explosive
The difference with Anders' story arc is that we met both Anders and Justice before they merged. We got to see the before and after, and IMO that's part of what made DA2 Anders so sad even if I wanted to throttle him most of the time
I want to hear Solas talk with Fenris (those lyrium slave markings) and Merrill (blood mage dalish) and Isabela (Rivaini pirate, plus the possible flirting) too. These missed possible conversations are the only reasons I'm sad they didn't push through with Hawke as IQ.
Yes, Anders does indeed show that spirits and humans can coexist within the same body (though not very happily in that case). However, all indications point to this not being the case with Solas.
For you it does, I see the opposite. You're assuming that this bond happened later, but it could have happened before he was even established as a god.
Wynne was also bonded to a spirit, with no ill effects as far as we can tell. So I would say Anders is more of a response to the negative consequences of that union.
That spirit eventually left her though right? When she met a templar or something in the books?
I want to hear Solas talk with Fenris (those lyrium slave markings) and Merrill (blood mage dalish) and Isabela (Rivaini pirate, plus the possible flirting) too. These missed possible conversations are the only reasons I'm sad they didn't push through with Hawke as IQ.
I'm pretty sure that any conversation between Solas and Fenris would end up in Fenris trying to spirit-punch Solas through the chest. Though it could be enlightening for Solas provided he survives the experience 
A face to put to all the modern elves' troubles, so to speak.
That spirit eventually left her though right? When she met a templar or something in the books?
Same here. It just happened so...naturally. And Solas was so obviously aware of all of the monumental problems it could cause. But he just as obviously couldn't help himself. What I found most refreshing was that, for a so-called god, Solas is one of the most human and relatable characters that I've ever seen in a Bioware game.
Yep. It's hard to be afraid or in awe of someone who you've seen get completely sloshed at an Orlesian Ball. Or who scrunches up his nose whenever he's forced to drink tea. Or who gets flustered when you tease him about "Fade Tongue".
1) Super solid ideas as always. I totally agree. I happen to side with things just being more simple. I have no doubt that Solas is who he is as a person - a powerful ancient elvhen who knew and was amongst the gods of the Elvhen Pantheon.
2) I think Solas answers this question himself whenever he talks about deity - the best gods are those who feel no need to prove that they are gods. It allows him to be as "human" as he is with all his strengths and personal foibles and quirks, while still experience/ understand things in an eternal sense.
<snip>
That spirit eventually left her though right? When she met a templar or something in the books?
She let the spirit leave her to save another, killing her. SPOILERS: It was the only thing keeping Wynne alive. Evangeline, the templar, died. Wynne essentially had the spirit prolonging her life do the same for Evangeline. This spirit seems to have no interest or ability to influence the personalities of those it possesses. It merely supports and protects with what I believe Wynne called love.
Because Solas is not possessed. And because Fen'Harel is not a spirit. And because Justice had no other option, he had to go with Anders and could not choose somebody "better".
There was never any point in time where I thought Flemeth had lost her marbels either. If she's not confident, calm, and collected I don't know who is. And I've seen Solas get angry at least twice (personal quest, Wardens). I am not sure about the Templars anymore but I think he was pretty pissed about that, too.
Then you and I have a very different definition of calm and collected. Mythal/Flemeth are terrifying to me for the very reason that she seems to be on the verge of losing it. That doesn't diminish her other qualities or the fact that she's astute, but she appears to have a very loose grasp on her rage. That's just how I view the character so I won't really get into it.
Solas gets disappointed and angry at times, yes, but not to the point where's going to KILL the Inquisitor over their decisions. Hell you can punch him and he doesn't do ****. I'm talking straight up losing it. We see it happen once.
For you it does, I see the opposite. You're assuming that this bond happened later, but it could have happened before he was even established as a god.
That spirit eventually left her though right? When she met a templar or something in the books?
What would be the point of having Solas bound to Fen'Harel since Arlathan though? I just don't see why they would go through the added complication when it basically amounts to the same thing. If Solas was ever separate, it would have to be Arlathan for it to be relevant. Otherwise, why not just stick with plain single-entity Fen'Harel?
And yep, as Mims said with regards to Wynne
He's only ticked if you ally with the templars. He was fine with my Lavellan who conscripted them.
I ally.
to show that those weren't the rule and that beings could exist with a mortal without actually controlling it.
This is not exactly true. Justice did control Anders a great deal. But however, Justice is not a god, it's a spirit and that is a huge difference after all.
I'm also not saying he isn't truly fen'harel:
I just don't see Solas as some kind of combined being. Even if the "spirit" of Fen'harel were simply the source of his powers or what have you. From what we can determine, Solas is, for all intents and purposes, an ancient elf whose powers were locked away in his orb. What made him "Fen'harel" were his own actions and position in the ancient past, rather than some sort of god-spirit merging with him. We have no evidence of anything else.
2) I think Solas answers this question himself whenever he talks about deity - the best gods are those who feel no need to prove that they are gods. It allows him to be as "human" as he is with all his strengths and personal foibles and quirks, while still experience/ understand things in an eternal sense.
Out of likes, but as usual Liz - I agree
I'm pretty sure that any conversation between Solas and Fenris would end up in Fenris trying to spirit-punch Solas through the chest. Though it could be enlightening for Solas provided he survives the experience
I don't know. Fenris doesn't really relate to his being an elf, as evident in his banters with Merrill. So long as you don't call him flat ear, and I doubt Solas would, I think they'll be pretty chill. And who knows, maybe Solas will even offer to remove Fenris's markings and then I no longer have to think about Fenris someday dying of lyrium poisoning
Edit: Ok I can't help but think about this some more.
I think Fenris is going to be on edge at first, as he always is with a mage. But Solas is polite and knows when to keep his distance, though he'll probably be both disgusted and fascinated by the lyrium markings, since they're probably Tevinter twisting the vallaslin. So little by little, he'll try to get close to Fenris. And Fenris is actually pretty civil, except when he hates you. So unless Solas shows his pity, and he knows when not to as evident in his relationship with Sera, and so long as Solas doesn't try making Fenris more elfy, they'll be fine. Heck, they can even be friends.
I just don't see Solas as some kind of combined being. Even if the "spirit" of Fen'harel were simply the source of his powers or what have you. From what we can determine, Solas is, for all intents and purposes, an ancient elf whose powers were locked away in his orb. What made him "Fen'harel" were his own actions and position in the ancient past, rather than some sort of god-spirit merging with him. We have no evidence of anything else.
We don't have evidence for a lot of things but a few things stick out for me. One, that Mythal could exist as a wisp after being "murdered", and two, Solas not knowing what exactly the gods are himself, which seems very odd to me.
What would be the point of having Solas bound to Fen'Harel since Arlathan though? I just don't see why they would go through the added complication when it basically amounts to the same thing. If Solas was ever separate, it would have to be Arlathan for it to be relevant. Otherwise, why not just stick with plain single-entity Fen'Harel?
And yep, as Mims said with regards to Wynne
Like I said, I think the gods originally were ethereal, or close to it. He isn't a spirit, but the god may have been at one point.
This is not exactly true. Justice did control Anders a great deal. But however, Justice is not a god, it's a spirit and that is a huge difference after all.
As far as Solas states, he is not a god either. Even Mythal seems to shrug off the notion of being godlike. It is very possible that they could be some other sort of entity- but I doubt it would be so vastly different from a kind of greater spirit. Kind of like how the forbidden ones are 'greater' demons. We don't know what sort of differences are set between them.
Retour en haut